Nate Parks, of Silverthorn Farms in Rossville, Ind., joins host Nick Carter to talk about his farm and navigating both the good in the bad of decades of working the land the right way.
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (00:04):
Welcome to More Than A Mile, a local food podcast from Market Wagon, focused on connecting you to local food through farmer stories from across America. I'm Nick Carter, your host, a farmer and the CEO and co-founder of Market Wagon. We are your online farmer's market with a mission to enable food producers to thrive in their local and regional markets. Food is so much more than just nutrients and calories. It's actually the fabric that holds us together. And I look forward to crafting a generational quilt of farmer stories and experiences, the victories and challenges of individuals, families, and teams doing their part to help democratize food in America. Thanks for joining me for this episode of More Than A Mile, and thank you for buying local food. One critical step in making an investment in food for future generations.
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (00:54):
My guest today is Nate Parks. And if you have bought local food anywhere in Indiana in the last decade, you've probably seen Nate or somebody from Silverthorn Farm. He has he's gone before me. He's been a pioneer in the local food movement around here. And several episodes ago, we talked about standing on the shoulders of giants and I would say Nate's one of those. So I'm really glad and honored to have you here, Nate. Thanks for having the time this morning to talk about farming with me.
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (01:24):
Sure. Thanks, Nick. I appreciate it. That's what I love to talk about. Right. So it's pretty easy, pretty easy thing to do.
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (01:31):
It should be easy for both of us. Right. It's just sit here and riff and and maybe we'll make a podcast out of it.
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (01:37):
Yeah. See what happens, right? Yeah.
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (01:40):
So you're in Clinton County and it seems like you've been there for a while or at least your wife has -- the information that I was given [says it was] 1864. Is that right? Is that when the farm started in your family?
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (01:53):
Well, so yeah, so we, we moved here in 2013 under this farm. My, my wife's, I think it was five great-grandfathers back bought this property 1864. I started my farm and my family were farmers in Montgomery county. That's where I grew up and we actually started Silverthorn Farm in Darlington Montgomery county. It would have been 2005-2006.
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (02:20):
Silverthorn [Farm] started over in Montgomery County. And then, you relocated?
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (02:24):
But it was actually, we relocated here in 2013. Yeah. We started as Tranquil Ridge Farm in Montgomery County. We had a, our farm, I grew up on was on Sugar Creek, you know, and it was this awesome ridge above the, above the creek. So it was Tranquil Ridge Farm. When we moved here to Clinton County, there was no ridge to be tranquil on anymore, so we had to change it, you know? But my wife's grandfather, you know, the five generations back was William Silverthorn who established this place. And so when we moved here, it was like, let's, let's pay homage to what it really is. And the man who started the farm so many years ago, you know, and bring the Silverthorn name back because, really, the land had been, the land had been cash rented out for 40 years. Nobody in her family farms, you know?
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (03:08):
Yeah. So, yeah, we've been here since 2013, so eight years now. It's been cool. It's been a good, it's been interesting, you know, it's definitely out of my home territory, but it was one of those when we, at that time in '13, when we moved, we were trying to grow and expand. And I was renting land in Montgomery County--where this was 120 acres that was available for us to use, her family, had wanted us to come take it over. And I couldn't buy that at that point in time, there was no way. So it was, it was a great opportunity we were lucky for.
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (03:38):
Well, that's incredible. That's really cool. And I grew up in Howard County, that's where our family farm is at, so we're just one county over from Clinton County? I can attest there's no ridges there.
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (03:50):
That's right. Yeah. We have to go to neighbors to find a sledding hill. 120 acres and the only sledding we can do is behind a tractor, you know?
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (03:58):
Yeah. I have more than one time. I've sledded off the top of either a mulch pile or, well, piles of other things.
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (04:07):
That's right.
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (04:10):
What does Silverthorn farm offer? What do you guys raise?
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (04:14):
The definition has changed a lot over the years. Right. And honestly we're in another wild transition, just like we have been over the last 15 years, 16 years that I've been doing this. This year, we really, all we have is fruit trees and some hay ground. We shut down our vegetable operations in 2020--at the end of the 2020--which was a hard decision for us to make, but one that we had to do in order to you know, just as a family and financially survive. Thankfully we got through that and we're on the other end of it now and just kind of looking forward to see where do we fit in and how do we want to proceed? Still pretty open-ended questions for us at this point.
