If the route to longevity is to be bendable into the music industry’s rules for success, The Lumineers really shouldn’t be here at all. It makes no sense. Their stripped back, rootsy ‘Americana’ (if that’s what we can call it) took hold for reasons not usually listed in the music industry rulebook. Instead, their unlikely ascendancy into the realms of being a major league band, by any measure, has happened through the real route to success: trial and error, hard graft, writing songs from the heart and performing them with vulnerability. And yes, when that led to big breaks, like supporting U2 on the massive anniversary tour for The Joshua Tree, they didn’t blow it. 

You don’t have to be a phenomenon but do have to be a pro. In today’s music business, you can’t phone in the work and expect a career in return. 

Wesley Schultz and Jeremiah Fraites have thought about it all, a lot. They know their strengths and weaknesses, their inspirations, and how to tap them. Tom Petty, Neil Young, Leonard Cohen and Radiohead are there in the mix. Indeed, you could say that The Lumineers self-awareness seems to be the real root of their ultimate success and longevity. That, and treating the work as sacred. As Fraites puts it:

“Even to make one song is impossible. It’s so much work. One song is already a pain in the ass, before you talk about doing a full LP.”

As Fraite’s friend and British booking agent Alex Bruford told him once “everybody wants Radiohead’s career”. And it’s a truism. The artist who doesn’t compromise creatively, can take a 180 degree turn if they want to, can meld their influences but render those as something unique to them. Artists that can call on the tradition of the song but dress it in different ways, adding something to the DNA of popular music. And do it all with success and recognition, and no need for hype. Dignity intact. 

It’s likely then, that a new generation of artists and bands coming up in today’s fractured and frantic music business, bands that really want success but don’t want to be moulded by the industry like plasticine, 

might just be telling themselves that they want a career like The Lumineers. 

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This episode is brought to you in collaboration with War Child. 

This is a special episode of The Art of Longevity celebrating vinyl and the ongoing importance of vinyl and the album form to artists and to music fans. 

In this short audio documentary you’ll hear some thoughts and stories from renowned musicians like Ben Folds, Gaz Coombes, Interpol, Laura Veirs, Alela Diane, Crowded House, Eels, Ron Sexsmith, Tindersticks, Feeder, Goo Goo Dolls, John Grant and Brett Anderson of Suede. 

The Art of Longevity returns shortly, meanwhile please listen and DONATE to War Child NOW! 

Thank you for listening and donating. 

For more visit https://www.songsommelier.com/artists-on-vinyl-documentary-1

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There are always some central pillars to a great party playlist - songs that just work. One of those is the Joan As Police Woman song Holy City. The song is always an instant hit at parties, guaranteed to elicit excitable inquiries as to “who is this?”. That instant reaction. The song is a #1 hit in my family - one of those multi-generational family life tracks.

But if Holy City is instantly likeable, with a great beat and a strong poppy hook, it’s somewhat uncharacteristic of Joan’s music, which is mostly the opposite: seductive slow burns that take their time to become loved. It’s what Joan herself refers to as the eternal quandary of a life making alternative and original songs in today’s music business.

“A lot of people are just really busy and they don’t have time to figure out what this incredible new music is that might require 10 listens until you’re hooked”.

Then again, after some time away from Joan’s music, it was another of her singles that I was immediately drawn to, the smouldering, unhurried jazzy ballad Full Time Heist, from her new album Lemons, Limes and Orchids. This song, written as a cynical ode to one of life’s chancers, is my song of 2024 and enters into the canon of my all time favourite songs. That’s two for Joan and makes her increasingly one of my very favourite artists. 

Joan is the ultimate collaborator - entirely comfortable with creating in the moment no matter who she works with - and some of her collaborators have been bona fide music royalty, including Tony Allen, Rufus Wainwright and Damon Albarn (and also David Sylvian although their recording sessions have yet to see the light of day - something I only discovered after my chat with Joan). 

But an effective collaborator as she is, Joan makes her own records, literally. Right from the start her 2007 debut Real Life was entirely self-funded, subsequently shopped around to labels that would be willing to take it to market. She had a little bit of help for her first E.P. from - of all places an independent record shop in Derby, England. Indeed, store owner Tom Rose of Reveal Records created his own label just to get Joan’s first songs on the market. Tom happens to be Joan’s manager to this day. 

Going back through the catalogue, it is striking just how high the quality of Joan’s solo output is, most notably her stunning Sophomore record To Survive (2008), the ultra-cool collaboration with Tony Allen and Dave Okumu The Solution Is Restless (released during the pandemic in 2021). And now Lemons, Limes and Orchids - yet another creative high water mark for an artist whose songs have a classic, timeless quality. 

