OCF Crosspoint Podcast

// Episode 44 show notes

What comes to mind when you hear that someone had a "mountaintop experience"? Maybe you think about Moses, who hiked back down the mountainside literally glowing because he had been in the presence of God. Or Peter, James, and John—the inner circle of Jesus—who saw Jesus in His true, divine nature as he was transfigured right in front of them. You might recall that was an event that impacted Peter so deeply that he wanted to camp out and build a few memorials for Jesus, Elijah, and Moses.

The point is this, we regard mountaintop experiences as those moments when God moves in such a mighty and unexpected way, that, at least figuratively, we come back glowing like Moses or wanting to build a memorial like Peter. And while a mountaintop experience can take place anywhere, for some people, such an event actually takes place on a mountaintop.

Take for example my guest today—First Class Cadet Brigit Jogan, a senior at the United States Coast Guard Academy. During her time at Rocky Mountain High this past summer, Brigit hiked the summit of Mount Antero in Colorado's Collegiate Peaks, and it was during that physical climb to the mountaintop that she experienced the Spirit of God moving in a mighty way. Today, Brigit is going to talk about that experience as she shares her story.

// What we talked about

Here's an outline of the questions Brigit answered this episode:

• Tell me about where you're from, and why the Coast Guard?
• As you look back over your time at the Coast Guard Academy, what's academy life been like for you? What are some things you've learned about yourself, and what are some challenges you've faced?
• Share a little about your spiritual journey. When did you accept Jesus and begin following Him?
• What's it like being a Cadet and also being a Christian? Are there difficulties you've experienced when it comes to integrating your faith into your life in the Coast Guard?
• Talk about your involvement in OCF at the Coast Guard Academy—how you first heard about OCF and why you decided to give it a try and then stay involved?
• Talk more about what it is you do with the ministry team.
• Tell me more about your Rocky Mountain High experience. What was it like?
• What sorts of things would best equip you to live out your calling as someone who is very early in her military career?
• If listeners were going to take away only one thing from our conversation today, what would you hope that it would be?

// About my guest

Originally from Grosse Pointe Park, MI, Brigit Jogan is currently a 1/c cadet (senior) at the United States Coast Guard Academy. She participates actively in OCF as cadet president, studies electrical engineering, swims distance freestyle, and frequently shares terrible jokes with those unfortunate enough to be in earshot. Her other hobbies include completing adult coloring books and looking at pictures of her beautiful dog, Phinn. In the future, she hopes to continue her education through the Coast Guard and to continue to stay very involved with ministry, with whatever adventures that entails.

Have you ever thought about what it means to be a good steward of your time? Maybe you can recall getting to the end of a day and thinking, "Why did I waste so much time?" Joining me on the show to talk about time stewardship is LTC Gil Jacobs, USA (Ret.). He was also my guest back in episode 18, when we talked about transformational leadership. Today, LTC Jacobs and I will talk about his new book called "Time for Christ."

// Book giveaway

LTC Jacobs has given me three copies of "Time For Christ" to give away for free. If you'd like to be entered for a chance to win one of the copies, send an email to [email protected] and mention "Time For Christ book giveaway" in the subject line. Deadline to enter is 30 September. Winners will be selected and notified by 4 October.

// What we talked about

Here are a few of the questions LTC Jacobs and I discussed:

• What led you to write the book?
• What does stewarding your time look like? Why is it important to be good stewards of our time?
• Talk more about the 7 ways of time stewardship that you wrote about:

1. Spend time with God.
2. Our time should demonstrate a love for other people.
3. Be a good steward and enjoy what God has given you.
4. Be trustworthy with your little portions of time.
5. Count the cost.
6. Live in harmony with God's plan.
7. Rest, and remember the Sabbath and keep it holy.

• There's a good leadership principle you write about that is centered on Proverbs 27:23. What does this look like for military leaders?
• The Stewardship Model: what is it and how might leaders use it?

• From principle 5, Count the cost: "Can you afford to add a new activity or commitment to your day?" How can we determine when it's appropriate to take on new tasks or activities? How can we best determine when to eliminate something from our list, or learn to just say no?
• If listeners took away only one thing from our conversation today, what would you hope it would be?

