Real Finds Podcast: Commercial Real Estate Unfiltered

Insurance is one of the largest and least understood costs in commercial real estate. In this episode of The Real Finds Podcast, Gordon Lamphere sits down with Lisa Holt, founder of Ivy Risk, to unpack how insurance markets actually work and why developers, investors, and property owners are seeing dramatic shifts in costs.

Lisa explains how insurance brokers evaluate real estate risk, why development projects are uniquely difficult to insure, and how global forces from climate risk to capital markets are reshaping the insurance landscape.

The conversation dives into the dramatic swings in insurance pricing over the past five years, why some asset classes like multifamily have faced the biggest challenges, and how sophisticated owners are using data and risk management strategies to regain control of their insurance programs.

They also explore emerging strategies like captive insurance structures, which allow large real estate owners to effectively become their own insurance company and turn risk management into a potential profit center.

Finally, Gordon and Lisa discuss how AI and analytics will transform underwriting and risk modeling in the next decade and what developers, investors, and operators should be doing today to stay ahead.

If you own, develop, or manage commercial real estate, this episode offers an inside look at one of the most important forces shaping property economics today.

Topics covered include:

• Why insurance costs skyrocketed after 2019
• How insurance markets actually price risk
• Why multifamily development has been hit hardest
• The role of climate risk in property insurance
• How insurance-linked securities are changing the market
• The rise of captive insurance programs for real estate owners
• How data and AI are transforming underwriting
• Geographic risk differences across U.S. real estate markets
• Why better property management can reduce insurance costs
• The future of insurance and real estate risk management

Connect With Lisa Holt

Website: https://ivyrisk.com

Instagram: https://instagram.com/ivyriskofficial

Email: [email protected]

About The Real Finds Podcast

Hosted by Gordon Lamphere, The Real Finds Podcast features conversations with developers, investors, policymakers, and operators shaping the future of commercial real estate, cities, and the built environment.

Through candid conversations with industry leaders, the show explores how deals get done, how markets evolve, and how real estate professionals navigate an increasingly complex world.

The podcast and newsletter reach 50,000+ real estate professionals, entrepreneurs, and investors across the commercial real estate ecosystem.

Caregiving is no longer a “personal issue” happening outside the workplace. It’s a workforce issue, a design issue, and a real estate issue.

Our blog: https://www.vvco.com/caregiving-building-for-a-longevity-society-and-the-future-of-work-with-marisa-toldo-rfp-89/

In this episode of The Real Finds Podcast, Gordon Lamphere sits down with Marisa Toldo—an architect and researcher focused on the built environment—to unpack the collision of three massive forces reshaping real estate and the workplace:

• The rise of the longevity society (aging populations + multi-generational workforces)
• The caregiving reality inside modern employment (childcare, eldercare, and everything in between)
• The future of work as AI, flexibility, and office vacancy push owners and occupiers to rethink what space is for

Marisa makes a provocative argument: office vacancy isn’t only a demand problem—it’s also a design failure. For decades, workplaces were built for the “perfect employee” (carefree, always available, always healthy). That person doesn’t exist—and the mismatch is starting to show up everywhere: retention, productivity, absenteeism, engagement, and how space is actually used.

We also get into practical and uncomfortable questions: What happens when companies that provide childcare start needing to address eldercare? What does “flexibility” actually solve—and what does it not solve? And how should real estate owners think about reuse, repurposing, and mixed-use strategies in a world with persistent office vacancy?

Key Topics We Cover:

- Why caregiving is a systemic workforce issue (not an individual problem)

- The “carefree employee” myth and how it shaped office design - Intergenerational models: childcare + eldercare + work, co-located

- Why many employees feel they have to hide caregiving responsibilities

- Multi-generational workforces and the physical space challenge

- Biophilic design: what it is (and what it isn’t)

- Measuring space usage: asking employees vs sensors vs observational studies - Office vacancy, reuse, and the case for mixed-use repurposing

- AI disruption and why “human-centered space” still matters

- What real estate should be talking about more: repurpose + circular thinking

The future: robots, drones, and designing space that’s “automation-ready”

About Marisa Toldo - Marisa Toldo is an architect and built-environment thinker whose work sits at the intersection of workplace design, caregiving realities, and longevity society planning. Her perspective is shaped by years working across regions including Latin America and Europe—and by her personal experience navigating Alzheimer’s caregiving within her own family.

