Negotiating the Ocean

Looking beyond the can - the importance of tuna fisheries

Part 2: The Indian Ocean

The Indian Ocean Tuna Commission manages the second most lucrative tuna fishery in the world. More than half of the tuna catches in the Indian Ocean come from small-scale fisheries, which are often characterised by a lack of data and information. Overall, the Indian Ocean faces many complex and unique challenges.

In this episode, we talk to four experts from the region who have been actively engaged in shaping the Indian Ocean tuna fisheries.

Guests:

Adam Ziyad – Chair of the Indian Ocean Tuna Commission

Dr Paul de Bruyn – Executive Secretary of the Indian Ocean Tuna Commission

Umair Shahid – Indian Ocean Tuna manager for WWF

Doreen Simiyu – Coordinator of the Indian Ocean Tuna Forum (SWIOTUNA)

Hosts: Bianca Haas & Jennifer Macey

Sound design and editing: Emily Perkins

Communication: Sunnefa Yeatman

For comments & feedback please contact: [email protected]

Find out more:

ANCORS Ocean Equity page https://oceanequityresearch.org/

ANCORS at the University of Wollongong https://www.uow.edu.au/ancors/

Indian Ocean Tuna Commission Website https://iotc.org/

WWF Website https://www.wwf-swio.org/

SWIOTUNA Website https://www.swiotuuna.org/

Blog on the 29th IOTC meeting: https://oceanequityresearch.org/fisheries-governance-publications/insights-into-the-29th-annual-meeting-of-the-indian-ocean-tuna-commission/

Research on the Indian Ocean Tuna Commission by ANCORS researchers:

Rambourg, C., Haas, B., & Colléter, M. (2025). The quiet voices of French territories in tuna fisheries management. Environmental Development, 55, 101162. https://doi.org/10.1016/j.envdev.2025.101162

Haas, B., Goodman, C., Sinan, H., Davis, R. (2023). Fact or fiction? Unpacking the terminologies used in fisheries allocation discussions. Marine Policy, 152, 105630. https://doi.org/10.1016/j.marpol.2023.105630

Davis, R., Hanich, Q., Haas, B., Cisneros-Montemayor, A., Azmi, K., Seto, K.L., et al. (2022). Who Gets the Catch? How Conventional Catch Attribution Frameworks Undermine Equity in Transboundary Fisheries. Frontiers in Marine Science. 9. https://doi.org/10.3389/fmars.2022.831868

Looking beyond the can - the importance of tuna fisheries

Part 1: The Western and Central Pacific Ocean 

The management of the tuna species is important for the livelihoods and food security of millions of people.  

This is especially true for the tuna caught in the Western and Central Pacific Ocean, which accounts for more than half of the global tuna catch. 

In this episode, we will hear from four experts who have dedicated their lives to ensuring that tuna fisheries in the Western and Central Pacific are managed sustainably.  

Guests:  

Professor Transform Aqorau – Vice Chancellor of the Solomon Islands National University 

Francisco Blaha – Fisheries Consultant 

Dr Josie Tamate – Chair of the Western and Central Pacific Fisheries Commission 

Rhea Moss-Christian – Executive Director of the Western and Central Pacific Fisheries Commission 

Hosts: Bianca Haas & Jennifer Macey 

Sound design and editing: Emily Perkins  

Communication: Sunnefa Yeatman 

For comments & feedback please contact: ⁠[email protected]⁠ 

Find out more: 

ANCORS Ocean Equity page ⁠https://oceanequityresearch.org/⁠ 

ANCORS at the University of Wollongong ⁠https://www.uow.edu.au/ancors/⁠ 

Western and Central Pacific Fisheries Commission Website ⁠https://www.wcpfc.int/⁠ 

Francisco Blaha’s Website ⁠https://www.franciscoblaha.info/⁠ 

Parties of the Nauru Agreement (PNA) Website: ⁠https://www.pnatuna.com/⁠  

Research on the Western and Central Pacific Fisheries Commission by ANCORS researchers: 