//About today's guest

Jeff Struecker enlisted in the United States Army as an Infantryman at age 18 and retired as a Chaplain with over 22 years of active federal service. In 2017, he was inducted into the US Army Ranger Hall of Fame. He served for ten years in the 75th Ranger Regiment in positions from Private to Platoon Sergeant. While serving in this unit, Jeff competed in and won the David L. Grange Best Ranger Competition in 1996. He taught ROTC at the University of Louisville and was recognized in 1998 as the US Army ROTC, Noncommissioned Officer of the year. Jeff spent his final ten years in the US Army serving as a chaplain in Airborne and Ranger units.

Throughout his career, Jeff has attended numerous professional military schools and has received many awards and commendations. Some of his awards include the Ranger Tab, Combat Infantryman's Badge, Pathfinder Badge, Master Parachutists Wings, Military Freefall Master Parachutist Wings, several foreign jump wings and the Combat Action Badge. He has been awarded other commendations and decorations throughout his military career.

His combat experience includes participation in the invasion of Panama, Operation Desert Storm, Black Hawk Down in Somalia, and more than a dozen combat tours in Afghanistan and Iraq. Jeff has been awarded medals for valor in combat and has received many medals as recognition for his service in the US Army.

Jeff holds a Ph.D. from Southeastern Baptist Theological Seminary in Wake Forest, NC. He also has several other earned and honorary degrees. Jeff in an award-winning author with five books in print. He and his wife, Dawn, have five children and two grandchildren.

//About our conversation

Jeff's book, "The Road to Unafraid," is the centerpiece for the conversation. Any number of perspectives or themes can be found in the book—God's calling; knowing God's will; His providence—but Jeff and I focused on trusting in God. In the face of fear and uncertainty at certain times throughout his life, I asked Jeff to talk about how God asked Jeff to trust Him and what that looked like in his life, particularly his military career.

I also picked out a few key points in his life and quotes from the book and had Jeff fill in the blanks as we discussed the broader topic of trusting God in all things.

//What we talked about

Where Jeff's from and his family life.

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Three things from Jeff's childhood: First, his fear of death and all the questions that go along with it; second, the fact that he walked alone to a nearby church because no one from his family would go with him; and third, the young couple who visited him to share the Gospel. What was God doing during those early years?

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Jeff went from Burger King to the Army after high school and talks about that period of his life. Looking back, where were God's fingerprints during this period of life?

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Jeff comments on these two quotes:

• "What I was learning about the unknown was that sometimes its advance billing sounds worse than the reality…The experience, in fact, can be an opportunity to train for an even greater task down the road."
• "I had learned to keep performing even if the circumstance wasn't fair. The enemy wasn't always going to fight fair. No use whining about it."

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The impact of Kurt Smith in Jeff's life, and how Kurt's conversion caused a lot of guilt and introspection in Jeff's life.

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Jeff comments on this quote from his book: "A lot of people look down on a soldier who's a Christian, thinking he's automatically weaker than the rest. He is assumed to be too compassionate and distracted with moral restrictions to be tough, that the enemy on the battlefield can exploit his weakness more easily."

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When he was with the Third Ranger Battalion, Jeff talked about being afraid of failing morally and spiritually.

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Jeff's deployment to Kuwait, and some difficulties there, would come into play when he deployed to Somalia. "Submitting to a higher authority is one of those life struggles that frustrates us all from time to time, both in and outside of the military."

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Jeff gives a quick summary of what was going on in Somalia, why we were there, and his role in the mission. What did it look like to trust God during this deployment?

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After the events in Mogadishu, Jeff found himself fielding all sorts of questions, and some frustrations about God and other spiritual matters, from the men he served with because they knew he was a Christian. "I didn't try to talk them out of their strong feelings. I just let them vent. Far greater minds than mine have struggled with why pain and suffering are so rampant in our world and how much of it is humanity's fault."

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How God called Jeff into the ministry and the ruckus that news caused around Ft. Benning. Jeff talks about what did this do to his faith and trust in God while he waited on Him for a clearer direction.

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After some time, Jeff found himself back in the Army, but this time as a chaplain assigned to the Second Ranger Battalion. During a deployment to Iraq, Jeff said those old fears from earlier in his career tried to resurface: "That's the way it usually is with our fears. We don't beat them back once and for all. They keep returning to test us, to see if we still have the faith and courage we showed last time."

"The opposite side of fear is not courage. The opposite side of fear is faith."

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Where does God have Jeff now? What's on the horizon?

