Puny Mortal Podcast

By DEAD GOODSociety & Culture

Puny Mortal Podcast episodes

September 27, 2024 Death Futures
Intro
In this episode, we discuss the concept of death futures and the potential technologies and experiences that
could shape the end of life.

Episode summary
We explore topics such as AI replicas of dead loved ones, holograms, virtual reality experiences, and the use of technology to enhance end-of-life care. We also touch on the ethical considerations of death tech and the intersection of technology and nostalgia.
And for the last time in Season 1 of the Puny Mortal Podcast, we encourage you to 'get mortal' with us as we make our final choices (for now) for our own future funerals.

Chapters
01:02 Episode introduction
03:00 What 'death futures' conjured for KV
03:23 Black Mirror episode 'Be Right Back'
05:00 LV says some episodes of Black Mirror are now 'death-present'
05:22 Dad Bot
06:52 Abba Voyage Tour
07:27 Hollogram bands we'd like to see
08:13 Story about Emma Satchell's friend, Paula Fowler, who invested in death tech before she died in 2024, and hollogram app
11:00 San Junipero - Death Futures Black Mirror episode
14:57 Second Life
17:58 Psilocybin & end of life care
18:58 How could augmented reality have helped Dad in his final weeks?
19:54 Finding a version of Dad playing Adagio for Strings from 1969 in the garage
22:49 Tech for revisiting and replaying memories
24:49 LV tries to force KV to watch San Junipero
25:25 KV's lost owl collection
26:52 Ethical considerations
28:00 Positively Peter Vigurs - Dad's living tribute FB group that we set up the year before he died
31:59 MY FAREWELL funeral planning zine: memorial marker choices and special requests

Huge thanks to Flamingo Heights Podcast Studio in Ouseburn (Newcastle-upon-Tyne) for their help with Season 1.
Let us know if you've got any thoughts about Season 2.
LOVE YOU BYE
46 min
September 19, 2024Natural Burial & Decay
Intro
In this episode, we discuss natural burial (sometimes referred to as green burial or an eco burial) and the concept of bodily decay.

Summary
We explore our own journeys in choosing future natural burials and how our feelings toward decay have evolved. We also discuss the environmental impact of cremation and the options available for eco-friendly funerals. The conversation touches on the different types of natural burial sites in the UK, the use of shrouds and eco-coffins, and the potential for community spaces in natural burial grounds.
We end by 'getting mortal' with you and sharing a few more of our own funeral choices. We also reflect on the importance of revisiting and re-evaluating funeral choices over time.

Points of clarification and links
Our death education work sees us popping up in lots of public places and events. We've had our DEAD GOOD stall at a range of markets. We could write a book about the conversations we've had with people!

KV completed Carbon Literacy training in June 2024 with The Carbon Literacy Trust.

Currently the operational carbon cost of one gas-fired cremation is between 126kgs CO2e and 400kgs CO2e. THAT IS A LOT.

The operational carbon cost of one natural burial is between zero kgs CO2e and 11kgs CO2e.

You can read an excellent recent research report about the carbon footprints of different funeral options here.

You can ask to be there when the coffin goes into the cremator. It's called witnessing the charge. Sometimes it costs a bit more to do this.

Chapters
01:02 Intro to episode
02:00 Common initial response to burial (fear of worms and claustrophobia
03:00 Cremation facts
05:17 What is a natural burial?
09:02 How did we come to choose natural burial for ourselves?
11:47 The story of Dad changing his mind from cremation to a woodland burial
17:10 The move to shrouds instead of coffins
17:49 "I welcome the worms now" KV
18:20 LV's interest in cardboard coffins as affordable option with arty decoration possibilities
20:50 The option of making your own shroud from fabrics/textiles you already own
21:48 The carbon costs of visiting a grave
25:00 The tale of Grandleberry Jam
26:00 The Wood School burial story
29:30 Our Get Mortal funeral planning using our My Farewell zine kit. We discuss the categories and our choices for 'Donations' and 'Resting Places'.

We'd love you to leave us a comment to tell us the ways in which this episode resonated with you.

Go on. Get in touch. We dare you.

LOVE YOU BYEEEEEE
40 min
September 13, 2024The Horror Genre & Death
Intro
In this episode of the Puny Mortal podcast, we discuss our relationship with horror films and how it connects to
our experiences and emotions around death and mortality.

