It’s been a few weeks since Patrick bested Nextlander’s Brad Shoemaker in a classic setup: who can beat the purposely difficult and arcane Volgarr the Viking and Volgarr the Viking II first, when played back-to-back while streaming? In its wake, Patrick chatted with Kris Dürrschmidt, CEO and creative director at Volgarr the Viking developer Crazy Viking Studios. You’ll do fine listening if you haven’t played Volgarr the Viking, as they spend most of their time discussing the nature of challenge, gotcha design, and the evolution of gaming’s relationship with difficulty.

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