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I ask Jeff: If listeners took away only one thing from our conversation, what would you hope that it would be?

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Jeff recommends "Walking With God Through Pain and Suffering" by Tim Keller for those wanting to read more about the topic of handling difficulties and the struggles of life.

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Jeff closes by talking about one of his books, "Hide and Seek."

//Book giveaway

We have one signed copy of "Hide and Seek" to give away. Just send an email to [email protected] by 31 August for your chance to win.

My guest today is Michelle Qureshi. Michelle is a graduate of the United States Coast Guard Academy, and she served 9 years in the military, leaving the Coast Guard as a Lieutenant. If that last name sounds familiar, then it's probably because you're familiar with speaker and author Nabeel Qureshi. He's Michelle's late husband who wrote two NY Times bestsellers, "Seeking Allah, Finding Jesus" and "No God But One," and who died in 2017 after being diagnosed with stage 4 stomach cancer in 2016.

Michelle's story of military life at the intersection of faith, family, and profession is one that deals with such topics as stress, hardship, and discouragement, but more importantly, it's a story of how she has experienced what she calls "incredible hope amidst suffering."

Where does your story begin? Why she joined the Coast Guard, how she met Nabeel.

"Trials have a way of giving you opportunities to grow."

Regarding that first assignment aboard the law enforcement cutter in 2008. What was that assignment like?

What was life like aboard the cutter?

You mentioned during a conversation offline that expressing emotions, or showing need, and even demonstrating morality were considered signs of weakness and ignorance. Talk more about that.

"There was a twisted delight in seeing innocence corrupted."

How did you see those around you coping with the stressful environment? What about you?

"God, I will serve you anywhere—anywhere but here."

The difficult assignment that we're talking about happened during the first 2 years of your marriage. What sort of support or advice were you getting from home, or was this even a topic you discussed with Nabeel?

Shifting the focus now to the challenges you faced at home—and of course I'm mostly talking about Nabeel's cancer diagnosis—talk more about that time in your life.

"We were just a rag-tag group of people that loved God."

What did dealing with stress look like in the situation with Nabeel? Michelle shares her three P's.

"God is present. God gives us power. And there is purpose in the trials and suffering."

Michelle offers some books and resources—including a potential book that she might be writing soon.

• Elisabeth Elliott author page on Amazon
• Joni Eareckson Tada author page on Amazon
• Lysa TerKeurst author page on Amazon
• Levi Lusko: Through The Eyes of a Lion

About Michelle

• Follow Michelle: NQMinistries
• Support: Patreon
• Books: Nabeel's books

November 23, 2014.

Does that date ring any bells for you? Unless it happens to be your birthday, or a loved one's birthday, or an anniversary, or some other impressionable event, then for most of you, November 23, 2014, likely was just another fall day only a few days before Thanksgiving.

For my guest this episode— Col Rich Tatem, USAF (Ret.)—that date will forever be etched into his memory as the day his son, Brennan, committed suicide. It's a date with an emotional connection that he likens to how a person might recall an event like 9/11—a day that, for most of us, is so vivid even nearly 18 years later that if someone were to ask, "Where were you on 9/11?" you'd immediately remember certain details of that day. Details that, on any other day, are nearly forgotten as quickly as they happen because they're so mundane or so routine.

Today, Col Tatem will share Brennan's tragic story with you, and he'll also challenge you to do several things—and these things apply whether you're a junior officer, a flag officer, or somewhere else in the ranks—develop social resilience for yourself and for those you lead, prepare for what he calls the crucible moments of life, and probably most importantly, remember that you are your brother's keeper. If you see someone in trouble, help them.

When it comes to applications, hardware, computers, and other such devices, plug and play technology is awesome. It allows the discovery of a hardware component in a system without the need for physical device configuration. For example, when you plug in that USB headset, or new mouse, keyboard, or similar device, chances are your computer's PNP technology almost instantly recognizes that new device.

Let's apply the PNP process from a biblical perspective: Does wisdom work the same way? When you read through Proverbs, can you just take a single proverb and plug it into a situation and then expect immediate results?

That's part of what we're talk about in this episode. And that phrase "plug and play" is one that you'll hear my guest use several times when talking about the application of wisdom. We'll also talk about using Proverbs chapters 1-9 as the interpretive lens for the rest of the book.

