Open Mike Podcast

On December 2nd, 1999, Timothy Cole died of an asthma attack while in prison for a sexual assault he didn't commit. Stunned by the injustice of the loss, his brother Cory vowed to clear his brother's name and ensure such a tragedy never befall anyone else. His family, joined by the victim and the Texas Innocence Project, successfully overturned Tim's conviction on February 6, 2009, becoming the state of Texas's first posthumous exoneration. Today, Cory is the Vice President of the Texas Innocence Project, drawing upon his experiences to lobby for progressive, statewide justice reform. Tune in to this moving installment of Open Mike for updates on the Innocence Project's current initiatives and how Tim's family is faring these days.

Show Notes

[00:30] Background of Cory Session, Vice President of Texas's Innocence Project, and context of his brother Timothy Cole's wrongful conviction and asthma attack death while behind bars.

[01:04] Cory, welcome to Open Mike. I hate meeting under these circumstances, but I know it's your life's mission, talking about your brother and Innocence Projects… you've worked tirelessly to free wrongful convictions — can you set the stage for our viewers on why?

[03:20] This ended up being a high-profile case… a white woman being allegedly raped by a Black man, a series of serial sexual assaults that started before he even got to campus… why don't you tell us some of the basic issues that happened within the case and doomed Timothy's chance at a fair trial?

[7:07] Testimonial from the survivor stated that her assailant kept smoking cigarettes and she would pocket the butts, thinking they would be useful as evidence. Timothy was a severe asthmatic and couldn't smoke — information that was not told to her by police.

[08:12] Another rape occurred, and Tim was identified as the rapist… which is impossible, because he was not even in the same geographic region and had an alibi.

[09:48] Tim refused a plea deal for two years of probation, because he refused to admit to a crime he didn't do.

[11:48] Every time Tim's defense attorney mentioned the name of a suspect who later ended up being guilty, the judge threatened to hold him in contempt.

[12:15] He was convicted and ultimately sentenced to 25 years in prison.

[15:28] On December 3rd, Tim's family was notified that he had passed away in prison the previous day.

[21:46] While Tim was in prison, he still remained in close contact with his family, with multiple visits. And maintained his innocence, hoping for eventual exoneration.

[22:59] A lot of these cases have bad lawyering, but it doesn't sound like that here. It sounds like Tim had a horrible prosecutor and judge. It's shocking how this jury came to this result. I know there was DNA evidence back during this time — none of which could have matched your brother and matched someone else.

[24:32] Was it argued at trial that your brother couldn't smoke cigarettes?

[25:12] Fast forwarding a little bit to the wonderful changes you and your family were able to put into action in Texas… why don't you talk about some of the developments that have occurred as well as your mission work?

[27:43] In 2008, an investigative reporter told Tim's family that detectives had a rape kit that would have potentially exonerated him, implicated Jerry Wayne Johnson, the actual rapist, and they were sitting on it. Up until that time, no one in Texas had been posthumously exonerated.

[31:45] Tim's family ended up meeting with then-governor Rick Perry and convinced him to pass the Timothy Cole Compensation Act which increased compensation funds to exonerees to $80,000 per year for time served — the most generous in the country — as well as up to 120 college credit hours and lifetime annuity.

[34:43] We've been doing a lot of these cases, and people who are exonerated do not receive the same benefits as someone who's been paroled… so it's fantastic that the state of Texas has been getting on board and trying to make it better for those who have been released.

[38:01] Tim's family still keeps in contact with the assault survivor who incorrectly identified him as a perpetrator, and there is no blame being cast— both parties are moving forward with grace and forgiveness.

 [39:03] Is there anything being done in Texas to make sure this never happens to someone else? Because you and I both know that wrongful identifications make up a huge percentage of wrongful convictions…

[42:16] Can you give us a brief overview of what you're doing as VP of Texas's Innocence Project?

[45:13] You're doing some great work and I commend you for these admirable efforts. Last question… what do you think Tim would say about all of the good work you're doing with the Innocence Project and all the developments that happened posthumously?

[47:13] While he was in prison, Tim stated, "I still believe in the justice system even if it does not believe in me."

[47:40] I think with your tenacity, we will reach a place where justice is distributed more equally. And I want to end on that powerful note. Cory Sessions, thank you so much for being here with us on Open Mike and sharing your story.

[48:02] Be sure to check out the Texas Innocence Project, and donate if you can!

[48:18] Another tough one… if you know somebody who needs to see this episode, forward it to them, like, comment, subscribe… thank you for being here with us and watching Open Mike — take care.

What if you could nourish both the bodies and the souls of your fellow neighbors? We the People Opportunity Farm has accomplished just that for Washtenaw County and its inhabitants. The community farming project has sowed the seeds for its participants' success by investing in the employment and development of formerly incarcerated men and women through farming and community engagement. Since its unofficial launch in 2017, the program has consistently expanded in both size and reach, selling its vegetables to seventeen area restaurants and donating fresh produce to those in need. We the People Opportunity Farm prides itself on its core values of radical inclusion, intentional collaboration, courageous disruption, foundational justice, and commitment to growth — all of which have been integral to the project's stunning development. If you're passionate about gardening or advocacy work, this episode is an absolute must-watch!

Show Notes

[00:44] Melvin Parson and Deshawn Leath, welcome to Open Mike!

[00:51] This is the first time I've had guests in my studio in months, and this feels like a really good one to welcome people back with. I've been reading about you, Melvin, and what a program you have put together — We the People Opportunity Farm in Washtenaw County. Tell us about this incredible nonprofit that involves farming, feeding the needy, and helping former convicts reintegrate into society!

[02:00] I love the analogy of building the plane in the air… when did you start this program?

[03:55] What did you grow in the garden that first summer?