Haas, B., Azmi, K., & Davis, R. (2024). Pacific tuna update: 20th Meeting of the Western and Central Pacific Fisheries Commission. Marine Policy, 168, 106320. ⁠https://doi.org/10.1016/j.marpol.2024.106320⁠  

Goodman C., Davis, R., Azmi, K., Bell, J., Galland, G.R. Gilman, E., et al. (2022). Enhancing cooperative responses by regional fisheries management organisations to climate-driven redistribution of tropical Pacific tuna stocks. Frontiers in Marine Science, 9. ⁠https://doi.org/10.3389/fmars.2022.1046018⁠ 

Azmi, K., & Hanich, Q. (2021). Mapping interests in the tuna fisheries of the Western and Central Pacific Ocean. Ocean & Coastal Management. 212, 105779. ⁠https://doi.org/10.1016/j.ocecoaman.2021.105779⁠ 

Hanich, Q., Jung, M., McDonald, A., Oh, S., Moon, S., An, J., & Yoon, M. (2021). Tuna Fisheries Conservation and Management in the Pacific Islands Region: Implications for Korean Distant Water Fisheries. Asia-Pacific Journal of Ocean Law and Policy. 6, 192-220. ⁠https://doi.org/10.1163/24519391-06020003⁠  

Haas, B. (2020). Tuna management in action: assessing the contribution of the WCPFC to the SDGs. Australian Journal of Maritime & Ocean Affairs. 12, 42-47. ⁠https://doi.org/10.1080/18366503.2020.1726261⁠ 

Episode 5- Access and Benefit Sharing of Marine Genetic Resources

Series on Stakeholders in BBNJ: PART 3 Scientist

We don’t yet know what the deep sea holds – but what we know is that benefits need to be shared fairly and equitably. A new Ocean Treaty changes the status quo of access and benefit sharing of marine genetic resources (MGRs) of areas beyond national jurisdiction. Yet, many questions remain about the nitty-gritty details of implementation.

• What are marine genetic resources and their digital sequence information?

• How can benefits be shared fairly and equitably?

• What are the most urgent issues to negotiate in upcoming meetings of the United Nations?

In this episode we meet Fran Humphries, Associate Professor at Griffith University, an expert on Access and Benefit Sharing of Marine Genetic resources. She guides us through ocean equity issues about sharing the genetic material of the deepest parts of the ocean.

Guest: Associate Professor Fran Humphries

Hosts: ⁠Ina Tessnow-von Wysocki⁠ & ⁠Jennifer Macey⁠

Sound design and editing: ⁠⁠EmilyPerkins⁠⁠

Communication: ⁠Sunnefa Yeatman⁠

For comments & feedback please contact: ⁠[email protected]⁠

Find out more:

ANCORS Ocean Equity page ⁠https://oceanequityresearch.org/⁠

ANCORS at the University of Wollongong ⁠https://www.uow.edu.au/ancors/⁠

You can find official documents in preparation for the First Preparatory Commission Meeting on the United Nations Website: ⁠https://www.un.org/bbnjagreement/en/meetings/preparatory-commission/documents/first-session⁠

 Research on Marine Genetic Resources:

Humphries, F. (2025). Decoding Marine GeneticResource Governance Under the BBNJ Agreement (1st ed. 2025.). Springer Nature Switzerland. https://doi.org/10.1007/978-3-031-72100-7

Humphries, F. (2025). Marine Genetic Resources Beyond National Jurisdiction: The Expansive Scope of the BBNJ Agreement. In: Humphries, F. (eds) Decoding Marine Genetic Resource Governance Under the BBNJ Agreement. Sustainable Development Goals Series. Springer, Cham. https://doi.org/10.1007/978-3-031-72100-7_3

Research on the BBNJ process by ANCORS researchers:

