Ruminations

#14 – Sarah Murphy is a first-generation bison rancher and founder of Murphy Legacy Bison, a 900-acre cow–calf operation and meat brand outside of Durango in the SW corner of Colorado.

Before her ranching days, she led marketing at Whole Foods Market and later at the Savory Institute where her dreams of managing bison emerged. Her leap into ranching was enabled in part by the mentorship of Mimi Hillenbrand of the famed 777 Bison Ranch in South Dakota, as well as a hefty dose of both creativity and persistence. Despite having no land, no animals, and no money when she got started, today Sarah is one of a select few raising 100% grass-fed and regeneratively-raised bison.

In addition to ranching, she continues to work part-time for the Savory team on a bison reintroduction project with tribal nations. And as a lifelong outdoorswoman—river guide, mountain biker, backcountry skier—she brings a rare perspective on how recreation, livestock, and land health are deeply connected.

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– https://savory.global/90

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Music written & performed by https://www.youtube.com/@travismcnamara9313

#13 – Donna Kilpatrick is the Director of Regeneration at Heifer Ranch, the 1,200-acre U.S. agricultural training center of Heifer International based in Perryville, Arkansas where she directs regenerative land management, supports farmer-led supply chains, and pilots on-farm innovation to improve ecosystem outcomes. In addition to overseeing livestock operations at Heifer Ranch, Donna has helped establish the ranch as a Savory Hub and now collaborates with Heifer’s international programs to deliver monitoring and training support in diverse contexts, from Central America to East Africa.

In this episode, we explore:

– how Heifer USA fits into the broader mission of Heifer International

– Donna’s early days at Warren Wilson College and the tractor moment that changed her life

– training farmers from Arkansas to Honduras in Holistic Management

– what she learned attending two advanced-level Savory courses

– how she manages an all-female ranch team and what that’s meant for culture and impact

– R&D efforts happening at Heifer Ranch

– how beavers, bobwhite quail, and gamagrass signal ecological recovery

– and what Donna’s “lifequake” taught her about patterns, healing, and personal regeneration

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00:00 Intro

01:54 Welcome Donna

04:34 Heifer International's Mission and Work

08:04 Grassroots Farmer's Co-op

16:34 Donna's Journey in Agriculture

28:16 Advanced Holistic Management Courses

39:40 Heifer Ranch Operations and Innovations

45:40 Innovative Technology

46:01 Cost and Labor Efficiency

47:41 Exploring Virtual Fencing

49:45 Staff Training and Management

53:43 Female Leadership in Agriculture

01:01:47 International Regenerative Agriculture Efforts

01:18:25 Personal Growth and Future Plans

01:25:04 Closing thoughts

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MENTIONED IN THE EPISODE:

– https://grassrootscoop.com/

– https://www.heifer.org/

– https://heiferusa.org/

– https://savory.global/eov/

– https://savory.global/calendar-event/holistic-management-comprehensive/

– https://savory.global/calendar-event/hands-on-holistic-management-course-at-the-hickory-nut-gap-hub/

– https://nrhythm.co/

– https://www.hickorynutgap.com/

– https://pasturebird.com/

– https://www.gallagher.com.au/

– https://www.ukkorobotics.com/

– https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/the-process/

– https://zachbushmd.com/

– https://www.acresusa.com/

– https://hoards.com/

– https://www.chelseagreen.com/writer/allan-nation/

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This episode is brought to you by Savory’s Regenerating Members, a global community restoring over 100 million acres through Holistic Management. For less than $1 per day, you can help regenerate 400+ acres every year:

Want to sponsor an episode? 👉 https://savory.global/podcast

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Music written & performed by https://www.youtube.com/@travismcnamara9313

#12 – Michael Frey is the co-founder of DIRT Wine and second-generation steward of Mariah Vineyards, producer of the world's first Land to Market Verified wines. Located on a remote ridge 2,400 feet above sea level in Mendocino County, California, Michael and his wife Nicole have transformed her family’s vineyard into a thriving model of regenerative viticulture—farming without irrigation or synthetic chemicals, integrating livestock via Holistic Management, and using real ecological monitoring to drive land management decisions.

