Salt Lake Dirt

Gloria J. Browne-Marshall is a constitutional law professor at John Jay College (CUNY), an Emmy Award-winning writer, and a former civil rights attorney. In her book A Protest History of the United States, she explores more than four centuries of American dissent, weaving together legal analysis, memoir, and interviews. The book examines the country's deep dual personality—the ongoing friction between empire-building and the promise of liberty—while expanding the definition of protest to include not just marches and demonstrations, but everyday resistance, personal survival, and artistic expression. This week on Salt Lake Dirt, Kyler sits down with Browne-Marshall to discuss stories from her family history, including her great-great-grandmother Eliza, who resisted enslavement in Kentucky before later joining the Exoduster migration to Kansas. They also discuss the establishment of Martyrs' Day on July 5th—a date inspired by Frederick Douglass's famous 1852 address—to honor the activists and everyday people who sacrificed everything in the struggle for equal justice. It is a grounded look at how civil rights and democratic progress have always relied on the sustained efforts of ordinary people willing to demand more of the nation.

Thanks for listening!

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Episode Links:

• Purchase A Protest History of the United States
• Gloria's Linktree
• Martyrs Day - July 5th

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SLD Podcast Info:

• Visit SaltLakeDirt.com for more interviews.

• Intro and outro music courtesy of Hot House West.

• Vienna Waltz composed by Nathan Royal, performed by HHW.

Today on Salt Lake Dirt, Kyler welcomes back playwright and novelist Matthew Gasda to discuss his new book, Stranger Beauty (Arcade). Blending speculative elements with intimate reflection—a style dubbed by one reader as "science autofiction"—the novel shifts between 2038 and hidden personal documents from 2023. During the interview, Gasda breaks down the multi-layered structure of the book, which centers on a writer who has surrendered his creative freedom to a surveilling system in exchange for security.The conversation explores the central themes that give Stranger Beauty its unique resonance, including the debate between the protagonist and his Orthodox Christian brother, the evolving role of AI in creative and daily life, and the grounding weight of fatherhood. Gasda reflects on his own creative process, his relationship with personal journals, and how the novel functions as both a reflection of the current cultural moment and a vision of the future.

Thanks for listening!

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Episode Links:

• Purchase Stranger Beauty
• Substack: @matthewgasda
• Matthew on SLD Episode 315

On the latest episode of Salt Lake Dirt, Kyler reconnects with author Elizabeth Ellen. Following up on their previous discussion about her novel American Thighs (available here), the two discuss her play Exit, Carefully—tracing its roots back to a chaotic family Christmas Eve and its path from a college short story to publication. Elizabeth also candidly reflects on navigating literary cancellations, stepping into the publisher role at Hobart, and preparing for her appearance on The Bret Easton Ellis Podcast. Beyond their conversation on Substack and the shifts within contemporary indie publishing, Elizabeth has a major project underway: she is currently publishing real-time chapters of her memoir in progress, I MARRIED A SEX ADDICT/I AM A SEX ADDICT, directly to her Substack page.

Thanks for listening!

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Episode Links:

• Follow Elizabeth on Substack
• Purchase American Thighs
• Hobart Pulp
• IG: @shortflightlongdrive
• Elizabeth on SLD Episode 333

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SLD Podcast Info:

• Visit SaltLakeDirt.com for more interviews.

• Intro and outro music courtesy of Hot House West.

• Vienna Waltz composed by Nathan Royal, performed by HHW.

This week on Salt Lake Dirt, Kyler sits down with author Dr. Stacey Patton to discuss her new book, Strung Up: How White America Learned to Lynch Black Children. Grounded in deep archival research and developmental psychology, Dr. Patton’s work reframes racial terror by centering the deliberate targeting of Black youth and examining how generations of white children were socialized into cruelty through spectacle violence. Drawing connections between intergenerational trauma, historical silence, and the modern political climate, Dr. Patton sheds light on how history continues to shape present-day realities for Black families across America. During their conversation, Kyler and Dr. Patton explore key themes from the book, including the powerful Du Bois question—“Ought children be born to us?”—and the neuroscience behind how moral development and empathy are shaped during childhood. They also discuss specific historical cases, such as the 1916 lynching of Jesse Washington, and the vital role that truth-telling and primary sources play in counteracting historical erasure. Thanks for listening!