Summary
We explore the influence of our dead dad on our interest (particularly LV's) in horror, our childhood memories of watching horror films, and the impact of horror on our perception of death and dying.
We also discuss the different ways in which we currently engage with horror films, with KV being unable to watch them nowadays due to an extreme reaction to a zombie film in the early 2000s, and LV continuing to enjoy them as a form of escapism and thrill.
SPOILER ALERTS IN THE NOTES & CHAPTERS BELOW.
Listen out for LV's audio zombie impression at 15:40.
We also discuss the connection between horror and neurodivergence, particularly in terms of disability and neurodivergent characters being portrayed as monsters or villains. We also briefly touch on the idea of creating new narratives and stories that challenge these stereotypes.
By the way, KV drops a swear word at 17:56 and LV trumps this by uttering a worse swear word at 34:46. FFS.
As always, we move on to discuss our own funeral plans, in the hope that it might inspire you to think about your own. Today we discuss our thoughts on 'funeral readings' and our choices for 'coffin toppers' and/or farewell flowers. You can buy your funeral planning zine from our webshop. Choose from a downloadable PDF you can print at home OR a riso printed kit on recycled coloured paper stock that we post to your house.
Links and points of clarification
LV and Dad bonded over their love of horror action films like the Aliens franchise, Starship Troopers, Total Recall, Silence of the Lambs, Jaws and more.

They would often converse in everyday life via horror film quotes alone.

Jaws was rated PG when we watched it in the 80s.

LV says Jaws is in her top 10 horror films. We must find out the other 9.

Troll was the first horror film we watched (1986). We were 9 and 7. Troll is rated 15. We borrowed it by ourselves on VHS videotape from a local corner shop in Wolverhampton.

Look In magazine of the 1980s was where we got ALL our pre-teen knowledge of pop music and film stars.

SPOILER ALERTS for the film 28 Days Later (see chapter timestamp below if you want to skip it). KV mentions this upsetting scene involving a crow.

KV didn't watch another horror film between 2002 and 2017 when she attempted to watch The Conjuring on Netflix. That didn't go well.

LV mentions Jenan Matari when talking about some of the underlying problematic politics of the horror genre. Watch the video here.

LV hates the 'torture porn' sub-genre (not actual porn)

She loves supernatural films. "What I'm after is make believe. I love spooky. Give me scary fairies. A grown-up version of Labyrinth."

We briefly mention the children's book Bottersnikes and Gumbles, which has a great chapter on the fake death and funeral of the King of the Bottersnikes.

When LV drops the F bomb at 34:46, she does so in relation to a Philip Larkin poem.

LV mentions the Farewell Flowers Directory - a network of UK eco flower farmers & florists.
Chapters
01:00-01:45 Introduction to Episode 4
01:46-03:10 LV & our dad bonding over horror action
03:11-04:30 LV's gateway horror film on VHS
04:31-07:00 Childhood fear of Freddie Kruger
07:01-08:15 How horror films made us feel about death
08:16-09:15 Key horror films from our childhood
09:16-10:30 Why did we watch horror as children?
10:31-13:51 Pet Sematary & Stephen King
13:52-14:20 Our current relationships with horror films
14:21-19:04 28 Days Later & KV saying byeeeee to horror
19:05-20:50 Becoming a parent & horror films
20:51-24:30 From escapism to critiquing the genre
24:31-26:04 Films even LV can't watch
26:05-27:20 LV favourite horror genre
27:21-27:53 Horror as a form of memento mori?
27:54-32:25 Horror, neurodivergence & disability
32:26-37:24 KV & LV's 'get mortal' funeral plans
38 min
September 06, 2024Fictional Deaths
Intro
In this episode, we discuss some of the fictional deaths that have stayed with us and how they shaped our understanding of death, grief and mortality.
Summary
We found ourselves sharing personal experiences of impactful fictional deaths, such as Aslan's death in 'The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe', the death of Kane in Alien, and that of Kerry Bishop in the soap opera 'Neighbours', and more. BEWARE - some of these deaths are quite graphic and might not be for more sensitive ears - this episode is marked 'explicit content' for this reason. Also, a heads-up that KV is a terrible spoiler-machine. She blabs out spoilers left, right and centre. So this episode comes with a huge SPOILER ALERT (see chapters below for specific spoilers).
And as always we end the episode by 'getting mortal' and sharing some of our own funeral wishes with you, specifically our choices of funeral ceremony venue AND our music choices.
Links and points of clarification
We left Wolverhampton in 1988 and moved to Trentham in Stoke-on-Trent, three days before KV was due to start secondary school. Big feels.

