Scrappy ABM returns with host Mason Cosby and guest Liam MacCormack, founder and solopreneur at Growth by Liam, breaking down how real account-based marketing gets built when the ACV is high, the deals are complex, and shortcuts fail. Liam starts at the only place that matters: historical closed won accounts, not guesses. He walks through a massive breakdown of who books demos, who joins calls, who gets added into the product in PLG motions, and how that activity builds a clear picture of the buying group.

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The conversation moves into where those personas actually spend time, why LinkedIn audience assumptions fall apart, how Reddit and niche communities come into play, and why talking directly to happy customers beats any ad platform pitch. Mason and Liam press into problem content versus solution content, high-intent measurement signals beyond revenue alone, and the scrappy, manual, “pain in the ass” direct mail and gifting-style plays that stand out in a world of ignored cold emails and identical ads.

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Liam MacCormack is the founder and solopreneur at Growth by Liam, partnering with early and growth-stage companies on growth programs across channels. In this conversation, he shares firsthand experience building account-based motions for enterprise and high-ACV deals, grounded in closed won data, buying group behavior, and real-world engagement signals from digital and offline channels.

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• How Liam starts ABM and targeting with a massive breakdown of closed won accounts, demo bookers, call participants, and product users.
• Why PLG signals—like who opens free trials, who gets added to the account, and when executives show up—reveal real buying committees and conversion windows.
• The ACV reality check: when a $10K deal should not trigger a heavy ABM program and why enterprise and high-ACV motions justify one-to-one or one-to-few plays.
• Using Sales Navigator, posting activity, and real behavior to confirm if target personas are actually active on LinkedIn instead of trusting audience estimates.
• Talking directly to customers and target personas to learn where they discover solutions, including subreddits and niche communities that never show up in generic targeting.
• Balancing problem content and solution content so target accounts recognize their pain, see new ways to solve it, and understand specific use cases by industry and persona.
• Early indicators that ABM is working: target accounts visiting the site, consuming content, booking demos, and moving into real sales conversations long before deals close.
• The challenge of digital ad fatigue, ignored cold outreach, and how thoughtful direct mail-style plays and personalized touches create excitement, word-of-mouth, and executive-level association.
• The biggest miss Liam sees: teams skipping deep upfront research, failing to map each member of the buying group, and only speaking to the initial contact instead of every decision-maker.

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• Mason Cosby on LinkedIn
• Liam MacCormack on LinkedIn
• Growth by Liam website: mentioned as Liam’s site for learning more about his work
• LinkedIn & Sales Navigator: for building and validating target account lists and activity
• Reddit & subreddits: as real communities where specific personas learn and share
• Direct mail-style campaigns and custom postcards: tactile plays to stand out with target accounts
• Scrappy ABM: Visit for more ABM tips and strategies
• Connect with Mason on LinkedIn for a conversation about ABM

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Scrappy ABM keeps the focus on practical playbooks that don’t break the bank, and this conversation stays locked on real-world execution. Host Mason Cosby sits down with Katerina Maerefat, who has repeatedly launched ABM at Quorum Software, OpenSesame, and Resilinc, shifting teams away from fully inbound spray-and-pray toward strategic account based marketing.

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Across this breakdown of roughly sixteen industry-focused programs, Mason and Katerina walk through building an all ICP vertical play, centering on one unified account list, reliable targeting, predictive intent dials, and consistent execution across channels. They highlight how campaign infrastructure, a shared list across platforms, and full-funnel content tied to buying stages prevent random acts of marketing. Katerina shares specific examples of competitive displacement, partner marketing, all ICP programs, special reports, and field reports, then ties it all to pragmatic measurement, sales alignment, and account-based everything that actually reflects how revenue teams work.

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Katerina has led ABM launches at her last three companies, including Quorum Software, OpenSesame, and Resilinc, where she shifted teams from spray-and-pray inbound to strategic account based marketing. She has built one-to-one, one-to-few, and one-to-many programs, along with closed-lost, competitive displacement, partner marketing, and all ICP industry plays. Katerina consistently centers her approach on predictive intent, named account lists, scalable campaigns across channels, and tight collaboration with sales.