[06:15] How did you get the land that you built the farm on?

[09:22] A chance interaction with a local, neighborhood kid who wanted to help with the farm made Melvin realize that this space could hold a tremendous amount of community value. It was his job to create a safe space for others to nourish themselves, both physically and spiritually.

[12:38] This community garden has been steadily growing — how large is it now?

[14:38] It's 2017, you had a quarter-acre of land for the garden, lots of volunteers… what kind of vegetables are you growing?

[15:40] Well-known Ann Arbor staple Zingerman's Roadhouse ended up being the first client they sold their produce to. They eventually expanded to seventeen other restaurant clients in the Ann Arbor and Ypsilanti area, all of whom praised the quality of the vegetables, which Melvin attributes to the quality of the soil he curated.

[17:46] How many acres are you growing on now?

[18:43] I want to bring Deshawn Leath into the conversation… one of Melvin's tenets is to bring in lots of volunteers and to bring in formerly incarcerated, paid interns into the farm. Tell us about yourself, and your story.

[21:50] While serving a five-year prison sentence, Deshawn committed himself to transforming his life, and was connected with Melvin through another nonprofit. He's currently interning with We the People Opportunity Farm, 46 days after his release.

[22:46] What an incredible story, Deshawn. Did you do any type of farming or gardening while you were in prison?

[23:50] Melvin, farming is not an easy business… using former inmates — tell me your thought process on that? It sounds like you're specifically seeking out former inmates to help the farm.

[28:29] You've probably already thought about this, Melvin, because you are quite the visionary… the two of you and others in your situation going into prison and teaching inmates about gardening, soil, and how to change their lives… If that's allowed, of course. Have you thought of that?

[29:28] Are all of your interns formerly incarcerated men and women? How many have you taken on?

[30:24] With help from their partner Grace Fellowship Church House of Solutions, which is where the farm is currently located, they hope to expand from half-an-acre to a full acre, which would allow them to introduce more people into the paid internship program.

[33:01] If people want to come for field trips, or just to visit, volunteer, and enjoy the energy of what you've grown, how can they find out about you and arrange to make that happen?

[34:30] Because of COVID-19, volunteering opportunities are more intentional and structured, but you can contact We the People Opportunity Farm at any time via their website and social to arrange a date.

[35:42] Deshawn, do you believe this internship will break the cycle of incarceration? What does this opportunity mean to you?

[38:28] One of the admirable values of your mission is to be "courageously disruptive of the prison-industrial complex." Could you explain that to me?

[40:44] You're in Washtenaw County and some really good things are happening there! You have a new prosecutor who's shaking things up, and ended the cash bail system… I think that's the first county in Michigan and hopefully it will become statewide.

[46:30] I can't see how you could fail with this energy you keep… you certainly have commitment from my law firm — we're going to donate to your cause — and when you need people out there, we're going to help bring people. We didn't even mention this — but you give a lot of this beautiful, soulful food to people who can't afford it! Tell us a little more about that.

[50:26] If there's anything you need from me, please reach out and let me know. Thank you both for being here — I really appreciate you taking the time to share your vision with me, and I look forward to the future because I know it's going to be bright.

[50:56] Thank you for listening and watching Open Mike! I hope you were as blown away as I was — please volunteer, donate, and buy merch from them! I can't wait to see what happens with this organization because I'm anticipating great things. Please share, like, comment on this episode — and thank you for tuning in.

The entire world has been disrupted by the COVID-19 pandemic, but few industries have been hit as uniquely hard as the bar and restaurant sector. Recognizing the dire straits the industry faces, Michigan-born comedian Jason Douglas was compelled to help and launched Pay it Forward Comedy, a virtual standup series that distributes crowd-sourced funds to struggling restaurants and bars. The shows feature national headline acts from shows like Seinfeld and Breaking Bad donating their time and talent to raise money for small businesses that have partially or completely closed down due to the pandemic. Tune in to this latest installment of Open Mike for information on upcoming comedy shows and ways to contribute to your local establishments — while enjoying laugh or two as well!

Show Notes

[00:30] Jason Douglas's bio and Pay It Forward Comedy charity event details.

[00:54] Jason, welcome to Open Mike!

[01:08] There are so many ways to help small businesses, like you're doing with Pay It Forward Comedy. Tell us how you came up with the idea!

[01:40] So you have the participation of some comedians who have been on Seinfeld and Breaking Bad… tell us who they are! How hard was it to get them to do this?

[02:21] Wait, Agent Gomez from Breaking Bad is a comedian?

[02:39] When are these comedy shows? How can people watch?

[02:47] Check out their Facebook Page for upcoming show dates!

[03:12] I didn't know you were a Metro Detroit guy! I have a lot of restaurant friends, so I love this idea. Where were you born and raised?

[03:37] How does this work? You're conducting this on Facebook or a platform where people can digitally log in… but let's say we pick a great restaurant — walk us through how the event works.

[04:48] Have you done one yet in Michigan?

[05:47] I know when I'm in a comedy club, I'm laughing my ass off… whereas, if I'm watching an HBO comedy set, I'm not as engaged. How are you finding it translating over via Zoom? How does the audience interact and how do you feed off them when the audience is remote?

[07:03] Let's try it — I'm gonna put you on the spot. Give me a little something!

[07:47] How many shows have you done thus far? And what's the reaction from the restaurants?

[08:08] Those headliners you mentioned… are they up for participating whenever?

[08:39] How many of the jokes are about COVID and the pandemic? What percentage does that occupy the setlist?

[09:35] Tell me about your comedic life! Before COVID, what were you up to, what's your background?

[11:07] You're booking a lot — are you still doing standup, or is that a thing of the past?

