Dr. Bethany Johnson returns to the show to share the deep history of the plague, and how we should be thinking about it today. She talks about how anti-Chinese and anti-Mexican sentiment impacted the mitigation and spread of the plague in the early 1900s. Bethany also talks about how climate change may impact infectious disease, antibiotic resistance, lyme disease, pet safety, mitigation measures, and what the defunding of government organizations will mean for us. 

She also has advice for all of those of us–and our dads out there–with wood piles in our backyard. 

Plus a few updates about The Means Sibs.

Bethany's first episode on measles!

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Jessica Wilson's book: It's Always Been Ours; Rewriting the Story of Black Women's Bodies

ABC News: Casey Means Senate statement

Breaking Big Food

Calley Means has left the White House

1630 plague

WHO Manual for plague surveillance, diagnosis, prevention and control

CDC page on plague

Traces of life in the death registries of the 1630 plague in Milano

We’ve been a lot of places with RFK Jr, his conspiracy theories, magical thinking, lies, his meltdowns in front of Senate committees, and seen that he doesn’t understand half of the things he talks about.

Exhibit A: He thinks babies are grown in placentas

Let’s make sure we’re clear on RFK’s indisputable, irrefutable cause of autism going forward. Today I share his gold standard science-certified cause of autism. 

Selena Salfen’s quote

Tylenol ad

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Jessica Wilson's book: It's Always Been Ours; Rewriting the Story of Black Women's Bodies

Kyle Davis, MSW, LICSW, joins the show to talk about his experience with Assertive Community Treatment for supporting people with severe and persistent mental illness. He shares details of that model today and what autonomy can actually look like when people are out of institutions and living in society. In Jessica’s interview with psychiatrist Dr. Carole Lieberman, Dr. Carole shared her belief that one of the biggest problems in psychiatry is that people with mental illness were released from institutions, and given the least restrictive environment for their care. This claim warranted a full follow-up episode and Kyle joined the show to share his thoughts about the claim that people can develop insight while living in institutions and he shares how a multi-disciplinary approach proves that people heal best in their communities and is more beneficial long-term than having more community clinics.

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Jessica Wilson's book: It's Always Been Ours; Rewriting the Story of Black Women's Bodies

MAHA and Cuteservatives are okay with spending millions on measles outbreaks yet want to control people’s food choices in the name of “health.” People are able to buy raw milk with SNAP, yet shouldn’t be allowed to buy a candybar? The math is not mathing. Today’s episode is a follow up to the episode released 10/1/25, “Fauci Needs to Be Locked Up!” with Dr. Carole Lieberman. Jessica responds to some of Dr. Carole’s claims, and has a good time with her own acronym for ways to avoid getting COVID. 

THOUGHTS AND PRAYERS!

Buy raw milk with SNAP

ADHD medications and substance use

RFK’s CDC on vaccines

Herd immunity

Clip Jessica posted on Instagram of Dr. Carole

Jessica’s MAHA Mindy makeover

RFK fires CDC workers and then brings them back

Dr. Fauci work timeline

Measles can cost $47K per case

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Jessica Wilson's book: It's Always Been Ours; Rewriting the Story of Black Women's Bodies

Jessica Wilson, MS. RD. is joined by Blake Flaugher, MPH, to give Jessica a full breakdown of poppers and RFK Jr.’s AIDS denialism. Jessica is very curious about butt stuff and Blake expertly answers her questions. He also answers a listener question about the spectrum of asexuality. The two have this conversation at a brewery and got the opportunity to make things awkward! Blake updates Jessica on the state of sex education in 2025 and shares what he’s found grounding and motivating as he continues to do this work. 

Blake's first Making it Awkward ep

AIDS denialism 

FDA crackdown on poppers 

Legality of poppers 

Go Ask Alice

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Jessica Wilson's book: It's Always Been Ours; Rewriting the Story of Black Women's Bodies

Psychiatrist Dr. Carole Lieberman, M.D., M.P.H. joins Jessica Wilson, M.S. RD. for a robust conversation about COVID, Dr. Fauci, RFK Jr., the MAHA report and whether supplements can fix our mental health. 

Dr. Carole specializes in the psychology of terrorism, criminal behavior, and political breakdown. She’s a frequent guest on Fox News, Newsmax, OAN, and leading patriot platforms. Her bold insights expose how psychological tactics once used by foreign enemies are now being weaponized against the American people. Dr. Lieberman connects the dots between radical indoctrination, media-fueled hysteria, and how psychological warfare is now being deployed inside the U.S.—not just abroad.

I was so compelled by this interview that I’ll be having a follow up episode exploring her ideas! If you have thoughts, ideas or want to send a voice memo with your feedback about this episode you can email them to [email protected]. 

