In this episode of More or Less, we dive into the shifting landscape of AI, attention, and business models. From the rise of ChatGPT as both productivity tool and entertainment, to the coming collision between commerce and AI-driven recommendations, the Morins and Lessins debate what’s hype, what’s real, and where the next big opportunities are for startups and VCs. Plus: the truth about local news, why coding is fun again, and a pop culture corner you won’t want to miss.

Chapters:

01:30 – Wedding Stories & The Early Jackson Hole Days

03:00 – Interviewing Mark Zuckerberg Goes Wrong

09:30 – Building Audiences: Why Longer is Better (and Sponsors Are Lining Up)

14:00 – Is AI for Productivity or Personal Use? The Real Data

16:00 – Big Tech vs. Startups: Who Wins Consumer AI?

20:00 – Can AI Save Local News? The Verticalization Debate

24:00 – The Real Business of Local Data: City Councils and Real Estate

28:30 – AI Business Models: Advertising, Affiliate, or Something New?

31:00 – Is AI Stealing Attention from Instagram? The Frenetic Race

33:00 – Commerce, Discovery, and the Death of Search

37:00 – The Productivity Trap: Why Margins Go to Zero

39:00 – How Are VCs Really Using AI? The Memory Game

40:30 – AI as Entertainment: Coding vs. Netflix

43:00 – The Future of Commerce: Push vs. Pull, Meta vs. OpenAI

46:00 – Google, Gemini, and the Battle for Relevance

47:30 – Late Night Coding: Why Claude Is Addictive

53:00 – Pop Culture Corner: Lena Dunham, AI Bands, and Wimbledon

We’re also on ↓X: https://twitter.com/moreorlesspodInstagram: https://instagram.com/moreorlessSpotify: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/moreorlesspodConnect with us here:1) Sam Lessin: https://x.com/lessin2) Dave Morin: https://x.com/davemorin3) Jessica Lessin: https://x.com/Jessicalessin4) Brit Morin: https://x.com/brit

We’re joined by a very special guest, Solana founder Anatoly Yakovenko for a wide-ranging conversation on crypto, tech, and what’s next. He breaks down the “punks, hoodies, suits” cycle, why AI is just a product while crypto is a movement, and how stablecoins are quietly driving global USD adoption. He shares his $1T stablecoin prediction, explains the Solana phone’s goal to challenge app store monopolies, and argues that crypto’s future lies not in mass adoption, but in serving a small group of high-value users.

Chapters:

00:00 Intro & Anatoly’s Backstory

03:20 Crypto’s Evolution: Punks, Hoodies, and Suits

07:00 Bitcoin, Meme Investing, and the Value of Ideas

12:00 Meme Coins: Infrastructure and Insanity

17:45 Why Build a Crypto Phone? Platform Wars Explained

24:00 Talent, Incentives, and the Crypto Dilemma

30:00 Stablecoins, Dollar Hegemony, and Global Finance

39:50 The Punks Are the Bankers Now

41:10 The Internet, Extremes, and the Death of Truth

49:00 Engagement, Incentives, and the Future of Platforms

52:20 Are the Punks Too Rich to Care?

54:30 Wrap-Up: Bold Predictions and Where Crypto Goes Next

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1) Sam Lessin: https://x.com/lessin

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4) Brit Morin: https://x.com/brit

This week, the gloves come off. We're diving into Meta's raid on OpenAI, asking if Mark Zuckerberg is the new Yankees of AI and who will be the 'Moneyball' underdog. Plus, a hot take on why usage-based pricing for AI is a flawed model, the challenge of creating 'God-tier' content that works everywhere, and why AI researchers are now earning more than soccer superstars. It's a packed episode you don't want to miss!

Chapters:

00:00 - Intro

01:18 - X vs. Threads: A Tale of Two Internets

04:38 - The “God Content” Challenge: Can You Go Viral Everywhere?

11:15 - Google’s “Last Gasp” to Save Publishers

14:23 - The Next Big Thing: Vanity Checks & Gold Delivery

20:15 - The Problem with AI Business Models

21:52 - Usage-Based Pricing is Generally Bad

26:45 - The Big News: Meta’s OpenAI Raid

29:45 - The AI Moneyball Era: Who are the Oakland A’s?

34:26 - What Will Meta’s New Super-Team Actually Build?

41:10 - The “Baller” Leader Move OpenAI Didn’t Make

42:50 - AI Researchers Are The New Rockstars

44:45 - F1 Movie: The Best Film of the Year?

