Optimized Equine Podcast

In part two of this conversation, Nandi Kegode shares her experiences navigating the American equestrian industry as an aspiring international athlete without major financial backing. She discusses the challenges of working through Florida and other competitive circuits, the mentors who supported her journey, and the toxic cultural dynamics she encountered in barn environments. Nandi opens up about her partnership with two other women of color who co-own her mare Idana, and their ambitious vision to create pathways for Kenyan athletes to reach top sport. The conversation explores the realities of "quirky" horses, the importance of two-way communication in training, and Nandi's vision for authentic cultural exchange through equestrian tourism in Africa.

• The equestrian sport is not designed to allow aspiring athletes without substantial financial backing to progress through the levels

• Marketing may celebrate diversity, but the industry often lacks understanding of true moral and ethical diversity

• Cultural differences in respect, work ethic, and interpersonal boundaries create significant challenges when navigating different barn environments

• Finding good mentors who prioritize horse welfare and human wellbeing is rare but essential for surviving the industry

• The "quirky horse" label is often an excuse for poor training, handling, or unaddressed pain rather than inherent personality

• True diversity in equestrianism includes cultural exchange and learning from different approaches to horsemanship worldwide

• Horses labeled as difficult often respond completely differently when treated with respect and proper communication

• You cannot terrify the rider and expect the horse to have a good experience—both must be supported

• Not every rider can ride every horse, and admitting that is a sign of good horsemanship

• Cultural exchange through equestrian tourism can provide quality education and competition experience at accessible prices

You can follow Nandi Kegode on Facebook or Instagram @african.horse.woman_official and @hisia_intel

Don't Forget To Follow, Subscribe, Rate The Show, and Follow Our Socials! ⁠

 Visit TamaraLeeBarrett.com

Chapters

[00:00] Introduction to Part 2

[00:32] Coming to America

[02:08] The Reality of Diversity in Sport

[05:30] Cultural Clashes in Barn Environments

[08:45] Navigating Toxicity and Racism

[12:36] Geographic and Economic Barriers

[13:27] Learning What Not to Do

[14:14] Jenni McAllister: A Role Model

[16:25] McKrell and Christian: Critical Mentors

[21:23] The Idana Partnership

[26:58] The Plan for Idana

[30:18] Equestrian Tourism Vision

[32:06] The True Meaning of Diversity

[36:08] How Horses Communicate

[40:49] Feeling Riders Aren't Born, They're Made

[42:40] The "Quirky Horse" Excuse

[50:18] Becoming What We Tell Them

[52:52] One-Way vs Two-Way Dialogue

[54:57] When Livelihood Depends on Sales

[56:06] Education in Body Language and Biomechanics

[57:23] Three Fairy Godmother Wishes

[58:52] The Sad Over-Correction

[1:00:00] How to Follow Nandi

In this episode of the Optimized Equine Podcast, Nandi Kegode shares her unique journey in the world of horsemanship, from her early experiences in Kenya and the UK, to her transition to the US, and the challenges she faced along the way. Nandi discusses the importance of respect and communication in training horses and riders, the cultural perspectives on horsemanship, and her struggles with mental health and addiction. She emphasizes the need for emotional intelligence in both horse training and personal growth, and the significance of finding purpose through horses. The conversation highlights the complexities of tradition in equestrian sports and the importance of self-reflection and accountability in the journey of a horse person.

Key Takeaways:

Nandi left Kenya to pursue top sport in show jumping, which ultimately brought her to the United States

Her early experiences with horses shaped her understanding of respect, learned from her father

After a classical upbringing, natural horsemanship was introduced to her when she was in the UK attending boarding school

The shift from communal village life to individualistic Western society contributes to mental health challenges like depression

Finding purpose through horses can lead to personal growth and recovery

Emotional intelligence is crucial in both horse training and personal life

Tradition in horsemanship must be balanced with progress and modern understanding

Respect is foundational to every interaction with horses, but must be distinguished from fear and blind followership

Feeling riders develop awareness through understanding themselves first

You can follow Nandi Kegode on Facebook or Instagram @african.horse.woman_official and @hisia_intel

