Land Decolonized Podcast

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Chief Edward (Ted) Williams of the Chippewas of Rama First Nation is on the show this week. The home of the popular and successful "Casino Rama" development, Chief Williams speaks to dealing with COVID-19, and plans for reopening the community with a large retail centre. Having a deep history in lands related work dating back to the early 1970s, he says the land code was part of community planning, and Rama was one of the early adopters to sign onto the Framework on First Nation Land Management from the beginning. Rama has had a history of exploring opportunities and moving quickly and believes communities should take this step towards land management because, "its our land, its our voice and its our control."


SHOW NOTES
:34  Richard welcomes Chief Ted Williams to the podcast.
:52  Chief outlines his community's response to the Covid-19 pandemic. The Band got out in front of this issue. The famous Rama Casino has been closed. Despite its economic importance, it will not open until the time is right. Usually two to three million visitors per year!
2:35  They handled Covid planning in earnest about ten days before it happened.
3:27  Chief has been involved with land for more than 40 years. They has surrendered some land for an industrial park in the early 80s and had clients. They won bid for Casino Rama in 1974, and wanted to place it on the waterfront but the community said no. Its current location was supposed to be temporary. Casino open now for 25 years and is a huge employer and revenue generator. Economic development has always been a priority.
6:24  Rama became one of the first signatories to the framework agreement in the mid-90s.
6:56  What does 'speed of business' mean to him? A good example is cannabis. Land was designated commercial earlier and retail operation opened quickly.
8:23   Great to be able to pick up the phone and deal quickly. Cutting out Ottawa for approvals around land use is ideal because no one knows about the land more than the community.
9:15  36,000 square foot retail building is open to leasing arrangements and lots of inquiries locally and national companies who want to locate at Rama. Building will be filled before Christmas. Lots of jobs and feeding other Band businesses, including two Tim Hortons outlets, the only Nation in Canada having two.
11:18  Chief describes the process of developing land and the role of council, staff and land code committee. Based on community's strategic planning and local input. No more waiting for Indian Affairs.
13:15  Band has settled two treaty negotiations and other items are under discussion that could involve further development. Possible land purchases and additions to reserve.
14:44  Resource Centre staff were fabulous in development of a land code promotion strategy for on and off-reserve members (mentions Cassandra in particular). Very thorough campaign. with in-person, web, digital, mail and more venues for sharing information. It led to a Yes vote of 91%.
18:20 Chief Williams shares his personal journey as it relates to colonization and the negative impact of an incomplete Canadian history. Being told what they should earn, where they should live, where to get spiritual needs met. Decolonization is about learning who you really are, where you come from and your own history. There is much work to be done .
22:20  Has land code helped with decolonization? Yes, land is our Mother Earth and we need to look after it. It helps create pride and a feeling of identity. We choose. We can compete in the Canadian mosaic.
24:30 What is his advice to other communities contemplating signing on to the framework agreement? You should be in control!
25:25. Chief expresses his communi

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Adam Good, Band Manager of Shawanaga First Nation near Lake Huron, Ontario, has been involved in the land code process from day one in his community. He was instrumental in shaping the community engagement and advocacy process. And with the prospect of an expanding land base (now under negotiation), having that foundation as a law-making entity will be critical to his community's success.

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Williams Lake First Nation's Chief Willie Sellars Jr. is on the show this week to talk about the positive developments that have come since passing the land code 7 years ago. Having been involved early on, Chief Sellars Jr. attributes strong community engagement and support for why land code works for them. Under his leadership, cultural revitalization balances the many economic development interests in this well-situated community.