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• How Katerina launched ABM at three companies by moving from fully inbound spray-and-pray to strategic account based marketing.
• Building an all ICP, industry-focused program using one unified account list across platforms for list consistency and scalability.
• Using 6sense or similar ABM platforms to create account-based lists, layer predictive intent, and sync audiences into LinkedIn, Meta, Google, and other channels.
• Why vertical targeting starts with named accounts instead of broken native filters, and how constant list growth and buying stage changes shape campaign design.
• Structuring campaign infrastructure so maps, CRM, landing pages, and ads tie together for performance tracking and meaningful “tweak the dials” adjustments.
• Running integrated, multi-channel programs: organic social, paid social, paid search, communities, and testing channels like Microsoft/Bing based on how specific audiences behave.
• Full-funnel content for ICP plays: blogs, videos, case studies, podcasts, infographics, special reports, field reports, webinars, and clear bottom-of-funnel CTAs that match buying stages.
• Measurement using stages from anonymous web visits through MQL, opportunities, sourced vs. influenced pipeline, and revenue — plus the shift toward account-based everything and pre-created opportunities.
• The critical role of sales alignment: agreeing on account lists, handoff processes, regular communication, sales enablement, talking points, and follow-up that matches ABM plays.

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• 6sense
• Demandbase
• LinkedIn
• Meta
• Google
• Microsoft / Bing
• Hotjar
• Microsoft Clarity
• Quorum Software
• OpenSesame
• Resilinc
• Salesforce
• JMI roundtable
• Special reports based on supply chain disruption data
• Field reports comparing equipment performance on rigs
• Scrappy ABM: Visit for more ABM tips and strategies
• Connect with Mason on LinkedIn for a conversation about ABM

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If you enjoyed today’s episode and found valuable insights for your business, be sure to subscribe to the Scrappy ABM podcast for more expert discussions. Don’t forget to leave a review and share this episode with your team or fellow marketers!

Scrappy ABM hands the mic to another show and lets the numbers speak. Mason Cosby opens this episode of Scrappy ABM by sharing a re-release from Is Anything Real in Paid Advertising?, “the show where we unpack what’s real and what’s just noise” in a chaotic world of marketing and media. Host Adam W. Barney sits down with Mason, who “lives the phrase market like you mean it” and runs a content first growth engine built on daily LinkedIn posts, weekly podcasts, cold ads, and speaking gigs at manufacturing conferences.

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Together they break down how a two-year-old business scaled through podcasts, 2,000+ target accounts with a five year conversion runway, and a four-show guest system that turns one great conversation into long-term relationships. They walk through thought leadership ads on LinkedIn focused on awareness, website de-anonymization and direct outreach, barter deals for PR and speaking, and a very real look at seasonality, CPL, CAC, and knowing your numbers when you’re an agency founder staring at your pipeline and wondering if this is even worth building anymore.

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📌 What We Cover

• How Mason scaled a two-year-old, content first growth engine by hiring a team that’s “better at doing the work,” creating time and margin for training, education, team leadership, and running the business.
• Why podcasting is outperforming expectations, including a 70–80% podcast booking rate and how roughly 40% of guests turn into opportunities or referrals within 90 days.
• The 2,000+ account target list with a five year conversion runway, and how a four-show guest “swap” system keeps ideal buyers creating content with Scrappy ABM 4–6 times over a year to year and a half.
• How Mason thinks about LinkedIn thought leadership ads as pure awareness for 2025, focusing on followers, newsletter subscribers, and engaged fans instead of forcing “book a meeting” conversions.
• Why the team didn’t rush into retargeting, how website de-anonymization plus direct outreach became a lower cost starting point, and why upcoming case studies, ROI calculators, and marketing-specific landing pages will change the retargeting play.
• The disconnect Mason sees between content creators and ad buyers: running similar ads to all audiences, letting algorithms decide, and missing programs mapped to where the buyer is in their journey and their past engagement.
• How barter arrangements came together, including implementing HubSpot and training a sales team in exchange for PR and introductions to conferences and events that expanded speaking opportunities beyond the LinkedIn bubble.
• A practical playbook for building a speaking portfolio: podcast circuits as “reps,” becoming the backup speaker for local events, traveling cheap, and “build your own stage” so you can capture footage and prove you can hold a room.
• Fractional CRO lessons on seasonality, offering annual commitments with delayed payments instead of discounts, and selling based on reasonable CAC and CPL—like a virtual conference that drives 24,000 engaged leads at about $2.08 per lead.
• Real talk for agency founders burned out on cold ads and not seeing ROI from content yet: know your numbers, know your actual close rate, break down why you’re sad or anxious, go from “I need 10,000 people” to “I need four customers,” and move from anxiety to conviction so you can act.

