Tech Won't Save Us

Paris Marx is joined by Lizzie O’Shea to discuss how Australia’s plan to make Google and Facebook pay news publishers entrenches a data-extractive business model and aligns the interests of tech giants and media companies against those of the public.

Lizzie O’Shea is a human rights lawyer and the founder of Digital Rights Watch. She’s also the author of “Future Histories: What Ada Lovelace, Tom Paine, and the Paris Commune Can Teach Us about Digital Technology.” Follow Lizzie on Twitter as @Lizzie_OShea.

Tech Won’t Save Us offers a critical perspective on tech, its worldview, and wider society with the goal of inspiring people to demand better tech and a better world. Follow the podcast (@techwontsaveus) and host Paris Marx (@parismarx) on Twitter, and support the show on Patreon.

Find out more about Harbinger Media Network at harbingermedianetwork.com.

Also mentioned in this episode:

• Lizzie wrote about the problems with this plan for Overland Journal and Nikkei Asia.
• Paris wrote about why we shouldn’t link big tech and news giants for Tribune Magazine.
• Facebook restricted news sharing in Australia, while Google has signed deals with News Corp, Nine Entertainment, Seven West Media, and more for its News Showcase.
• Australia has among the most concentrated media ownership in the world. Former prime ministers Kevin Rudd and Malcolm Turnbull called for a royal commission on Rupert Murdoch’s media empire.
• Australia’s competition regulator released a digital platforms report with recommendations that included the bargaining code in 2019.
• Canada and the European Union may copy Australia’s model. French publishers are already getting paid by Google.

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Paris Marx is joined by Rida Qadri to discuss how gig workers in Jakarta created networks of mutual aid in the face of a lack of support from companies and the government, and how their experiences show the importance of workers’ local knowledge for delivery platforms.

Rida Qadri is a PhD candidate in Urban Information Systems at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology. Follow Rida on Twitter as @qadrida.

Tech Won’t Save Us offers a critical perspective on tech, its worldview, and wider society with the goal of inspiring people to demand better tech and a better world. Follow the podcast (@techwontsaveus) and host Paris Marx (@parismarx) on Twitter, and support the show on Patreon.

Find out more about Harbinger Media Network at harbingermedianetwork.com.

Also mentioned in this episode:

• Rida wrote about how delivery platforms in Jakarta show the importance of the human workers and their local knowledge.
• Paris wrote about Uber’s dark side, including its lack of support for drivers in Mexico and Brazil who faced violence.
• Gojek and Grab may merge, which would cause problems for gig workers in Southeast Asia.

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Paris Marx is joined by Lauren Kaori Gurley to discuss how Amazon surveils workers to stop them from organizing, the difficult working conditions in warehouses and for delivery drivers, and whether Jeff Bezos become Executive Chair will change anything.

Lauren Kaori Gurley is a labor reporter at Motherboard/Vice. Follow Lauren on Twitter as @LaurenKGurley.

Tech Won’t Save Us offers a critical perspective on tech, its worldview, and wider society with the goal of inspiring people to demand better tech and a better world. Follow the podcast (@techwontsaveus) and host Paris Marx (@parismarx) on Twitter, and support the show on Patreon.

Find out more about Harbinger Media Network at harbingermedianetwork.com.

Also mentioned in this episode:

• Lauren wrote about how Amazon’s Global Security Operations Center has a massive surveillance operation involving Pinkertons, and how the company monitors Facebook groups and internal listservs. She also spoke to workers about how they felt about it.
• Paris wrote that Jeff Bezos’ legacy as CEO is one of brutal exploitation and that can’t be forgotten.
• Ken Loach’s Sorry We Missed You shows how the gig economy ruins people’s lives.
• During the pandemic, there were Amazon walkouts across the United States and global protests during the pandemic. Workers in Bessemer, Alabama are also voting on unionization.
• Amazon stole delivery drivers’ tips and has been forced to repay them $61.7 million.

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Paris Marx is joined by Grafton Tanner to discuss how social media constantly resurfaces the past, why film and television uses nostalgia to keep us engaged, and whether there’s a way to wield nostalgia in pursuit of a better world.

Grafton Tanner is the author of “The Circle of the Snake: Nostalgia and Utopia in the Age of Big Tech” and “Babbling Corpse: Vaporwave and the Commodification of Ghosts.” Grafton is also writing  “The Hours Have Lost Their Clock: The Politics of Nostalgia” for Repeater Books, due out in October 2021. Follow Grafton on Twitter as @GraftonTanner.

Tech Won’t Save Us offers a critical perspective on tech, its worldview, and wider society with the goal of inspiring people to demand better tech and a better world. Follow the podcast (@techwontsaveus) and host Paris Marx (@parismarx) on Twitter, and support the show on Patreon.