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (05:00):
Well, a small world, but your hay is a pretty good hay, our goats are enjoying it. So I was up at, I was up in Nate's farm several months ago, loading a trailer full of hay. So you took 120 acres from your wife's family and didn't take it. But you, you took over the, that family farm and you said it individually has been cashed rented for decades prior. So conventional grain agriculture. What was it like to convert that back into raising real food? Was that difficult?
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (05:32):
Yes and no, we were lucky. So 2012 was when we kinda made the decision that we were going to move here. And that was that drought year, you know, and the farm, the way it's kind of split up, there's a tree line down the center of the 120 [acres]. There's an east and west side. We originally took over the eastern side. And so 2012, I planted the whole thing to clovers and, and a lot of cover crop mix while we were still farming in Montgomery county. So then when we moved here in 13, it was, you know, we had a year of cover crop, but what we found when we got here was 1.2% organic matter and less on everything. It was, it was bad shape, really rough, you know, drainage was pretty poor. So it took a lot, it's taken a lot of time to, to fix it, but the benefit we had, we had 120 acres and generally I would produce around 30 acres of vegetables.
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (06:24):
So I didn't need all the land in production. And it allowed me to have half of my land in cover crops every year and half of it in vegetable production. So I could flip flop and move those blocks around to really try to build back organic matter. And we're getting there, you know, we're improving. We're still not 2% on a lot of it. Our high tunnels, we've gotten up to 5%, you know, where we, we do a lot of the compost addition, but just with the cover crops and kind of the crop rotations out in the main fields, we have been able to see improvement, which is just, it's a long process to bring that back, you know, but all of a sudden, you know, probably two, three years in, we saw the earth warm activity come back. We saw the biological activity in the soil is really come back cause they were dead. I mean, there was nothing left do with soil. So when we took them over and really hard packed, you know, the, the they're classified as a silt loan, but they acted like a clay, you know, just, just really sticky. And you know, with no organic matter in there, you had nothing to stick. You had nothing to work with, you know? So it was really hard to work and, and hard to deal with, but we've kind of been able to with cover cropping and rotations, we've been able to pull out of that.
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (07:29):
That's amazing. I can't imagine a less than 2% of organic matter. And for listeners who don't know what Nate and I are talking about, we would test soils every year, sometimes more than once a year. And you know, the majority of soil is, is sand, you know, tiny pieces of rock clay, but what your plants are going to eat is organic matter. It's going to be decomposing other plants--less than 2% of your soil was organic matter. That's incredible. And do you know what kind of production methods had been before? Was it high tillage before?
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (08:06):
No, it was, it was actually 30 years--it was just 30 years of no-till corn and beans. So, in theory, that's their conventional wisdom is no till is going to rebuild organic matter and, and save some of that soil. And maybe it did. I mean, what would the result be? Would we be less than 1% if it was conventional tillage? I don't know. Yeah. You know, what, what would have been left? If it was conventional till it's, you know, we don't have that kind of information, but what I do know is that it certainly didn't seem beneficial in my eyes looking at it. And, you know, you look at the, probably back in the days of the prairies before this was farmed, we were probably 10 to 12% organic matter, you know, and it is a long, you know, you're talking, it, it takes a long time to build and a long time to degrade, right. I mean, it's not like you can go from 1% to 2% in a year that would just be, unless you just dumped so much organic matter on that piece of land, that it would increase. And that's what we did in the high tunnels. But, you know, a high tunnel is 3000 square foot compared to anchor at 43,000 square feet times 120. I mean, you don't have that much biomass, but in carbon, you know, it's all carbon, we're trying to put it.
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (09:22):
Yeah. So you did a lot of cover cropping, like you said, and that's going to draw carbon out of the atmosphere and turn it into leaves, and those leaves are going to decompose the next year. Did you do any other additive things? Did you have any manure or did you bring in some of the organic matter off farm?
