The Afternoon Ramble Archive

WLIW-FM’s Brian Cosgrove speaks with Michael Timmins of the Cowboy Junkies as the band celebrates more than 40 years together. Timmins reflects on the making of the landmark The Trinity Session, the evolution of his songwriting, the band’s enduring original lineup, and the stories behind some of their most memorable recordings. He also shares exciting news about a new Cowboy Junkies album expected in March 2027.

See the Cowboy Junkies at the Tillis Center on November 12.

Brian Cosgrove: I'm Brian Cosgrove and the Cowboy Junkies are coming back to Long Island on Thursday the 12th to the Tillis Center at CW Post College to celebrate, believe it or not, which is their 40th anniversary. And you can go to tilliscenter.org for tickets. And hopefully there's maybe a few left. Last time I checked, it looked like it's definitely going to sell out by Thursday the 12th. But you can go to tilliscenter.org to get tickets and information. And it is my pleasure, what a thrill, to have Michael Timmons from the Cowboy Junkies on the phone. Thank you for your time, Michael.

Michael Timmins: Absolute pleasure.

BC: Oh, it's great to talk to you. So 40 years. Holy cow.

MT: I think we're we're now coming 40 years and beyond.

BC: Yeah, that's what that's what you're calling it, right? Forty years and beyond. Yeah, exactly. I think, you and me are just about maybe exactly the same age. And, I remember when I was a kid and, my parents and folks would say, enjoy it. it's going to go over like that. And it is like a blink of the eye, 40 years.

MT: It sure is.

BC: Absolutely. So this is the band, which is no small feat on its own, is the original lineup for the past 40 plus years.

MT: That's correct. Yeah, the four of us is me, my sister Margot, brother Pete, and Alan Anton Bass, who's been a friend of mine for ours for longer than Pete's been alive. So he's basically a brother.

BC: And you know, one of the many things I love about the Cowboy Junkies, Michael, is that when you guys, I love your original stuff, but when you guys do somebody else's song, you put your own stamp on it, which is an extraordinary thing, it absolutely is. And when you guys started, and I don't have to tell you, you're well aware of it, in 86, your first album, your very first album, was outside of 1 original. It was all covers. And then the breakthrough, of course, which is such an extraordinary album and just gets better with time, in my opinion, was 1988's The Trinity Session, where there was a few more originals, but some extraordinary cover songs that you did on that. is such a milestone album for so many music fans. Michael, does that bring you back to the day, that one day that you recorded that album? Can you remember that fairly vividly?

MT: Yeah, I mean that's, you know, as I was saying, a lot of my memories have left, you know, it's kind of frustrating, but that day was pretty, obviously very important to us, but also even at the time it was extremely relevant because it was such an amazing day from a musician point of view where, you know, a whole bunch of us gathered in a church and with no expectation, and, you know, just as an experiment, really, and it all came together on that day, which we recorded training session, and we knew it did, you know, we knew it came together. While we were performing, playing during those 12 hours or so that we were in the church, we knew something special was happening. We didn't know whether it was going to be captured on tape, and we certainly didn't expect others to hear it or to know about it or whatever, but From a personal point of view, for the six, seven, eight, I guess 10 musicians who were participating in that day, it was very, very special. Musicians will tell you that you're always searching for that show or that session where everything comes together and everything just seems to sort of mailed into one and it all was searching for that. And that was one of those days and we just very fortunately had Peter Moore recording it and and that's that's the journey session. So yes, I have lots of very vivid memories of that day for sure.

BC: Yeah. I mean, that's one of those albums, I think, not only for me, but for a lot of folks that I remember getting it. I remember putting it on for the first time and like, and just like being like, whole, I've never heard anything like this before. was just elated and I probably you know I probably listened to that album for a month straight when I first got it because it was yeah go ahead.

