Emerge: Making Sense of What's Next

Jill Nephew - Using ChatGPT is Like Eating Plastic for Your Cognition

Listen Later

In this conversation I speak with Jill Nephew. Jill, a former AI black box algorithm engineer with extensive experience in developing software architectures, holds a highly heterodox perspective on the risks associated with LLM AIs. In this conversation we explore Jill's argument that using LLMs like ChatGPT or Bard are like eating plastic for your cognitive agency and natural intelligence, how it is that AIs could cause the rise of new 'supercults', and how another world is possible, if only we learn to ask the right questions.

If you enjoy this podcast and want to support it please consider becoming a Patreon supporter.


  • [3:52] The critical difference between cognition and thinking
  • [9:49] Why is using LLMs like eating plastic for our cognition?
  • [16:04] What LLMs represent in the context of the meta-crisis
  • [24:51] How LLMs signal trustworthiness and use randomness to confuse us and unground our cognition
  • [36:00] What we can expect to see as LLMs introduce more plastic into our cognition
  • [38:29] What ways of interacting with LLMs might be safe?
  • [47:52] What are cults and how do they function in relationship to our cognition?
  • [53:29] The possibility of an AI 'supercult'
  • [55:27] The most dangerous thing we do to each other
  • [59:48] The deep meaningfulness and richness of grounded cognition, going beyond trauma healing, beyond the monkey mind
  • [1:07:17] Technology to reclaim natural intelligence, the practice of inquiry, the difference between 'good' inquiry and 'bad' inquiry
  • [1:12:31] The rigorous engineering behind good inquiry forms
  • [1:13:29] The power of inquiry, the feeling of insight, how to achieve a quiet mind
  • [1:18:29] Jill's advice for how to respond to the acceleration of planetary destruction


    • Jill's Conversation with Layman Pascal on the Integral Stage⁠

    Inqwire, the software Jill has developed to help people reclaim their natural intelligence.

    Support Daniel on Patreon

    ...more
    View all episodesView all episodes
    Download on the App Store
    Emerge: Making Sense of What's NextBy Daniel Thorson
    • 4.7
    • 4.7
    • 4.7
    • 4.7
    • 4.7

    4.7

    103 ratings

    More shows like Emerge: Making Sense of What's Next

    View all
    Being Well with Forrest Hanson and Dr. Rick Hanson by Rick Hanson, Ph.D., Forrest Hanson

    Being Well with Forrest Hanson and Dr. Rick Hanson

    2,464 Listeners

    The Daily by The New York Times

    The Daily

    111,096 Listeners

    Deconstructing Yourself by Michael W. Taft

    Deconstructing Yourself

    392 Listeners

    Everyone Is Right by Integral Life

    Everyone Is Right

    42 Listeners

    Guru Viking Podcast by Guru Viking

    Guru Viking Podcast

    94 Listeners

    The One Inside: An Internal Family Systems (IFS) podcast by Tammy Sollenberger

    The One Inside: An Internal Family Systems (IFS) podcast

    266 Listeners

    The Jim Rutt Show by The Jim Rutt Show

    The Jim Rutt Show

    255 Listeners

    IFS Talks by Aníbal Henriques, Tisha Shull & Alexia Rothman

    IFS Talks

    192 Listeners

    The Ezra Klein Show by New York Times Opinion

    The Ezra Klein Show

    15,546 Listeners

    Inner Cosmos with David Eagleman by iHeartPodcasts

    Inner Cosmos with David Eagleman

    577 Listeners