This week on In The Meanwhile, Marcus and Nora do what America refuses to do: pay attention. They skim the State of the Union so you don't have to, drag the idea of replacing epidemiology with astrology, and ask a very basic question: should our Surgeon General believe in vaccines or just vibes? Then it gets real. While Black History Month goes conspicuously unmentioned in a country built on Black labor and brilliance, Marcus shares a speech that reframes Black history not as a Pinterest board of heroes, but as a survival manual. From his mother witnessing Rosa Parks' arrest at nine years old to vigils in Minneapolis and Rainier Beach, the throughline is unmistakable: inheritance isn't just trauma. It's tools. And we're gonna need them.

Mentioned in the episode:

Full service at Westside UU | Crowded Out wins inaugural Procedure Award (!!)

Support the pod:

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Read Nora and Marcus's Books:

Crowded Out: The True Costs of Crowdfunding Healthcare | Readying to Rise

Music: No Tears for a Wolf · Ahamefule J. Oluo · Okanomodé. Used with permission.

Logo by Nikki Barron.

Transcripts are machine-generated and imperfect.

Nora and Marcus's work on the podcast is separate from their professional roles and does not represent the views of their employers.

Links to bookshop.org are affiliate links.

We're back with a question that sounds obvious until you say it out loud: if you're picking a North Star… why is "more prisons" anywhere on the map?

This week, Nora and Marcus wade through the usual dystopian fog and land in L.A., where a blockbuster social media trial is screaming in 4K: "Yes. The harm. Is the business model." Not a glitch. Silicon Valley said, "Move fast and break things," and we're like, "Cool, you broke our kids' brains."

Then enter Emily Galvin Almanza (Partners for Justice) and her new book The Price of Mercy, which is part courtroom drama, part myth-busting masterclass, part polite society intervention. Emily brings lived experience, legal receipts, and the kind of clarity that makes you sit up straighter. She walks us through how people get criminalized before they're even arrested, how poverty itself becomes probable cause. How bail is basically a "pay-to-sleep-in-your-own-bed" subscription service. (Premium tier: freedom. Ads included.) And how plea deals are engineered so aggressively that "choice" becomes less a right and more a hostage negotiation with your own future.

Mentioned in the episode:

See Emily Galvin Almanza at Town Hall Seattle Saturday Feb 21 | Follow Emily: @galvinalmanza | The Price of Mercy: Unfair Trials, a Violent System, and a Public Defender's Search for Justice in America | Partners for Justice | Dads on Duty | Marcus on Jesse Jackson in The Stranger |

Support the pod:

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Read Nora and Marcus's Books:

Crowded Out: The True Costs of Crowdfunding Healthcare | Readying to Rise

Music: No Tears for a Wolf · Ahamefule J. Oluo · Okanomodé. Used with permission.

Logo by Nikki Barron.

Transcripts are machine-generated and imperfect.

Nora and Marcus's work on the podcast is separate from their professional roles and does not represent the views of their employers.

Links to bookshop.org are affiliate links.

This week on In The Meanwhile, Nora and Marcus start with civic sunshine(yes, the Seattle Seahawks are Super Bowl champions), and end in the deep waters of power, protest, and historical memory.

From Ernest Jones' "spirit-forward" parade speech to a congressional hearing that felt like defiant incompetence colliding with diabolical intent, they unpack the Bondi–Epstein fallout, elite impunity, space lasers over El Paso (it was a balloon), charting the increasingly surreal cartography of America's institutional collapse.

They then sit down with Jelani Cobb, dean of Columbia Journalism School and author of Three or More Is a Riot, to trace the throughline from Trayvon Martin to George Floyd, from Ferguson to January 6, and from protest to backlash. Cobb breaks down how Black collective action gets reframed as threat, why property damage often outranks the value of Black life in public debate, and what it means to teach journalism as press freedoms erode.

It's a conversation about history as barometer, protest as democracy, and why, as Cobb reminds us, no fascist gets to drive us out of a country our ancestors built.