MT: Good well it's funny you know when we because the way that was recorded it was it's live off the floor in this church and is recorded to two-track and I don't get too much too in the weeds but that means that basically what what we recorded that day is the album there's no there's no post-production there's no mixing there's no editing there's no adding instrumentation So when we walked out of the church that day, we had the album in our pocket, and we went home, and the next morning, the next day, we sort of put it on, you know, realizing we had a great day, but what do we have here on tape? And we were sort of like you. It was like, holy, holy, holy moly. We got it, we captured it. And again, we didn't know that other people would hear that, but from our point of view, it was like, wow. And we ourselves, you never do this with your own music, you know. You quickly tire of your own stuff. We couldn't stop listening to it because it didn't sound like us. It was so utterly, so otherworldly and outside of our own bodies that day that it sounded like another band, like we were listening to somebody else. So we had the same reaction, which was kind of interesting, and I guess a lot of people did, which was good.

BC: However, initially, I didn't, look at the real details. Now, since then, I've come to realize that it's called the Trinity Session, one session, right? So, I didn't realize that, it was done in one day in a church. And, I mean, these are, and the covers that you do on the Trinity Session, I mean, you're handling Hank Williams, Robert Johnson, Lou Reed's Sweet Jane, which is, I mean, this is, stuff that, you want to do it justice. And you guys, not only did you do it justice, but you made it your own. which is so extraordinary. And it's such a great, great record. And I just want to remind folks, it's our pleasure to have Michael Timmons of the Cowboy Junkies on the phone. They're returning to Long Island on Thursday, the 12th of November to the Tillis Center at CW Post College. You can go to tilliscenter.org for more information. And one of the things, Michael, that must have been a real, when you heard that Lou Reed was glowing about your cover, because he was a tough, he was a tough critic, Lou Reed.

MT: Definitely, yeah. He wasn't the type to give a compliment. Yeah, when I get somebody to come and reach out to him and send it to him and He got back with a with a straight four, but, you know, I think I think it was the best, the best version I've ever heard. Yeah, that was good enough. So we, we, we, we take this couple of times after that, but the first time we've had been told us that I'm losing.

BC: I'm losing you a little bit again, unfortunately. Yeah, a little bit better. Yeah, I'm sorry. Yeah. I mean, you're, are you up at home up in Canada?

MT: Yeah, I'm in Canada.

BC: Okay, yeah, so I'm on the East End of Long Island. So there's going to be a little bit of snafus. Folks have to put up with it, I hope. So I certainly will. I have no problem with it. But yeah, I mean, when Lou Reed, you know, gave you the thumbs up and you added the other chorus to it as well, I mean, I mean, how much better does that get?

MT: That was one of the reasons he liked it so much because we put that bridge back in there and which had been taken out when he recorded Sweet Jane with the Velvet Underground. He quit the band halfway through that album and they ended up taking that bridge out because nobody in the band liked it, so they had edited it out. But we had heard it on a live record, so we liked it, so we put it back in. So he was very happy because then he said, now I can play the bridge again and people don't wonder what the hell's going on.

BC: I know, he was, he wasn't happy at all with the Loaded album. He was very resentful. Yeah, he was very resentful about that. And my goodness, I don't have to tell you, you're the last person I have to tell, but you know, your sister Margo to me is like, I stopped editing my tracks whenever I hear her sing. She's like, you know, Roy Orbison or Patsy Cline or, you know, I mean, what a voice, you know. Yeah, she's so extraordinary. So the Trinity Session album comes out You guys start to get noticed. It's a big breakthrough for you guys. And again, it's probably a touch more covers than originals. But then the third album comes out, which is a tremendous album. And I love all your stuff, but the Caution Horses come out. And this is where, Michael, your songwriting, I mean, it's like you just hit the ground running. It seems to me with the songwriting, was songwriting something that you had been, I would imagine you'd been working on, but when the caution horses came out, like sun comes up, it's Tuesday morning, cheap is how I feel, those songs are extraordinary.

MT: Well, thank you. Yeah, you know, I'd always like writing and words and poetry and that, so, and I'd kind of, in an earlier band, I'd done some songwriting, but with the Junkies, you know, the initial idea was just, you know, to do a lot of covers. I'd sort of fallen away from writing songs and kind of got a bit disillusioned, I guess, with the state of music, so we had thought of You know, with the first record, we brought in all the blues covers, you know, so we wanted to go sort of move back in time. And with Trinity, when we discovered the country music, you know, sort of really got into it, then that sort of really sparked my interest in writing songs because obviously, you know, especially classic countries writers and singers were very much into very, you know, pretty great songwriting. So that sort of got me back into it and I went from there.