The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe was written by C.S. Lewis (1950). It's 206 pages and recommended for 6-12 year olds.

We were forced to watch this BBC adaptation of The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe in 1988 before we left Wolverhampton.

Here's Aslan's death scene in the film Narnia. I just re-watched it. Maaaaaan, it's a lot. Tilda Swinton as the White Witch is everything though.

Gremlins (1984, directed by Joe Dante). This means KV was actually just SEVEN when she watched this at Helen's video party.

The character KV is talking about is Kate Beringer, Billy's girlfriend, played by Phoebe Cates.

Watch the Gremlins chimney death story for yourself. I tried to fact-check that Kate's dad was drunk before his death, but couldn't find this info.

We loved Neighbours so much in the late 1980s & 90s. The character Kerry Bishop was indeed pregnant when she was killed. And there is a bit of gore (fake blood where she has been shot by mistake). You can watch the episode here. The death scene is actually just 1 minute in length. Starts at 07:46-08:53. KEZZA!!!

Alien (1979, Ridley Scott) and Kane's death. Love the casual smoking at the spaceship dining table pre-chestburster scene. If you haven't seen this before, be warned! There is convulsing and explosive blood and twitchy death throes. John Hurt is a total ledge.

The final Harry Potter book is Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows (2007). So KV's son was actually only six. Crikey.

KV is referring to Chapter 36: The Flaw in the Plan

We'd also like to take this opportunity to say that TRANS LIVES MATTER VERY MUCH.

LV chose Time as a Symptom by Joanna Newsom

KV chose Play Dead by Bjork

KV also chose a cover of Bjork's Joga by Georgi Kay.

This is how you pronounce Bjork like a pro.

We both came across the Joga cover while watching Top of the Lake. Have you seen it? It's VERY challenging but VERY good.

You can order your own GET MORTAL funeral planning zine kit from our webshop.

Chapters
01:00-02:05 Episode intro
02:06-03:26 SPOILER ALERT WARNING
03:27-10:20 The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe
10:21-15:30 Gremlins
15:31-19:08 Kerry Bishop in Neighbours
19:09-20:55 Alien
20:56-21:28 Introducing our own kids to death via fiction
21:29-28:05 Harry Potter
28:06-29:21 Tell us about the fictional deaths that stayed with you
29:22-30:22 An invitation to creative people to think about how they depict death and grief in their work
30:38-38:19 Get Mortal Funeral Planning Zine - our choices for funeral venues and our music choices
39 min
August 30, 2024Neurodivergence and Death
Intro
In this episode, we talk about our experience of the intersection between neurodivergence, death and funerals. Be warned though, this episode gets heavy in places. Heavier than we expected. For this reason, we've marked this episode as containing 'explicit' content - but not because of any bad swears (we've saved those for the next episode - true story).
Oh, and we recorded this episode before LV invested in a proper good mic. Picture her, for Episode 2, wearing a teeny tiny microphone attached to the wire of her (probably free) earphones, like some Y2K business guy, pre-bluetooth era. Thus, I blame the slight jingly-jangly sounds when LV is speaking on this offensively cheap mic. I promise these sounds are banished in all future episodes. Thanks to expensive new mic.
We may record a follow-up episode in a future season of PUNY MORTAL as we only managed to scratch the surface here.
Summary
We initially talk about being late-diagnosed neurodivergent people and how this intersects with our experiences of death and funerals (both pre-diagnosis and post-diagnosis). But it gets rather heavy when we talk about our dad’s active dying in his last couple of weeks in February 2022. So maybe skip to the end if you want to hear the lighter content, such as the weird minister at our granddad’s funeral, and our uncontrollable funeral giggling (i.e. later at the same funeral. But also at the funerals of other family and friends. FFS).
As always, we end the episode by sharing with you some of our own funeral wishes. In Episode 2 we talk about our choice of physical send-off and choice of ceremony type. We're sharing our funeral wishes in the hope that it'll encourage you to do your own planning. You can order your own GET MORTAL funeral planning zine from our website.
By the way, if you’re neurodivergent like us, we’d LOVE to hear from you about your experiences of funerals and grief. Does any of this resonate? Or are the Vigurs sisters the only weirdos in the corner?

