We're living in unusual times, with political history being made every week and the seemingly imminent collapse of a certain global super power on the horizon. "Once you pull on the thread of collapse, the entire tapestry of history begins to unravel," writes Luke Kemp. What can we learn from looking at the collapse of past societies?

• Guest: Luke Kemp, research affiliate at the Centre for the Study of Existential Risk at the University of Cambridge. His first book is 'Goliath’s Curse: The History and Future of Societal Collapse'.

Originally broadcast on 21 May, 2025