In this episode, we explore:

– how Michael and Nicole convinced the older generation to embrace a new regenerative path

– the specific vineyard practices they’ve adopted—from diverse cover crops and contract grazing to sap analysis and pollinator trials

– the disconnect between terroir and soil health in mainstream wine culture

– and why transparency, not just flavor, might be the most radical thing you can put on a wine label.

We also dig into the challenges of regenerative farming in a dry-farmed vineyard at elevation, the aesthetic tensions between “clean” and “complex” landscapes, and how Michael is thinking about measuring nutrient density and flavor outcomes at a deeper level.

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00:00 Intro

01:56 Welcome Michael Frey

03:06 Regenerative viticulture

07:41 Michael & Nicole's journey to regenerative

22:29 1st steps of their transition

36:37 Trade-offs & considerations of regenerative viticulture

43:59 The importance of data

45:30 Terroir

47:16 Conventional vs. Regenerative viticulture

52:15 Transparency (or lack thereof) for additives

55:10 Introducing DIRT Wine

59:54 The Future of Regenerative Viticulture

01:06:59 Advice for consumers & wine growers

01:12:24 Favorite failures

01:17:25 Looking ahead

01:26:50 Closing thoughts

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MENTIONED IN THE EPISODE:

– https://www.dirt-wine.com/

– https://mariahvineyards.com/

– https://savory.global/eov/

– https://savory.global/land-to-market/

– https://sonomawinegrape.org/paul-dolans-deep-sonoma-county-roots/

– https://www.stephanvanvliet.com/

– https://www.bionutrient.org/

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This episode is brought to you by Savory’s Regenerating Members, a global community restoring over 100 million acres through Holistic Management. For less than $1 per day, you can help regenerate 400+ acres every year:

Want to sponsor an episode? 👉 https://savory.global/podcast

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Music written & performed by https://www.youtube.com/@travismcnamara9313

#11 – Hunter Lovins is a regenerative-economy trailblazer, co-author of the bestselling books Natural Capitalism and A Finer Future, and a force behind initiatives that help farmers, CEOs, and even entire nations build “economies in service of life.”

In this episode, we revisit the big ideas of Natural Capitalism 25 years on, unpack Hunter’s blueprint for a just, regenerative economy, and hear why she’s co-launching COPx—a people-powered alternative to the UN climate talks. Hunter also shares stories from the field: scaling community-managed natural farming with 4 million smallholders in India, quadrupling yields in Zambia, and advising Gulf states on turning desert sands green. Along the way we talk about regenerative economics, the double-edged sword that is capitalism, “global weirding,” and how every plate she spins—finance, policy, ranching, activism—aims at one goal: tackling climate, water, and food crises all at once.

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00:00 Intro

04:00 Hunter’s current projects

10:03 Where does resistance to change originate?

16:36 Neoliberal economics

23:46 Origins of neoliberal capitalism

28:17 Mercantilism

34:08 Regenerating Membership

35:10 Capitalism vs. the Degrowth movement

38:40 'Natural Capitalism' 25 years later

40:53 Introducing 'A Finer Future'

44:25 COPx

58:47 What’s on the horizon?

01:02:35 Final thoughts

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MENTIONED IN THE EPISODE:

– https://www.natcapsolutions.org/natcapinc/

– https://apcnf.in/global/

– https://reclaimdemocracy.org/powell_memo_lewis/

– https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lewis_F._Powell_Jr.

– https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Gustave_Speth

– https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Drucker

– https://natcapsolutions.org/

– https://www.copx.earth/

– https://www.clubofrome.org/

– https://capitalinstitute.org/team/john-fullerton/

– https://capitalinstitute.org/regenerative-capitalism/

– https://www.kateraworth.com/

– https://doughnuteconomics.org/

– https://drawdown.org/

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This episode is brought to you by Savory’s Regenerating Members, a global community restoring over 100 million acres through Holistic Management. For less than $1 per day, you can help regenerate 400+ acres every year:

Want to sponsor an episode? 👉 https://savory.global/podcast

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Music written & performed by https://www.youtube.com/@travismcnamara9313

In this episode, we sit down with Jen Hunter and Andy Wear of Fernhill Farm and Fernhill Fiber, recognized as the 2022 Sheep Farmers of the Year by Farmers Weekly. With decades of shepherding under their belts, they share insights on how they've transformed their hilltop farm into a thriving cultural and ecological hub, cross-breeding 6 types of sheep to produce premium wool, on-farm events with 20,000 attendees, how EOV data informs their management, and more. 