[12:04] Before COVID, there were a lot of new comedy shows on Netflix… now that live comedy shows are paused, I imagine there's been a boom in recorded comedy specials?

[12:50] Royal Oak's Comedy Castle is consistently voted one of the nation's best comedy clubs and just reopened in late February for the first time since the pandemic.

[14:05] Do you like heckling when you're performing?

[15:28] You mentioned you worked with Brad Garrett… what did you do for him? Is he a good dude?

[16:05] Your company is called the Comedian Company and you're still booking events both corporate and private party right now… if anyone is listening and owns a restaurant that is struggling, make sure to contact Jason, who is providing this service.

[22:36] Jason also got Darren McCarty, a former Open Mike Guest, into comedy.

[23:48] Thanks for being on Open Mike, Jason! We'll talk soon.

[23:58] There you have it! Jason Douglas from Pay It Forward Comedy… if you have someone in your life who loves to laugh, be sure to forward this episode to them and like/subscribe. We're nearing 3 million downloads and are coming up to our 100th episode, which we have some special stuff planned for… we appreciate you watching — take care!

At age 17, Philadelphian Terrance Lewis found himself falsely accused of the 1996 murder of Hulon Howard, incriminated by the deceased's girlfriend who was under the influence of crack cocaine at the time. After an excruciating two-year-long investigation, Lewis was ultimately convicted of murder and sent to prison. He would remain wrongfully incarcerated for the next twenty-one years, until a new defense team, groundbreaking Supreme Court ruling, and pragmatic Common Pleas Judge helped pave the way to his 2019 exoneration. Upon release, Lewis successfully filed a civil rights lawsuit against the city of Philadelphia and appropriated the funds to launch the Terrance Lewis Liberation Foundation, a non-profit that advocates for wrongfully convicted and disproportionately sentenced peoples. Tune in to this installment of Open Mike to find out how he managed to reassemble his life and give back to others who have been similarly victimized.

Show Notes

[00:13] Terrance Lewis's background and bio.

[00:49] Terrance, welcome to the show. I'm so happy to have you here, today.

[1:00] I've read a lot about you and I have to say I'm so sorry you spent nineteen years in prison for a murder you didn't commit. It's just a heartbreaking story and I'm so pleased you're approaching a two-year milestone of being released. I'm honored to have you on the show.

[01:48] Terrance actually spent over twenty-one years in prison.

[02:57] It's scary how common these stories are, how common the injustice and the fraud is. It's just mind-boggling...

[03:38] Let's go back to 1997, you were nineteen years old, expecting your first child, a month away from being born… were you excited about becoming a dad?

[04:58] Were you able to build a connection with your son while you were in prison?

[05:59] Terrance was placed in the farthest regions of Pennsylvania, far from his hometown of Philadelphia, further isolating him from his family.

[06:15] How many times did you see your son in those twenty-one years?

[07:21] Let's go back to 1997 again… there was a murder in your neighborhood, you were living with your cousin, didn't have a ton of money… did you hear about this murder or know that something happened?

[08:42] When was the first time you were notified you were a suspect? Was it when the police approached you?

[09:33] Tell us how the police became convinced of your guilt and arrested you?

[11:29] One of the witnesses had gotten high on crack cocaine prior to alleging Terrance's guilt. Police then manipulated and exploited her unreliable memory to spoon feed her contrived information that pinned the murder on Terrance.

[13:15] They never got a wrongful confession out of you, correct? They never tied you with DNA, a weapon, or any evidence except for a known addict who was getting high when she allegedly saw you, correct?

[14:01] There were two other people convicted who were with you at the time, yes?

[15:24] Who was your defense attorney for your trial?

[16:37] Was this a court-appointed attorney or did you retain him with money?

[18:56] Did you meet your attorney before the trial?

[20:57] How many days was your trial?

[21:30] A lot of these wrongful conviction trials are short jury trials with poor defense attorneys who aren't calling up witnesses or cross-examining… did he mount any defense once the trial was going? Were you aware during your trial that things were going horribly awry?

[24:21] Where were you at the time of the murder? Did you have an alibi?

[26:18] None of that makes sense and it's shocking to hear these types of stories. Did your attorney call any witnesses at all on your behalf?

[27:58] Terrance, with all due love and respect, you keep saying you're not a lawyer… but you're smarter than a lot of lawyers I know — you don't have to be a lawyer to brainstorm these facts you're presenting, which makes your situation even sadder. Did you testify at trial? You mentioned that you wanted to, but did you ever take the stand?

[32:05] Take us through the process of how you were exonerated — what happened along that journey?

[34:07] In 2012, the U.S. Supreme Court ruled that it was unconstitutional to give minors like Lewis mandatory life sentences without the possibility of parole. In 2016, a second ruling from the high court made that decision retroactive, giving Lewis the opportunity to be resentenced.

[38:11] You went to a judge, prepared to plead guilty to a crime you didn't commit in order to win your innocence… and that judge decided to not make you go through with that, and vacated your sentence on the spot — is that basically what happened?

[40:54] I want to talk about how you got your paralegal degree while you were in prison — is that true?

[41:13] You got out of prison and you had job offers! That was actually a positive aspect, and I'm curious — are you working now? What are you currently doing?

[41:40] Terrance is in the process of opening his own foundation, a 501c3 nonprofit, the Terrance Lewis Liberation Foundation, dedicated to advocating for wrongfully convicted people and those serving disproportionate sentences. The Liberation Foundation also seeks to support formerly incarcerated folks and challenge police and prosecutorial misconduct.

[43:46] You filed a civil lawsuit after you got out and won over $6 million — congratulations, you deserve it! And you're using your own money to help other people get out of prison, which is commendable. Is that what you're doing full-time now?

[45:24] You had a dream to go to college, our notes say. Is that something you're still pursuing?