SHOW NOTES:
1:03 Chief Sellars congratulates RP and team on the podcast.
2:06 Population of Williams Lake and rural surroundings is diverse with about 50,000 population and is really the hub to a number of 15 First Nation communities.
3:26 They own a golf course and campsite and are moving into future tourism opportunities. Investing in culture and language revitalization.
4:43 Chief Sellars talks about his background at university, as a firefighter and then moving into the role of a special projects coordinator and then onto council. He really liked the community engagement process of the land code process, including urban engagement sessions to engage as many as possible. Highest voter turnout ever, since eclipsed! 95% said Yes.
7:57 Land Code basically sold itself because of so much animosity toward the federal control over the Band.
8:58 Chief says they've been lucky with capacity and great hiring for legal counsel, economic development positions. He had great mentorship under a woman chief.
11:03. Land Code has led to the development of other laws, including real matrimonial property law, dog nuisance, etc. A balance between people who want change and those who say you're moving too fast. Very challenging.
12:42 How does he find balance? Golf, basketball, year-round skating, taking kids fishing.
14:37 Land management helped with a big highway landing project and local infrastructure development. 49 acres of reserve land was needed to build out the highway. The band turned down lowball offers for land value. Land Code gave Band huge credibility and leverage.
Important to build homes and create a tax base for own-source revenues. And most important, $2 million in wages went to members! Many other jobs from Band-owned enterprises. Open for business at the speed of business.
24:00 Chief Sellars gets into the demographics of membership, located around the world. They've had great engagement with them, which is difficult, but vital. Land Code brought them together on a common cause.
25:50 He talks about the engagement strategy with the community, especially in light of Covid and the move to online spaces. He loves getting people into a room to meet face-to-face. Elders provide important advice, especially in the recent Kamloops tragedy and the investigations that will be required. All nations are included because they all had people go to that school.
29:30 Chief discusses his thoughts on 'decolonization'. He wants to see First Nations on a level playing field, but there is still discrimination, especially in an old-school town and municipalities need more education. Hard for them to accept new concepts, such as leasing on First Nations land. There is an awakening in Indian country. Yes, we can celebrate those children coming home, but there is so much more to do. People need to prove themselves by doing more than using the reconciliation buzzword.
32:50 A few jokes about golf and Richard signs off.
33:38 Episode ends

LINKS:
Williams Lake First Nation (T'exelcemc)
First Nations Land Management Resource Centre
Framework Agreement on First Nations Land Managem

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Our 25th episode takes us to Coast Salish territory in British Columbia. Former chief Willie Charlie of Sts'ailes First Nation joins the show this week. Willie is currently a negotiator who has had a broad array of experience and perspective on the history of land use that is still rich in memory.  Having watched the transition to land code, Willie says it is the protection of the environment has been a fundamental priority, law-making to deal with COVID-19, and easing into economic development and land use in the way the community is comfortable with - short term commitments that help balance revenue generation with the ongoing protection of land.

SHOW NOTES:

1:45 Willie tells us where his community is located, in a pristine valley about a two-hour drive east of Vancouver.
3:33 He had many opportunities to leave as a young man but wanted to keep his family in this way of life. He represented Canada.
4:39 He served on council prior to deciding to run for Chief. His role is quite different today in a 'non-political' role. Gives him added perspective. He had a varied career as a teacher, in corrections, and in his own business.
6:25 Willie says there were many examples of 'Big Brother' interfering with the Band, which helped spur interest in the Land Code. They were never compensated for logging in their territory.
8:10 Land Code has offered protection of the environment..good clean land, water, and air. They were able to create their own laws to govern the preservation of their lands. It now also offers the chance to seek business opportunities without having to seek approval in Victoria or Ottawa.
9:50 Additions to Reserve process has been very frustrating. Fifteen years over a road issue!
11:37 Land code is fairly new and Sts'ailes is off the beaten path, so they're moving slowly toward economic development. Now negotiating with BC and Canada on separate reconciliation agreements, which could mean more land to work with. Whatever is done the same approach should be taken with lands off-reserve in their traditional territory. Land code has helped pave the way.
13:52 Some pipe (not for the TransMountain Pipeline) being stored in a light industrial park, doing some milling and logging but new opportunities will come. The community wasn't comfortable with leasing out too much land. They negotiated a role to be involved in any cleanup since they know the land, rivers, and lakes so well.
18:20 Land Code is only 3 years old and there is much engagement as it ties into comprehensive community planning. The pandemic also meant they used their law-making ability to deal with Covid-19. They initiated a lockdown and restricted movement, which required adjustment as conditions changed. This was self-policed.
23:07 How the FNLMRC has helped guide the community through the land code process, especially with its knowledge of approaches across the country. Willie often talks with other communities about the Sts'ailes experience.
25:07 Willie shares his vision for the immediate future, especially moving toward self-governance. Land Code was an excellent step in that direction, along with FNFMB certification that allowed for 10-year grant funding. There will be bumps and mistakes, but at least they have the authority and control to address issues, not relying on others. Land Code is a significant step.
27:30 Listeners can contact him or Lands Manager Dawn Charlie.
28:00 Richard promotes Sts'ailes website.