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00:00 Intro

01:25 Fernhill’s Fiber Experience event

07:19 Setting the stage

11:10 Jen’s background

15:57 The history of Fernhill

22:38 From shepherding to Holistic Planned Grazing

28:24 Trading weddings for wool

37:17 Join the movement

38:18 Financial planning

47:23 Field observations

56:27 Balancing ecological & nutritional needs

01:00:38 Ecological monitoring

01:09:16 Partnering with HD Wool

01:11:17 Cross-breeding 6 types of sheep

01:21:47 Future aspirations

01:28:27 Final Thoughts

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MENTIONED IN THE EPISODE:

– https://www.fernhill-farm.co.uk/

– https://fernhillfibre.co.uk/

– https://fernhillfibre.co.uk/events/fernhill-fibre-experience-21st-march-2026

– https://www.fieldmargin.com/

– https://www.3lm.network/

– https://fernhillfibre.co.uk/eov-regenerative-verification

– https://www.hdwool.com/

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This episode is brought to you by Savory’s Regenerating Members, a global community restoring over 100 million acres through Holistic Management. For less than $1 per day, you can help regenerate 400+ acres every year:

Want to sponsor an episode? 👉 https://savory.global/podcast

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Music written & performed by https://www.youtube.com/@travismcnamara9313

In this episode of Ruminations, we explore what it means to be in relationship with place—even while living a nomadic lifestyle. Our guest is Leon Bucher: Holistic Management educator, EOV Verifier, and one of five members of Savory’s Global Quality Assurance team for Ecological Outcome Verification (EOV).

Together, we unpack how EOV works—not just the mechanics, but the deeper meaning. Leon shares insights from years of walking land with producers across Europe, explaining how ecological indicators serve as feedback loops for better management. From baseline monitoring to five-year trend analysis, we look at what getting EOV actually involves for a farmer or rancher—and why, in Leon’s words, regeneration is ultimately about relationship.

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00:00 Intro

02:13 A German nomad lands in northern Sweden

09:54 Career shifts

26:28 Learn everything or just get started?

31:31 Why do ecological monitoring?

34:01 TAKE MORE PHOTOS!

39:37 Monitoring for marketplace differentiation

41:18 Regenerating Members

45:20 What is EOV?

50:41 Calibrating data by eco-region

57:07 How indicators correlate to ecosystem processes

01:00:08 Leon’s favorite ecological indicators

01:01:34 Engaging your senses in monitoring

01:08:35 Setting up EOV on your farm or ranch

01:17:34 Trendlines & comparing to reference sites

01:20:27 Walking through an EOV report

01:23:37 Quality Assurance review

01:34:29 “Regeneration is relationships”

01:39:51 Final Thoughts

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MENTIONED IN THE EPISODE:

– https://landregeneration.eu/en/

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This episode is brought to you by Savory’s Regenerating Members, a global community restoring over 100 million acres through Holistic Management. For less than $1 per day, you can help regenerate 400+ acres every year:

Want to sponsor an episode? 👉 https://savory.global/podcast

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Music written & performed by https://www.youtube.com/@travismcnamara9313

In this episode of Ruminations, we dig into the legislative soil beneath America’s regenerative agriculture movement with Aria McLauchlan, co-founder and executive director of LandCore. Aria brings a rare insider’s view of how soil health is making its way into federal and state policy—often against the odds.

We explore how LandCore is reshaping the policy landscape by working alongside USDA, legislators, producers, and investors to mainstream soil health as a critical lever for economic resilience, food security, and climate action. You’ll hear about their groundbreaking risk modeling tools, the Soil Health Bill Tracker, and what it actually takes to get meaningful policy passed in a system designed for the status quo.