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Connect with us here:

1) Sam Lessin: https://x.com/lessin

2) Dave Morin: https://x.com/davemorin

3) Jessica Lessin: https://x.com/Jessicalessin

4) Brit Morin: https://x.com/brit

Join the More or Less crew for a Summer Edition from the cabins! We dive into how AI is reshaping hiring, the future of resumes, the rise of agentic coding assistants, and why service businesses suck (unless you're Brit doing a fun side-hustle ). As always, we tackle the latest in tech news from The Information, from OpenAI's copyright battles to the next phase of Bumble and the realities of Tesla's Robotaxis.

We’re also on ↓X: https://twitter.com/moreorlesspodInstagram: https://instagram.com/moreorlessSpotify: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/moreorlesspod

Connect with us here:1) Sam Lessin: https://x.com/lessin2) Dave Morin: https://x.com/davemorin3) Jessica Lessin: https://x.com/Jessicalessin4) Brit Morin: https://x.com/brit

This week on More or Less, we dive into the escalating AI talent wars, Meta’s bold moves, and what the latest hires really mean for the future of AI innovation. The More or Less team break down why product execution is overtaking research wizardry, what's happening between OpenAI and Microsoft, and how AI is reshaping inbound for all markets.We’re also on ↓X: https://twitter.com/moreorlesspodInstagram: https://instagram.com/moreorlessSpotify: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/moreorlesspodConnect with us here:1) Sam Lessin: https://x.com/lessin2) Dave Morin: https://x.com/davemorin3) Jessica Lessin: https://x.com/Jessicalessin4) Brit Morin: https://x.com/brit

This week on More or Less: Is Austin out-innovating San Francisco in self-driving tech? Why Apple’s WWDC liquid glass announcement a bigger deal than you think. The real story behind Meta’s $14B Scale AI move, and the new economics of AI talent. Plus, what’s next for startup investing in an era where talent trumps business models. We’re also on ↓X: https://twitter.com/moreorlesspodInstagram: https://instagram.com/moreorlessSpotify: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/moreorlesspodConnect with us here:1) Sam Lessin: https://x.com/lessin2) Dave Morin: https://x.com/davemorin3) Jessica Lessin: https://x.com/Jessicalessin4) Brit Morin: https://x.com/brit

This week on More or Less, we debate whether tech culture is unwatchable, why “Substacker” might be the last job standing, and if Build-A-Bear is secretly the next great AI company (move over, Nvidia). Plus: the real risks of self-driving Teslas on field trips, the myth of the “everything app,” and why the future just might be all about vibes. Come for the hot takes, stay for the man cave updates.Takeways: - The film 'Mountain Head' received mixed reviews, with some finding it unwatchable.- Substack's CEO predicts that 'substacker' will be one of the six main jobs in the future.- AI is expected to lower the cost of content creation, making it easier for creators to enter various industries.- The competitive nature of the content creation landscape. There is a significant barrier to entry regarding truth in the creator economy.- Authenticity is crucial for creators when launching products.- Build-A-Bear exemplifies how a brand can leverage AI for future growth.- Self-driving technology raises important safety and ethical questions, especially for children.- Investors are often driven by the potential for market cap expansion, thus creating the narrative of an "everything app"- The future of technology will likely involve more personalized and specialized solutions.We’re also on ↓X: https://twitter.com/moreorlesspodInstagram: https://instagram.com/moreorlessSpotify: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/moreorlesspodConnect with us here:1) Sam Lessin: https://x.com/lessin2) Dave Morin: https://x.com/davemorin3) Jessica Lessin: https://x.com/Jessicalessin4) Brit Morin: https://x.com/britChapters:00:00 The Rise of Personalized Robotics02:55 Home Renovations and the Ultimate Man Cave05:45 Critique of Mountain Head: A Cinematic Disappointment08:55 The Future of Work: Substack and Creator Economy12:00 AI's Impact on Content Creation and Distribution14:57 The Evolution of Creator Brands and Product Authenticity18:08 The Supplement Market: Trends and Concerns20:55 Hardware Innovations: AR, VR, and Snap's Future27:55 The Future of Snap and OpenAI's Potential Acquisitions30:02 Innovative Wearables and the Concept of the E-Cane33:07 Build-A-Bear: The Unexpected AI Company35:59 The Everything App: Future of Digital Consolidation40:00 Elon Musk's PR Strategies and Tesla's Self-Driving Technology47:58 AI in Everyday Life: Unique Applications and Experiences

This week on More or Less: Investors too squeamish for OnlyFans, AI makes the creator economy weirder (and richer), and why your next ETF might be Mormon. Plus, the real reason nobody watches your full podcast, and a healthy dose of tech industry self-roasting.