My guest today is Pastor Keith Peck. He has over 40 years of pastoral ministry experience, and recently retired as pastor emeritus of Broadneck Evangelical Presbyterian Church in Annapolis, Maryland, where he served for 27 years.

Keith is also the guest speaker during session 4 of Summer R&R at White Sulphur Springs, which is currently underway, and he's speaking at Spring Canyon during Summer Celebration Week 7, which starts July 20th.

WHAT WE TALKED ABOUT

Military connection. Keith has ministered to and with the Navigators, Cru and OCF staff at the US Naval Academy, and he shares more about how God put the military on his heart as an area of ministry and outreach.

His presentation at both conference centers includes an introduction study and 6 topics on wisdom, and is titled "Reading Proverbs through the lens of its interpretive guide." Keith talks more about what that means.

From his introduction study: What is wisdom and why is it important?

Keith delves into the other 6 topics and talks about the purpose of each one.

Keith talks about which of the topics seems to be hardest to grasp or causes the most discussion, and why.

Resources that Keith recommends for someone wanting to do a more in-depth study on wisdom.

• How to Read Proverbs, Tremper Longman III
• Proverbs: Kidner Classic Commentaries

Keith's story. Who are you?

In this episode, Crosspoint host Josh Jackson chats with pastor and author Chris Plekenpol, who recounts an incident with a suicide bomber in Iraq and also talks about God's word, God's spirit, God's people... finding God's will.

Chris graduated from the United States Military Academy at West Point in 1999 and served in the Army for seven years. Upon God's call in his life to ministry, he attended Dallas Theological Seminary and received his Masters in Theology (ThM.) Chris traveled as an evangelist and missional group trainer with iamsecond.com for two years before becoming the Lead Pastor of Wells Branch Community Church.

Chris is the guest speaker during week 7 of Summer RNR at White Sulphur Springs. If you haven't made summer plans, or if your plans suddenly change, check out the White Sulphur Springs and Spring Canyon websites for availability this summer, or start planning ahead for the fall and winter programs we offer at both conference centers.

OUTLINE //

Here are some of the topics Chris and Josh talk about:

Chris shares his story, including a moment in his career in which his trajectory shifted from Army Special Forces to a calling to serve full time in Christian ministry.

While deployed, Chris recounts a moment in Iraq when an encounter with a suicide bomber left a deep spiritual impact in his life.

Chris gives insight into what he'll be talking about this summer at White Sulphur Springs Conference Center—a topic he calls "God Speaks."

How can someone know God's will? Chris offers advice to listeners who might be asking that question about God right now.

When it comes to relationships, Chris talks about different relationship stories from the Bible and what tell us about our faith—why does God bring certain relationships into our lives?

Why do we tend to treat the ones we love the most the worst and what we can do to fix that?

Chris is asked: If you could only take one of your books with you to a deserted island, which would you take and why?

Answer: Faith in the Fog of War, vol.2 (daily devotions that Chris wrote while in combat)

Other books:

• Faith in the Fog of War, first edition
• Stumbling Souls: Is Love Enough?
• Is Love Wrong?: An Evangelical Christian encounters a Gay Activist
• Dating Basic Training

Other resources Chris recommends:

NET Bible

The Bible Project

"God's Word should be a primary diet in your life."

In this episode, pastor and author Dr. Gary Phillips discusses a topic he has titled "Basic Training for the Family: Biblical Principles for Navigating Cultural Minefields."

Gary is senior pastor of Signal Mountain Bible Church in Chattanooga, Tennessee, where he and his wife, Betsy, have served since 1985. Gary earned degrees from Vanderbilt University, Dallas Theological Seminary, and Grace Theological Seminary.

He's also the guest speaker at White Sulphur Springs Conference Center during Week 5 of Summer R & R, which runs from July 5-12. If you haven't made plans for that week, or for the rest of the summer, be sure to check out the White Sulphur Springs website for details about how you can get signed up for Week 5 when Gary is speaking, or get more information on all of our summer sessions.

What we talked about

Gary talks about how he has seen the military family change during the roughly 36 years he's been involved at OCF and as a speaker at WSS. What's different? What's still the same?

The topic of basic training for the family has been divided into two parts: first, goals for marriage, and second, goals for parenting.

Goals for Marriage

What should be some goals for marriage?

"The very best gift that might wife ever gave to me was to begin a journey into a very deep devotional life on her own—not dependent upon me. And that produced amazing fruit for our marriage."