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00:00 Intro

03:20 Welcome Aria

04:20 Aria's Journey into Policy

09:55 Founding LandCore: Mission and Goals

12:15 Economic Incentives for Farmers

16:48 Navigating Capitol Hill: Engaging Policymakers

24:51 Risk Mitigation and Soil Health

32:31 LandCore's Risk Modeling Tool

37:55 Challenges in Modeling Grazing Practices

42:05 Practice-Based vs. Outcomes-Based Approaches

44:27 LandCore's Policy Priorities

45:56 The Farm Bill

51:28 Engaging with Legislators

59:49 Broader Implications and Agencies Involved

01:04:59 Global Perspectives

01:08:33 Economic Case for Soil Health

01:22:18 Future of Soil Health Policy

01:28:20 Final Thoughts

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– https://landcore.org/

– https://landcore.org/bill-tracker

– https://landcore.org/news-post/2024/05/02/land-core-risk-model-interactive-beta-tool

– https://landcore.org/news-post/public-comments-hhs-dietary-guidelines

– (BONUS) https://landcore.org/news-post/rooted-in-health-the-soil-and-human-health-connection

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This episode is brought to you by Savory’s Regenerating Members, a global community restoring over 100 million acres through Holistic Management. For less than $1 per day, you can help regenerate 400+ acres every year:

Want to sponsor an episode? 👉 https://savory.global/podcast

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Music written & performed by Travis McNamara.

In this episode we're joined by Pablo Borelli, co-founder of Ovis 21, the Savory Hub in Argentina. With a background in agronomy and extensive experience in Holistic Management, Pablo shares insights on how Ovis 21 has impacted over 26 million hectares and trained over 5,000 people in Holistic Management over the last decade. The conversation explores Pablo’s journey, the underlying principles and key insights of Holistic Management, and the transformative effects it has had on Patagonian grasslands and livestock management. Plus, dive into case studies and real-world applications that highlight the importance of planned grazing, recovery periods, and the ecological benefits of regenerative agriculture.

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00:00 Intro

04:35 Challenges and Innovations in Holistic Management

10:05 Early Adoption and Training in Patagonia

26:39 Holistic Management Principles and Practices

39:57 Understanding Holistic Grazing Plans

40:20 Redefining Overgrazing

43:25 The Concept of Overresting

48:08 Four Key Insights of Holistic Management

50:29 Importance of Holistic Context

58:16 Holistic Planned Grazing Explained

01:04:39 Recovery Periods in Grazing Plans

01:11:53 Advice for New Holistic Managers

01:13:09 The Future of Regenerative Grazing

01:20:22 Final Thoughts

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This episode is brought to you by Savory’s Regenerating Members, a global community restoring over 100 million acres through Holistic Management. For less than $1 per day, you can help regenerate 400+ acres every year:

Want to sponsor an episode? 👉 https://savory.global/podcast

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We’d love to hear your thoughts:

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Music written & performed by https://www.youtube.com/@travismcnamara9313

In this episode of Ruminations, we sit down with registered dietician and author Diana Rodgers to discuss her recent peer-reviewed paper on the nutritional benefits of animal-sourced foods. We delve into the challenges and biases she faced in getting her research published and break down common misconceptions about meat consumption. The conversation covers detailed nutritional information, the importance of protein, iron, zinc, B12, and the environmental and ethical aspects of meat production. Additionally, Diana shares her personal journey and announces her shift towards a new chapter in life centered around art and community.

00:00 Intro

05:25 Challenges in Nutrition and Dietetics

14:32 Understanding Scientific Studies

23:56 Nutritional Benefits of Red Meat

33:59 Protein Intake and Dietary Recommendations

45:10 Exploring Protein Needs for Older Adults

46:31 Challenges in Publishing Nutrition Research

48:12 Historical Roots of Anti-Meat Bias

54:30 Nutritional Benefits of Red Meat

01:04:50 Debunking Anti-Meat Arguments

01:18:23 Advice for Vegetarians and Vegans

01:23:28 Transitioning to a New Chapter

01:27:10 Final Thoughts and Resources

Stay in Touch with Diana

sustainabledish.com

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This episode is brought to you by Savory Institute’s Regenerating Members, a global community committed to restoring grasslands. Learn more and join for just $10/month at 👉 https://savory.global/member

Want to sponsor an episode? 

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Lazy R Ranch

New Cowgirl Camp

Roots of Resilience

Salish School of Spokane

UVE - Intermountain West Savory Hub

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YouTube: @SavoryInstitute

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We’d love to hear your thoughts. Suggest future guests here: https://www.tfaforms.com/5169997