LINKS:
Sts'ailes website
Willie Charlie email: [email protected]
First Nations Land Management Resource Centre

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Chairman of the Land Advisory Board Robert Louie is back on the show for a special extended episode in celebration of the 100th Land Code passed in Canada. Robert says "Land Decolonized" means a resurgence of Indian people, First Nations Land Management succeeds because it is community-driven, yet the main challenge has been to get the government to move faster.  Robert notes his biggest inspiration to stand up in life being something his learned from his Grandmother

SHOW NOTES:
00:26 Richard introduces Robert Louie

1:38 Robert shares his excitement over recently marking the 101st community to approve its land code. He also shares what his colleagues were thinking as they first explored the idea.

3:21 Communities across Canada have shared good news after being recognized as governments without the interference of other levels. It is real governance authority. It's the future.

4:47 Robert describes his interpretation of decolonization as the dismantlement of the Indian Affairs bureaucracy, no longer prisoners, no longer considered inferior or less worthy. It had to change. Land decolonized is a resurgence of Indian people.

6:30  Does he have a strong personal reason for his mission? Yes, he saw things growing up and decided to follow his proud grandmother's lead to "stand up". People looked at them in a derogatory manner. Suppression was something they had to live with. Today feels like "liberation."

10:20 He heard so many charges of "You're selling out" that it made him furious, blaming opposition to land code on poor communication, often on purpose.

11:55 Land Governance Registration Act proposal is stalled and not likely to be dealt with until fall at the earliest. This would simplify the legislation and help avoid confusion over interpretation of the Act and the Framework Agreement itself.

13:46 Online workshops and training will be more common in the future as a result of the pandemic. Eg: the national conversation on Indigenous law enforcement. Band laws that protect community health need to be recognized and enforced, and we need to rely on the RCMP and provincial police to assist.

16:02 Funding is always an issue. Need to find resources and means of generating revenue in communities, requiring a further look at taxation opportunities.

17:12 Discussion of the integration of national organizations on land code, taxation, financial management and finance authority. This is their 3rd year, but Covid has impacted meetings. Still a desire to work together once Covid subsides.

19:00 Is the land code tidal movement spreading eastward? Yes! the 100th community is in Quebec, and land codes passed in New Brunswick, Nova Scotia, and even Newfoundland and Labrador.

20:13 Robert explains why Indigenous people are used to collaborating and supporting each other through the land code process. "We're all in the same canoe and had better paddle in the same direction."

21:35 How has the movement stayed strong in strategic direction? He credits the fact that it is community-based. We want the good things that all Canadian do.

22:45 Biggest challenge ahead? Getting government to move quicker, for example, on the enforcement issue. The entrenchment of old policies needs to be cleared away. The biggest opportunity is that there is a clear option for communities can proceed with self-government. It took 25 years to reach 101 operational communities. He sees it speeding up in future years because the studies prove it's working well. Governance is at the crux of it.

25:30 A great story about Robert's grandmother challenging a bear and forcing it to stand down. He learned something that day, even

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This week Richard sits down close to home with Rose Paul of Paqtnkek Mi'kmaw Nation in Nova Scotia. Paqtnkek is currently a developmental community that is looking to have its land code ratification vote in the fall of 2021. Rose has walked her community through the process by engaging with many other communities and taking up many of the available options for self-government, all while planning for land management implementation and building a strong economic foundation for her community along the way.


SHOW NOTES

:30   Richard's intro of Rose Paul, the driving force behind the land code process at Paqtnkek Mi'kmaw Nation, 23 km east of Antigonish in Nova Scotia.

2:25   Rose describes how she got excited about the opportunities from the framework agreement and meeting with Robert Louie, chair.

3:30   Rose took Band staff and councillors to other Atlantic communities adopting the land code. They shared similar struggles with the Indian Act.

5:34   She says the key benefit is taking control of the systems to protect the environment and sacred sites while also planning for future development for seven generations.

7:32   A government letter that denied commercial development on the Band land across the highway continues to motive Rose. It spurred her on to confronting an unfair system.

10:12.   Rose describes what now exists on land once forbidden - a $14 million travel centre that houses nine business entities with plans for more.