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🔗 Resources Mentioned

• LinkedIn – Mason’s primary channel for connecting and sharing content.
• Scrappy ABM – “If you Google scrappy a BM, there’s a newsletter, there’s a podcast, there’s a website” with an “ungodly number of webinars.”
• HubSpot – Used in a barter arrangement for a HubSpot implementation and sales process training in exchange for PR and conference introductions.
• Website de-anonymization tools – Used to identify who is on the Scrappy ABM site so Mason can screenshot activity and directly ask, “Hey, something on our website that’s gonna be helpful?”
• BW MX – A conference where Mason has spoken for multiple years, including keynotes and three hour breakouts, and where he’s now considered a standing speaker.
• So guru conferences – The virtual conference business where Mason serves as a fractional CRO and sells sponsorships based on CPL and engaged leads.
• Scrappy ABM: Visit for more ABM tips and strategies
• Connect with Mason on LinkedIn for a conversation about ABM

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If you enjoyed today’s episode and found valuable insights for your business, be sure to subscribe to the Scrappy ABM podcast for more expert discussions. Don’t forget to leave a review and share this episode with your team or fellow marketers!

Scrappy ABM host Mason Cosby sits down with Chris Moody from Demandbase to confront why so many ABM programs have failed inside B2B organizations that “tried ABM” over the last five or six years. The conversation centers on executives who launch impressive strategy decks and shiny new initiatives without changing real behavior, staying close to sales, or aligning on who does what when the rubber hits the road. Chris calls out the pattern of marketing introducing “ABM” as a new object to sellers who have always focused on high-value accounts, and why that tension stalls programs before they start.

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Together, Mason and Chris walk through starting with one account, proving a different, more coordinated way of working, and then scaling what actually works. They dig into buying groups, resource allocation, dedicated ABM leadership, and why celebration of wins matters. Most importantly, they offer a human test for alignment: whether sales would actually choose to spend time with marketing outside the conference room.

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👤 Guest Bio

Chris Moody is the chief evangelist at Demandbase and has spent years around the ABM space, including time at TOPO and Gartner. In this conversation, he brings a practical, sales-first lens to account-based programs, leadership alignment, and coordinated go-to-market execution.

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📌 What We Cover

• Why many well-intentioned executive-led ABM initiatives fail when marketing doesn’t truly talk to sales or align on metrics, ownership, and execution.
• How “new shiny object” ABM pitches can feel like a slap in the face to sellers who have always focused on high-value accounts.
• The two paths after the leadership meeting: lip service and Slack messages vs. real behavior change, clear roles, and shared work.
• Starting scrappy: picking one account, one seller, and one cross-functional group to prove a new, more personal, more relevant, more strategic approach.
• The role of a dedicated account-based leader and cross-functional pods that pull in sales, marketing, customer success, events, and social as needed.
• How CMOs can walk in “hat in hand,” join calls, understand buying groups, and reallocate people, time, and budget toward the highest-value accounts.
• Why celebrating wins, sharing stories, and weekly communication (like Moody’s “M5”) reinforce trust and momentum across teams.
• The “dinner test” and direct Slack messages as simple signals that sales and marketing are genuinely aligned, not just aligned on paper.

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🔗 Resources Mentioned

• Demandbase – Account-based GTM and pipeline AI platform
• Connect with Chris Moody on LinkedIn
• Scrappy ABM: Visit for more ABM tips and strategies
• Connect with Mason on LinkedIn for a conversation about ABM

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If you enjoyed today's episode and found valuable insights for your business, be sure to subscribe to the Scrappy ABM podcast for more expert discussions. Don't forget to leave a review and share this episode with your team or fellow marketers!