Read Jelani Cobb's Books:

Three or More is a Riot | To the Break of Dawn | The Substance of Hope

Mentioned in the episode:

Trayvon Martin and the Parameters of Hope | Quitting America | SPL Reading List |

Support the pod:

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Read Nora and Marcus's Books:

Crowded Out: The True Costs of Crowdfunding Healthcare | Readying to Rise

Music: No Tears for a Wolf · Ahamefule J. Oluo · Okanomodé. Used with permission.

Logo by Nikki Barron.

Transcripts are machine-generated and imperfect.

Nora and Marcus's work on the podcast is separate from their professional roles and does not represent the views of their employers.

Links to bookshop.org are affiliate links.

Nora and Marcus are back in Seattle after Marcus's whirlwind reporting trip to Minneapolis, and what he saw there stayed with him. From vigils and memorial sites honoring Alex Pretti and Renee Good, to organizers building "community protection" in real time (warming stations, escorts, carpools, and mutual aid), Marcus reflects on how grief travels across time and distance, and how solidarity can, too.

They talk about what feels different right now: a shift from performative outrage to everyday people asking, "What are you doing?" and then actually doing it. The conversation also zooms out to the bigger picture: state violence, the fragility of billionaire leadership, the stakes for local journalism, and the hard truth that you can't "microwave" a community when the crisis hits.

Plus: a little righteous pettiness about the Melania documentary flop, and Nora's eight ounces of joy, which features Ian McKellen bringing Shakespeare to late-night TV as a fierce, immigrant-rights mic drop.

Mentioned in the episode:

Common Power | Charles Douglas III | Seattle Indivisible | George Floyd Square | Pastor Sergio Amezcua | Philly's ICE out law | New Mexico ban on detention centers | Minnesota Star Tribune | Melania movie box office failure | Ian McKellan on Late Show with Stephen Colbert

Support the pod:

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Read Nora and Marcus's Books:

Crowded Out: The True Costs of Crowdfunding Healthcare | Readying to Rise

Music: No Tears for a Wolf · Ahamefule J. Oluo · Okanomodé. Used with permission.

Logo by Nikki Barron.

Transcripts are machine-generated and imperfect.

Nora and Marcus's work on the podcast is separate from their professional roles and does not represent the views of their employers.

Links to bookshop.org are affiliate links.

This week on In The Meanwhile, Nora and Marcus do what every emotionally stable person does in a collapsing empire: eat dessert first and deal with the vegetables later. They speed-run the Trump administration's latest clown car pileup: featuring the extremely cursed timeline where even the NRA and Senate Republicans are like, "Hey man… maybe chill?" — before zooming out to a much bigger target on the authoritarian wishlist: universities.

Enter constitutional law scholar Brian Soucek, author of The Opinionated University, who joins for a brainy, spicy, occasionally laugh-so-you-don't-scream convo about what academic freedom actually means (hint: it's not "tenured guy yells vibes"). They dig into why calls for "neutrality" are usually code for "please stop challenging power," how outsourcing expertise hollows out education, and why turning campuses into beige corporate training centers would be a tragedy for democracy. We're reminded that universities — messy, loud, imperfect as hell — are still some of the last places where people practice the radical act of disagreeing in public and (sometimes) learning something.

Mentioned in the episode:

Federal judge actually tossing out a lawsuit | Hannah Fried episode | Pediatrician who fought to help Alex Pretti | at least 8 other people killed by ICE | Howard Zinn | "Committee A" on Academic Freedom and Tenure | Committee on Academic Freedom | UC's National Center for Free Speech and Civic Engagement | Gaza Med School Commencement Speech | SSE: Living and Loving Under the Carceral State | Arts at King St Station Art

More from Brian Soucek:

The Opinionated University: Academic Freedom, Diversity, and the Myth of Neutrality in American Higher Education | Brian Soucek at Town Hall Seattle Feb 3

Support the pod:

Donate here to support In The Meanwhile

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Read Nora and Marcus's Books:

Crowded Out: The True Costs of Crowdfunding Healthcare | Readying to Rise

Music: No Tears for a Wolf · Ahamefule J. Oluo · Okanomodé. Used with permission.