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (09:38):
Yeah, we did a lot. We actually were lucky--the south border of my farm is the north border of the town of Rossville. And, and so they brought all their leaves to us. So, and all the recyclables, they run as a kind of a composting project within that town. And so they'll bring all that product out and I can use that leaf mold. And then obviously all of our vegetable waste, we would mix with that. And that was most of the compost we use. We also have a lot of the tree trimmers, local would bring a raw mill, you know, ramial wood chips. So we use a lot of the wood chips and several, you know, there's like the 4-H forage fairgrounds and Clinton County bring out their manure after the schools. So we took in a lot of products to be able to build. For several years we did do quite a bit of livestock, but it was, it was pasture-based stuff. So we never really had a big maneuver pack with built anywhere, you know? So so having that other compost was great, but we used it, you know, we didn't have enough to cover the whole area. You know, we'd just have to do kind of trouble spots and high tunnels, which is those high production areas that would really focus on with compost.
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (10:42):
Yeah, 120 acres is a lot of area.
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (10:44):
I mean, if you're really trying to make an impact yeah. And cover crops were the most economical way for me to kind of turn that around and make an impact backwards. And that's kind of why, you know, when we shut the vegetables down last fall I already was doing some hay and things on the farm anyway. And for me it was like, okay, the quickest, easiest thing for me to do right now is just put in alfalfas and clovers, let them lie and rest for a little bit. It's, it's, you know, it's going to be the least intensive thing I could do it to try to make sure we at least stay in a holding pattern as opposed to a degradation pattern of row crops, which may still be, you know, an optimum of every few years. Maybe we'll throw in some row crops. I don't know. You know, I don't know what that I would love to say it'll be vegetables again one of these days, but you know, right now, I don't know if that's going to be realistic, you know. Unfortunately.
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (11:34):
2020 changed the world quite a bit, didn't it, Nate?
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (11:38):
Yeah. You know, and for me, we had, you know, I kind of probably zigged when I should have zagged a few times. In [20]18, we shut down our CSA program, which we had had for 12 years. We were, you know, when we had our CSA in a 300, 350 range, it was a really economical thing for us to do. We had the, we had the scale to make it work. Cause we did it all custom pack and custom order. So there was a lot of labor involved in just the pack out. I mean, as you know, with Market Wagon, but I mean, it's the same kind of scenario we did just on our farm, you know? And so in [20]18 we dropped that because our restaurant sales had really built our wholesale sales. That's what we really went after. Ended up most of our, say about 85% of our sales, would go to restaurants.
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (12:25):
And then that other 15% were just kind of made up in markets. You know, we had dropped out of markets and then in [20]18 we added the market back, drop the CSA to just kinda help us take a breath a little bit. It was a lot of, a lot of labor, a lot of work. And we had been working with Purdue on the final program of hemp since 2015. You know, we were one of two farms that were growing hemp in those early years. And so when [20]19 came around, we were finally able to to go full production and, and sell that crop. And you know, if anybody's fell down hemp saga, it was, it was a disaster, you know, and we ended up $150,000 in the hole at the end of the [20]19, you know, so we were scratching and clawing trying to get out of that at [20]19, you know, that kind of burned up my savings and my background, my, you know, my cash that we'd held back.
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (13:14):
And then we roll into [20]20 with COVID. And like I said, 85% of my sales were the restaurants, you know, so all of the sudden that went from $25,000 a week in sales to our biggest week in 2020, it was $1,600 that week, you know, so it was it wiped us out, you know, and we had 10 people on payroll and you've got 30 acres of production on the ground. It was a nightmare, you know, so that was that was, that was how it happened. So, you know, you can't, you can't blame it all on 2020, there was things that happened ahead of it. And we were just in a really bad spot for 2020 to happen. Right. And so by the time that 2020 ended, we were just, there was a decision to be made. I mean, there was no, like I said, I'd spend all my cash, right.
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (13:58):
You know, in [20]19 burned the cash reserves. In [20]20 we had our retail was up, which was great, but it was still only 15% of our end caps. So when you're, when you're dealing with the high payroll, we had the high production, we had the, the high output of costs. It was just, we had to, we had to, we had to stop somewhere, you know, there had to be a breaking point. And that's what we did. We sold all of our equipment. We you know, in October the girls who had--I had three sisters that worked for me for eight years, you know, they were my greenhouse manager, pack shed managers, and stuff like that. And they stopped in October and we just had to regroup, you know, and and take a look back. And, and thankfully we, you know, it was, we came out great and we were able to sustain ourselves in the farm still here. You know, I'm still here, we're still plenty of our equipment left. It's just the actual production part had to be, had to be over, you know.
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (14:52):
They'll farm and find a way to survive.