[47:01] I commend you for all the work you're doing to give back. And I'm so sorry you lost those 21 years. I love your attitude and energy. I've become friends with some exonerees in Detroit, and they have similar character — they're caring people, loving people, they care about their community and aren't consumed by rage or vengeance. And I get the same vibes from you.

[48:29] Keep up the good fight, Terrance.  Good luck with your son, your foundation… we appreciate you coming on Open Mike. Thanks again, it was so nice to meet you!

[49:01] There you have it — Terrance Lewis, exoneree from Pennsylvania, what a crazy story…if you've been following our wrongful conviction series, it's just more of the same. If you know anybody who needs to see this, forward it to them, like it, subscribe to our channels, and thank you for being a fan of Open Mike. Take care!

This week, Open Mike welcomes its first faceless guest! Meet Ghost, a mysterious vigilante who has launched Creep Catching Unit, an online movement dedicated toward keeping communities safe by exposing and reporting pedophiles. CC Unit operates independently of law enforcement to entrap and confront predators who believe they're meeting up with children or young teens. They then post videos of the altercations online for the Internet to distribute and publicly shame — a pillory for the digital age. In this must-see episode, Ghost takes us through his vigilante origin story, shares details on CC Unit's most intense encounters, and swaps war stories with a surprise, celebrity visitor!

Show Notes

[00:05] Background of CC Unit and their founder, Ghost.

[00:52] Welcome to Ghost — or should I say Mr. Ghost — how are you?

[1:00] CC Unit is pretty big in California! I've looked at your YouTube channel that has tens of thousands of followers, your Facebook page is replete with information… but for my listeners who aren't familiar with CC Unit, tell them what you're all about!

[01:58] How many people are in CC Unit?

[02:23] On these videos, you're normally the one who confronts these people?

[02:47] How long have you been doing this?

[03:04] I know you want to remain anonymous, but what can you tell us about your background? Tell your fans a little bit about yourself — that you can tell us.

[03:54] What sparked your interest to help your community like this?

[04:30] The first day Ghost created a decoy account, he caught a sex offender.

[04:52] Is being a detective or police officer still in the cards for you?

[05:48] You're setting up decoy accounts and posing as a younger person, a 13 or 14-year-old… and then what happens? Take us through the process.

[07:16] How surprised were you the first time one of these creeps started hitting up what they believed to be a young kid?

[08:20] Did you videotape your first encounter when you met the perp?

[08:57] How many videos have you posted with different individuals?

[09:35] I've watched some of these videos… how many people do you gave with you when you make a bust?

[10:22] You're not carrying a weapon when do make these busts, do you?

[10:41] What does "CC" stand for in "CC Unit?

[10:56] What does law enforcement think about you?

[11:27] I know here in Michigan, police and prosecutors were very upset with Zach Sweers from Anxiety Wars and said they would refuse to prosecute anyone he brought to them. Has anyone in California said anything like that to you?

[12:12] How many arrests and convictions have you helped facilitate?

[13:01] One person was convicted, and he was in the military? Tell me about that case, what did he try to do?

[13:56] Did you participate in that trial in any way? That case was based on evidence you brought to them?

[14:52] When you put the videos and offenders' information on the internet, what's the reaction?

[15:43] Let's go to your Facebook page for a second… when scrolling through these, you do explain what all these people did to land on your page… there are hundreds of these! You have people of all different backgrounds in these cases and other people in the chat logs providing you their employment and other miscellaneous information… is there a movement behind these videos you're posting?

[17:00] You mentioned you used to watch To Catch a Predator with Chris Hansen… tell us about your experience with that show, what it meant to you, and how it shaped what you're doing now.

[18:50] What did you think of Chris Hansen?

[19:20] Would you say he was one of your heroes growing up?

[19:42] Have you ever talked to him or met him?

[20:24] Well, Ghost, I have a special surprise for you today. I'd like you to meet Chris Hansen!

[20:45] Thanks for jumping on today, Chris, I know you're busy! Ghost here is trying to follow in your footsteps in California and is exposing a lot of pretty scummy people. I thought you guys should meet!

[23:17] Ghost, if you had one question for Chris what would it be?

[23:30] Would you ever collaborate with CC Unit?

[24:38] Thank you for appearing on the show, Chris!

[25:16] Let's go back to you — have you had TV producers and directors call you for any potential collaborations?

[26:00] What are plans for CC Unit moving forward? Are you going national or expanding to bring on more cases?

[27:15] You're active on YouTube and there are lots of commercials on your stuff! I assume you're making some revenue from this?

[29:08] Is any part of your surprised that there are still these types of people online? You post something from a decoy account and get hundreds of responses… is that still shocking to you?

[30:19] Tell us about your craziest bust to date.

[31:10] The scariest part to me is that you're just scratching the surface of this. It feels like there are tens of thousands of people out there still doing this… and that they're successful. That scares me!

[32:20] Keep up the good work… CC Unit and Ghost, anyone who watches your stuff appreciates what you're doing. Stay safe, be careful, and thank you for appearing on Open Mike!

[33:17] There you have it — Ghost from CC Unit with a guest appearance by Chris Hansen. Thanks for watching Open Mike and sharing this episode with anyone who needs it. We have our 100th episode coming up and we have something special planned — you won't want to miss that! Take care and stay tuned…

Imran Syed is nationally recognized attorney, professor, and documentary film producer. As assistant director of Michigan's Innocence Clinic, he and a coterie of supervised law students are at the forefront of criminal justice reform, investigating and litigating a wide variety of cases with special focus on forensic science-based innocence. Having litigated several arson wrongful convictions based on outdated science, Syed is an outspoken supporter of strategies needed to address obsolete scientific evidence and its role in false imprisonments. In Episode 93 of Open Mike, Syed and Mike discuss potential outcomes of the justice reform movement, and why arson cases may specifically lead the charge to widespread, national reform.