Scrappy ABM brings a focused look at business to government—B2G in the context of an ABM program. Host Mason Cosby sits down with Michelle Hanley to map the nuances of payment processing for governments across state and local. With a finite group of agencies, shifting election cycles, and long six to 24-month timelines, buying groups change and risk aversion is real. Michelle lays out a play that flips “normal B2B” on its head: events to meet new people and get contacts, email as the day-to-day touchpoint, and webinars that are completely bottom of funnel—often a sniff test for open opportunities. Listen for practical talk on RFPs, contact harvest, segmentation by state or city, stage one opportunities, and why “if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it” still shapes adoption—while teams have to get scrappy with budget.

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Michelle Hanley is the Senior Manager of Demand Gen at PayIt, focused on payment processing for governments across state and local. She leads programs that rely on events, email, webinars, RFPs, and segmentation of buying groups—often by state or city—with timelines ranging from six to 24 months. Michelle highlights stage one opportunities, contact harvest, and attribution to guide spend.

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• B2G ABM focus: state and local, a finite group of agencies, and elected roles that change every 2, 4, 6, 8 years
• Buying signals & timelines: RFPs, six to 18 months locally, 18 to 24 months at the state level
• Channel mix that flips B2B: events to meet people and get contacts, email for nurtures and newsletters, webinars as bottom-of-funnel
• “Sniff test” webinars: smaller registration but tied to open opportunities and real evaluation
• Paid as air cover: paid media for awareness; content syndication for contact harvest into lead scoring and nurtures
• Segmentation reality: agencies like DMV, finance, IT; buying groups differ by state and city
• Success metrics in motion: stage one opportunities, the right people in system, events with the right audiences, and relationship expansion within accounts
• Budget constraints: fewer campaigns, bigger impact; get scrappy and point dollars to events and webinars with attribution
• Mindsets in government: risk aversion, legacy systems, and “if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it”—while newer officials expect credit card online and digital

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• BigMarker (webinar platform)
• Marketo (automation platform)
• Salesforce (CRM)
• Groove (BDR outreach; “a Clary program”)
• Outreach — outreach.io
• SalesLoft
• CaliberMind (attribution)
• LinkedIn (contact and community)
• City of Atlanta — cityofatlanta.com
• Scrappy ABM: Visit for more ABM tips and strategies.
• Connect with Mason on LinkedIn for a conversation about ABM

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If you enjoyed today's episode and found valuable insights for your business, be sure to subscribe to the Scrappy ABM podcast for more expert discussions. Don't forget to leave a review and share this episode with your team or fellow marketers!

“Where are the freaking meetings?” It’s the question every marketer hears — and the one that defines real accountability in B2B marketing. On this solo episode of Scrappy ABM, host Mason Cosby breaks down how to measure success across every stage of an ABM program so you can focus on the right goals at the right time.

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Rather than chasing meetings too early, Mason introduces the account progression model, a six-stage framework — from awareness through opportunity — that helps marketers understand where buyers really are in their journey. He shows how to align metrics with intent, track engagement meaningfully, and report results that earn credibility with both sales and executives.

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If you’ve ever struggled to connect marketing activity with pipeline, this walkthrough gives a clear, practical map for knowing what to measure, when to report it, and how to prove your impact at every stage.

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• Why “Where are the meetings?” is the wrong first question for ABM success
• The six stages of the account progression model: awareness, initial engagement, meaningful engagement, marketing qualified account, sales qualified account, and opportunity
• How to measure awareness through simple engagement metrics like impressions, clicks, and visits
• Tracking engagement that validates problem recognition and solution exploration
• Identifying high-intent signals that move accounts into meaningful engagement and MQA status
• What to measure once sales takes over: budget, authority, need, and timing
• How marketing continues to play a role in opportunity acceleration and deal closure
• Reporting engagement early, then shifting to meetings, pipeline, and revenue for executive visibility
• Building dashboards that connect marketing activity to real business outcomes

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• Scrappy ABM: Visit for more ABM tips and strategies.
• Connect with Mason Cosby for a conversation about ABM.

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If you enjoyed today's episode and found valuable insights for your business, be sure to subscribe to the Scrappy ABM podcast for more expert discussions. Don’t forget to leave a review and share this episode with your team or fellow marketers!