BC: Yeah, you absolutely did. You absolutely did go from there, Michael, because then, we go from, and I can't, you have too many albums and we don't have enough time. I wish we did, but, and then you go to Black Eyed Man and that, I mean, holy smokes. So personally, I mean, you must have been like, where are these coming from? Were you, I've heard many songwriters of your caliber say, you know, I'm kind of just like a conduit. they just come through me. Is it was that is that happen more than not or is it kind of strenuous strenuous for you or a combination?

MT: I think it's a combination, I think it's part part part of a discipline of writing, writing a lot and focusing on especially back in those days. That's all I did. You know, this is pre-family, pre-kids. So there's a lot of time involved. And even now, when I go to write, I focus solely on writing. I kind of get away from my life and try and rent or go to a place in the country or somewhere where I'm not going to be bothered. I have nothing else to think about but songwriting. So there's an element of discipline and and focus and then and then you hope for you hope for a few things to fall on you from the sky as well.

BC: I think it's been a pretty good combination so far. So I'm certainly grateful for what you've given us so far in these 40 plus years. A quick reminder, if you're just joining us, it's our pleasure to have Michael Timmons of the Cowboy Junkies on the phone. They're returning to Long Island on Thursday, the 12th of November. They're coming to CW Post College, the Tillis Center. If there are any tickets left at this point go to Tillis Center.org and again they're celebrating their 40th anniversary and beyond so you recently I know you're you go way back with Blue Rodeo and they recently celebrated their 40th anniversary right yeah.

MT: Exactly yeah we sort of even before their blue rodeo and before we were cabbage junkies we shared rehearsal space and equipment and So on the Toronto music scene, we've been sort of locked with them for a long time. And Greg, one of the Greg Keeler, one of the two founders, we go to Montreal and he was friends of my older brother. So, you know, I played a lot of ball hockey with him and so I've known him forever as well.

BC: Gotcha. Yeah, because, you know, I was as I was preparing to talk to you, I'm looking and I'm like, I know that you guys knew Blue Rodeo, you know each other. And I'm and I called up the first album on whatever it was, Wikipedia. and the photo credit for the first album goes to Jim Cuddy.

MT: That's right, that's right. Yeah, they were just, yeah, I forgot about that. That's true. Yeah, he was at the time he was working in the... In the film industry, we all had other jobs and working on the music, and he was an art director, so he had access to a Polaroid camera. So, we were at somebody's pool party, I think, and he just took pictures all day, and we liked how ugly the pictures were.

Brian Cosgrove

Oh my goodness, this is showing our age because I know what a Polaroid camera is, but I don't know how many. Yeah, everybody younger than 40 or 50 might not know that, but that is such a great, great story I love blue rodeo as well so as I do cowboy junkies so look I don't want to put you on the spot here Michael because man I'm kind of doing that but I mean you just you came out with an album in 2023 do you think there's any new music that might be percolating or coming around the bend or.

Michael Timmins

I actually just mixed the last song of our new record yesterday.

Brian Cosgrove

Oh my gosh so I'm glad I asked.

Michael Timmins

Yeah so it'll help you know I think we're aiming at a March release so yeah so there's a new record on the way.

Brian Cosgrove

Okay, so maybe we'll see it by early mid next year.

Michael Timmins

Yeah, I think March, March-ish, that's way more from March 2027.

Brian Cosgrove

Okay, and I would, so I would imagine that this, as you celebrate your, so far, your 40 years, you're going to, you're going to cover the span from day one right up until the most recent, which came out. Good.

Michael Timmins

We might even throw a couple of I've summed up the new record in there, so, we try and keep everything, our concerts, we don't, we try and touch on every era, and obviously there's always a healthy dose of Trinity in there, 'cause that's a Trinity sessions, that's an important record. Sure. And then we try and throw one or two unexpected things in there as well. And so it's a very wide spanning, it goes through our whole catalog or show these days. And it's different every night pretty much because we have a lot of songs. But we have to keep ourselves interested as well.