Don't Forget To Follow, Subscribe, Rate The Show, and Follow Our Socials! ⁠

 Visit TamaraLeeBarrett.com

Chapters:

[01:54] Introduction and Background

[02:20] Leaving Kenya for Top Sport

[04:19] Growing Up with Polo Ponies

[04:41] Discovery of Natural Horsemanship

[06:18] The Sunrise Ride Revelation

[07:02] Classical Training in Kenya

[08:27] Pony Club and Early Education

[11:05] Natural Horsemanship in the UK

[14:12] Isolation in the Showing World

[15:38] Hunters in Kenya vs America

[19:08] Cultural Perspectives on Feeling

[21:28] Horse Welfare in Kenya

[24:06] Parents' Different Approaches

[26:18] Joining the US Military

[29:26] Mental Health Journey Begins

[30:26] Addiction and Homelessness

[31:09] Children Save Her Life

[32:38] The Path Back to Horses

[33:06] Depression and Individualism

[36:18] Understanding Respect in Practice

[39:13] Normalized Sociopathic Behavior

[41:18] Unqualified Trainers

[42:32] Gaslighting in the Industry

[46:42] Wishy-Washy to Aggressive

[48:30] The Need to Walk Away

[50:12] Breeding for Sensitivity

[51:54] Feeling Can Be Taught

[53:04] Horses as Most Abused Domestic Animals

[55:03] Ignorance vs Intent

[58:09] Respect vs Blind Followership

[1:00:41] The Village of Accountability

[1:02:35] Three Types of Respect

[1:05:45] Fear is Not Respect

[1:06:16] Setting Up Part 2

In this episode, host Tamara Lee Barrett sits down with Ivy Starnes of Ivy's Glide Gait, a gaited horse trainer from Fort Worth, Texas. Ivy shares her journey from a horse-naive teenager in suburban Chicago to becoming a sought-after clinician who travels the country teaching riders that the secret to perfect gait isn't found in big bits, gadgets or force—it's built on relaxation and genuine connection. Ivy emphasizes the importance of rider education and truly understanding the gaits. She also dispels common misconceptions about the training of gaited horses, and touches on the evolution of training methods that she has seen over her career.

What You'll Learn:

• Why gaited horses are actually MORE challenging than regular horses (and why that's a good thing!)

• The biggest myths plaguing the gaited horse world and why they're harmful

• How to achieve that coveted smooth gait on a loose rein without heavy bits or shoes

• The importance of vertical flexion and softness in gaited horse training

• Why arena work is essential, even for trail horses…and even if it doesn’t happen in the arena!

• Ivy's approach to horse health, including the often-overlooked issues of ulcers and hoof care

Takeaways:

• Gaited horses can do at least 5 different gaits, making them more complex to train than walk/trot/canter horses

• The pacey, high-headed gaited horse you see isn't the only way—or the best way

• Building relaxation and softness should come before pursuing speed or collection

• The 60-second rule: giving horses time to process what they've learned

Whether you're a gaited horse owner struggling to find that perfect gait, or simply curious about these unique horses, you will love this episode. Ivy's compassionate, science-based approach proves that you can achieve beautiful results without harsh methods.

Guest Bio: Ivy Starnes specializes in gaited horse training through her business Ivy's Glide Gait. Based in Fort Worth, Texas, she travels nationwide conducting three-day clinics focused on achieving smooth, relaxed gaits. Her extensive online content and training videos demonstrate that gaited horses can naturally gait on a loose rein in a relaxed frame, challenging traditional training methods in the gaited horse community. You can find her on YouTube, Facebook, Instagram, TikTok and ww.ivyshorses.com

Don't Forget To Follow, Subscribe, Rate The Show, and Follow Our Socials! TamaraLeeBarrett.com

Chapters

00:00 - Introduction: Meet Ivy Starnes and Ivy's Glide Gait

01:33 - From Suburban Chicago to Horse Training

07:41 - The "You Can't Do That" Challenge

09:47 - Clinic Life: Teaching All Levels

12:17 - Gaited Horse Propaganda Debunked

15:10 - The Challenge Factor: Why Gaited Horses Are Actually Harder

24:47 - Does Correct Gait Really Matter?

29:43 - Training Approach: Clinics vs. Long-term

36:19 - Breaking Up Bad Movement Patterns

40:00 - Vision for Industry Change

44:45 - Meet Firefly: Ivy's Personal Horse

51:51 - Life Lessons from Horses

53:41 - Corner Turners: The Dressage Group That Changed Everything

56:33 - Three Horse-Related Wishes

59:01 - Where to Find Ivy

In this episode of the Optimized Equine Podcast, host Tamara Lee Barrett sits down with Show Jumping Hall of Fame inductee Linda Allen and USES co-founder McKrell Baier to explore the design, values, and structure of the U.S. Equestrian Society’s LevelUP Events.

Together, they unpack how this bold new format reimagines equestrian competition through the lens of:

• Ethical equine treatment

• Holistic rider development

• Transparent judging and feedback

• Education-centered event design
  

Listeners will hear Linda Allen’s reflections on her six-decade career as a course designer, judge, and coach—and why she believes now is the moment for structural change in the sport. McKrell Baier shares how USES is building a more inclusive and values-led infrastructure—one that empowers both students and coaches while strengthening welfare and access at every level.

From redefining “success” in the show ring to rebalancing the student–coach dynamic, this episode offers a practical and visionary look at where equestrian sport can go when care and clarity lead the way.

Learn More! 

Linda Allen – Show Jumping Hall of Fame Inductee, Course Designer & Coach

Linda Allen’s six-decade career in show jumping encompasses world-class riding, FEI-level judging, Olympic course design, and strategic leadership in equestrian education. Inducted into the Show Jumping Hall of Fame in 2022, she was one of the original FEI Level 4 Course Designers and designed the 1996 Olympic and 1992 World Cup Final jumping courses. She has served as Technical Delegate at major championships and presided over FEI Ground Juries globally. A veteran clinician, consultant, and educator, Linda co-founded the Young Horse Trainers’ School, coached international teams to podium success, and earned top honors from USEF and The Chronicle of the Horse. Her published work includes 101 Jumping Exercises for Horse and Rider and the JumpSmart instructional DVD, with contributions to EquestrianCoach.com. You can learn more at LindaAllenEquestrian.com

McKrell Baier – USES Co-Founder, Ethics Architect & Learning Innovator

McKrell Baier is a founding force behind the U.S. Equestrian Society and a lead designer of its LevelUP programs—shaping a new era of sport through ethical frameworks, inclusive learning models, and coach licensing reform. With a background in curriculum design, coaching systems, and nonprofit governance, McKrell has helped define how USES elevates equine welfare, rider development, and competition access across disciplines. She led the creation of the LevelUP Event model and helped reimagine scoring, format design, and professional standards for coaches, students, and facilities. A frequent contributor to national equestrian strategy conversations, McKrell’s work centers on building systems that reflect the values of care, clarity, and community—while still challenging the sport to evolve.

You can find the United States Equestrian Society on Instagram and at us-es.org

Don't Forget To Follow, Subscribe, Rate The Show, and Follow Our Socials! TamaraLeeBarrett.com

Chapters

00:00 Introduction

01:25 Innovative Approaches in Equestrian Education

04:32 Character Development in Horse Sport

09:15 The Role of Coaches and Students

14:14 Understanding Client vs. Student Dynamics

19:52 The Spectrum of Equestrian Goals

24:04 Personal Experiences in Equestrian Training

27:47 The Importance of Pedagogics in Coaching

30:43 Understanding Individual Coaching Needs

32:57 The Importance of Basics in Riding

35:27 Level Up Program: A New Approach to Learning

41:22 Event Format and Structure

47:05 Judging and Feedback Dynamics

59:51 Building Character Through Riding

01:05:48 Evolving Traditions in Equestrian Sports

01:10:31 Innovative Event Formats for Equestrian Competitions

01:15:53 Engaging Spectators through Creative Riding Events

01:22:01 Building Community and Inclusivity in Equestrianism

In this episode of the Optimized Equine Podcast, rider biomechanics expert Erica Poseley reflects on her journey with horses and the 'corner turners' who have shaped her approach to riding, training and teaching. Erica emphasizes the importance of understanding horse behavior and how they learn, as well as the significance of the rider’s position–no matter the discipline or goal! 

About Erica: 

Erica Poseley is a Rider Biomechanics expert with a diploma in Equitation Science from Equitation Science International. Erica's journey to becoming an expert in these fields began long before her work in rider biomechanics and equitation science. Erica has been riding since she was very young, but never had a formal riding lesson until she graduated from UCLA with a degree in philosophy and moved to Maui, Hawaii. There she started dressage lessons and bought her first horse after seeing a book in the Lahaina Library entitled My Horses, My Teachers by Podhajsky the former head of the Spanish Riding School. She was mesmerized by the beauty of the riders and the horses and this love of correct dressage training and beautiful posture still motivates her daily to ride correctly and teach others to uphold this high standard of excellence. 

Fast forward and Erica moved to California to pursue her dreams of becoming a professional trainer. She apprenticed with the late Liz Searle and Jeff Moore and also got to ride with The Baron von Blixen Finecke, an Olympic gold medalist, who was a great influencer in how Erica thinks of training and posture. 

Fast forward a bit more and Erica started working with another wonderful teacher, Sandy Howard, who then introduced her to Mary Wanless. Erica has been studying with Mary for the last 30 years and is an accredited Ride with Your Mind coach. Needless to say, Mary has been a huge influence in her knowledge of rider biomechanics. Through Mary and her top coach, Ali Wakelin, Erica heard about the work of Dr. Andrew McLean. Dr. McLean is one of the founding fathers of equitation science. Equitation science is the application of scientific principles, particularly learning theory, to understand and improve interactions between horses and humans. 

In 2019, Erica earned her diploma in equitation science from Equitation Science International and since then, she's been passionate about sharing this transformative knowledge with riders and coaches. What makes Erica's approach unique is how she combines the science of how horses learn with the biomechanics of effective riding, creating a powerful foundation for clear, humane communication between horse and rider. 

You can learn more about Erica and her work at www.gotseat.com

Visit tamaraleebarrett.com for more info, episodes and to follow our socials!

Chapters

00:00 Introduction

14:30 Training with Masters

17:19 The Importance of Rider Biomechanics

19:36 Understanding Rider Influence

22:47 The Journey into Equitation Science

25:25 Learning Theory and Horse Training

28:07 Precision in Communication with Horses

30:59 The Complexity of Training Aids

33:35 The Evolution of Riding Techniques

35:52 Understanding Light Pressure in Riding

37:11 Behavioral Insights from Equine Studies

39:02 Interpreting Horse Behavior and Needs

43:28 Addressing High Pressure in Horses

45:52 Defining Good Horsemanship

49:02 Eternal Passion and Learning

51:09 The Journey of Improvement

54:05 Connecting Riding and Skiing

56:49 The Disconnect in Horse Training

59:44 Coaching and Responsibility

01:01:50 Corner Turners: Influential Figures in Riding

01:10:13 Integrating Biomechanics and Equitation Science

01:14:51 Understanding Horse Learning and Rider Communication

01:16:34 The Emotional Spectrum in Horse Training

01:21:10 Wishes for the Future of Equestrian Education

01:25:28 Advocating for Horse Welfare and Modern Training Practices

In this episode of the Optimized Equine podcast, Piper Klemm, PhD shares her unique journey from a young horse enthusiast to the owner of The Plaid Horse magazine. She discusses the importance of community, education, and the evolution of the equestrian industry. Piper emphasizes the significance of in-person events, the challenges of riding, and her vision for a more collaborative and supportive equestrian community. She also reflects on her personal connection with horses and the lessons learned from both successes and failures in her riding career.

Takeaways

Piper's journey into the equestrian world began at a young age.

The barn experience instilled discipline and time management skills.

Social media and the internet opened new educational pathways for horse enthusiasts.

Piper's transition into journalism was sparked by a random opportunity.

The Plaid Horse magazine was born out of a desire to do things differently.

In-person events foster community and connection among equestrians.

Piper emphasizes the importance of the lessons learned by training young horses.

About Piper Klemm, PhD:

Piper is the Owner and Publisher of The Plaid Horse Magazine, but she has created more than just a publication—she's built a platform that provides educational articles, grants, and experiential learning opportunities for riders of all ages and levels.

Piper also the host's The PlaidCast, which has become North America's most listened-to horse show podcast, bringing critical conversations and Hunter Jumper industry insights directly to riders, trainers, and enthusiasts.

Piper co-authored the Show Strides book series, which follows young riders as they navigate the challenges of horse showing while discovering that the power of horses, and friendship, matters more than any blue ribbon.

You can learn more about Piper Klemm, PhD, The Plaid Horse, The PlaidCast and more at theplaidhorse.com

Don't Forget To Follow, Subscribe, Rate The Show, and Follow Our Socials! tamaraleebarrett.com

Chapters

00:00 Piper's Journey: From Passion to Profession

05:24 The Evolution of The Plaid Horse

11:20 In-Person Connections: Bridging the Digital Divide

20:20 Returning to Riding: A Personal Journey

27:36 The Road to Devon: A Milestone Achievement

35:57 Evolving the Equestrian Industry

44:47 Lessons Learned Beyond the Saddle

51:50 Wishes for the Equestrian World

In this episode of the Optimized Equine Podcast, host Tamara Lee Barrett speaks with David Reichert from the United Dressage and Jumping Club (UDJC). They discuss David's extensive background in equestrian sports, the differences between European and American systems, and the challenges faced by riders in the USEF system. David shares insights on the importance of comprehensive rider education, the innovative approach of UDJC to competitions, and how they are making equestrian events more affordable and accessible for all riders. David expresses his aspirations for the future of UDJC, and improving the overall equestrian landscape. He concludes with heartfelt wishes for the welfare of horses and the development of young riders in the sport.

Takeaways

David Reichert emphasizes the need for better education in equestrian sports.

The European system requires qualifications for all riders to show, unlike the American system.

Early specialization in riding can hinder overall education and skill development.

UDJC aims to create a more well-rounded and accessible environment for riders.

The USEF system often sets horses and riders up for failure.

David believes that thorough education is essential for success in equestrian sports.

UDJC's competition format focuses on style and rider ability rather than just speed.

Affordability in horse shows is achievable with the right management and volunteer support.

The average cost of participating in UDJC shows is significantly lower than traditional shows. 

Innovative feedback mechanisms can enhance the learning experience for riders.

Ability classes provide a new approach to dressage, focusing on rider skills rather than horse quality.

Encouraging youth participation in dressage is vital for the future of the sport.

The future of UDJC includes expanding shows and improving the equestrian landscape.

Horse welfare should be prioritized above all in equestrian sports.

A better path for young horses and riders is necessary for their development.

Success in equestrian sports is linked to the quality of training and education.

**Learn more about United Dressage and Jumping Club (UDJC) at udjc.org 

Don't Forget To Follow, Subscribe, Rate The Show, and Follow Our Socials! ⁠ tamaraleebarrett.com **

Chapters

00:00 David's Equestrian Journey

04:32 The Birth of UDJC

06:57 Comparing European and US Equestrian Systems

10:30 The Impact of Early Specialization

12:26 The Role of Education in Equestrian Training

17:02 The Flaws in the USCF System

20:18 The UDJC Approach to Training

24:19 The Challenges of Young Horse Education

37:45 Understanding Class Formats for Young Riders

41:37 Jumping Classes: Structure and Philosophy

43:44 The Importance of Quality Training and Trainers

48:55 The Need for Trainer Education and Certification

01:08:44 Affordability and Accessibility in Equestrian Shows

01:15:23 Feedback Mechanisms in Competitions

01:16:58 Ability Classes: A New Approach to Dressage

01:17:08 Future Aspirations for UDJC

01:17:36 Transforming Equestrian Education

01:25:14 The Role of Trainers in Youth Development

01:33:35 Overcoming Financial Barriers in Equestrian Sports

01:40:32 Creating a Culture of Success in Riding

01:44:50 Corner Turners: Defining Moments in Equestrian Life

01:49:04 Wishes for the Future of Equestrianism

This episode features Spencer LaFlure, founder of the Center for Neuromuscular-Based Horse Dentistry, discussing a revolutionary approach to equine dental care that goes far beyond traditional tooth floating. The conversation explores how proper jaw alignment through neuromuscular dentistry connects to a horse's entire body system, affecting everything from performance to behavior.

LaFlure explains how traditional dentistry focuses on removing sharp points and creating smooth surfaces, but this approach actually disrupts the horse's natural biomechanics. His method instead emphasizes restoring anatomically correct dental inclination and enabling complete natural jaw movement, which activates what he calls the "primo-vascular system" - an energy grid that connects the jaw to the horse's neuromuscular and proprioceptive systems.

The discussion covers some controversial aspects of this approach, including why some veterinarians are not open to it, the problems with power tools, excessive sedation, unnatural head positioning, and why adjusting incisors (front teeth) is crucial despite traditional dentistry avoiding this practice. Throughout the discussion, LaFlure emphasizes the importance of continuous learning and education in improving equine dental practices, ultimately advocating for a more balanced and informed approach to equine health.

Takeaways

Neuromuscular-based dentistry offers a revolutionary approach to equine dental care.

Jaw alignment significantly impacts a horse's overall performance and well-being.

Many equine professionals chase symptoms rather than addressing root causes.

Resistance to change in equine dentistry can hinder progress and improvement.

Sedation practices in equine dentistry are often misunderstood and misapplied.

Education and continuous learning are vital for advancing equine dental practices.

Find A Practitioner and Learn about The Center for Neuromuscular Based Horse Dentistry at neuromuscularhorsedentistry.com

Don't Forget To Follow, Subscribe, Rate The Show, and Follow Our Socials! tamaraleebarrett.com

Chapters

00:00 Introduction to Neuromuscular Dentistry

07:25 Understanding Traditional vs. Neuromuscular Dentistry

13:10 The Role of Sedation in Dentistry...Is It Really A Necessity?

18:36 The Connection Between Nervous System and Performance

23:26 Conclusion and Future Directions

38:43 The Importance of Dialogue with Horses

43:38 Evolution of Horse Dentistry Education

48:29 The Neuromuscular Approach to Horse Dentistry

56:14 The Journey of Learning and Sharing Knowledge

59:14 Embracing Change and Continuous Improvement

In this episode of the Optimized Equine Podcast, Tamara Lee Barrett delves into the complexities of equine welfare and the future of the equestrian lifestyle with Daniel Dauphin of Dauphin Horsemanship and McKrell Baier of the United States Equestrian Society. 

The discussion highlights the concept of social license to operate, the importance of public perception, and the internal and external challenges faced by the equestrian community including the economic pressures affecting equestrianism. They discuss the necessity for a united front to address these challenges, and the importance of education in improving horsemanship and equine welfare. They emphasize the value of collaboration and proactive measures to foster positive change in equestrian practices. Tamara and her guests also discuss the challenges posed by radical animal rights groups, the implications of current laws on equine welfare, and the need for a balance between education and regulation.

Takeaways 

Social license to operate is essential for equestrianism.

Public perception can significantly impact the equestrian industry.

There is a two-front battle for equestrianism: internal and external.

Misuse of equipment can be a gray area in terms of abuse.

Education is crucial for improving equestrian practices.

Economic pressures are changing the landscape of equestrianism.

The equestrian community must unite to face challenges.

Public scrutiny can lead to unfair judgments of equestrian practices.

Understanding the motivations behind animal rights activism is important.  Measured responses are crucial to equestrian sports.

The majority of horses are not in competitive environments.

Hyperflexion and rollkur are significant issues in dressage.

Education is key to improving horse welfare.

Keeping horses in stalls is detrimental to their health.

Judges play a critical role in enforcing ethical practices.

Governing bodies must acknowledge their shortcomings.

Collaboration is essential for driving change in the industry.

Economic pressures can lead to unethical decision-making.

The equestrian industry faces significant challenges that require urgent attention. 

Legislation can have unintended consequences for animal welfare.

Education is more effective than regulation in animal care.

Certification should be based on real education, not just passing tests.

The horse industry must engage in meaningful conversations about welfare.

Economic value of horses is essential for their protection.

Animal rights legislation can lead to harmful outcomes.

Education can create better humans and improve animal welfare.

Learn more about our guests! 

You can find Daniel Dauphin and Dauphin Horsemanship at dauphinhorsemanship.com and thebitcourse.com 

You can find the United States Equestrian Society on Instagram and at us-es.org

Chapters

00:00 Introduction to Equine Welfare and Equestrian Lifestyle

02:58 Understanding Social License to Operate

04:25 The Impact of Animal Rights Groups

06:54 The Importance of Open Dialogue in Equestrianism

07:33 Addressing Misconceptions and Internal Conflicts

10:25 The Role of Education in Equestrian Practices

12:23 Navigating the Challenges of Equestrian Competitions

12:50 The Influence of External Perceptions on Equestrianism

14:53 The Need for Change in Equestrian Practices

17:02 The Future of Equestrianism and Horse Welfare

27:35 Challenges in Equestrian Governance

29:36 The Role of Social License in Change

31:01 Navigating Equestrian Welfare Discussions

32:46 Economic Pressures on Equestrian Professionals

34:53 Judging Standards and Their Impact

36:08 The Need for Education Over Regulation

38:32 Engaging with Animal Welfare Organizations

39:58 The Importance of Professional Certification

40:38 Balancing Competition and Education

40:53 The Future of Equestrian Practices

In this conversation, Tessa Nicolet shares her journey from a young horse enthusiast in Switzerland to a respected trainer and clinician based in Arizona. She discusses her philosophy of Cohesive Horsemanship, which blends classical techniques with practical applications, emphasizing mutual respect and communication between horse and rider. Tessa delves into the world of working equitation, highlighting its versatility and the diverse community around the sport. She reflects on the lessons horses have taught her about confidence and personal growth, and acknowledges the influential figures and experiences that have shaped her approach to horsemanship. Takeaways1. Diverse Training Background Creates Better HorsemanshipTessa's exposure to European pony club, Western reining, ranch work, and French classical dressage has developed a well-rounded approachCross-disciplinary training helps develop more versatile and educated horses and ridersDifferent disciplines can complement and enhance each other rather than conflict2. Working Equitation as a Comprehensive SportFour trials: dressage, ease of handling (obstacles), speed, and cattle workEmphasizes practical application of dressage skills through obstacles that simulate real ranch workCross-discipline friendly - riders can compete in Western or English tackSeven levels from introductory (walk/trot) to advanced (one-handed, freestyle to music)3. Quality Horsemanship is Partnership, Not DominanceDefined as "two willing beings coming together for a dance"Built on mutual trust, confidence, and respectNot about obedience or dominance, but about communication and willing cooperationRequires vulnerability and openness from the human partner4. Horses as Teachers and TherapistsHorses communicate through body language - humans must become skilled observersSimply acknowledging what you see in a horse's behavior can change the conversationHorses taught Tessa confidence, leadership skills, and how to be vulnerable in a healthy wayThe therapeutic value of horses extends far beyond riding5. Modern Training Must Adapt to Modern HorsesToday's horses are bred for athletic ability that didn't exist in classical timesThis can mask poor training methods because naturally gifted horses succeed despite themWorking with less naturally gifted horses requires better technique and deeper understandingBuilding an athlete requires progressive development of strength, flexibility, and mental capacityLearn more about Tessa Nicolet and Cohesive Horsemanship at cohesivehorsemanship.comFollow our socials and tune in to more episodes of the Optimized Equine Podcast at tamaraleebarrett.comChapters00:00 Tessa's Journey with Horses11:04 The Evolution of Cohesive Horsemanship20:02 Working Equitation: A Unique Discipline28:27 Defining Quality Horsemanship35:43 The Journey of Learning and Improvement42:06 Life Lessons from Horses48:01 Wishes for the Future of Horsemanship