Learn More: https://www.marisatoldo.com/

Connect: https://www.linkedin.com/in/marisatoldo/

About The Real Finds Podcast - Find Us At: https://www.vvco.com The Real Finds Podcast is hosted by Gordon Lamphere, a commercial real estate agent focused on how the built world is changing from workforce shifts and automation to development strategy and real-world deal dynamics.

Subscribe + Follow: If you’re a real estate investor, developer, occupier, or operator—and you care about where the market is going (not where it’s been)—subscribe for weekly conversations with people shaping the built world.

New episodes every week!

In this episode of The Real Finds Podcast, Gordon Lamphere sits down with Mike Herl, SIOR (Partner/Broker at Madison Commercial Real Estate)—who spent 17 years on the road and logged 3,500+ shows touring with major acts like Mötley Crüe, REO Speedwagon, Cheap Trick, and even crossing paths with Smashing Pumpkins (plus the broader Midwest orbit of legends like Steve Albini). Then he took that same high-stakes, contract-heavy, personality-driven touring world and translated it directly into large commercial real estate deals and building one of Madison’s most recognized boutique platforms.

Mike breaks down why Madison is a deceptively complex market, how student housing became a magnet for institutional capital, why office vs. retail has flipped over the last two decades, and what’s really happening in industrial—from the shift to tilt-up product to zoning constraints that push growth across municipal lines. If you want a sharp, operator-level view of how real markets evolve and how professionals build durable businesses inside them, this one delivers.

If you care about Midwest market dynamics, capital stacks, entitlement friction, and how real operators actually win, this one’s for you.

Guest: Mike Herl, SIOR — Partner | Broker, Madison Commercial Real Estate

Host: Gordon Lamphere — Commercial real estate agent (industrial, office, land) | Van Vlissingen & Co.

What we cover:

• From touring with Cheap Trick / REO Speedwagon / Motley Crüe to negotiating CRE deals
• How Mike built his practice: first principles, first job, then launching a boutique firm
• Why Madison went from “brain drain” to a magnet for talent (and demand)
• Student housing: why institutional money can win at 4–5% returns (and what that does to land pricing)
• Office vs retail: why it was “easier” then and why it’s reversed today
• Industrial in Dane County: product obsolescence, tilt-up economics, and zoning constraints
• Data centers, municipal politics, and the “growth moves across the line” reality

Connect with Mike:

Email: [email protected]

If you want to talk about industrial space, office space, or where capital is actually flowing in the Midwest, reach out anytime at www.vvco.com

This episode marks a rare, in-depth market briefing directly from Gordon Lamphere, drawing on real transactions, real underwriting, and real negotiations happening across Chicagoland as we enter Q1 2026.

Learn More: https://www.vvco.com/state-of-the-commercial-real-estate-market-2026-q1-rfp-87/

After a year of conversations with developers, corporate occupiers, lenders, municipal leaders, and operators across every major asset class, listeners asked for something different. Not predictions. Not headlines. But a grounded, operator-level view of what is actually working, what is quietly breaking, and where capital is moving next.

This episode delivers that clarity.

Based on more than 100 completed transactions and active mandates across office, industrial, multifamily, industrial outdoor storage, land, and redevelopment, Gordon walks through how the Chicagoland commercial real estate market is no longer reacting to disruption, but reallocating with intent.

You will hear a detailed breakdown of:

• Why office has stopped falling and started sorting, and what that means for Class A, B, and conversion-ready assets
• How industrial is normalizing unevenly, with power, labor, and infill now driving pricing more than square footage
• Why multifamily is absorbing supply quietly and setting up for its next tightening cycle
• How industrial outdoor storage has emerged as one of the most supply-constrained land uses in the region
• Where redevelopment math finally pencils again, and where it still does not

Markets We Cover: Chicago, Elk Grove Village, Evanston, Schaumburg, Vernon Hills, Highland Park, Waukegan, Naperville, Arlington Heights, Lake Forest, Lake Zurich

This is not a surface-level market recap. It is a framework for understanding where risk is becoming priceable again, where optionality matters most, and how sophisticated occupiers and investors are positioning for the next decade.

