Mark Clifton, Mark Hallock, and Dan Hurst discuss how pastors can navigate leading through changes early in their ministry at a church.

1. Why “Don’t change anything in the first year” is a bit too simplistic.
2. Help your folks understand the “why” behind changes.
3. Am I the right person to lead this change, and if not, am I better suited for a second-chair ministry?

Mark Clifton, Mark Hallock, and Dan Hurst discuss some difficult situations that pastors may need to shepherd through in their churches.

1. How do you shepherd an unmarried couple who have been attending your church, but have been dishonest about their living situation?
2. A couple asks you to perform their marriage ceremony. They claim to be believers but are not actively involved in any church.
3. How do you shepherd church members who are unwise in their social media usage?
4. How do you shepherd a leader whose marriage is clearly not in a good spot, but they are unwilling to talk about it?
5. Issues surrounding alcohol usage.

Mark Clifton, Mark Hallock, and Dan Hurst talk about some ways to effectively connect with first-time visitors.

Mark Clifton, Mark Hallock, and Dan Hurst discuss an article from Sam Rainer on some simple metrics to determine if your church is truly revitalized.

1. Children and students comprise 25% or more of average worship attendance.
2. Conversion ratio reaches 20:1 or better.
3. Giving consistently exceeds expenses.
4. Deferred maintenance is minimized.
5. The number of people in groups is 80% or more of average worship attendance.

Resources Related to this Episode:

“How to Know Your Church is Revitalized (5 Key Indicators)” by Sam Rainer

Mark Clifton and Dan Hurst welcome D.J. Horton, President of the 2025 SBC Pastor’s Conference, to the show! D.J. talks about his heart for bivocational pastors, church revitalization, and some things surrounding the 2025 SBC Pastor’s Conference in Dallas this June.

• D.J.’s journey in ministry to this point, including his 20+ years at Church at the Mill.
• D.J.’s life as the son of a bivocational pastor and his experience in smaller membership churches.
• The heart behind the 2025 SBC Pastor’s Conference
• Why pastors of smaller churches should make it to the Pastor’s Conference and SBC Annual Meeting in Dallas in June.

Mark Clifton, Mark Hallock, and Dan Hurst discuss an article from Barnabas Piper about what to do when your children resist and even resent your ministry in the church.

1. Remember your family is your primary ministry.
2. Remember you are called to lead your family.
3. Acknowledge that ministry is hard on kids and costly to families.
4. Consider the stage your kids are in and the cost of ministry for them.
5. Take your kids’ challenges to your fellow leaders for prayer and care
6. Consider your home and family dynamics
7. Consider your church’s relational and cultural dynamics
8. Find outlets for relief
9. Consider stepping away from ministry.

Resources Related to this Episode:

“Help! My Kids Aren’t on Board with Ministry” by Barnabas Piper

Mark Clifton, Mark Hallock, and Dan Hurst discuss an article from Lifeway about some difficult people you will encounter in church and ministry life.

1. The Dominator
2. The Dodger
3. The Debater
4. The Drainer

Resources Related to this Episode:

4 Difficult People You’ll Encounter in Ministry – and How to Handle Them by Christ Surratt

Mark Clifton, Mark Hallock, and Dan Hurst discuss how pastors should prepare and preach the invitation.

1. Every sermon needs to lead to an intentional ask, call, or response.
2. Never assume the hearer knows what to do. In fact, assume their next move needs to be directed by clearly articulated direction.
3. Spend time in your preparation:
4. Identifying what response should be made after the message.
5. Craft thoughtful expressions of calling for salvation, service, or obedience.
6. Decide whether there should be application following each point, or one invitational call at the end of the meeting.
7. Make sure you plan to leave significant time and energy for your invitation and never let it be an afterthought.

Mark Clifton, Mark Hallock, and Dan Hurst discuss how the word “revitalization” can sometimes be uncomfortable, and why the word “renew” may better communicate what we mean.

1. Become a praying church.
2. Understand the church’s mission.
3. Focus on what God can do.
4. The Word is the Word to follow.
5. Serve God with glory.

Resources Related to this Episode:

5 Steps to Local Church Renewal by Desmond Barrett

Mark Clifton, Mark Hallock, and Dan Hurst discuss how some things for pastors to think through when it comes to their attire on Sunday mornings.

1. Ask the question, “What does what I’m wearing communicate?”
2. You don’t want your clothes to distract.
3. Wear clothes that are culturally appropriate, but plain.

“Be prayerful and honest with yourself about this. Sure, not everyone will agree with where you fall on this issue, but I would encourage two things: 1) make sure your conscience is clear before the Lord in this and 2) always err on the side of plain and unimpressive.” – Mark Hallock

Resources Related to this Episode:

What Should a Pastor Wear by Mark Hallock