Kraabel, K. (2022). Institutional arrangements in a BBNJ treaty: Implications for Arctic marine science. Marine Policy, 142,103807-. ⁠https://doi.org/10.1016/j.marpol.2019.103807⁠

Lothian, S. (2023b). The BBNJ Agreement: Through the Prismof Deep-Sea Vulnerable Marine Ecosystems. Ocean Development and International Law, 54(4), 469–499. ⁠https://doi.org/10.1080/00908320.2023.2296400⁠

Lothian, S. (2022). Marine conservation and international law: legal instruments for biodiversity beyond national jurisdiction. Routledge, Taylor & Francis Group.

Tessnow-von Wysocki, I., & Vadrot, A. B. M. (2024).Pathways of scientific input into intergovernmental negotiations: a new agreement on marine biodiversity. International Environmental Agreements : Politics, Law and Economics, 24(2–3), 325–348. ⁠https://doi.org/10.1007/s10784-024-09642-0⁠

Tessnow-von Wysocki, I. (2023). Science-policy interfaces for ocean protection: The case of the international negotiations for the conservation and sustainable use of marine biodiversity of areas beyond national jurisdiction (BBNJ). Doctoral Thesis. ⁠https://phaidra.univie.ac.at/detail/o:1978693⁠

Tessnow-von Wysocki, I., & Vadrot, A. B. M. (2022).Governing a Divided Ocean: The Transformative Power of Ecological Connectivity in the BBNJ Negotiations. Politics and Governance, 10(3), 14–28. ⁠https://doi.org/10.17645/pag.v10i3.5428⁠

Tessnow-von Wysocki, I., & Vadrot, A. B. M. (2020). The Voice of Science on Marine Biodiversity Negotiations: A Systematic Literature Review. Frontiers in Marine Science, 7. ⁠https://doi.org/10.3389/fmars.2020.614282⁠

Vadrot, A. B. M., Langlet, A., & Tessnow-von Wysocki, I.(2021). Who owns marine biodiversity? Contesting the world order through the ‘common heritage of humankind’ principle. Environmental Politics, 31(2),226–250. https://doi.org/10.1080/09644016.2021.1911442

Episode 4 – Civil Society

Series on Stakeholders in BBNJ: PART 2 Civil Society

It’s not just government delegations that participate in ocean negotiations. There are countless non-governmental organisations (NGOs) who observe and advise in the negotiations and support implementation.  These NGOs have real concerns about protecting marine biodiversity and increasingly campaign about ocean equity.

• What is the role of civil society in the BBNJ negotiations?

• Which new bodies will be established under the new agreement?

• How does the design of the committees carry implications for ocean equity?

In this episode, we talk to civil society and meet Rebecca Hubbard, the director of the High Seas Alliance – a global Alliance of more than 60 NGOs and the International Union for Conservation of Nature (IUCN).

Guest: Rebecca Hubbard

Hosts: Ina Tessnow-von Wysocki⁠ & ⁠Jennifer Macey⁠

Sound design and editing: ⁠Emily Perkins⁠

Communication: Sunnefa Yeatman

For comments & feedback please contact: [email protected]

Find out more:

ANCORS Ocean Equity page https://oceanequityresearch.org/

ANCORS at the University of Wollongong https://www.uow.edu.au/ancors/

You can find official documents in preparation for the First Preparatory Commission Meeting on the United Nations Website: https://www.un.org/bbnjagreement/en/meetings/preparatory-commission/documents/first-session

High Seas Alliance Website: https://highseasalliance.org/

Research on the BBNJ process by ANCORS researchers:

Lothian, S. (2023). The BBNJ preamble: More than just window dressing. Marine Policy, 153, 105642-. https://doi.org/10.1016/j.marpol.2023.105642

Lothian, S. L. (2022). Marine conservation and international law: legal instruments for biodiversity beyond national jurisdiction. Routledge, Taylor & Francis Group.

