In this episode we speak with the writer Liz Pelly, who over the past 5 years has written a series of revelatory critical pieces about the streaming economy for The Baffler.

We discuss whether the distinction of Independence is all that useful in music at this point in history, take a look at the ways in which the streaming platforms flatter some kinds of music and have flattered to deceive for others, and question what the recent Spotify exclusivity deal with Joe Rogan might mean for musicians.