Takeaways

• OnlyFans presents a unique investment opportunity despite its controversial nature.
• Market dynamics in the sex work industry are shifting due to platforms like OnlyFans.
• Investment perspectives on controversial industries are evolving with societal changes.
• Digital identity verification is becoming increasingly important in the tech landscape.
• AI is transforming content creation and user interaction on platforms like OnlyFans.
• The need for robust age verification systems is critical for online safety.
• Social engineering poses significant risks to digital security and identity verification.
• The intersection of technology and privacy raises important ethical questions.
• New technologies are emerging to address identity verification challenges. Cybersecurity is a growing concern in today's digital age.
• Personal security measures are becoming increasingly important.
• The evolution of media is leading to new forms of content consumption.
• Platforms like TBPN are disrupting traditional media models.
• Cultural shifts are changing the landscape of digital content.
• Celebrity ventures are becoming significant players in the market.
• The importance of remembering complex passwords cannot be overstated.
• Media companies must adapt to the soundbite era to stay relevant.
• Tech hiring is experiencing a downturn post-pandemic.
• The de-stigmatization of platforms like OnlyFans is creating new opportunities.

We’re also on ↓

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• Instagram: https://instagram.com/moreorless

Connect with us here:

1. Sam Lessin: https://x.com/lessin
2. Dave Morin: https://x.com/davemorin
3. Jessica Lessin: https://x.com/Jessicalessin
4. Brit Morin: https://x.com/brit

Chapters

00:00 Celebrating Milestones and Listener Engagement

03:00 The Business of OnlyFans and Its Market Dynamics

05:58 Investment Perspectives on Controversial Industries

09:04 The Evolution of Digital Identity and Security

12:00 The Intersection of Technology and Privacy

14:59 The Future of Age Verification and Digital Safety

17:53 The Role of AI in Content Creation and Interaction

20:59 Exploring New Technologies for Identity Verification

24:06 The Implications of Social Engineering and Security Risks

34:00 Navigating Cybersecurity Challenges

36:55 The Importance of Personal Security

39:57 Media Evolution and Disruption

44:03 The Future of Tech and Media

49:57 Cultural Shifts in Digital Content

53:58 Celebrity Ventures and Market Trends

This week, Sam and Dave are joined by a very special guest: Synthetic Fidji. Yes, an AI version of Fidji Simo, created after the real one politely declined (hey, the show must go on, okay?).

They get into:

• the bull and bear case for vibe coding
• Gemini vs. GPT (is Sam having second thoughts?)
• why GitHub might be quietly, ruthlessly winning the AI dev race
• the identity crisis no one’s cracked with LLMs

Plus: OpenAI just spent $6 billion on hardware to team up with Jony Ive, the MEO phone is suddenly everywhere, and more.

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Connect with us here:

1. Sam Lessin: https://x.com/lessin
2. Dave Morin: https://x.com/davemorin
3. Jessica Lessin: https://x.com/Jessicalessin
4. Brit Morin: https://x.com/brit

00:00 Introduction

01:24 OpenAI CEO of Applications?

07:55 Tools that ACTUALLY work

18:47 Is everyone lying about vibe coding?

43:10 The big identity problem with LLMs (and Zapier)

52:26 Google I/O: "Who cares?"

54:13 Is OpenAI big tech? They buy Jony Ive's startup

56:17 The "hyper-viral" Methaphone. How?

59:40 Outro

What happens when Sam gets fed up with shady secondary brokers mid-recording?

He starts vibe coding a platform to replace them—live on the pod!

On this week’s More or Less, the gang dives deep into the messy mechanics of the secondary markets and how early cashouts might be a bigger red flag than anyone wants to admit.

Plus:

• Airbnb’s déjà vu product strategy
• The quiet crisis in venture liquidity (and who’s actually good at selling)
• OpenAI’s new “CEO of Applications”, and
• The looming threat of Trump’s nonprofit tax crackdown (and what it means for Harvard, endowments, and… Froyo)

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Connect with us here:

1) Sam Lessin: https://x.com/lessin

2) Dave Morin: https://x.com/davemorin

3) Jessica Lessin: https://x.com/Jessicalessin

4) Brit Morin: https://x.com/brit