🎙️ Episode Description

In this episode of At the Water’s Edge, Scott Kelly is joined by former Air Force pilots, Tactical Air Control Party (TACP) veterans, and military scholars to take on one of the most contentious debates in U.S. defense policy: should the A-10 Warthog be retired?

Drawing on combat experience from Iraq and Afghanistan, Pentagon planning, and military history from World War II to Ukraine, the panel makes a clear case that retiring the A-10 isn’t about obsolescence—it’s about priorities. They break down what close air support (CAS) actually requires, why multi-role fighters like the F-35 cannot replace a dedicated CAS platform, and what is lost when institutional knowledge and CAS culture disappear.

This is a ground-truth conversation about war as it is actually fought—low, slow, close, and unforgiving—and why the A-10 still matters in an era of great-power competition.

Steve Call — Former B-52 pilot, Pentagon strategist, military historian, author of Danger Close

Nathan Bachand — Former TACP, Air National Guard, PhD historian, founder of the TACP Foundation

Conan Higgins — Former TACP with 25 years of service, former law enforcement officer, PhD in international law, author on crisis leadership

What the A-10 was actually designed to do—and why that mission still exists

The difference between dedicated CAS and “CAS as a checkbox”

Why speed, stealth, and altitude don’t replace loiter time, visibility, and survivability

The limits of the F-16 and F-35 in real close-air-support scenarios

CAS as an offensive enabler, not just a defensive backstop

Lessons from World War II, Korea, Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan, Ukraine, and Taiwan war games

Why drones and light attack aircraft are not true A-10 replacements

Institutional incentives, budget priorities, and the Air Force–Army divide

What ground troops lose when CAS culture disappears

Close Air Support is not obsolete—it has been deprioritized

No existing aircraft replaces the A-10’s combination of survivability, loiter time, and firepower

CAS requires people, culture, and repetition, not just sensors and software

Future wars will still put soldiers in the mud—and they will still need air support they can trust

“You can atomize terrain from the air forever—but if you want to keep it, you put young men in the mud.”

“The sound of the A-10 gun is the hand of God saying: don’t worry, I’ve got you.”

“If the F-35 had outperformed the A-10, you’d already know about it.”

CAS — Close Air Support

TACP — Tactical Air Control Party

JTAC — Joint Terminal Attack Controller

FACA — Forward Air Controller (Airborne)