Show Notes

[00:14] Imran Syed bio and background as assistant director of the University of Michigan Innocence Clinic.

[00:58] Imran Syed, thank you for being on Open Mike today!

[01:25] You don't have a giant ego, but let's put it into perspective… how long has the Michigan Innocence Clinic been in existence, how many convictions have you overturned… give us some general statistics!

[03:28] In eleven years of being open, the Innocence Clinic has had twenty-four successful victories ranging from arson to murder.

[04:30] Let's set the table for our viewers… how many cases do you get asked to review per year?

[06:09] On average, how many cases per year would you say you open?

[07:24] What percentage of the work you do is conducted by law students as opposed to the clinic's three supervising attorneys?

[09:05] I know that the law students there, like yourself, are going on to do this for a living which has to be gratifying for you guys…

[10:17] I've interviewed six people who have been wrongfully convicted in Michigan, and the only reason they're home with their families is because of organizations like the Innocence Clinic. Some of these cases you even worked on! How does the enormity of what you're doing add up in your brain? How does that feel?

[13:33] You were instrumental in the Dwayne Provience case, which was one of the country's first non-DNA innocence cases. Why was this particular case so groundbreaking?

[17:00] It feels like you can't go another week with another wrongful conviction being overturned, right?

[19:42] Out of all these interviews I've been doing, and all these podcasts in this industry… I've met the most generous people. Your community is pretty special. When I'm reading through these cases preparing for an interview, the defense attorneys in wrongful convictions are usually just bad. What percentage of the time did exonerees have a stellar defense with the right experts and right arguments?

[22:57] You actually wrote a film on the case we were talking about called The Price of Providence… it won a few awards at the Great Lakes Film Festival, so congratulations on that! Tell us how about that project and how we can watch it!

[27:34] Another case you worked on, Walter Forbes — recently released after 37 years for a murder he didn't commit. How long ago was he exonerated?

[27:58] Why don't you take us through that… how long did you work on that case?

[34:54] And how is Walter Forbes now that he's out of prison after 37 years?

[37:07] Talk about patience! This man should be giving lectures on the topic — I can't even wait 37 minutes for an answer on some things, let alone 37 years. It's unbelievable!

[40:13] It's interesting, every exoneree I've met hasn't come out of prison embittered, and it's very consistent! They're appreciative and they don't want to waste another day being mad — and they're all horrible stories! The only good aspect of these stories is that they've been released.

[41:28] One area that the Michigan Innocence Clinic specializes in is arson cases… I've never worked on any arson case — why are so many people imprisoned based on evidence surrounding arson?

[46:22] You have so much knowledge about arson cases… there are probably thousands of arson cases across this country right now being brought for wrongful reasons. Are you able to implement this knowledge and proliferate it to their defense attorneys, court-appointed or otherwise? Or are they on their own and forced to Google? How do you get the right information to the right people?

[48:48] I'd be remiss if I didn't mention your clinic's success in Abusive Head Trauma cases… It feels similar to what you're describing in the arson world, which is basically junk science. Am I right?

[55:25] Maybe you and will one day have future conversations on this and civil attorneys across the country listening to this will be more inclined to help. I'm a big believer everyone should do a certain amount of pro bono hours per year, but not everyone does. Maybe with your professorship, we'll be able to teach and shed some light on it!

[56:32] Any time there's been reform, it has followed a civil litigation case with competent, qualified, oftentimes high-profile attorneys. Very rarely does it come out of criminal cases because no one has the resources to litigate the cases properly.

[58:58] Professor Imran Syed, thank you for being with us today and taking time to educate our listeners and viewers.

[59:38] If you know people who are interested in these issues, forward this episode to them and be sure to like and subscribe to our channel! Thank you for watching Open Mike!

Show Notes

[00:14] Kate Judson's background and bio as Executive Director of the Center for Integrity in Forensic Sciences.

[01:37] Welcome to the show! I'm so excited to talk to you – on Open Mike, we've never really focused on forensics. I'm reading a quote from you that says there have been 2,500 exonerations since 1989… is that right?

[02:18] It feels like every single week there's another exoneration, and it's hard to believe the frequency. Are you tracking what percentage of these exonerations are due to forensics?

[03:49] Let's take a step back… can you tell us about forensic evidence and why it's such an important part of criminal trials?

[04:27] What are some of the common problems and issues you encounter when dealing with forensic evidence and scientists?

[05:25] In 60% of exoneration cases, forensic analysts have overstated what evidence has showed… meaning, they stated the evidence was more conclusive than it actually was. The most common issue is cognitive bias, an unintentional, yet inherently human, subjective interpretation of objective data.

[06:44] On the show we had an attorney who discussed hyper-focus or tunnel vision on behalf of prosecutors and law enforcement… is that something you encounter?

[08:03] One of the reasons we do these shows is because I want potential jurors listening to have a healthy dose of skepticism… because when you have a scientist or analyst in court pointing to evidence saying, "This blood spatter means this," it's a hard thing to prove, isn't it?

[09:28] We can't stop ourselves from having a human brain and processing information the way we're naturally disposed to — that's why it's so important to have a system to counteract it.

[09:38] One of the Center for Integrity in Forensic Sciences' areas of specialty is diagnosing Shaken Baby Syndrome, is that true? Can you tell our audience about the major flaws of that diagnosis in those types of cases?

[10:58] Our audience listened to an interview with Julie Baumer, someone who was convicted of Shaken Baby Syndrome… you worked on that case and wrote an Amicus for it, is that correct?

[11:55] Isn't it true they recently changed the name from Shaken Baby Syndrome to "Abusive Head Trauma" cases?

