In the absence of a new mainline episode, I decided to do a parallel upload of this special I recorded for Waitangi Day this week.

Waitangi Day and the Treaty of Waitangi occupy a complicated place in New Zealand's public consciousness, especially in light of the current debate around David Seymour's Treaty Principles Bill. In this special longform interview for Waitangi Day 2025, Hugh talks to Dr Peter Cleave about this complex and difficult history. Dr Peter Cleave has been involved with retention and development of Te Reo Māori since the 1970s, holding numerous teaching roles at all levels. He has been both an academic and a broadcaster in Te Reo Māori, and was named an Officer of the New Zealand Order of Merit in 2025 for services to Māori language education.

Produced by Manawatū People's Radio with the support of New Zealand On Air.