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (14:53):
So now, yeah. Yeah. And so now I've and, and I just before I was a farmer, I was a builder. I build a lot of houses and I kind of went back to that beginning of the year and was doing a lot of remodel work. And then a company in Rockville, Indiana was a Family Farm Fresh Co-Op, which is a lot of words to say, but it's a, it's a co-op of Amish growers is about 30 growers down there. And I've worked with them over the years on just production consultation, you know, just winter production on some of the greenhouse stuff that we did here. And then they called and asked if there was any way that I could come manage their sales and manage the production of all those farms. So I ended up, you know, kind of worked it out and now, so that's what I'm doing this year is helping them, you know, managing their production on that.
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (15:40):
And so that's six or seven semi-loads of product a week going out to Chicago and Florida and all over the country on a, on a larger scale, right. It's Whole Foods and Fresh Tyme and, and big broker buyer which is interesting. It's a different world. It's, it's super similar to what I was doing with the restaurants. I mean, it's just a different buyer, you know, and instead of just my farm, it's 30 farms. And I get to manage all the production on that. And they're great growers right. And it's the organic food movement, which I still love to be a part of. So that that's been really been really good for me this year. And we'll see how that keeps going, but I get to be engaged in this community, which is, you know, in the end that's, what's important to me is making sure we keep trying to advance this organic local food movement, which is just it's so frustrating how difficult it is and just shouldn't be, you know,
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (16:34):
I know, I know.
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (16:36):
Right?
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (16:38):
Yeah. Tell me about it. And yeah, these, these curve balls, you know, one of the things that our farms suffered from for a long time with program agriculture and the, the hemp disaster sounds like, you know, just another, another chapter in that book of, of program agriculture. But the other interesting thing is, you know, what you didn't ask for is the farms are like yours, any, any farmers, they scale up restaurants, the next logical place to scale up to who would have thought that, that entire market would be shut down for almost a whole year. And I just can't imagine.
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (17:13):
And they're not back yet, you know, they, they suffered such financial loss. There's no blame to sit on them, right. I mean, what are we going to do? And now the, you know, I think they're still, you know, we saw of the 60 restaurants we were selling to the last, I can't remember now, who knows where they're at now that was 21 or 22, are just done completely, you know, they're not coming back. And the ones that are coming back are in such a fiscal problem, as far as financing, you know, they're still reeling from, from the cashflow loss. You know, they're a 10% margin business, you know, that's not a, that's not a massive margin they have. So, buying local food is, is really difficult for them now, you know, I think they'll come back. I hope they do. You know, I think they'll make a rebound, but it's not going to be a, it's going to be a while to rebuild that, you know?
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (18:02):
Yeah. I wanted to ask you about organic, the organic label. Correct me if I'm wrong, your farm is certified USDA organic, correct?
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (18:12):
Correct. We, we dropped that certification this year just because I didn't have it. It was just hay, but that's how we've always been in the past. Yeah.
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (18:21):
Yeah. So tell me why is the organic label important to you as a farmer? What's it, what's it represent?
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (18:29):
It''s an interesting question. And it's a hard one to answer because a lot of ways it's not important to me. But in other way, it's important to our, to a customer base that we want to appeal to. At the end, why I finally certified after several years was cause I was tired of answering the questions. You know, you're not certified, so how do I know that you are? It's like, fine. Let's just certify the farm. Like, this is how I, this is how I produced. And so much of the time, you know, actually in the restaurant industry, organic's not important because I can't, they're not really selling organic foods through the restaurant industry. You know, the local food is what's important to them. But I just wanted to, it was important to me on that, that way of production in that way of life.
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (19:13):
And so I just said, okay, let's just certify it. And now I don't have to keep answering these questions. And you know, are you certified? Are you not certified? Or how do you produce, like, let's just get the certification done. Everybody knows what I am and how I'm doing it now. It's just official. Nothing changed at all is how we always did it. It's just, now we have more expense, you know, and then we have a label to say, to say that we are, you know, if, if I was going in like the broader scale wholesale sales, like, like I'm dealing with a farm fresh co-op now it's super important. You know, if you're going to be dealing with that, that bigger scale of market, you have to have that certification to gain, to gain the benefit of those dollars, you know because certified organic kale compared to conventional kale, there's a massive price difference on the whole, when you're selling semi load locks, you know, I was never that big.