Dr. Carole on FOX news re: the VP debate

RFK Jr. and wellness farms

Elizabeth Blackwell

First MAHA report

Second MAHA report

Recent Interviews with Carole Lieberman

1. Real America's Voice with Eric Bolling

2. NY Post on Bryan Kohberger

3. OAN with Dan Ball

4. Joe Pags Show

Kaila Yu, author of the newly released Fetishized; A Reckoning with Yellow Fever, Feminism, and Beauty, joins Jessica Wilson, MS RD the show to talk about the fetishization of Asian women. 

Kaila reflects on the women in the media who influenced her, and her path into the pinup and import modeling industry. She devotes a chapter to the book and film Memoirs of a Geisha and Jessica and Kaila talk about the ways the book and movie continue to impact societal views of Asian women. 

They also got into the origins of the model minority myth and the connections to trad wives today. 

In Fetishized Kaila also explores the legacy of U.S. occupation in shaping Western perceptions of Asian women.

Kaila in Teen Vogue re: Love Island 

Fetishized; A Reckoning with Yellow Fever, Feminism, and Beauty

Kaila on Instagram

Fetishized in NYT!

Atlanta spa shooting 

“Oxford Study” on social media

Debunking “Oxford Study”

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Jessica Wilson's book: It's Always Been Ours; Rewriting the Story of Black Women's Bodies

MAHA’s Making Our Children Healthy Again Strategy Report is out, and “strategy” is a generous term for this document. Beef farmer Trampus Harmon and public health dietitians Selena Salfen and Meghan Cichy return to the show to share their thoughts. 

Post production note: Dr. Casey Means has resumed the path to becoming Surgeon General and is declaring her conflicts of interest. 

Dr. Jessica Knurick newsletter

Marion Nestle

Wellness Farms

RFK Jr on autism

Trampus on collagen and beef tallow

Trampus on raw milk

Meghan and Selena on the first MAHA report

Meghan and Selena on Levels and CGMs

Meghan and Selena on the first 100days of RFK

Selena and the Levels intro

Selena’s Regrifting episode on Casey and Calley Means

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Jessica Wilson's book: It's Always Been Ours; Rewriting the Story of Black Women's Bodies

Would you ever add chia seeds to your latte? Levels Health, a health-tech startup co-founded by presumptive Surgeon General Casey Means, is a deeply unserious company and provides both hilarious and irresponsible guidance on its app. 

Public health dietitians Selena Salfen and Meghan Cichy return to the show to discuss our 30 days of using a CGM paired with the Levels app. 

Jessica didn’t find what she was looking for in her CGM data and laughed at the app’s inaccuracies. 

Meghan thought she was working harder than Levels, and found both more helpful and nicer CGM feedback with ChatGPT. 

Selena shared her history with health anxiety and her longer term use of a Stelo CGM. She shares how her experience was impacted when Levels provided her with incorrect data and biometric analyses. 

The three get into whether we should be using CGMs and if so, under what conditions. 

The three also discuss the most recent Levels podcast #280 and how it seems to answer a lot of concerns Selena and Jessica had in the CGM intro episode. The episode also discussed a lack of research to back up claims made by Levels and Casey Means herself. Host Ben Grynol and guest Dom D’Agostino, PhD took an unexpected turn and veered into the closed off “adult” section of Blockbuster; could there be a tie to food choices and curiosity? 

Imprecision Nutrition? Intraindividual Variability of Glucose Responses to Duplicate Presented Meals in Adults Without Diabetes

Casey’s Instagram post with her food scores 

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Follow Jessica Wilson on Instagram @jessicawilson.msrd and TikTok @byjessicawilson

Jessica Wilson's book: It's Always Been Ours; Rewriting the Story of Black Women's Bodies

Journalist Jamie Ducharme joins the show for the 100th episode!! She talks with Jessica about her  experiences after the TIME magazine article, “Still Processing; Not all  Ultra-Processed Foods are the same. Or, some argue, even unhealthy.”* was published. RFK Jr entered the chat about the article and things got a bit out of hand. 

The two talk about food as identity and nutrition journalism today and why there seems to be a lot of stories that don’t add much to the conversation. 

*This is the print edition title. The online title changed to Why One Dietitian is Speaking Up for Ultra Processed Foods, as discussed in this episode. 

Jessica’s ultra-processed food experiment results

Jessica’s ultra-processed food experiment parameters

Jessica’s Slate op-ed: Ultra-processed Foods Have a Terrible Reputation. They Don’t Deserve It.

Avoiding UPFs may DOUBLE weight loss

Marty Makary on The Conversation

Jessica reading feedback she got about TIME

This episode is sponsored by BIG FOOD

Initial TIME recap episode

Like this episode? You can rate, review, subscribe, follow, share and comment!

Questions about the show? Guest pitches? Email [email protected]

You can buy awkward merch!

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Follow Jessica Wilson on Instagram @jessicawilson.msrd and TikTok @byjessicawilson

Jessica Wilson's book: It's Always Been Ours; Rewriting the Story of Black Women's Bodies