Logo by Nikki Barron.

Transcripts are machine-generated and imperfect.

Nora and Marcus's work on the podcast is separate from their professional roles and does not represent the views of their employers.

Links to bookshop.org are affiliate links.

This week on In The Meanwhile, Nora and Marcus open with global chaos: tantrum diplomacy, Greenland confusion, and peace-as-a-timeshare, before turning to something far more urgent and close to home: the accelerating cruelty of ICE. Joined by Angelina Godoy, founding director of the UW Center for Human Rights, they unpack how immigration enforcement has slid toward secret-police tactics, how Washington state data is being quietly weaponized, and why "immigrant rights are human rights" isn't just a slogan, it's a legal and political battleground. It's dark, funny, furious, and grounding all at once: a group therapy session for a moment that demands clarity, courage, and boundaries.

Mentioned in the episode:

UW Center for Human Rights | report on immigration enforcement and driver information | Immigration officers assert sweeping power to enter homes without a judge's warrant, memo says | Economist/YouGov Poll | ICE Can Now Spy on Every Phone in Your Neighborhood | Fury as Amazon Ring Cameras Are Hooked Up to ICE System | 2026 Oscar Nominations | Sinners | Ryan Coogler | Fruitvale Station

Read Prof. Godoy's Books:

Popular Injustice | Of Medicines and Markets

Support the pod:

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Read Nora and Marcus's Books:

Crowded Out: The True Costs of Crowdfunding Healthcare | Readying to Rise

Music: No Tears for a Wolf · Ahamefule J. Oluo · Okanomodé. Used with permission.

Logo by Nikki Barron.

Transcripts are machine-generated and imperfect.

Nora and Marcus's work on the podcast is separate from their professional roles and does not represent the views of their employers.

Links to bookshop.org are affiliate links.

This week on In The Meanwhile, Nora and Marcus stare into the news-cycle roulette wheel, where every slot reads "are you kidding me?" and land on America's default coping mechanism: militarism. Press freedom under attack. ICE acting like it's Fallujah. The President threatening war like it's a vibes-based policy choice. Totally normal stuff.

They're joined by Michael McPhearson, a U.S. Army veteran and head of Veterans for Peace, who calmly explains how forever wars abroad get rebranded and redeployed at home. From "enemy combatant" logic to Congress abandoning its job, McPhearson connects the dots and makes the apparently radical case that being anti-war is actually pro-veteran. Incisive, furious, and darkly funny. Strap in.

Mentioned in the episode:

Veterans for Peace | Iraq Sanctions | Abolition of the Army in Costa Rica | Mark Fisher: Capitalist Realism | Testament of Hope: The Essential Writings and Speeches of MLK Jr.

Support the pod:

Donate here to support In The Meanwhile

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Read Nora and Marcus's Books:

Crowded Out: The True Costs of Crowdfunding Healthcare | Readying to Rise

Music: No Tears for a Wolf · Ahamefule J. Oluo · Okanomodé. Used with permission.

Logo by Nikki Barron.

Transcripts are machine-generated and imperfect.

Nora and Marcus's work on the podcast is separate from their professional roles and does not represent the views of their employers.

Links to bookshop.org are affiliate links.

When politics feels less like a news cycle and more like a full-body stress test, we hit pause and ask the real question: how do we actually defend democracy, right now, with real people?

This week, Nora and Marcus sit down with Hannah Fried, CEO and co-founder of All Voting Is Local, for a conversation that's sharp, human, and refreshingly free of abstract hand-wringing. Fried breaks down how election interference actually works, not just the unhinged headline moments, but the quieter stuff: bureaucratic choke points, "technical" rule changes, and the slow grind of making voting harder on purpose. And she explains how organizers across the country are fighting back year-round to keep the ballot accessible, secure, and dignified.