Tessnow-von Wysocki, I., & Vadrot, A. B. M. (2024).Pathways of scientific input into intergovernmental negotiations: a new agreement on marine biodiversity. International Environmental Agreements : Politics, Law and Economics, 24(2–3),325–348. https://doi.org/10.1007/s10784-024-09642-0

Tessnow-von Wysocki, I. (2023). Science-policy interfaces for ocean protection: The case of the international negotiations for the conservation and sustainable use of marine biodiversity of areas beyond national jurisdiction (BBNJ). Doctoral Thesis. https://phaidra.univie.ac.at/detail/o:1978693

Tessnow-von Wysocki, I., & Vadrot, A. B. M. (2022). Governing a Divided Ocean: The Transformative Power of Ecological Connectivity in the BBNJ Negotiations. Politics and Governance, 10(3), 14–28. https://doi.org/10.17645/pag.v10i3.5428

Tessnow-von Wysocki, I., & Vadrot, A. B. M. (2020). The Voice of Science on Marine Biodiversity Negotiations: A Systematic Literature Review. Frontiers in Marine Science, 7. https://doi.org/10.3389/fmars.2020.614282

Episode 3 – Small Island States

Series on Stakeholders in BBNJ

PART 1 : Small Island States

Small Island States may be small when it comes to land – but are often big ocean states.

They are particularly vulnerable, as they depend on the ocean for their livelihoods and are among the most affected by climate change.

In the negotiations, they often form negotiating blocs to speak in one voice. Outcomes of negotiations for the new Ocean Treaty affect us all – but the direct impact of the treaty is especially felt in the case of Small Island States.

• What are challenges for Small Island States in the negotiations and implementation of the treaty?

• How will be ensured that they can shape new High Seas institutions in the long-term?

• And will the new ocean treaty shift power imbalances in ocean governance?

In this episode we hear from Angelique Pouponneau, the lead negotiator of the Alliance of Small Island States (AOSIS) what ocean equity means for Small Island States.

Guest: Angelique Pouponneau

Hosts: Ina Tessnow-von Wysocki and Jennifer Macey

Sound design and editing: ⁠Emily Perkins⁠

Communication: Sunnefa Yeatman

For comments & feedback please contact: [email protected]

Find out more:

ANCORS Ocean Equity page https://oceanequityresearch.org/

ANCORS at the University of Wollongong https://www.uow.edu.au/ancors/

You can find official documents in preparation for the First Preparatory Commission Meeting on the United Nations Website: https://www.un.org/bbnjagreement/en/meetings/preparatory-commission/documents/first-session

Website of the Alliance of Small Island States (AOSIS): https://www.aosis.org/

Research on the BBNJ process by ANCORS researchers:

Lothian, S. (2023). The BBNJ preamble: More than justwindow dressing. Marine Policy, 153, 105642-. https://doi.org/10.1016/j.marpol.2023.105642

Lothian, S. L. (2022). Marine conservation and international law: legal instruments for biodiversity beyond national jurisdiction. Routledge, Taylor & Francis Group.

Tessnow-von Wysocki, I., & Vadrot, A. B. M. (2024).Pathways of scientific input into intergovernmental negotiations: a new agreement on marine biodiversity. International Environmental Agreements : Politics, Law and Economics, 24(2–3),325–348. https://doi.org/10.1007/s10784-024-09642-0

Tessnow-von Wysocki, I. (2023). Science-policy interfaces for ocean protection: The case of the international negotiations for the conservation and sustainable use of marine biodiversity of areas beyond national jurisdiction (BBNJ). Doctoral Thesis. https://phaidra.univie.ac.at/detail/o:1978693

Tessnow-von Wysocki, I., & Vadrot, A. B. M. (2022).Governing a Divided Ocean: The Transformative Power of Ecological Connectivity in the BBNJ Negotiations. Politics and Governance, 10(3), 14–28. https://doi.org/10.17645/pag.v10i3.5428