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (20:05):
So it sounds like you, nothing changed. You were organic before organic was on your label. But just to make it easier to answer the question--to explain to consumers that you, yes, indeed grew the food the right way. Being able to put that sticker on made it easier.
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (20:23):
Yeah, that was part of it. And the other part was like, let's, you know, if that's what we believe in, and that's what we're trying to do is support and push the organic movement. Then it's also important for me to have be a part of that certification that part of those statistics within our state and to say, yes, we do have that growing here and to try, you know, the more land that we have certified, the more people in that program, the more support we get from a state level coming backwards to the organic growers, right? If, if there was no organic growers certified in our state, then the state level legislation and even the extension services and everything else, there's not an incentive for them to be coming backwards to support the farms. Right. So, so at that level, you know, we, we did a lot of work with Purdue because we're super close, you know, we're a half hour from, from the campus.
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (21:08):
So to have, for them to have a certified organic vegetable farm close--them and we always had, you know, 6, 8, 10 different research projects that we were able to coordinate with everybody--to Purdue, whether it's the etymology department or whatever department it is for them to do research. So it was important in that, in that respect to just get the support for all the other local farms in our area saying that there is, there is organic agriculture here and we do need to support, and it is, it's a real thing. Right? So that, that was probably more of a driving factor than anything else was just so that we could make sure that our voices are heard, you know. That's not oppposed to saying we do grow organically, you know? Well that, that doesn't do anything. You're still can't count it as a conventional grower on the anything USDA related. Right.
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (21:54):
So what's your relationship with the USDA like today?
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (21:56):
I don't know. I mean, that's super easy this year. I don't have any relationship with it. Right. I don't have to worry about any, any regulation or any certifications. It's pretty, pretty cozy. I just coast through now before it was, yeah, it was pretty...
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (22:13):
Do you think the organic movement is better being managed by the USDA over the last couple of decades then prior?
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (22:20):
No, I don't. I mean, I think there's a lot of challenges. Yeah. I feel like, you know, there, there's all these questions around is hydroponic organic or not? You know, and the original USDA regulations were born product, you know, now we have, now there's all these debates on that. And, you know, I have plenty of views on it. And there's also, you know, when we look at pastured poultry and, and now, you know, a door opened on the side of a enclosed chicken barn is considered pasture ranged and organic. And is that really what the consumer thinks are certified organic eggs are? I don't think of it that I think of it as you know. So that those, those are such challenges. I don't know how you, you know, you get such big, you know, just like anything else. We have corporations that are going USDA organic, and they have bigger lobbies than us small farmers have.
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (23:13):
So they get these exemptions on, on some things that I don't necessarily think that the consumer believes will be a USDA organic. And it's, it goes back to just the most important certification is, is buying local, knowing your farmer, in my opinion, you know, I mean, how else are you going to know how your food's produced? You're, you're just not, unless you know who it is and where it's coming from. And that's just, to me, that was always the most important thing for me is having that communication with whoever my buyer was, whether it was my, my chefs at all the restaurants or the smaller grocers that we had on their buyers, or if it was my CSA members or if it was the people at market, I just wanted to make sure they knew who we were. We're making sure our farm is open to them. They come see how we were producing and have that comfort level on your food. Otherwise, a USDA organic stamp. I don't know how much confidence can you have in, I don't know, you know?
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (24:06):
Yeah. Well, I share the same opinion. How much confidence can you have in a sticker that was handed out by a guy with a badge. Right. And I think that, I think, I don't know what you think, but I think the future of that organic certification is eroding because more and more consumers are having the wool pulled off of their eyes, you know, and, and realizing just what you said, that the lobby is big, the exception list is getting longer and longer, and there's still farmers like you and I that are doing it the right way, whether we're going to have a sticker or not.
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (24:40):
Yeah. And you know, it's been the challenge for the couple of decades that I've been in this industry is reaching those customers who are, what are the 3-5% of our population who it's important to them where their food comes from and how it's raised. Unfortunately, I don't think that that number has grown a lot over the years. You know, we still have such a small percentage of the population that we're trying to reach, but I think still the, the most important messages is local and is know your farmer. I mean, just, just go connect with who's growing the food. I mean, that's, that's the best way that you're going to ever assure what you're really getting.