[12:26] What is your best advice on those types of cases? Doctors, hospitals, and police seem to jump on that conclusion pretty quickly and it disrupts and ruins lives… if you were to be able to get in front of all those people and educate them, what would your stance be?

[18:25] In the case of bite marks, my impression is that all bites marks are accurate because we have different dental idiosyncrasies… tell me why that is completely wrong!

[20:57] Kate, you made me realize how messed up our thinking is. The bias comes from people dying in a fire and using their dental records to identify them, that's where my inherent bias came from! We take all this information we're exposed to on the news or TV shows, and when we're presented bite marks or dentals records in a criminal case, we assume it's inherently accurate, and it's not!

[22:04] The legal system knows this to an extent. There are cases with precedential value that state it's important for the science brought into a court case to be related to the research that underlines it.

[23:56] Kate, you started off as a public defender. Lots of these wrongful convictions unfortunately involve court-appointed attorneys who don't have the same resources as prosecutors' officers. Now that you're in forensics and can see both sides, what needs to be done to level the playing field between public defenders and the prosecutors' offices?

[26:36] You're now working as the Executive Director of the Center for Integrity in Forensic Sciences. How did that come about?

[27:29] What is the overall mission of your new organization?

[27:44] And it was co-founded by Dean Strang and Jerome Buting who are well-known in their defense of Steven Avery documented in the Netflix docuseries Making a Murderer. Major hit. How has that series impact the community fighting wrongful convictions?

[28:40] What was your take on that whole show and your take on Steven Avery's guilt or innocence? I have to ask!

[31:47] I don't know if you can track this or anecdotally… are people now more likely to believe forensic science can be flawed after watching series like Making a Murderer?

[32:40] Are Dean and Jerry still defending people accused of crimes or are they more focused on the project you're working on?

[33:20] Make sure to check out all the good work the Center for Integrity in Forensic Sciences is up to — along with their social media — on their website!

[33:59] Anyone in the criminal justice system can receive training on these issues — prosecutors, judges, people facing criminal charges. In rare cases, they also get involved as co-counsel to litigate a particular issue.

[35:09] Kate, thank you so much for being on and doing this work. We appreciate all you do!

[35:36] If you know someone who would benefit from seeing this information, share this episode and make sure you subscribe to get updates! Thank you for watching, thank you for listening. Have a great day!

Do you enjoy sugary, deep-fried treats? What about a nice, relaxing drink after a long day? Thanks to Detroit City Distillery's palate-tickling paczki vodka, you can have both at the same time! In this intoxicating episode, distillery co-owner Michael Forsyth discusses how the concoction is steeped Detroit's Polish heritage, explains the innovative pastry-to-vodka distilling process, and updates us on business progress throughout the pandemic. Bonus content— Mike and team conduct an in-office vodka tasting!

Show Notes

[00:40] Michael Forsyth, co-owner of Detroit City Distillery — welcome back to Open Mike!

[00:50] Last time you were here, you provided some bourbon that was very good that I restocked several times. But you had mentioned you had amazing paczki-flavored vodka and yet you sold so many of them you weren't able to share any with me! You sold out 2,000 bottles in 4.5 hours last February, is that true?

[02:13] Tell us about your business and what you've been up to since the pandemic!

[03:52] Bottle sales this past pandemic year compared to a normal year… are they up, down, flat, what's happening?

[04:35] Bars were closed, but people purchased so much alcohol from liquor stores that business was actually up compared to the previous year.

[05:37] We're talking about Paczki Day, which is coming up, February 16th. Do you want to tell our listeners about Fat Tuesday and what it's all about?

[06:22] Detroit City Distillery is partial to New Palace Bakery in Hamtramck, a local, 100-year-old institution.

[07:18] You love paczkis and you love alcohol… what made you decide to put together the proverbial chocolate and the peanut butter?

[09:13] Has anybody copied you yet?

[10:23] You showed me last year of the paczkis smushed up in the alcohol, and it looked kind of gross and good at the same time! But you strain out the paczkis and then it burns off, right?

[11:34] On that note, you're making my mouth water. So I want to introduce you to two of the people who helped the alcohol industry sell all of those bottles last year — Jami and Ryan who work here at the law firm! I thought rather than drinking alone in my office, I would have them in here and sample it and give us their opinions!

[12:50] I like the bottle, especially the sticker of the paczki on the back!

[13:15] It's 88 proof — how about you explain what that means while I pour for my friends?

[13:55] Most vodka is proofed at 80, so this is going to give you a little more bang for your buck.

[14:34] Alright… what's "cheers" in Polish?

[14:44] Wow, that's smooth! I don't usually drink vodka straight — this is really good!

[15:18] You can distill anything into vodka because it's essentially pure alcohol. You can make it out of potatoes, wheat, rye, grapes. Potato vodka is often the smoothest, a "blank canvas."

[16:25] Jami loves it — it's much smoother than the vodka she normally drinks.

[16:55] Ryan agrees — it doesn't have the burn going down. The raspberry flavor comes through, but you can actually taste the doughiness of the pastry.

[17:38] This might be good just on the rocks… would you mix this with anything?

[18:19] Detroit City Distillery does a riff on a White Russian with this vodka. They use Bailey's instead of Kahlua and grate cinnamon over the top.

[19:04] There's another drink called the Polish Daisy that's the paczki vodka, Cocchi Americano (a fortified wine), lemon, and vanilla syrup. They'll be bottling and selling this as a bottled cocktail.

[22:37] These pre-bottled cocktails you're selling — where can I go out and buy those?

[22:54] Purchase cocktails on the Detroit City Distillery website, and pick it up in person or curbside at their tasting room! They're open Wednesday-Sunday.