Tessnow-von Wysocki, I., & Vadrot, A. B. M. (2020).The Voice of Science on Marine Biodiversity Negotiations: A Systematic Literature Review. Frontiers in Marine Science, 7. https://doi.org/10.3389/fmars.2020.614282

After decades of negotiations and a 36 hour-long meeting at the United Nations in New York, countries from around the world agreed to a new Ocean treaty in 2023. The landmark treaty governs Biodiversity of Areas Beyond National Jurisdiction – what we call, BBNJ.  A big task: It does not only protect marine life in the High Seas, but also ensures that benefits are shared fairly and equitably amongst all. The high seas, beyond national borders, cover two-thirds of the surface and nearly 95 percent of the volume of the entire ocean. But the treaty has not yet been ratified into domestic law by the 60+ countries needed to make it legally binding. This episode explores what happens next and how decisions now have real implications for ocean equity.

• What is still left to negotiate after the treaty has been adopted?

• How can all voices be heard for decisions about international areas?

• And what needs to happen now for this Agreement to come into life?

Join us and special guests Janine Felson and Adam McCarthy, the co-chairs of the Preparatory Commission for the entry into force of the BBNJ agreement.

The episode is published ahead of the First Preparatory Commission meeting April 14-25, 2025, in New York.

Guests: Janine Felson & Adam McCarthy

Hosts: Ina Tessnow-von Wysocki & Jennifer Macey

Sound design and editing: ⁠Emily Perkins⁠

Communication: Sunnefa Yeatman

For comments & feedback please contact: [email protected]

Find out more:

ANCORS Ocean Equity page https://oceanequityresearch.org/

ANCORS at the University of Wollongong https://www.uow.edu.au/ancors/

You can find official documents in preparation for the First Preparatory Commission Meeting on the United Nations Website: https://www.un.org/bbnjagreement/en/meetings/preparatory-commission/documents/first-session

Research on the BBNJ process by ANCORS researchers:

Dalaker, K. (2024). ‘A Commentary on the BBNJ Agreement Using the History of the Making of UNCLOS and Its Implementation Agreements’. Ocean Yearbook Online, vol. 38, no. 1, pp. 125-60.

Kraabel, K. (2022). Institutional arrangements in a BBNJ treaty: Implications for Arctic marine science. Marine Policy, 142, 103807-. https://doi.org/10.1016/j.marpol.2019.103807

Lothian, S. (2023a). The BBNJ preamble: More than just window dressing. Marine Policy, 153, 105642-. ⁠https://doi.org/10.1016/j.marpol.2023.105642⁠

Lothian, S. (2023b). The BBNJ Agreement: Through the Prism of Deep-Sea Vulnerable Marine Ecosystems. Ocean Development and International Law, 54(4), 469–499. https://doi.org/10.1080/00908320.2023.2296400

Lothian, S. (2022). Marine conservation and international law: legal instruments for biodiversity beyond national jurisdiction. Routledge, Taylor & Francis Group.

Tessnow-von Wysocki, I., & Vadrot, A. B. M. (2024). Pathways of scientific input into intergovernmental negotiations: a new agreement on marine biodiversity. International Environmental Agreements : Politics, Law and Economics, 24(2–3), 325–348. https://doi.org/10.1007/s10784-024-09642-0

Tessnow-von Wysocki, I. (2023). Science-policy interfaces for ocean protection: The case of the international negotiations for the conservation and sustainable use of marine biodiversity of areas beyond national jurisdiction (BBNJ). Doctoral Thesis. https://phaidra.univie.ac.at/detail/o:1978693

Tessnow-von Wysocki, I., & Vadrot, A. B. M. (2022). Governing a Divided Ocean: The Transformative Power of Ecological Connectivity in the BBNJ Negotiations. Politics and Governance, 10(3), 14–28. https://doi.org/10.17645/pag.v10i3.5428

Tessnow-von Wysocki, I., & Vadrot, A. B. M. (2020). The Voice of Science on Marine Biodiversity Negotiations: A Systematic Literature Review. Frontiers in Marine Science, 7. https://doi.org/10.3389/fmars.2020.614282

70 % of the Earth’s surface is Ocean. Beneath the surface lies a complex web of global governance. Who decides how to manage the ocean in a way that is fair and equitable to both the marine environment and humans who rely on the sea for their livelihoods?