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (25:16):
I agree. And that that's been--sounds like that was central to how you connected with the customers over the decade or more that you've been, you were farming the produce off of your farm. Now you're involved in a larger co-op and you mentioned that your customers with that co-op, that you're helping are wholesale to Whole Foods and other large grocers. Is it a challenge there to connect with the consumer and to maintain the value and the, and the crop? If there's not a direct connection to the consumer?
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (25:50):
A hundred percent. Yeah. It's, you know, when you start to deal with these buyers and these bigger institutions, you're, you're one of many that are calling them every day, and emailing them every day, and trying to sell the same kind of product that everybody across the entire country is trying to sell to them. You know, they're, they're not interested in your story. They need to stamp that you're, you're certified organic. They need to stamp that your gap certified, and then I need you to have the best price available to them, you know?
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (26:20):
A couple of stickers and lower your price.
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (26:23):
That's it. You know, and that's been a real challenge because I don't accept that. You know? And so my whole career has been, I'm going to set the price and you're going to buy it, or you're not. But this isn't the price I need for me to be successful growing this crop. And this is what I want. If you don't buy it, that's fine, but this is what I need to have out of it. And now I'm in a scenario where I have to accept the price that's given to this.
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (26:50):
And that's the price that you need to to do it right by the land, right? If you want the soil to go from 1.2% organic matter and go up, and there are customers, like you said, small percentage that care about that soil and what you're doing to it, and what you're doing to the earth, this is what it costs to do it right.
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (27:09):
And you know, now we've got to figure in labor costs. Holy cow, man, you know, the difference from 15 years ago to today on the, on the labor costs on anybody you want to bring on your farm to work is massive. That's a very big difference. And somehow we're supposed to keep the food costs the same. That's, that's a, that's a hard thing to understand how we're supposed to do that. Right. I mean, there's only so many efficiencies you can gain on the production side to where someone's got to give them, and these prices have to go up, but nobody wants to hear that. Right. I mean we want food cheaper and cheaper every, every year, which is not reality. Right. So, yeah, it's, it's a, it's a real challenge when you scale up to those levels of, you know, a thousand cases of kale a week is a lot of kale. That's, you know, 24,000 bunches of kale. You're, you're out a different, you're not, you're not you're not able to say this is what I want for for these bunches, you're having to kind of take what you can get so you can move that product. Cause it's not going to be good next week. Right? Definitely a challenge.
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (28:07):
So Nate, you started farming a couple decades ago and it's been in your, your family's blood for a long time. What advice do you have for a new farmer? Someone who wants to get into farming today?
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (28:20):
Well, that's a--it's a long list. I think it's what I've always said the most, you know, I've done, I've went to so many conferences and seminars and read so many books and all those things over the years and they're all good. But the most important thing is just finding a mentor. Finding somebody who's doing what you want to do. That's already in this industry and is succeeding and go tell them you will work for them. You don't care what you get paid, go out there on that farm and figure out what they're doing and to be successful because it's, it's, it's not as easy as reading a book and going and doing it right. You need to, you need to be a part of a farm and to see the entire operation, how it works and what all the, you know, what, what all do you have to do to make sure that you succeed?
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (29:06):
And there's a lot of guys out there they're doing a really good job and they need help for sure. And you need their knowledge and the best knowledge that I get, and still today, I talk to talk to guys every week, you know, friends of mine that I've had for these decades that have been doing this, that are farmers and that we all lean on each other, you know, that's, that's going to be the most knowledge you get and the best information you get. And you've got to build that network of people within the industry. That's where you're going to learn the most. And so, find a mentor within this and whether they need them, they may not need you as a mentee, right. But go offer your help and be free and go out there and help them as much as you can so that you can learn what you need to learn to do it, you know, because it's a, it just takes doing it.
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (29:52):
You know, you just gotta go. That's, that's, that's always been my thing to people was like, you know, read everything you can read, go to every conference that you can go to, absorb as much information as possible. But at the end of the day, get out on the farm and help somebody that's successful doing farming the way that you want your farm to be. You know, whether that's an acre or a quarter acre, or whether it's a hundred acres, whatever it is that you want your farm to be, there's somebody out there who's doing it successfully. Go find a way to help them and learn from them.
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (30:23):
Who are those people for you when you were getting into it?
New Speaker (30:27):
It took me a long time to understand that that was important, but I didn't have that.