Subscribe to The Real Finds Podcast for ongoing insights grounded in real deals, real data, and real market dynamics.

Available on YouTube, Spotify, and all major podcast platforms.

In this episode of The Real Finds Podcast, host Gordon Lamphere sits down with Anita Verma-Lallian, a seasoned real estate developer at the intersection of data centers, energy infrastructure, AI, and film studio development. With a family background spanning more than four decades of land development, Anita shares how her platform has evolved from residential and industrial projects into some of the most capital-intensive and strategically complex assets in real estate today.

The conversation explores what actually makes a viable data center deal in 2025 and beyond, from access to power and transmission infrastructure to land scale, zoning feasibility, and community dynamics. Anita breaks down why Arizona has emerged as a critical data center market, how developers are navigating long power lead times, and why off-grid and bridge power solutions like natural gas, solar, and nuclear adjacency are reshaping site selection.

Gordon and Anita also dig into capital formation and exit strategies in a low-liquidity market. Anita explains how tech investors and real estate developers are increasingly partnering to merge technical expertise with development execution, why data centers continue to attract capital despite broader market uncertainty, and how different projects call for different exit paths, from land sales to long-term development and leasing.

Beyond data centers, the episode explores Anita’s work in film studio development, the role of tax incentives in Arizona, and the surprising overlap between media production, AI, and data infrastructure. The discussion highlights how proximity to data centers can reduce latency, improve production efficiency, and support next-generation content creation.

The episode closes with Anita’s perspective on how AI will reshape real estate over the next decade, advice for young professionals entering cyclical markets, and a candid look at why margin, not hype, ultimately determines which asset classes get built.

This is a must-listen conversation for developers, investors, occupiers, and anyone tracking the future of data centers, energy-driven real estate, and AI-enabled infrastructure.

For more on how data centers are shaping the Illinois and Wisconsin market, reach out to our team of commercial real estate agents here!

On this episode of The Real Finds Podcast, Gordon Lamphere sits down with Justin Den Herder, structural engineer, professor at The Cooper Union, and principal at global engineering firm TY Lin, to unpack what mass timber really means for commercial real estate.

They dig into how mass timber moves from romantic concept to bankable project, why embodied carbon is finally showing up in real underwriting conversations, and how timber can make adaptive reuse deals pencil out in a tighter capital markets environment.

In this episode, Gordon and Justin discuss

• How Justin’s early work on heavy timber and masonry conversions led him into the world of mass timber

• Why timber’s strength-to-weight ratio and panelized fabrication make taller, column-free commercial buildings possible

• The embodied carbon math behind steel, concrete, and timber, and why forests matter to your next pro forma

• Real-world case studies like Hines’ T3, Brock Commons, Ascent in Milwaukee, and Amherst College’s mass timber overbuild

• Fire, moisture, and code issues that still spook lenders and insurers, and what the data actually shows

• How biophilic, exposed timber structures can boost tenant experience, retention, and long term asset value

• What developers and investors most often get wrong about cost premiums and risk

About Justin Den Herder: Justin is a structural engineer, professor at The Cooper Union for the Advancement of Science and Art, and a principal at TY Lin. His work spans adaptive reuse, campus and civic projects, and cutting-edge mass timber structures that link healthy forests to lower carbon buildings.

If you are a developer, investor, architect, or commercial real estate agent looking for an alternative to traditional construction, this conversation will change how you think about structure, sustainability, and value creation.

If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe, leave a five-star rating and review, and share The Real Finds Podcast with a colleague. You can find us on YouTube, Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and wherever you listen.

In this episode of The Real Finds Podcast, host Gordon Lamphere sits down with Cali Williams Yost, CEO and founder of the Flex+Strategy Group, to explore how CEOs, COOs, HR leaders, and real estate decision makers can move beyond simple “return to office” mandates and design truly high performance flexible work models. Cali has been a pioneer in flexible work since the late 1990s, and she explains how technology, shifting demographics, and the shock of COVID created today’s clash between leadership expectations, employee realities, and underutilized office space.