Episode 1 of ‘Negotiating the Ocean’ explores the idea of Ocean Equity and how it can be applied to the high-level international talks governing and managing the ocean and its resources. We meet ANCORS researchers who work on different aspects of Ocean Equity, including fisheries, climate change, pollution, deep sea mining, renewable energy, and more.

We ask the big questions:

• Who gets to fish, where, and how much?
• How is climate change being factored into decision-making?
• How are responsibility and costs for environmental protection shared between developed and developing countries?
• How can benefits from minerals and genetic material be shared equitably?
• Who gets a seat at the decision-making table and is a diversity of voices being heard?
• And, what is the role of future generations and planetary health?

Join us for this first episode of negotiating the ocean and meet a collective of ANCORS experts passionate about reshaping the way global society relates to and looks after the Ocean.

⁠Quentin Hanich⁠, Professor at ANCORS, leading the Fisheries Governance Program

⁠Aline Jaeckel⁠, Associate Professor at ANCORS

⁠Michelle Voyer⁠⁠, Assoc.-Professor at ANCORS, leading the Blue Futures Program

⁠Freya Croft⁠, Post-doctoral Researcher, ANCORS

⁠Kamal Azmi⁠, Senior Research Fellow, ANCORS & Coordinator of the Graduate Certificate in Fisheries Management and Development

⁠Randa Sacedon⁠, ANCORS Research Fellow

⁠Makrita Solitei⁠, Associate Research Fellow, ANCORS

Hosts: Ina Tessnow-von Wysocki⁠, Bianca Haas⁠ & ⁠Jennifer Macey⁠

Sound design and editing: ⁠Emily Perkins⁠

Communication: Sunnefa Yeatman

For questions & comments please contact:

Ina Tessnow-von Wysocki ([email protected]⁠)

The Australian National Centre for Ocean Resources and Security (ANCORS), based at the University of Wollongong (UOW), is the only multidisciplinary university-based centre of its type in the Southern Hemisphere dedicated to delivering specialised research, advisory services, education and training in ocean law and policy, maritime security, and marine resources management.

ANCORS Ocean Equity page https://oceanequityresearch.org/

ANCORS at the University of Wollongong https://www.uow.edu.au/ancors/

The ANCORS Ocean Equity Podcast Negotiating the Ocean peeks below the surface of international ocean governance. We take you behind the scenes of ocean negotiations on biodiversity, fisheries and deep-sea mining and ask the big questions around equity and social justice.

Marine biodiversity, fisheries, deep-sea mining, climate change, and pollution are all inherently international issues and require cooperation at multiple levels. Negotiating the Ocean from ANCORS is your audio guide to navigate these high seas negotiations.

Each episode we’ll talk to experts around the world about the challenges facing the ocean and how the global community is trying to address them. Above all, we’ll look at these issues through the lens of equity, which means the process needs to be inclusive of different voices –because outcomes of the negotiations affect us all. 

So, whether you live by the ocean or far away, plan to attend the upcoming negotiations as part of a delegation or are an ocean enthusiast – this podcast is for you.

Podcast Team

Hosts

Jennifer Macey , Podcast Producer & Journalist

Ina Tessnow-von Wysocki, Ocean Nexus Postdoctoral Research Fellow, ANCORS

Bianca Haas, ANCORS Research Fellow

Editing

Emily Perkins

Communication

Sunnefa Yeatman

Find out more at ANCORS and Ocean Equity Research.