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Episode Links:

• Purchase Strung Up: How White America Learned to Lynch Black Children
• Follow Stacey Patton on Substack
• Follow Stacey Patton on Facebook

SLD Podcast Info:

• Visit SaltLakeDirt.com for more interviews.

• Intro and outro music courtesy of Hot House West.

• Vienna Waltz composed by Nathan Royal, performed by HHW.

This week on Salt Lake Dirt, we are replaying a fan-favorite episode from last year’s KPCR mixtape specials featuring actress and performer Lauren Ashley. Bringing her signature passion for Old Hollywood and vintage culture, Lauren sits down with Kyler for a cozy, autumn-inspired music showcase. Known for her appearances in Hollywood Graveyard short films and her deep appreciation for classic cinema history, Lauren brings a playlist curated for crisp air, changing leaves, and nostalgic fall afternoons. Throughout the hour, the two walk through tracks ranging from Nat King Cole and Barbra Streisand to Sophie Ellis-Bextor, the Avett Brothers, and Bernard Herrmann's classic film score for The Ghost and Mrs. Muir. Because copyright restrictions prevent music tracks from being included directly within the podcast audio, you will need to pause the episode as each song is introduced and play it on your preferred streaming service to experience the mixtape in full. Feel free to listen the conversation here and then click the link to take you directly to the playlist of songs.

Thanks for listening!

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Episode Links:

• ⁠Autumn Mixtape - Playlist⁠
• ⁠⁠Lauren on Salt Lake Dirt - Episode 320⁠⁠
• ⁠⁠Linktree: @folklaur⁠⁠
• ⁠⁠Follow Lauren on Instagram⁠⁠
• ⁠⁠Watch The Tomb of Nosferatu⁠⁠
• ⁠⁠Watch Graves from the Black Lagoon

SLD Podcast Info:

• Visit ⁠SaltLakeDirt.com⁠ for more interviews.

• Intro and outro music courtesy of ⁠Hot House West⁠.

• ⁠Vienna Waltz⁠ composed by Nathan Royal, performed by ⁠HHW⁠.

It was great having Keith Koeneman on Salt Lake Dirt to talk about his new novel, Paternity. Having previously written a biography on former Chicago Mayor Richard M. Daley, Keith made the leap to fiction with a story that follows two couples in Chicago's Lincoln Park neighborhood over two decades. He shared how he structured the book like a Netflix series with 19 interlocking chapters, drawing heavy inspiration from Elizabeth Strout's Olive Kitteridge while maintaining a strict chronological timeline as the characters age from their late twenties to their fifties. During our conversation, Keith opened up about his writing process and how reading hundreds of books a year growing up shaped his love for storytelling. We talked about how he picked up lessons on short chapters and plot hooks from reading mystery novels, as well as the importance of setting work aside and having a couple of honest friends read drafts. It was a really fun discussion about the balance between fiction and nonfiction, and Paternity is a fantastic read for anyone who loves deep character-driven stories.

Thanks for listening!

Kyler

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Episode Links:

• Purchase Paternity

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SLD Podcast Info:

• Visit SaltLakeDirt.com for more interviews.

• Intro and outro music courtesy of Hot House West.

• Vienna Waltz composed by Nathan Royal, performed by HHW.

Having Jerry Stahl back on Salt Lake Dirt to talk about Gonzo Neurotic: The Best (And Not-So-Best) of Jerry Stahl was incredible. He’s one of my all-time favorite writers, and reading through this huge mix of his previously uncollected work and forgotten journalism was an absolute blast. We talked about everything from the backstory of his cult film Cafe Flesh to the surreal reality of doing press tours on shows like Oprah and Tom Snyder after publishing Permanent Midnight. What makes Jerry’s work so special to me is how effortlessly he balances laugh-out-loud humor with pure, raw honesty. During our chat, we got into the brutal reality of the editing process, the strange feeling of revisiting your younger self on the page, and how writing is often just a necessary way to stay sane. Gonzo Neurotic is a fantastic look back at a legendary career, and I hope you enjoy listening to our conversation as much as I enjoyed having it.