[23:29] Some of your liquor is available at local liquor stores and supermarkets. Will these bottled cocktails and paczki vodka be sold at these locations as well?

[24:21] Last year, people were calling from Poland, asking how they could get their hands on the paczki vodka! In Michigan, bars are not allowed to ship alcohol, but Woods Wholesale Wine in Grosse Pointe is licensed to ship alcohol out-of-state (but not in state, ironically).

[25:11] It feels like we need a law change in Michigan… how are we one of the only states that can't ship alcohol?

[25:56] Jami and Ryan just refilled their glasses, so that's a compliment right there! And then they're going to try and do some work around the firm after this… So if you call the firm and Jami answers and sounds a little happy, you know why!

[26:28] What was your biggest seller last year?

[27:03] Are you guys sending out newsletters? How are you getting the word out?

[27:57] Cheers, Michael! Happy Paczki Day, and hopefully you'll sell out just as quick as last year.

[28:32] Thank you for watching this installment of Open Mike: Alcohol Edition. I'm going to start slurring my words in a minute. If you know someone who likes alcohol, vodka, or paczkis, share this episode and make sure you subscribe to get updates! Thank you for watching, thank you for listening. Take care!

Note: at the time of production, Detroit City Distillery's vodka had not yet been released. When it was released on February 1st, 2021, the entire stock sold out in 22 minutes.

Mike McCormick is a dedicated father, husband, and community leader committed to teaching developing male minds the essence of authentic masculinity.

Our antiquated, social norms often compel men to resist vulnerability, withdraw, and insist everything is within their control, while larger questions of what it means to be a man go unanswered.

Many men reach adulthood without the emotional skillset or sense of identity required to properly function in the world — they're little kids trapped in a big kids' bodies.

In order to combat this cultural deficiency, McCormick curated ManQuest, a spiritual approach geared toward transforming teenaged boys into men of courage, empathy, and integrity while strengthening bonds with their fathers and other male mentors.

This episode is a must-watch for anyone with teenaged sons — the two Mikes discuss everything from media influences on male development, hurdles that deter holistic connection with our sons, and actionable methodologies to help navigate the path to authentic manhood.

Show Notes

[00:29] Mike McCormick's background and bio as author of Manquest: Leading Teenage Boys into Manhood and founder of McCormick Basketball.

[01:49] Welcome to the show, Mike! You wrote a book and accompanying program called Manquest — what is Manquest and why is it so important?

[02:47] What are the hurdles in our way that prevent us from doing a better job of raising our sons?

[03:52] I imagine social media over the last ten years hasn't helped. I know raising daughters in the time of social media has been difficult… raising sons must be even harder.

[05:19] Some dads may be listening to this and thinking, "This is uncomfortable… I'm not quite sure how to do this…" What's your advice to help them get out of that discomfort and talking to their sons?

[06:11] Lots of parents, including yourself, struggle with wanting to be friends with their kids vs. being a disciplinarian, administering tough love, and giving out advice. How do you advise the fathers and mentors you coach on the difference between being a friend and being a parent?

[08:31] Tell us more about the Manquest program! Is there a religious aspect to this program?

[08:56] The book is spiritual, not religious — it's suited for people who are of faith as well as those who do not follow a specific faith.

[09:37] What is "authentic masculinity?"

[10:27] It can be boiled down into Five Guideposts, which are the "essence" of what it means to be a man: Lead Courageously, Pretend About Nothing, Protect Your Heart, Engage in Deep and Meaningful Relationships, Stay Awake!

[12:39] Those are really good reminders for all of us. Your book also talks about "Rugged Truths." What does that mean? Can you give us a few examples?

[14:16] The Rugged Truths are basically individual points that examine the realities surrounding the Five Guideposts. While the Guideposts are the goal, the Rugged Truths are the harsh facts that life isn't fair, we all go through periods of doubt and darkness, and that we aren't going to be able to embody the Guideposts at all times. But we are still able to and need to get up when we're knocked down.

[16:50] Because of our archaic cultural norms, teenaged boys are rarely going to demonstrate the vulnerability to reach out and ask their fathers or mentors what it means to be a man. They're compelled to act like they "have it all together."

[17:49] Manhood is taught, it is not caught. Men are made, they're not born.

[18:00] Are you finding the boys want to talk about these issues? Or is this something you have to convince them to talk about and realize the importance of?

[18:55] Movies are a great way to unlock conversation and father-son bonding.

[19:35] This makes me think… in the Jewish faith, once you hit thirteen, you become a man — that's it. In your program, when do you see the boys entering manhood? Is there a specific age, or is it different for everyone?

[21:04] Being a man is not a specific moment in time. It's about choosing to live as a man. It's a daily, moment-to-moment decision that we all have.

[21:42] You mentioned movies… what are some of the best movies that can create an automatic connection and open up lines of communication?

[24:24] You also have a daughter… is that the next book? Is "Womanquest" next?

[27:00] It's our responsibility to step up and provide these boys what they need to become men, because they're struggling.

[27:28] Make sure to check Mike's work on the Manquest website, shoot him an email with questions, and read his book, available on the site or Amazon!

[28:56] Thank you for being so passionate about this, writing the book, and doing what you do, Mike. Thanks so much for being on Open Mike today.

[29:22] Mike McCormick, Manquest — I advise you to check it out! If you know anybody who would gain benefit from this episode, please tell them about it! Comment, like, subscribe — we're already over 2 million downloads and we're approaching our magic 100th episode! Thank you for being here, thank you for watching, and stay tuned for more!

In 1980, Iowan man William Beeman was accused of murdering a woman named Michiel Winkel. However, Winkel was seen by several witnesses for days after the alleged time of her murder. Despite this testimony, Beeman has remained in prison for the last forty years.