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (30:34):
If you had that to do over again You'd take your own advice, right?
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (30:36):
Do, as I say, not as I do type of thing. Right. And really honestly, you know, back then, there, there wasn't a lot happening, you know, there wasn't, there wasn't as many farms as we have today. I don't think. And, and I wasn't, I just, you know, when I started, so I grew up on a conventional corn and bean farm. It was kind of different cause it was back in 80s and 90s, so we really didn't have GMOs yet. So we still cultivated. And we did a lot, we had a hundred cows, cow/calf operation then, and, you know, a hundred thousand, we farrowed outside and there were about 800 acres of row crops and hay that we did. So it was real, super diversified. It gave me a great base of a vegetable farm, which is very diversified.
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (31:15):
Right. And so when I started, I had, I was, I was able to, I always had this entrepreneurial spirit and I just have never really worried about risk. I have a pretty high tolerance for it. So I was able to just go at it and just fail until I succeeded. That took a lot more years than it needed to, you know, if I would have had, you know, if I would've had a mentor and I just, I had a lot of books or like, and then I just started meeting guys at the markets and or at the conferences and we all, you know, just kind of became friends and started leaning off of each other. But I think one of the, and I really wasn't a mentor, but there was Roxbury Farm out in New York. If you ever go to RoxburyFarm.com, they've got, they've got all their manuals on how they've been producing vegetables for probably 25 years in now and 2000 members CSA in New York.
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (32:10):
And I just based my model off of everything that he had on that production manual, and man, that was huge. It really helped me, you know, and that was probably 6, 7, 8 years in. So actually when I moved to Rossville on this bigger scale, I was able to just come right here and implement everything that he had been doing on his farm from, you know, like all my blocks are 50 by 300, which is a third of an acre. And it's I was six-foot bed spacing. So it's eight beds on the block. It's all a third of an acre, so it's easy to rotate. There's a sod path in between every block. So my sprayer that I use for all my beneficials is 25 feet. So I go around every single block. I never had to drive into them, I could spray them all at a harvest conveyor that was 25 feet. So we could drive around every block and just harvest onto that conveyor and take it out. You know, if you're harvesting by hand, all you had to do is walk three or four blocks to the right or left. And you're on a road, you know, a path. So there's just little things like that that made such a big difference. Right? And then you have all the L.A. Coleman references and people and John Martin, or J.M. Fourtier or whatever, what's his last name? The market gardner, J.M?
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (33:28):
No idea. Can you tell that I didn't take the advice either? I don't know any of these people.
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (33:36):
And that was all the greenhouse stuff, you know, cause I, I focused hard on greenhouses for a long time. You know, we were, we were four season production is what we focused on. We had an acre of greenhouse covered production, you know? And that was so cheesed for us. Not really, we didn't make a ton of money in the winter, but it kept my employees on full-time, you know, and that was, that was huge where I could pay my employees year round and I didn't have to use money that we made in the summer to keep them on, on winter. There there's always work. And that was always huge for us to keep rolling. So yeah, like I say, do, as I say, not as I do.
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (34:10):
Yeah, same here. Well this has been really fun. I appreciate you taking the time to share your story. And I know I know that it's not the end of the story. I know there's a lot more that you're going to be doing in agriculture, in Indiana and in organics for the decades to come. As as we close out, if any of our listeners want to connect with you or support your farm, how can they do that?
Nate Parks (Silverthorn Farm) (34:32):
Yeah. Website's Silverthorn-farm.com. You can always go there and there's, there's plenty of links there to connect with me, whether it's through our Facebook or my email is [email protected]. I'm always available there for any questions? If anybody has anything they want to reach out, I'm always available.
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (34:49):
Awesome. Thanks, Nate.
Nick Carter (Market Wagon) (34:56):
Thanks for listening to this episode of More Than A Mile. Be sure to sign up for Market Wagon @marketwagon.com or after downloading the Market Wagon app for iOS or Android. Follow us @MarketWagon on Instagram, Twitter, Pinterest, and Facebook for stories, recipes, special announcements, news, and just digital handshakes from our friendly farming community. If you enjoyed More Than A Mile, please rate the podcast and write a review on iTunes, Castbox, Podchaser, or wherever you listen to your favorite podcasts. Thank you for continuing to support local food.
