"I describe it as a fantasy novel about the real world we live in, or a realistic novel about the fantasy world we live in." Anthem is Noah Hawley's terrific, page-turning sixth novel, and his first after his Edgar Award-winning bestseller, Before The Fall—it's also our January 2022 Barnes & Noble Book Club pick. Noah joins us on the show for a wide-ranging, spoiler-free conversation about breaking the fourth wall, the death of satire, how we can use fiction to help us make sense of a nonsensical world (even when our brains are working overtime "to maintain the illusion we believe in."), writing for the screen vs. writing for the page, and more, including the ways Kurt Vonnegut's Slaughterhouse-Five and J.R.R. Tolkien's Lord of the Rings inspired Anthem. Featured books: Anthem by Noah Hawley, Slaughterhouse Five by Kurt Vonnegut, Lord of the Rings by J.R.R. Tolkien, The Unbearable Lightness of Being by Milan Kundera, Song of Solomon by Toni Morrison, The Virgin Suicides by Jeffrey Eugenides, White Noise by Don DeLillo, and One Hundred Years of Solitude by Gabriel Garcia Marquez.

Poured Over is produced and hosted by Miwa Messer and engineered by Harry Liang. Follow us here for new episodes Tuesdays and Thursdays (and occasional bonus eps on Saturdays).