Enter Erica Nichols Cook, the Director Wrongful Conviction Division at the Iowa State Public Defender.

Cook has spent the last several years attempting to get Beeman a new trial based on previous, possibly intentionally undisclosed evidence — evidence that could exonerate him. In this installment, she rehashes the outlandish circumstances of the case, provides updates on its appeal status, and discusses the challenges of reforming the criminal justice system in one of the most immutable states in the country.

Show Notes

[00:18] Backgrounds of Erica Nichols Cook and Jeff Wright.

[01:23] Thank you both for coming on the show! Erica, I'm going to start with you. As Director of the Wrongful Conviction Division (WCD) in Iowa's Office of the State Public Defender, how serious is the problem of innocent people being locked up in America, in your opinion?

[01:49] Throughout the world, there have been 2,700 exonerations since 1989, only 16 of which were in Iowa.

[2:20] Sounds like Iowa is a little bit behind the times… on Open Mike, we've talked to many people who deal with the conviction integrity units inside the prosecutor's office. You are inside the defender's office, (Jeff Wright who is on the podcast with us) which is the complete opposite. I don't quite understand it, because you guys are the defenders of these people — of course you think these people are wrongfully convicted… so what good does it do? Jeff, I'm going to direct that question to you.

[3:30] So the difference is you have a department inside the Public Defender's Office that specifically looks at post-conviction cases. This started in about 2015 — what led to this division being created?

[06:49] Do you guys still have private attorneys who can handle criminal cases, a court-appointed system?

[07:22] Not every state has a state-run public defender's office — Michigan doesn't have one. I've asked several criminal defense attorneys why that is. Do you think it's important to have one overseer of all the public defenders in the state, as opposed to on a county-wide basis?

[08:39] What are some of the recurring issues that have led to so many innocent people going to prison? You mentioned there are less than 20 in Iowa, which is shockingly low… you know there are hundreds, if not thousands more. What are some trends that you're seeing?

[09:21] You're talking about Brady violations… a lot of our listeners don't know what that means — could you give us a brief lesson on that?

[11:16] That's a fascinating process, I've never heard of a deposition in a criminal case. That means you can sit with a police officer, detective, or investigator and ask if there's any exculpatory evidence. Based on their truth and veracity, you get what they tell you… whether or not it's the right authority person. Am I interpreting this correctly? Because it all sounds very strange!

[13:31] It sounds like you need a law change, and you have a friendly lieutenant governor there… but if they're not going to hand you a report, how do they comply with Brady?

[14:01] It sounds like a waste of time, money, legal resources… you might have twenty people to depose — who has the time for that, especially if you're deposed or a court-appointed attorney?

[14:54] What's the recipe for successfully finding the right experts and preventing wrongful convictions in the future?

[15:52] You talk about violation of due process… are you referring to the 1980 case of William Beeman? Let's dive into it.

[20:42] Was the interrogation recorded? Or was there any evidence tying him to the crime scene?

[22:05] The one piece of evidence you haven't talked about yet — and tell me if I read your briefs wrong — there were SEVEN eyewitnesses who saw the victim after the time frame during which she was allegedly killed.

[22:59] Two of the exculpatory witnesses were also hypnotized by law enforcement to get more information about Michiel Winkel's whereabouts.

[23:50] In 2019, prosecutors turned over an 853-page investigative report after a judge ordered discovery to obtain DNA testing of a semen sample located at the scene of the crime. In this document, they found eyewitnesses accounts that would have corroborated two other eyewitness accounts of seeing Winkel out and about AFTER the time period in which Beeman allegedly killed her. The trial attorneys did not have any of this information available to them before they went to trial on behalf of Beeman.

[24:45] So the jury did hear from two or three witnesses that she was alive after the date prosecution said she was killed. That was actually argued and presented, and they still didn't believe it?

[25:30] The body was not kept in a cooler between the time it was located and when an autopsy was conducted the next day. The medical examiner who conducted the autopsy was a family practice doctor, who wasn't experienced in forensics.

[26:30] The body was in a stage of rigor mortis that corroborated other timeline witnesses that saw Winkel after the alleged time of her death.

[27:04] What is the state saying now? Why are there still roadblocks? Why is there no honest prosecutor stepping up to help exonerate this man, what is going on there?

[29:26] When a free society decides to imprison its people, it needs to do everything within its power to ensure that they're guilty. And if there is anything that determines later that they're not, it needs to be given full weight and evaluated.

[30:10] It feels like every day I'm getting a notification that someone has been exonerated. The momentum is here, but it doesn't seem like Iowa has caught up yet. My question is… have you been in front of a judge with this new evidence? What did they say?

[32:27] So the court of appeals hasn't ruled… how is the makeup of your Supreme Court — I assume pretty Republican? Is your governor a Republican? Lieutenant governor as well? He seems pretty sympathetic as a former defender, though…

[34:22] I've become friends with some exonerees here in Michigan, and some of their stories go back to a newspaper columnist who took interest in their story and got the attention of the public on their side. Has this man received good public attention in Iowa yet?

[36:09] The right person has to hear it, and the right person has to get mad. This DNA evidence is so important, and there are so many innocence clinics just focusing on DNA… I assume you haven't searched their evidence room?

[36:30] They HAVE searched the evidence room. There are boxes from 1979, but not 1980. There is no box labeled "Beeman" or "Winkel" and no explanation.

[37:16] How old is Mr. Beeman these days?

[37:40] Thank you both for your work on the Beeman case. Please let me know what happens with the court of appeals. Let's try to get some publicity out there so people know what's happening. Best of luck and keep fighting.

[38:28] Thank you for watching Open Mike. If anybody you know is interested or experienced in these cases, please forward this episode to them. We really appreciate your support. Take care.