Find out more about Harbinger Media Network at harbingermedianetwork.com.

Also mentioned in this episode:

• Paris wrote about consolidation in the film and television industries.
• Disney lobbied to extend copyright terms and what it might mean when Mickey Mouse goes into the public domain.
• George Lucas describes how commercialism limits what kind of movies can be made (17:18-18:40).
• Hollywood is using AI to help decide which films get made.
• A Harry Potter television series is in early development at HBO Max.
• Books mentioned in this episode: “The Future of Nostalgia” by Svetlana Boym, “New Dark Age: Technology and the End of the Future” by James Bridle, “Protocol: How Control Exists After Decentralization” by Alexander Galloway, “The End of Forgetting: Growing Up with Social Media” by Kate Eichhorn, “Radical Nostalgia: Spanish Civil War Commemoration in America” by Peter Glazer, and “Left in the Past: Radicalism and the Politics of Nostalgia” by Alastair Bonnett.
• Movies and shows mentioned in this episode: Ready Player One, San Junipero (Black Mirror), eXistenZ, The Matrix, and The Merchants of Cool.

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Paris Marx is joined by Becca Lewis to discuss YouTube’s history of incentivizing extreme content, how the storming of the US Capitol shows the power of media spectacle, and why we should see social media platforms as media companies.

Becca Lewis is a PhD candidate in Communication at Stanford University. She’s also written for a number of publications, including NBC News, Vice News, and New York Magazine. Follow Becca on Twitter as @beccalew.

Tech Won’t Save Us offers a critical perspective on tech, its worldview, and wider society with the goal of inspiring people to demand better tech and a better world. Follow the podcast (@techwontsaveus) and host Paris Marx (@parismarx) on Twitter, and support the show on Patreon.

Find out more about Harbinger Media Network at harbingermedianetwork.com.

Also mentioned in this episode:

• Read Becca’s report for Data & Society, “Alternative Influence: Broadcasting the Reactionary Right on YouTube.” You can also read her articles on YouTube radicalization, the final report on the Christchurch shooting, and why Trump’s Twitter ban was an editorial decision.
• Jacob Hamburger explains why the “intellectual dark web” and its claims about political correctness are nothing new.
• Alex Nichols explains how New Atheism was a precursor to the IDW and alt-right influencers.
• The video of Ben Affleck pushing back against Sam Harris’ Islamophobia on Bill Maher’s show, which was supposedly Dave Rubin’s “classical liberal” awakening.
• Zeynep Tufekci describes how YouTube’s recommendation algorithm recommends increasingly more extreme videos.
• Twitter workers demanded Trump be banned before Jack Dorsey announced the decision.
• People who inspire how Becca thinks about platforms: Robyn Caplan at Data & Society and Tarleton Gillespie at Microsoft Research.

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Paris Marx is joined by Salomé Viljoen to discuss existing proposals to expand individual data rights or treat it as a form of labor, why we instead need to see data governance as a collective democratic project, and how that would give us the power to decide what data is collected and what it’s used for.

Salomé Viljoen is an affiliate at Berkman Klein Center for Internet and Society at Harvard University, and a joint postdoctoral fellow at NYU School of Law’s Information Law Institute and the Cornell Tech Digital Life Initiative. Follow Salomé on Twitter as @salome_viljoen_.

Tech Won’t Save Us offers a critical perspective on tech, its worldview, and wider society with the goal of inspiring people to demand better tech and a better world. Follow the podcast (@techwontsaveus) and host Paris Marx (@parismarx) on Twitter, and support the show on Patreon.

Find out more about Harbinger Media Network at harbingermedianetwork.com.

Also mentioned in this episode:

• Read Salomé article about data egalitarianism for Phenomenal World.
• People who write about informational capitalism: Shoshana Zuboff and Nick Couldry on one side, and Jathan Sadowski and Julie Cohen on the side that Salomé prefers.
• People talking about data as property or labor: Andrew Yang through the Data Dividend Project, Eric Posner and Glen Weyl in “Radical Markets,” and Jaron Lanier.
• Proto-data egalitarian examples: Andrea Nahler’s proposal for a civic data trust, Barcelona’s civic data trust, the US Census, and learning from libraries’ management of public information.

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Paris Marx is joined by Anna Wiener to discuss her journey into the tech industry, how Silicon Valley’s desire for a “frictionless” world is affecting culture, and why it’s important to analyze Substack’s claims about the future of journalism.

Anna Wiener is the author of “Uncanny Valley” (available in paperback on Bookshop) and a contributing writer at the New Yorker. Follow Anna on Twitter as @annawiener.

