Part 1 of 2. In his most in-depth and wide ranging interview since becoming First Minister of Scotland, John Swinney joins Bernard and Alex.

• "I was exhausted" when Nicola Sturgeon stood down in 2023. My year out revitalised me and allowed me to become First Minister.
• If I'm elected as First Minister in 2026, I'll stand again in 2031.
• 2024 General Election was a "punishing defeat" delivered by people "disappointed in the SNP".
• The SNP government needs to rebuild trust by showing the electorate it is delivering.
• Independence will be in the manifesto and a referendum if there's the appetite.
• I have sympathy on Council Tax but won't re-value properties.

Focussing on UK, Scottish and Global politics, if you like other great political podcasts like The Rest is Politics, The News Agents, Newscast, Questions Time, Holyrood Sources, Planet Holyrood, The Stooshie, The Steamie, Scotcast, Americast etc etc then The Ponsonby and Massie Podcast could be a great show to add to your list of favourites.

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