Kyler

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Episode Links:

• Purchase Gonzo Neurotic: The Best (And Not-So-Best) of Jerry Stahl
• Jerry Stahl's Nowheresville (Substack)
• Jerry on SLD Episode 62 (2022)

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SLD Podcast Info:

• Visit SaltLakeDirt.com for more interviews.

• Intro and outro music courtesy of Hot House West.

• Vienna Waltz composed by Nathan Royal, performed by HHW.

This week on Salt Lake Dirt, Kyler sits down with author Susanne Antonetta to discuss her book, The Devil’s Castle: Nazi Eugenics, Euthanasia, and How Psychiatry’s Troubled History Reverberates Today. The conversation explores how Nazi-era euthanasia programs influenced modern psychiatric practices, including the rise of short, 15-minute appointments and heavy reliance on pharmaceuticals. Antonetta shares how her own 2019 psychotic episode and her discovery of German activist Dorothea Buck transformed her historical research into a personal exploration, highlighting alternative, conversation-based approaches like "open dialogue" that prioritize holistic, patient-centered care. The interview also addresses the stigma surrounding mental health and the danger of viewing psychiatric conditions through a strictly biological lens. Antonetta stresses the importance of examining history as gene-editing technologies advance, emphasizing that compassion, dialogue, and community support remain vital for true healing. Listeners can explore more of Antonetta's work on her website, read her column in Psychology Today, or pick up the paperback edition of The Devil's Castle.

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Episode Links:

• Purchase The Devil's Castle
• SusAntonetta.com
• Psychology Today Column

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SLD Podcast Info:

• Visit SaltLakeDirt.com for more interviews.

• Intro and outro music courtesy of Hot House West.
• Vienna Waltz composed by Nathan Royal, performed by HHW.

Mallory Smart returns to Salt Lake Dirt to chat with Kyler about her new book, Book of David. They get into the origin of the character, Dave, and how processing personal loss found its way onto the page, giving the project its emotional weight without losing its edge.Smart also opens up about the nuts and bolts of independent publishing, from running a small press to dealing with the chaos of the literary festival circuit. It’s a candid conversation about the realities of writing, navigating the literary world, and turning real life into fiction.

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Episode Links:

• Pre-Order Book of David from Asterism
• Pre-Order on Amazon
• MallorySmart.com

SLD Podcast Info:

• Visit ⁠SaltLakeDirt.com⁠ for more interviews.

• Intro and outro music courtesy of ⁠Hot House West⁠.
• ⁠Vienna Waltz⁠ composed by Nathan Royal, performed by ⁠HHW⁠.

Alex Osman returns to the show this week to discuss his novel, Xanadu, Pennsylvania, out now from Filthy Loot. Alex breaks down the book's evolution—stitching together decade-old drafts with new material to explore small-town secrets, human observation, and a strange town-wide obsession with Olivia Newton-John. We also talk about writing from an introverted perspective, honing in on sensory details, and why kids in fiction can be surprisingly cruel. Beyond the text itself, we discuss the physical design of the book and the pop-culture influences behind it. Alex shares how alternative 90s albums like Faith No More’s Angel Dust inspired the artwork, why he prefers compact pocketbook editions, and how classic comedy shape his reading habits. Take a listen to the episode and pick up a copy of Xanadu, Pennsylvania through Filthy Loot.

Thanks for listening!

Kyler

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Episode Links:

• Purchase Xanadu, Pennsylvania
• IG: @magkneesiumm
• Alex on SLD Episode 280

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SLD Podcast Info:

• Visit SaltLakeDirt.com for more interviews.

• Intro and outro music courtesy of Hot House West.
• Vienna Waltz composed by Nathan Royal, performed by HHW.