Scrappy ABM brings a practical playbook that doesn’t break the bank as host Mason Cosby sits down with Nick Clark to focus on the workflow side of operationalizing an ABM program. The conversation centers on program orchestration—who reaches out at what time with what thing and why—and the underestimated scope of the work. You’ll hear how ICP accounts shape targeting, how a documented workflow in Asana creates a white-glove ABM ecosystem with unique landing pages, forms, completion actions, targeted display ads, and curated email drips, and why starting simple proved out the path to a 24-email segmentation. The discussion gets specific on channel mix, geo-targeted ads around events, QR codes and vanity URLs in Ubers and Lyfts, alignment with sales, and measurement across Account Engagement (Pardot), Salesforce, and performance reports in Six Sense to see ICP accounts move through deeper stages faster.

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Nick Clark is the Marketing Automations Director at Basis Technologies. In 2025, he’s focused on ICP accounts, email-intensive automation, and event-driven go-to-market with sellers “boots on the ground.” Find the team at basis.com.

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• Program orchestration: who reaches out at what time with what thing and why
• Targeting and account segmentation as Basis shifts to ICP accounts
• A documented workflow in Asana to stand up an ABM “ecosystem environment” (unique page, form, completion actions, ads, curated emails)
• Starting simple (agency vs. brand) and iterating to role-based personalization (VP and above vs. director and below) across 24 unique emails
• Using Six Sense performance reports to see ICP accounts move into deeper stages faster—just by sending emails that complement sellers
• Channel mix by persona and device: geo-targeted ads, unique webpages, value propositions, and event-driven tactics
• Events in 2025: Ubers/Lyfts, QR codes, and vanity URLs around Adweek and similar gatherings
• Measurement across Account Engagement (Pardot) and Salesforce campaign objects, attribution gaps, and “anec data” from sales
• Alignment with sales to keep one tone and one voice—even with cookie uncertainty
• Lessons learned: exclude current clients where needed, avoid paralysis by over analysis, perfect is the enemy of good

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• Basis Technologies — basis.com
• Asana (project management tool)
• Six Sense (ABM platform)
• Account Engagement (Pardot)
• Salesforce (campaign object and reporting)
• Adweek (New York)
• Ubers, Lyfts, QR codes, vanity URL
• Scrappy ABM: Visit for more ABM tips and strategies.
• Connect with Mason on LinkedIn for a conversation about ABM

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Scrappy ABM shares a repurposed conversation where Mason Cosby is interviewed by Rohan Karunakaran on Founder Led. Mason started in sales, learned account based marketing by selling to a very specific niche, and built programs using a really good list, a really good value proposition and offer, and a basic CRM and a marketing automation platform. He launched Scrappy ABM as a side hustle, did about $300,000 in sales in three weeks, and now runs about $200,000 a month with a team of about 14. The conversation covers product market fit, the account progression model (awareness through reengagement), the 4D framework (data, distribution, destination, direction), and a six-hour workshop that delivered 300 slides and eight templates with a 9.4 out of 10 rating. Discover how LinkedIn, podcasts, and webinars drive discovery, why bangers should be recycled, and how to use negotiation levers to keep pricing cards face up.

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Rohan Karunakaran hosts Founder Led, where he dives into the minds of today’s successful entrepreneurs. He first connected with Mason Cosby on LinkedIn and invited him to share the story of starting Scrappy ABM, launching it when he just had his daughter, and the opportunity ahead for account based marketing and business building.