Cali and Gordon dig into what it really means to redefine your operating model around performance across places, spaces, and time. They talk about why “hybrid” is the wrong frame, how to decide what work must happen in person versus remotely, and why some underused space can still deliver strong ROI when it is designed around the right interactions. They also tackle one of the biggest challenges many companies face today: engaging mid career employees who are critical carriers of culture and institutional knowledge, but often the least likely to show up in person.

You will learn:

- Why most organizations are stuck arguing about days in office instead of defining a clear, flexible work model

- How to design intentional in person interactions for development, collaboration, innovation, and culture

- What Cali calls the “clash of contexts” between C suite leaders and early career employees, and how to bridge it

- How to re engage mid career talent so they see in person time as high value, not a waste of time

- The “new math” of workspace utilization and why perfect occupancy is not the goal

- How flexible work principles are showing up in manufacturing, R&D, healthcare, and other on site environments

- Why change management, or “change magic,” is the real unlock for productivity, well being, and culture in a post pandemic world

- How AI fits into the next decade of work, and what should stay fully human

Connect with Cali:

Website: flexstrategygroup.com

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/caliwilliamsyost

Substack: The Now and Next of Work

If you found this conversation helpful, please like the video, subscribe to The Real Finds Podcast, and leave a 5-star rating and review. Your support helps us bring on more world-class guests who are shaping the future of work, commercial real estate, and the built environment.

Watch more episodes on YouTube or listen on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Reach out to our team of commercial real estate experts!

In this episode of The Real Finds Podcast, host Gordon Lamphere sits down with industrial outdoor storage specialist Andrew Wiesemann to unpack one of the hottest, most misunderstood asset classes in commercial real estate today. From zoning headaches and generational turnover to cap rate spreads and sovereign wealth funds, this conversation is a masterclass in how IOS really works on the ground.

Andrew shares how he went from buying multifamily in Chicago for a family office to focusing on single-tenant industrial assets in Wisconsin and Indiana, and ultimately into IOS after discovering how crucial outdoor storage was to the tenants at a Lansing, Michigan site. That pivot gave him a front row seat to the structural supply shortage that has pushed IOS into the spotlight.

Gordon and Andrew dig into why IOS is so constrained by zoning and legacy big box development, and how that lack of supply is colliding with demand from trucking, equipment rental, data center infrastructure, utilities, waste, and building materials users. Andrew explains why municipalities often misunderstand truck yards and storage yards, how long standing users lose their rights when sites go vacant, and why that keeps choking off future supply even when land looks available from the street.

They also walk through the investor side. Andrew breaks down who is buying IOS today, from private 1031 buyers treating it like a retail income play to institutional capital looking for mark-to-market stories with three to five-year weighted average lease terms. He compares traditional industrial cap rates to IOS portfolios, explains why there is still a spread, and why he expects cap rate compression as data, comps, and standardization catch up.

If you invest in IOS or are even just IOS curious, you will want to hear Andrew’s framework for what makes a Class A yard versus a Class B or C yard. He walks through the user focused checklist: access and truck flow, dual ingress and egress, stabilization and pavement, clear heights and door heights, yard configuration, lighting and security, and how all of this ties into long term functionality as equipment and user needs evolve.

They go deep on:

- How e commerce, trucking restrictions, and retailer parking policies created a national truck parking and IOS crunch

- Why only certain heavy industrial zoning categories allow outdoor storage by right and how early 2000s big box development quietly ate up that land

- The generational turnover wave among long time junkyards, scrap yards, and automotive users, and why some are sitting on an unrecognized gold mine

- What happens when a long term tenant finally turns over and the site suddenly has to meet today’s codes, from fencing and landscaping to parking and paving

- How to think about IOS cap rates relative to traditional industrial and why portfolios can price differently from one off sites

- Why infrastructure is destiny for IOS, and how markets like Chicago, DFW, Memphis, Kansas City, Mobile, and Savannah benefit from heavy public and private investment in ports, highways, and intermodals

For more, reach out to Gordon Lamphere and our team of commercial real estate experts at https://www.vvco.com, Chicago's trusted commercial real estate agents and commercial property managers.