12:45   Rose credits sister First Nations with helping her along and introducing her to other national players such as the tax commission, finance authority, financial management board and others that work so well together. Great things began to happen once introduced to the land code process.

19:14   Rose really enjoys hearing the stories from this podcast series and is using it to reach out to others across Canada. She commends other communities for joining the process.

20:46   She has a bold vision for the next 7-10 years if the community ratifies the land code. Plans include a potential hotel, business centre, residential development, energy partnerships and other joint ventures operating at the speed of business.

23:25   Huge props to the resource centre team for their support and encouragement!

23:57   Richard's closing and thanks for making us #4 last month in the Apple Podcast rankings for Non-Profits in Canada!

LINKS
Paqtnkek Mi'kmaw Nation
Bayside Travel Centre at Paqtnkek
Rose Paul's email: [email protected]

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The Resource Centre is thriving with a dedicated strategy for Training, Mentorship & Professional Development (TMPD). Angie Derrickson, TMPD Manager is on the show this week to explain the details of the strategies 4 year evolution, the webinars and “knowledge path tool” that are offered to First Nations.

SHOW NOTES

00:53    Angie takes a break from giving a presentation to BC Links to Learning to speak with Richard about her work at the Resource Centre
1:57    Her role in delivering capacity support covers a broad program of courses, workshops and other training resources.
2:47   Angie describes the collaboration among staff and those within a developmental community from the time they sign a framework agreement and individual agreement with Canada.
3:50   Land registry is often a popular topic for early learning.
4:42   Her background was in land management, as senior lands officer at Westbank First Nation, which is now self-governing. Moving from the Indian Act to Land Code involved lots of transitional work. Her work gives her insights into the issues facing land managers today.
7:54   Understanding her audience is key to delivering training and explaining the legalities behind the framework agreement. Her team provides direct community support. Richard gives a shoutout to Danielle Allain of the Eastern Region for her work at Paqtnkek Mi'kmaw Nation, now a developmental First Nation under the framework agreement.
10:00   The resource centre has save-the-date events between now and December 2021 to provide current training across the country. Topics can be changed to react to any developing 'breaking news' in the land code space. These are separate from any national online conversations that might be taking place.
12:23   The 'knowledge path tool' is fairly new and helps individuals and teams determine what kind of training they need. It's all about defining what a community wants to accomplish with their land code.
14:39  Her strategy is to make sure online tools are there from nations with experience to help others just starting out on their land code journey. She responds to new issues and developments that require training support.
15:54   Example: The change in community ratification processes now supports e-voting, so new training was required for that.
17:05  Angie encourages visits to the events page and to register. Workshops are open to all, not just signatory nations. She welcomes questions!
18:18  Richard promotes Events and Contact Us pages on the website.

LINKS:
Upcoming 'save-the-date' LABRC training events
Framework Agreement on First Nation Land Management

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Andrew Beynon and Richard discuss the upcoming (April 28th) National Online Conversation on Enforcement of Indigenous Government Laws  2021:First Nation Policing Program & Policy Update. (This episode was recorded one day before the online session.)

The online conversation will include Public Safety Canada and the RCMP providing an update on First Nation policing, including updates on Minister Bill Blair's mandate commitment to co-develop a legislative framework that will ensure that police services better reflect the communities they serve. In addition, this session will explore recent First Nation experiences with innovations in policing.

show notes:

1:23 Richard provides a reminder of two previous Covid and legal podcasts featuring Andrew Beynon (Episode 3 and Episode 4 - December 2020) 

2:15 Andrew talks about why talking about the Policing Program and Policy update was important and the issue of underenforcement or gaps in indigenous laws and how the "National Online Conversation" came to be.

3:40 Andrew summarizes the National Online Conversation events that occurred in 2020 and the content can still be accessed at www.indigenousenforcement.com - topics such as matrimonial property laws, COVID-19 laws, practical guidance for law enforcement, and broad level discussion on Indigenous justice (ft. UBC Chancellor Steven Lewis Point). 

5:06 Richard and Andrew talk about the difficulty of enforcing laws and the common theme across Canada - the legacy of underenforcement of laws under the Indian Act (bylaws) on First Nations the progress made and the reality that enforcement of laws will always be an ongoing issue for First Nation Governments. 

8:16 Andrew explains who this National Online Conversation event is made for people who work in the area of law enforcement, but also federal, provincial/territorial government officials, and has invited a decorated panel of representatives who have operated policing in First Nation communities. 