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• Starting in sales, discovering account based marketing, and building programs with a really good list, value proposition and offer, CRM, and marketing automation
• The ABM craze in 2020 and why roughly 80% of programs failed by 2023
• Two ICP tracks: 20–100M SaaS or vertical specific companies with dedicated sales, HubSpot/Salesforce plus Pardot/Marketo/HubSpot, and ACV at least 30,000 a year; and the podcast offering for founder led services businesses
• Product market fit before ABM, refunds when it didn’t work, and formalizing ICP after 18 months based on massive wins and referrals
• Discovery through LinkedIn, 75+ podcast interviews, and webinars (including 16 in two months), plus an aggressive release schedule of two episodes a week and over 200 episodes
• The six-hour workshop: 300 slides, eight templates, 75 people live, 40 meetings, and a 9.4 out of 10 score; next date: November 13 at scrappy.com/workshop / scrap ab.com/workshop
• LinkedIn approach: build a target account list, connect first, post problem and solution content on the six reasons ABM programs fail (execution, leadership buy-in, sales and marketing alignment, measurement, limited internal resourcing, targeting)
• Content operations: podcasts and webinars as the closed-loop source, video reach changes, rotating formats, saving and reposting bangers every two to three months
• 4D framework: data, distribution, destination, direction to design repeatable playbooks with targets, triggers, aligned destinations, and tracking
• Account progression model: awareness, initial engagement, meaningful engagement, MQA, SQA, opportunity, reengagement—and measuring the right goals at each stage
• Pricing transparency and negotiation levers from Todd Caponi: length of commitment, time to cash, volume, start date—with cards face up and a pricing calculator

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• LinkedIn (primary discovery mechanism)
• YouTube, Apple, Spotify (podcast distribution)
• HubSpot, Salesforce, Pardot, Marketo (CRM/marketing automation)
• Todd Caponi (four levers of negotiation: length of commitment, time to cash, volume, start date)
• Money Models (book reference)
• Do This, Not That (podcast example on YouTube, Apple, Spotify)
• Scrappy ABM: Visit for more ABM tips and strategies.
• Connect with Mason on LinkedIn for a conversation about ABM

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If you enjoyed today's episode and found valuable insights for your business, be sure to subscribe to the Scrappy ABM podcast for more expert discussions. Don't forget to leave a review and share this episode with your team or fellow marketers!

Scrappy ABM spotlights practical playbooks that don’t break the bank, and Mason Cosby welcomes Steven Tripp to focus on what actually moves revenue when sales and marketing aren’t on the same page. Steven’s stance is simple: pick the right accounts, prioritize first-party engagement data, and be brave enough to let buyers pull themselves through their own funnel. He lays out how a 100% inbound motion can evolve without jumping back on the expensive ad hamster wheel, why de-anonymizing late works when HubSpot lights up, and how ungating content led to a 5x traffic jump. You’ll hear the SAP “sunset” story—one search a month, one perfect lead—and how a matrixed buyer’s-journey approach ensures the right content shows up on Google and YouTube at every point. The punchline: marketing’s “product” isn’t leads—it’s SQAs—and alignment gets real when teams listen, act on behavioral signals, and measure what sales actually values.

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Steven Tripp is the marketing director at Wynne Systems. A full-funnel marketer who “went back to sales roots,” Steven prioritizes first-party engagement, behavioral signals, and building a content flywheel over ads. He champions ungated content, content mapped to every step of the buyer’s journey, and measuring marketing on SQAs with high intent and close rates. Connect with Steven Tripp on LinkedIn.

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• Building the account list with Apollo, custom scoring, and piping it back into Salesforce so “we know what the world looks like.”
• Prioritizing by first-party engagement data (not third-party “intent”) and actioning behavior on your own content.
• Operating as 100% inbound today—and why a transition to support outbound helps AEs progress deals.
• The SAP “sunset” example: write the article nobody else has; one search a month → one right lead in enterprise.
• Creating a culture of listening to prospects, customers, and your own team to surface unique data competitors don’t have.
• Treating Google as #1 and YouTube as #2 search engines; publishing content for every point in the buyer’s journey.
• Ungating content and letting buyers move through their funnel; the immediate 5x traffic lift.
• Seeing months of anonymous research, then de-anonymizing in HubSpot when someone finally raises their hand.
• Defining marketing’s “product” as SQAs, not leads; measuring like an outsourced provider that must prove value.
• Moving from the ad hamster wheel to the content flywheel; “be brave—and be right” to win leadership buy-in.

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• Apollo
• Salesforce
• SAP
• HubSpot
• Courageous Marketing (“UDI wrote a book, called Courageous Marketing”)
• Scrappy ABM: Visit for more ABM tips and strategies. (ScrappyABM.com)
• Connect with Mason Cosby for a conversation about ABM

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If you enjoyed today’s episode and found valuable insights for your business, be sure to subscribe to the Scrappy ABM podcast for more expert discussions. Don’t forget to leave a review and share this episode with your team or fellow marketers!