What type of "basic training" is needed to help us reach those goals, or at least put us in a good position to reach them?

What cultural landmines do families face when it comes to reaching these goals for marriage?

How can a couple navigate the minefield, and either avoid those landmines or recover from a direct hit?

Goals for Parenting

What are some goals to have as parents?

What's the "basic training" needed for parenting?

What are some landmines that families face when it comes to parenting and reaching those goals as parents?

How do families navigate the minefield together?

Recommended Resources

"The Meaning of Marriage," by Tim Keller

"The Marriage Builder," Larry Crabb

"The 5 Love Languages," by Gary Chapman

"In His Image," by Jen Wilkin

"Thriving, Not Just Surviving," by OCF (Or contact the Home Office for info about how you can purchase a copy: 800-424-1984)

Gary offers one final takeaway for listeners.

Gary shares more about himself, his involvement with OCF, and how God put it on his heart to minister to our military men, women, and families.

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Remember, if you have an idea for a guest, topic, or story you'd like us to consider on a future episode, send an email to me at [email protected]. Thanks for taking time out of your day to spend it with us, and we hope you'll join us for the next episode of OCF Crosspoint.

In this special Memorial Day bonus episode of OCF Crosspoint, we deviate from our typical episode format of sharing stories of military life, and instead, bring you a devotional from "Leader, Draw Near," a weekly devotional written by Col Larry Simpson, USAF (Ret.), and his wife, Bobbie. The Simpsons are also the OCF field staff reps in the Puget Sound area.

The book is available on Amazon in ebook format only. If you'd like a soft cover print copy, contact the OCF Home Office at 800-424-1984.

To quote from Bailey Suzio on the website, herviewfromhome.com...

"Memorial Day is not just about the freedom we've been given but about the high, high price it has been bought at. It is a day to stop, survey the beauty, and recognize the cost.

So please, this Memorial Day, stop and pass down the legacy of the fallen. I encourage you to come alongside those in grief. Find a way to support Gold Star Families.

Tell your children what and why Monday is a day off work. Savor the time you have as a family and do something together to serve. Lay wreaths on graves. Pray together for those grieving. Share about the fallen. Find a way to remember the day for what it is and to honor those who have paid the ultimate cost."

Today, we remember and honor those men and women who have gone before us and paid the ultimate sacrifice while serving America in uniform.

I hope you'll join me on the next episode when I chat with Dr. Gary Phillips about navigating cultural minefields as a couple and as parents. That's coming up in one week.

Thanks for taking a few minutes out of your schedule today to enjoy this bonus episode of OCF Crosspoint.

According to the Barna Group, 51% of U.S. churchgoers have never heard the term Great Commission, found in Matthew 28:18-20. Furthermore, only 37% could pick it out from among a group of Bible verses.

So whether you're in the group who has never heard of the Great Commission, or if you know the Great Commission backwards and forwards—while reading it in Greek—stick with us today as our guest, CH LTC Dan Holcomb, USA (Ret.), talks about how the Great Commission relates to what he calls "Disciplines of a Warrior."

CH Holcomb is also a guest speaker at Spring Canyon Conference Center during Week 4 of Summer Celebration. He began his military career in 1975, retired in 2013, and is now a Professor of Practical Theology at Covenant Bible Seminary in Lakewood, Washington.

Summer registration links at both OCF conference centers:

Spring Canyon White Sulphur Springs

What we talked about

Here are some questions that CH Holcomb answers this episode:

• Tell us your story.
• How did you recognize that it was God calling you to that next thing… that next chapter of your life?
• Talk about the relationship between the Great Commission and the topic of Disciplines of a Warrior.
• When we talk about living out the Great Commission, what does that look like for those in the military? Does it look different for those serving in uniform?
• Why do you think Jesus wants disciples instead of converts?
• In verse 20 of the Great Commission, we see the word "observe" in many Bible translations. What is the meaning of that word, and what does it look like for us as disciples to "observe"?

Resources recommended by CH Holcomb

"Celebration of Discipline," by Richard Foster

"The Spirit of the Disciplines," by Dallas Willard

CH Holcomb's Facebook Group, To Be Like Him

Contact CH Holcomb: [email protected]

Contact OCF Crosspoint

If you have an idea for a guest, topic, or story we should consider, send an email to [email protected].