In this episode of The Real Finds Podcast, host Gordon Lamphere sits down with Alana F. Dunoff, ProFM, FMP, IFMA Fellow, a strategic facilities planning consultant, adjunct professor in Temple University’s Facility Management program, and principal of AFD Professional Services. With more than 30 years of experience helping organizations align people, process, and place, Alana brings a unique perspective on how companies can reimagine the workplace for a post-pandemic world.

Alana shares how her background in environmental psychology shaped her approach to workplace strategy and why the return-to-office conversation is really about meaning, culture, and belonging. She explains why the most effective offices function like kindergarten classrooms, offering flexibility, creativity, and comfort in equal measure. Together, Gordon and Alana explore how to right-size portfolios, refresh spaces without major capital projects, and measure success through innovation and engagement rather than attendance.

They discuss how to align HR, facilities, and leadership strategy to create hybrid models that actually work and how to invest in people by investing in place. Alana also reveals how coffee rituals, collaboration zones, and wellness spaces can quietly rebuild culture and help employees reconnect with their organization’s purpose.

🔍 Key Topics Covered:

- Why task-based “kindergarten classroom” layouts outperform traditional office design

- How hybrid work is redefining space planning and employee engagement

- Strategies for right-sizing portfolios while preserving long-term flexibility

- Metrics that matter: innovation, engagement, and culture over square footage per head

- Small space upgrades that drive big behavior changes

- How to train and support managers for flexible, distributed teams

- The growing influence of Gen Z on workplace design and company culture

- Practical ways to rebuild belonging and human connection inside the office

Whether you are an HR leader, a facilities manager, or a commercial real estate investor, this episode offers clear, actionable insights for designing workplaces that balance flexibility, performance, and purpose in today’s evolving business landscape.

📚 Alana’s Recommended Read: Start With Why by Simon Sinek — a reminder that purpose and clarity drive performance more than policy.

📍 Learn More About Alana and AFD Professional Services:

Website: https://www.afdfacilityplanning.com

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/alanadunoff

Email: [email protected]

About the Author Gordon Lamphere is a Chicago-area commercial real estate agent and host of The Real Finds Podcast, where operators, economists, and developers share how they’re reshaping the built world. Learn more at www.vvco.com

🎧 Listen and Subscribe to The Real Finds Podcast: Spotify | Apple Podcasts | YouTube

Today’s Guest: Xander Snyder, Senior Commercial Real Estate Economist at First American. Xander blends a rare mix of family-office investing experience and data-driven economic analysis, helping institutional investors, developers, and lenders make sense of real-world market trends. With 15+ years in the business, he’s part economist, part operator, translating macro shifts into actionable market intelligence.

Why this matters now: Industrial has been the darling of commercial real estate for five straight years, but the cycle is maturing. After peaking at nearly 800 million SF under construction in 2022, the U.S. is now in a rebalancing phase: large-box supply is heavy, tenants are consolidating, and rent growth is slowing at the top end. Meanwhile, small-bay remains one of the most resilient slices of the market.

In this episode, Xander breaks down how industrial demand, labor, power, and capital are reshaping the Midwest and what the data says about where the next opportunities will emerge.

What You’ll Learn

- Who Xander Is: From a multi-generation LA family office to First American’s national research team, why he sees industrial through both a data and dealmaker’s lens.

- Boom → Rebalance: How low rates and pandemic demand created an unprecedented surge — and why developers are now pulling back on spec.

- Midwest in Focus: Chicago, Indianapolis, Columbus, Detroit, and Minneapolis — which markets have already absorbed supply, and which are still overshooting.

- Small-Bay Advantage: Vacancy near 3%, steady rent growth, and a broader tenant pool make it the most stable industrial segment right now.

- Labor & Incentives: Why the availability of skilled industrial labor predicts rent growth better than any headline metric.

- IOS, Cold Storage, and Data Centers: How new sub-asset classes are evolving and why “power is the new zoning.”

- Investor View: Cap rates are up 150–170 bps from 2022 lows, and for the first time in years, positive leverage is back on the table.

About the Author Gordon Lamphere is a Chicago-area commercial real estate agent and host of The Real Finds Podcast, where operators, economists, and developers share how they’re reshaping the built world. Learn more at www.vvco.com