It's urgent without being apocalyptic, hopeful without being naïve, and a reminder that democracy isn't a vibe, it's a practice. It lives in communities, relationships, and showing up over and over again. And when someone tries to take your vote? Hannah Fried is very clear: that's your cue to fight like hell.

Mentioned in the episode:

All Voting is Local | I am Legend | Minneapolis to ICE: Get the Fuck Out

Support the pod:

Donate here to support In The Meanwhile

Follow us:

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Read Nora and Marcus's Books:

Crowded Out: The True Costs of Crowdfunding Healthcare | Readying to Rise

Music: No Tears for a Wolf · Ahamefule J. Oluo · Okanomodé. Used with permission.

Logo by Nikki Barron.

Transcripts are machine-generated and imperfect.

Nora and Marcus's work on the podcast is separate from their professional roles and does not represent the views of their employers.

Links to bookshop.org are affiliate links.

We're dropping this mini-episode as new details emerge around the fatal shooting of Renee Nicole Good by an ICE agent. Nora and Marcus cut through the fog, the spin, and the both-sides media haze to talk plainly about what the video shows, what federal officials are claiming, and why those two things are in direct conflict.

They unpack how language is being weaponized to justify lethal force, why U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement accountability feels intentionally out of reach, and how this killing fits into a broader, deeply disturbing pattern. The stakes are named without euphemism: what happened to Renee could happen to anyone. And that is precisely why people are still showing up, still filming, still bearing witness, and still refusing the quiet that unaccountable power depends on.

Mentioned in the episode:

ProPublica Report on ICE violence against protestors | ProPublica: What the Trump Administration's Videos From a Chicago Immigration Raid Don't Show | Pramila Jayapal on KING5 | Jan 7 2026 ICE protest in Seattle| Ijeoma Oluo

Support the pod:

Donate here to support In The Meanwhile

Follow us:

Instagram | BlueSky | Website

Read Nora and Marcus's Books:

Crowded Out: The True Costs of Crowdfunding Healthcare | Readying to Rise

Music: No Tears for a Wolf · Ahamefule J. Oluo · Okanomodé. Used with permission.

Logo by Nikki Barron.

Transcripts are machine-generated and imperfect.

Nora and Marcus's work on the podcast is separate from their professional roles and does not represent the views of their employers.

Links to bookshop.org are affiliate links.

2025 is finally over! In this week's episode, Nora and Marcus take stock of a year that felt like two cursed decades duct-taped together, and ask the real question: what do we keep? Enter Alex Gallo-Brown, a labor organizer, poet, and the campaign manager behind Seattle's very real, very satisfying David-beats-Goliath mayoral upset. Together, they dig into how a scrappy, people-powered campaign took on big money, establishment politics, and doomscroll-induced despair—and won. It's a conversation about solidarity, humor as resistance, democracy vouchers, and why ordinary people stepping into the halls of power might be the most hopeful story we've got for the year ahead.

Mentioned in the episode:

Ep 3: Civic Bravery | Ep 8: Gabriel Teodros | Ep 11: Katie Wilson | Income Inequality in the US | AP: Here's why everyone's talking about a K shaped economy | Democracy Vouchers | Pablo Neruda | Labor Notes Books | Works & Days by Gina Myers | Bristlecone pines

Support the pod:

Donate here to support In The Meanwhile

Follow us:

Instagram | BlueSky | Website

Read Nora and Marcus's Books:

Crowded Out: The True Costs of Crowdfunding Healthcare | Readying to Rise

Music: No Tears for a Wolf · Ahamefule J. Oluo · Okanomodé. Used with permission.

Logo by Nikki Barron.

Transcripts are machine-generated and imperfect.

Nora and Marcus's work on the podcast is separate from their professional roles and does not represent the views of their employers.

Links to bookshop.org are affiliate links.