BC: Yeah, right. And again, in the same category, not putting you on the spot, do you have time to listen to newer artists or bands or is there anything, I mean, you're just coming off making a brand new record so you might have been absorbed in that but do you listen to newer music or are you listening to older music of any kind right?

MT: I generally use my when I'm listening to music I'm listening to stuff that that is, but that is, I know, it moves me in a certain way, so I'm not searching anymore as I once were.

BC: I mean, I got to tell you, Michael, really, and I mean this from the heart, and I don't want, I told you I can be a little bit geeky because I'm such a huge fan of you and the band, is that your songs, the imagery, and the emotions that they evoke. And, I mean, there's dozens of songs that really get, the old saying when I listen to you guys is, what comes from the heart reaches the heart. And I get that from Cowboy Junkies. And I thank you.

MT: Oh, thank you. Thanks for saying that.

BC: Well, thank you for making all this music for all this time and beyond. Again, the Cowboy Junkies are coming to Long Island on the 12th. It's a Thursday of November. The Tillis Center at CW Post Tillis Center.org if there's any tickets left. So Michael, the song, it's kind of obvious. I mean, I could spend days thinking about the song I wanted to go out with because I'm such a big fan of the Cowboy Junkies, but I figured I'd go with the most obvious song and that's Anniversary Song. Okay. All right. So Michael Timmons of Cowboy Junkies, thank you for your time.

MT: Thank you.

Afternoon Ramble with Brian Cosgrove 7 days a week at Noon on 88.3 88.7 & 96.9 WLIW - FM serving Long Island & Southern New England Listen live online or to recent archived shows on your own schedule wliw.org/radio or the wliw-fm free app.

Afternoon Ramble with Brian Cosgrove 7 days a week at Noon on 88.3 88.7 & 96.9 WLIW - FM serving Long Island & Southern New England Listen live online or to recent archived shows on your own schedule wliw.org/radio or the wliw-fm free app.

Afternoon Ramble with Brian Cosgrove 7 days a week at Noon on 88.3 88.7 & 96.9 WLIW - FM serving Long Island & Southern New England Listen live online or to recent archived shows on your own schedule wliw.org/radio or the wliw-fm free app.

Joe Lauro is a true jack-of-all-trades. When he's not producing American Grooves Radio Hour for WLIW-FM, his love of music and music history manifests in leading his band The Hoodoo Loungers and now producing music documentaries. He recently produced "Newsport & the Great Folk Dream" with Director Robert Gordon. The film won the Social Impact Award and was the closing film for the Long Island Music & Entertainment Hall of Fame Film Festival.

He joined Brian Cosgrove on the air to talk about making the documentary, the film festival, and more.

Brian Cosgrove hosts a live broadcast from the Grandstand Stage, featuring Jay Shepard and Jake Lear & The Kings.

Afternoon Ramble with Brian Cosgrove 7 days a week at Noon on 88.3 88.7 & 96.9 WLIW - FM serving Long Island & Southern New England Listen live online or to recent archived shows on your own schedule wliw.org/radio or the wliw-fm free app.

Afternoon Ramble with Brian Cosgrove 7 days a week at Noon on 88.3 88.7 & 96.9 WLIW - FM serving Long Island & Southern New England Listen live online or to recent archived shows on your own schedule wliw.org/radio or the wliw-fm free app.

Afternoon Ramble with Brian Cosgrove 7 days a week at Noon on 88.3 88.7 & 96.9 WLIW - FM serving Long Island & Southern New England Listen live online or to recent archived shows on your own schedule wliw.org/radio or the wliw-fm free app.

Afternoon Ramble with Brian Cosgrove 7 days a week at Noon on 88.3 88.7 & 96.9 WLIW - FM serving Long Island & Southern New England Listen live online or to recent archived shows on your own schedule wliw.org/radio or the wliw-fm free app.