Tech Won’t Save Us offers a critical perspective on tech, its worldview, and wider society with the goal of inspiring people to demand better tech and a better world. Follow the podcast (@techwontsaveus) and host Paris Marx (@parismarx) on Twitter, and support the show on Patreon.

Find out more about Harbinger Media Network at harbingermedianetwork.com.

Also mentioned in this episode:

• Read Anna’s articles on Substack, Section 230, and Salesforce Park in San Francisco.
• Ava Kofman, Francis Tseng, and Moira Weigel explain how Amazon self-publishing has become a haven for white supremacists.
• Venture-capitalist firm Andreessen Horowitz wrote about what they see as the “passion economy.”

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Paris Marx is joined by Mathew Lawrence and Thomas Hanna to discuss the problems with platforms, why antitrust alone is not enough to fix them, and how we can encourage the creation of democratic platforms that serve the public good.

Mathew Lawrence is the founder and director of Common Wealth. He’s also the co-author of “Planet on Fire: A Manifesto for the Age of Environmental Breakdown.” Preorder it now from Verso Books and follow him on Twitter as @DantonsHead.

Thomas Hanna is the research director at The Next System Project. He’s the author of “Our Common Wealth: The Return of Public Ownership in the United States.” Follow him on Twitter as @ThomasMHanna.

Tech Won’t Save Us offers a critical perspective on tech, its worldview, and wider society with the goal of inspiring people to demand better tech and a better world. Follow the podcast (@techwontsaveus) and host Paris Marx (@parismarx) on Twitter, and support the show on Patreon.

Find out more about Harbinger Media Network at harbingermedianetwork.com.

Also mentioned in this episode:

• Mathew and Thomas wrote a new report with Nils Peters called “A Common Platform: Reimagining Data and Platforms.”
• Eric Levitz wrote about how venture capitalists are like US central planners.
• Dan Hind wrote a previous report called “The British Digital Cooperative.”

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Paris Marx is joined by Tim Maughan to discuss the exploitative infrastructures that make the modern world possible, how complex technological systems rob us of our power to control our collective destiny, and why predicting trends isn’t hard when you understand capitalism.

Tim Maughan is the author of “Infinite Detail” and “Ghost Hardware.” He’s also written for BBC Future, New Scientist, and Motherboard, and is writing a new column for OneZero. Follow Tim on Twitter as @timmaughan.

Tech Won’t Save Us offers a critical perspective on tech, its worldview, and wider society with the goal of inspiring people to demand better tech and a better world. Follow the podcast (@techwontsaveus) and host Paris Marx (@parismarx) on Twitter, and support the show on Patreon.

Find out more about Harbinger Media Network at harbingermedianetwork.com.

Also mentioned in this episode:

• Read about the trip Tim took with Unknown Fields on a container ship, at manufacturing sites in China, and near a toxic lake in Inner Mongolia that’s the product of mining rare-earth minerals.
• Read the first article in Tim’s new column, No One’s Driving.
• Kim Stanley Robinson says billionaire space visions are “just a fantasy of our culture right now.”
• Media mentioned by Tim: Judge Dredd comics, The Running Man, RoboCop, Rollerball, and Ad Astra.

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Paris Marx is joined by David Banks to discuss how tech solutions to increase corporate control in cities will be sold to us as fun and convenient, and what that will actually means for access and equity in urban life.

David Banks is a visiting assistant professor at the University at Albany. He’s the editor-at-large at Real Life, and has written for The Baffler, e-flux architecture, and Current Affairs. Follow David on Twitter as @DA_Banks.

Tech Won’t Save Us offers a critical perspective on tech, its worldview, and wider society with the goal of inspiring people to demand better tech and a better world. Follow the podcast (@techwontsaveus) and host Paris Marx (@parismarx) on Twitter, and support the show on Patreon.

Find out more about Harbinger Media Network at harbingermedianetwork.com.

Also mentioned in this episode:

• Read David’s articles for Real Life on the subscriber city and e-flux architecture on software as infrastructure.
• Paris wrote about the end of the Paramount Decrees, including what it could mean for the future of cinemas.
• How people are fighting back against landlords attempts to use tech against tenants (“proptech”).
• Slavoj Žižek gives a father/son example of totalitarianism (from ~0:00-3:00).
• David Harvey’s “Right to the City” essay mentions how homeownership makes people more conservative.
• Red Vienna remains a great example of public housing.
• Kevin Rogan wrote about how smart-city technologies are designed to hide human labor.
• Books in this show: “Radicalized” by Cory Doctorow, “Urban Warfare” by Raquel Rolnik, “Capital City” by Samuel Stein, and “Loft Living” by Sharon Zukin

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