11:03 Andrew explains further that this conversation is practical in nature, not academic, and the focus is on what are the things that are based on experience that First Nations would like to think about. 

12:05 Andrew reiterates that for those who are unable to attend the online event in person to visit the dedicated website www.indigenousenforcement.com and todays session will be recorded and uploaded there, in addition to the monthly sessions coming up. 

13:05 Andrew shares the best place to get in touch for more information on this topic is to follow the RC website www.labrc.com and him personally via email at [email protected] 

13:36 Andrew adds information about the upcoming National Online Conversations: May will feature Saskatchewan pilot project on enforcement of First Nation laws and further interesting conversations in June, July and throughout the year. 

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After 2000 downloads of the podcast, our 20th episode takes us to the thriving community of Membertou First Nation in Nova Scotia! Richard interviews Trevor Bernard, a lawyer, and Executive Director who has watched his community's transformation over the last 30 years. This community was the first in Nova Scotia to pass a land code and did so with a large amount of community engagement and a vision for prioritizing self-government initiatives and embracing a new level of jurisdiction. This approach has been a compliment to their growing business presence and strategy for making Membertou a true destination in the region.


SHOW NOTES:
1:19   Trevor describes Membertou's location within Sydney, Cape Breton.
2:26  Membertou bought parcels of land that were once its home community before a forced re-location.
3:24   As ED, he oversees most of the band's government programs and provides legal counsel and is experienced in the land code process. He oversees the lands department. Became operational in 2019. Began exploring the process in 2010 and became developmental in 2012.
5:54   Why it took longer than first thought to become 'operational'.
7:35   Trevor describes their unique approach to community education over the framework agreement. It all started with talks over a connector road. Membertou was developing its brand as 'a destination' with subsequent business interests who wanted to locate there. Key was to assert more jurisdiction outside the Indian Act.
10:14   Formation of a governance committee open to all members. That group took ownership and helped inform others about the framework agreement.
14:45   There was some concern about banks' ability to foreclose but people were reassured that it was not part of land code.
16:49   Trevor went to law school in 1991 and thought he would never return due to poverty and indebtedness. Not much was going on. Then - the transformation! More fiscal resources meant less reliance on Ottawa.
20:25   Land Code lays down values and principles around land management so it is crucial to other laws, certificate of possession, zoning, etc.
23:20   Additions to reserve and aggressive residential development.
25:26   Now with the ability to operate at the speed of business. Eg: Hampton Inn development.
28:50.  His predictions over the future now that 100th community is about to go operational. Gives shoutout to Resource Centre staff for their help and expertise. Membertou would not be there in land management without them!
31:36   Richard's extra and call-to-action.

LINKS:
Email: [email protected]
Twitter: @mb2law
First Nation Land Management Resource Centre: labrc.com
Membertou First Nation website: https://membertou.ca/

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James Cada from Mississauga First Nation joins the show this week. This Land Advisory Board member is a 30 year veteran of land management and his community of Mississauga First Nation enjoyed a smooth transition to self-government over their lands with many benefits and along the way.

SHOW NOTES:
1:52   Jim describes his experience with the Land Code in his capacity as director of operations. Phil Goulais, Austin Bear and Robert Louie played key roles.
2:45 Had a draft land code by 2003. Tells the story of a road that was a critical element. Wasn't passed until 2009.
4:03  No issues with land registry. There were no Certificate of Possession (CP) on the occupied land base and no surveys.
4:48  The land code has led to several laws, including waste management, noise bylaw, community protection (important in Covid management in a small community.)
6:11.  Had only .16 acres of land when the code was passed! But added land later.
8:14   History of having land use plan covering historic and sacred sites to protect. That stalled but community is still working on it. Covid has affected consultation.
9:51  Comments on approaching 100 operational communities within the framework agreement. A long way from those original 14! "We are in charge" and no longer having to deal with ISC.
11:16  Jim enjoys speaking in other communities about the benefits of land code.
12:20   He sees much improved relationships with businesses, especially Hydro and Union Gas.
13:11   Jim developed a good rapport with Resource Centre staff and has great things to say about the level of support.
14:12   Bill Henderson and other legal counsel have been great.
14:33.  The best way to contact Jim is by email at the Band office.
15:03   Richard promotes upcoming shows.




LINKS: