Ordinary Discipleship Podcast

What if the church’s leadership crisis isn’t a failure of character, but a failure of systems? In this conversation, Jesse Cruikshank sits down with longtime friend, pastor, author, and leadership reformer Lance Ford to examine how modern leadership models—largely borrowed from business and industry—have quietly reshaped the church in ways Jesus never intended. Drawing from Lance’s new book The Atlas Factor, they trace the surprisingly recent rise of “leadership” as a dominant framework, explore how power concentrates and erodes empathy, and reflect on why so many pastors are burning out while congregations remain stalled. Together, they recover a biblical vision of the church as a body—shared, relational, Spirit-led—where discipleship replaces control, and where movement returns when no one tries to play the head except Christ himself.

ORDER Jessie’s newest book, Ordinary Discipleship: How God Wires Us for the Adventure of Transformation → https://a.co/d/51j86DG

For more great stuff, check out: Ordinary Discipleship by Whoology: https://whoology.co

Follow us on social media:
https://instagram.com/ordinarydiscipleship
https://facebook.com/ordinarydiscipleship

Follow Jessie on social media:
Instagram: https://instagram.com/yourbrainbyjess
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/jessica.s.cruickshank/
Twitter: https://twitter.com/yourbrainbyjess

In this episode, Jessie Cruickshank talks with pastor and author Mandy Smith about the quiet, surprising ways God brings renewal through ordinary people and ordinary acts of faith. Mandy shares the unfolding story of her congregation in Brisbane, the deep personal healing she’s experienced in the process, and the unexpected movement sparked by one woman whose life has been transformed by Jesus.

Together, Jessie and Mandy explore:

• Why the “small things” of faith carry real transformative power
• What it means for the Church to reclaim her identity as the beloved Bride of Christ
• How cultural expectations of strength, efficiency, and control distort our understanding of discipleship
• What happens when we embrace our humanness the way Jesus embraced His
• A stunning modern story of healing, baptisms, and Spirit-led multiplication

This conversation invites you to see yourself—and the Church—with new eyes: beloved, whole, and capable of bearing surprising fruit through simple daily faithfulness.

Listen in and be encouraged to step into the ordinary, Spirit-filled work God is already doing in and through you.

ORDER Jessie’s newest book, Ordinary Discipleship: How God Wires Us for the Adventure of Transformation → https://a.co/d/51j86DG

For more great stuff, check out: Ordinary Discipleship by Whoology: https://whoology.co

Follow us on social media:
https://instagram.com/ordinarydiscipleship
https://facebook.com/ordinarydiscipleship

Follow Jessie on social media:
Instagram: https://instagram.com/yourbrainbyjess
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/jessica.s.cruickshank/
Twitter: https://twitter.com/yourbrainbyjess

In this deeply moving conversation, Jessie sits down with longtime friends Jessica and Andrew Arnold to talk about their journey raising and discipling their daughter Sarah, who is autistic, vibrant, socially curious, and wonderfully unique. The Arnolds open up about Sarah’s early diagnosis, the beauty and complexity of her faith, and the ways they’ve learned to release expectations, trust God, and embrace who she is rather than who they once imagined she might become.

With honesty and tenderness, they share what it looks like to navigate neurodivergence, emotional highs and lows, identity questions, and spiritual formation in real time. They talk about Sarah’s love for cosplay, her evangelist’s heart, her deep honesty, her struggles with jealousy and belonging, and the remarkable way she makes space for others on the margins. The conversation also highlights how faith communities can support neurodivergent individuals—not by fixing them, but by attuning, welcoming, and creating belonging.

This episode is an invitation to reimagine discipleship with gentleness, patience, and grace. It reminds us that God’s image is reflected beautifully in every person, and that those who experience the world differently often teach us the most about vulnerability, love, and the heart of Jesus.

ORDER Jessie’s newest book, Ordinary Discipleship: How God Wires Us for the Adventure of Transformation → https://a.co/d/51j86DG

For more great stuff, check out: Ordinary Discipleship by Whoology: https://whoology.co

Follow us on social media:
https://instagram.com/ordinarydiscipleship
https://facebook.com/ordinarydiscipleship

Follow Jessie on social media:
Instagram: https://instagram.com/yourbrainbyjess
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/jessica.s.cruickshank/
Twitter: https://twitter.com/yourbrainbyjess

In this episode, Jessie Cruickshank sits down with her friend and fellow leader Tracy Matthews for a rich, grounding conversation on what it means to cultivate spiritual attunement in life and leadership. Tracy shares vivid imagery God gave her during prayer—living water seeping into dry, cracked places—and invites us into a way of leading that begins not with planning and striving, but with presence, receptivity, and alignment with God’s heart. Together, Jessie and Tracy explore the difference between self-driven leadership and Spirit-led wayfinding, how teams can discern God’s guidance together, why shared power and co-regulation matter for emotional and spiritual health, and how slowing down can open us to wisdom we’ve been missing. They talk courage, disappointment, group culture, and the surprising freedom that comes when we release our grip on the plan and follow the Spirit’s gentle nudge instead. This is a practical and deeply encouraging conversation for anyone longing to hear God more clearly and lead with greater peace, courage, and connection.

ORDER Jessie’s newest book, Ordinary Discipleship: How God Wires Us for the Adventure of Transformation → https://a.co/d/51j86DG

For more great stuff, check out: Ordinary Discipleship by Whoology: https://whoology.co

Follow us on social media:
https://instagram.com/ordinarydiscipleship
https://facebook.com/ordinarydiscipleship

Follow Jessie on social media:
Instagram: https://instagram.com/yourbrainbyjess
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/jessica.s.cruickshank/
Twitter: https://twitter.com/yourbrainbyjess

In this episode, Jessie Cruickshank sits down with Geoff and Cyd Holsclaw to explore their new book Landscapes of the Soul—a beautiful and practical guide to understanding attachment theory through the lens of faith and discipleship.

Together, they unpack what it means to live with secure, insecure, or disorganized attachment, reframed as landscapes of the soul: the pasture, the jungle, the desert, and the war zone. Geoff and Cyd share how these metaphors help us see our relational and spiritual patterns without shame—inviting us to move from self-protection toward deeper connection with God and others.

This conversation bridges brain science and spiritual formation, showing how embodied faith and attachment awareness can transform the way we read Scripture, practice discipleship, and experience God’s love in everyday life.

Learn more about Geoff and Cyd’s work at embodiedfaith.life

ORDER Jessie’s newest book, Ordinary Discipleship: How God Wires Us for the Adventure of Transformation → https://a.co/d/51j86DG

For more great stuff, check out: Ordinary Discipleship by Whoology: https://whoology.co

Follow us on social media:
https://instagram.com/ordinarydiscipleship
https://facebook.com/ordinarydiscipleship

Follow Jessie on social media:
Instagram: https://instagram.com/yourbrainbyjess
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/jessica.s.cruickshank/
Twitter: https://twitter.com/yourbrainbyjess

In this episode, Jessie Cruickshank sits down with evangelist and disciple-maker Mike Wiggin to talk about surrender, grace, and what it truly means to follow Jesus. Mike shares his powerful story of moving from legalism to life—how an encounter with grace changed everything—and why he’s passionate about helping people not just believe in Jesus, but actually surrender to Him.

Together, they unpack the difference between emotional experiences and true transformation, explore why so many church models miss the heart of discipleship, and introduce Mike’s Simple Communities and Hope Dealer Training—a movement helping ordinary believers multiply the gospel in everyday life.

It’s an honest, hopeful conversation about faith that costs something, community that sustains, and the beauty of a gospel that’s as simple as it is powerful.

Learn more:

• Mike Wiggin: x2networks.org

ORDER Jessie’s newest book, Ordinary Discipleship: How God Wires Us for the Adventure of Transformation → https://a.co/d/51j86DG

For more great stuff, check out: Ordinary Discipleship by Whoology: https://whoology.co

Follow us on social media:
https://instagram.com/ordinarydiscipleship
https://facebook.com/ordinarydiscipleship

Follow Jessie on social media:
Instagram: https://instagram.com/yourbrainbyjess
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/jessica.s.cruickshank/
Twitter: https://twitter.com/yourbrainbyjess

Discipleship isn’t a skill to master—it’s a story to be lived. In this episode, Chris, Jacob, and Jessie Cruickshank unpack why so many churches reduce discipleship to a series of classes or leadership pipelines, and how that misses the heart of transformation. Together they explore the difference between leadership training and true discipleship, why one-size-fits-all programs leave people behind, and how small relational communities can actually cultivate spiritual maturity.

From rethinking old church models to the importance of relationship, rupture and repair, and trusting the Holy Spirit in group settings, this conversation challenges us to see discipleship not as curriculum-driven but as a Spirit-led journey of rewriting our lives with Jesus.

If you’ve ever wondered how to move beyond programs into real transformation, this episode offers a hopeful vision for discipleship that is personal, relational, and rooted in story

ORDER Jessie’s newest book, Ordinary Discipleship: How God Wires Us for the Adventure of Transformation → https://a.co/d/51j86DG

For more great stuff, check out: Ordinary Discipleship by Whoology: https://whoology.co

Follow us on social media:
https://instagram.com/ordinarydiscipleship
https://facebook.com/ordinarydiscipleship

Follow Jessie on social media:
Instagram: https://instagram.com/yourbrainbyjess
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/jessica.s.cruickshank/
Twitter: https://twitter.com/yourbrainbyjess

In this episode of Ordinary Discipleship, Chris, Jacob, and Jessie Cruickshank dive into the vital practice of listening in discipleship. Too often, leaders rush to “fix” problems rather than truly hearing the heart of the person in front of them - or what the Holy Spirit might be saying in the moment.

The conversation explores:

• Why listening requires humility, presence, and discernment
• The danger of treating people as “projects” rather than unique children of God
• How giving away control creates space for spiritual and emotional maturity
• The role of differentiation in healthy relationships and leadership
• Why agency is essential for true discipleship growth

Whether you’re leading in the church, discipling a friend, or simply navigating relationships, this episode will challenge you to slow down, listen deeply, and trust the Spirit’s work in others.

ORDER Jessie’s newest book, Ordinary Discipleship: How God Wires Us for the Adventure of Transformation → https://a.co/d/51j86DG

For more great stuff, check out: Ordinary Discipleship by Whoology: https://whoology.co

Follow us on social media:
https://instagram.com/ordinarydiscipleship
https://facebook.com/ordinarydiscipleship

Follow Jessie on social media:
Instagram: https://instagram.com/yourbrainbyjess
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/jessica.s.cruickshank/
Twitter: https://twitter.com/yourbrainbyjess

Is real change possible, or are we just learning new ways to cope? In this episode of the Ordinary Discipleship Podcast, Chris, Jacob, and Jessie Cruickshank dive into the deep work of transformation through Jesus. Together they explore how discipleship is not about behavior modification or memorizing verses, but about being recreated by the Holy Spirit.

The conversation wrestles with the tension between brokenness and healing, how true repentance leads to change, and why many faith communities settle for coping mechanisms instead of trusting God for miracles. Jessie shares powerful stories of identity shifts, Jacob reflects on how brokenness precedes wholeness, and Chris tells of witnessing real transformation in the lives of ordinary people.

This conversation reminds us that discipleship is about surrender - letting Jesus take the wheel, even when it means revisiting pain, so that God can bring lasting change from the inside out.

ORDER Jessie’s newest book, Ordinary Discipleship: How God Wires Us for the Adventure of Transformation → https://a.co/d/51j86DG

For more great stuff, check out: Ordinary Discipleship by Whoology: https://whoology.co

Follow us on social media:
https://instagram.com/ordinarydiscipleship
https://facebook.com/ordinarydiscipleship

Follow Jessie on social media:
Instagram: https://instagram.com/yourbrainbyjess
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/jessica.s.cruickshank/
Twitter: https://twitter.com/yourbrainbyjess

Jessie Cruickshank is a disciple-maker, wilderness guide, and ordained minister. She has trained thousands of people how to survive when their life depended on it and earned a Master’s degree in experiential education at Harvard to learn how the brain works to help people train more effectively.

Relationships are messy and that’s by design. In this episode of the Ordinary Discipleship Podcast, Chris, Jacob, and Jessie dive into why conflict isn’t something to avoid but a key part of how God shapes us in community. From roller derby and MMA stories to real-life church leadership challenges, they unpack how healthy conflict can actually strengthen relationships, clarify communication, and deepen discipleship.

Together they explore:

• Why conflict doesn’t always come from sin but from being human
• How to engage disagreements in ways that lead to growth, not division
• The biblical framework of the fivefold ministry and the “messiness in the design”
• Practical ways to see the other person as a teammate instead of an enemy

If you’ve ever wrestled with conflict in your marriage, church, or community and wondered how to navigate it faithfully, this conversation offers both challenge and encouragement for the journey.

ORDER Jessie’s newest book, Ordinary Discipleship: How God Wires Us for the Adventure of Transformation → https://a.co/d/51j86DG

For more great stuff, check out: Ordinary Discipleship by Whoology: https://whoology.co

Follow us on social media:
https://instagram.com/ordinarydiscipleship
https://facebook.com/ordinarydiscipleship

Follow Jessie on social media:
Instagram: https://instagram.com/yourbrainbyjess
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/jessica.s.cruickshank/
Twitter: https://twitter.com/yourbrainbyjess

Jessie Cruickshank is a disciple-maker, wilderness guide, and ordained minister. She has trained thousands of people how to survive when their life depended on it and earned a Master’s degree in experiential education at Harvard to learn how the brain works to help people train more effectively.