Links and points of clarification
As undiagnosed neurodivergent children our mum was always having to write notes to teachers to give them a heads-up on our quirks.

We both had a lot of time off secondary school. LV due to physical symptoms. KV due to overwhelm and needing quiet time.

Emetophobia is the very real fear of vomit and vomiting.

Wings Picasso's Last Words (Drink to Me) - Dad schooled us on the back catalogue of Wings in his last two weeks.

There are loads of dawn choruses on YouTube.

When we were giggling and egging each other on in the back of Dad's bright yellow Citroen CX, he would wearily say "Face the windows, girls" to stop us looking at each other.

We mention helpful books on dying by Dr Kathryn Mannix. Her TED Talk is a good starting point.

Check out Becky Ellis's @neuro_divers account on IG. There are some great infographic posts on autism and grief.

Chapters
01:08-05:50 Our personal experiences of neurodivergence
05:51-11:48 The intersection of our dad's death and our neurodivergence
11:49-24:50 The last two weeks of Dad's life
24:51-29:20 Funerals and neurodivergence
29:21-32:10 Our Granddad's funeral & inappropriate laughing
32:11-32:47 Tell us about your neurospicy funeral experiences
32:48-39:10 Get Mortal funeral planning chat: our choices of physical send-off and choice of ceremony type
40 min
August 22, 2024First Experiences of Death
Intro
Welcome to the first ever episode of the Puny Mortal podcast. It's fair to say that we definitely didn't know what we were doing when we recorded Episode 1. Thank goodness Flamingo Heights were on hand with good advice and even better sound production.

Summary
What was your first experience of death? How did it make you feel?
In this inaugural deathy conversation, we discuss our first
experiences of death. Lindsey recalls her first experience through the death of plant life, specifically a Wolverhampton broad bean. We also discuss our highs and lows with the Indian Moon moths we reared from caterpillars in the 1980s. Top tip: don't do this if you also keep cats as pets. Then we talk about the death of Hammy, the adventuring hamster of our childhood friend Rachael. Although, with Hammy, it was less about his death and more about his spontaneous and unwise exhumation. We also mention the sudden death of our childhood neighbour, the death of a classmate at junior school, and the first deaths of family members when we were teenagers. Oh and there's a bit where we reminisce about the
terrifying UK public information films from the 1970s and 1980s.
We end each episode by getting mortal, by which we mean sharing our funeral choices with you for our own future farewell ceremonies. At the end of Episode 1, we share how we'd like our dead bodies cared for before our funerals and our coffin/shroud choices. We encourage you to start thinking about your funeral wishes. And if you'd like, you can order one of our get mortal funeral planning zines from our website.

Links and points of clarification
We lived in Wolverhampton in the UK Midlands between 1982-1988.

Our junior school gave us stick insects as well as Indian Moon moth caterpillars. Stick insects ate privet hedge. Moon moths ate hawthorn.

This is what Indian Moon moth caterpillars and moths look like. The moths have a lifespan of less than 10 days.

Mottephobia or fear of moths is a real thing.

There are blue (e.g. small emerald moth) and yellow (e.g. brimstone moth) moths in the UK. KV did fact checking.

Keeping curtains shut at home between a death and the funeral is a Victorian mourning tradition.

The UK's public information films of the 1970s and 1980s were terrifying. Don't believe us? Check this out.

Uncle Bill died in 1994. Our nan died the following year in 1995.
This is the Enya song that was played at our nan's funeral. 'Evacuee' on Shepherd Moons (1991). Our dad chose this to play as we left the crematorium chapel. I'm listening whilst typing this. Cue sniffling and snarggging.

LV blurts out that she'd like Ben Harrison AKA Furious Pie to paint her cardboard coffin when she is dead.

Chapters
01:00-02:06 RIP LV's broad bean
02:07-09:21 RIP family of Indian Moon Moths
09:22-16:30 RIP Hammy the hamster
16:31-20:25 RIP our next-door neighbour in Wolves
20:26-23:30 Death of a classmate at junior school
23:31-26:40 1980s UK public information films
26:41-34:10 Our first family funerals as teenagers
35:30-35:39 The ringing of our bell folk doll
35:40 Get Mortal funeral wishes chat
42 min

About Puny Mortal Podcast

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The Puny Mortal Podcast is brought to you by the DEAD GOOD sisters, Katy and Lindsey Vigurs (Vigurs rhymes with tigers). We think that talking about all things death, dying and grief is important, so…

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