The obvious question is how does such an uncompromising, singula artist even survive in today’s content-flooded music business?

“I practice daily to avoid the whole ‘compare and despair’. Keep the focus on myself and make the best music I possibly can and then I’m a happy person”. 

If she is happy, we should be too - and lucky to have her making such wonderful music. 

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Of all the bands to grace our company on The Art of Longevity, Keane have ridden the music industry rollercoaster through all the stations of the cross: struggle, success, excess, disintegration and if you’re lucky - enlightenment. Tim Rice-Oxley doesn't hesitate for a moment:

“Yeah, absolutely. Our struggle was quite long and our disintegration was quite quick, although we clung on effectively for quite a while. I feel like now we are in a more positive and exciting place than the day before Hopes & Fears came out”.

It’s easy to forget in these days when the monoculture is a dot in the rear view mirror, that Keane really went huge: five consecutive number one UK albums (album six ‘Cause & Effect’ was number two). Their early success carried an unstoppable momentum. Yet behind the sheen of that success, as quickly as their second album ‘Under The Iron Sea’, the band was imploding - a combination of exhaustion and the pressure of heightened expectations causing an emotional disconnection between bandmates - a difficult thing to handle for old school friends.

Every band of longevity should make a book and/or a film. It’s what fans in today’s crowded music landscape deserve really - the scarcity of access to the inner circle, whether that’s present or past. And for Keane themselves it sounds like the book has served a therapeutic purpose in a way.

“We’re insanely hard on ourselves, to the point where it’s not good. We’d find any feedback and take it as a stick to beat ourselves up with. But we’re finally at a point now where we can say that we are quite good at what we do, proud of our music and our place in the world”.

As Keane heads back into the studio next year, the band is far better equipped than when they headed to Sanger’s French farmhouse 20 years ago to make their debut - both emotionally and technically. The only problem is that they have set the bar high when it comes to track record. The creative ambition and self-critical muscles of this band are no doubt twitching away.

“I know I’m going to have to write a lot of songs to get to the magic. One of the things bands struggle with is quality control - knowing the difference between what’s good and what’s great. There are millions of people out there trying to write songs as well so you have to raise your voice about everything else out there”.

On page 35 of the book Hopes & Fears: Lyrics and History are two lists on the page of a ring bound notepad, titled The OK Computer Test. 

“There’s no way we thought we were making the next OK Computer but you’ve got to try. You ask yourself “how do our heroes do it”. But if we knew then what we know now, we might have put ‘Somewhere Only We Know’ at number five instead of first”. 

For the next Keane record I suggest they apply “The Hopes and Fears Test”, just to make sure their new material is up to scratch. 

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What happens when you are a cult band (indeed when Pitchfork refers to you as “the ultimate cult band”) and you make the most accessible, most ‘mainstream’ album of your career?

It’s a relevant question for many bands these days, because emerging from cult status to the mainstream (what’s left of it) is a very valid path to longevity and success. Look at Nick Cave for example. He’s done alright.

But I can’t think of a better example right now, than Los Campesinos!

With All Hell, they have made the kind of record that can win over new fans, which isn’t easy on your 7th album. If we whisper it quietly, they may have even made a classic album.

Only time will tell, but for now the band is enjoying basking in a little bit of well deserved success, including an 8.5 on Pitchfork, hitting number 14 on the UK album chart and sold out UK venues - bigger ones than they have played before. Not quite a jump from cult status to daytime radio playlists, but nonetheless, progress. Los Campesinos! have just found a route to a larger audience.

“We’ve always looked for validation elsewhere, but to achieve the best reviews of our career and chart position [for All Hell] is very flattering and something we appreciate more now than at any other point in our career.”

It remains to be seen if the glut of year end ‘best albums of’ lists remember to include All Hell, if indeed they considered the record a suitable candidate. Well, it’s on my list. What’s more, the vinyl package is lovely (apart from the 45 RPM but we’ll let that one go for now). 

Nothing better though, than a band in the enlightenment phase:

“When we formed we were very much ‘indier than thou. Very pretentious. We were very prescriptive to what being in a band should be. Authenticity has always been very important to us but now, our approach to releasing music, playing live shows - we’ve become the band we always should have been. So now I can be smug!” 

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Artists have a duty to claim that their most recent project is the best work they have ever done. But what if it’s true? I’m so taken with David Gray’s new album Dear Life (released January 2025) - and so too is David of course - that it seemed churlish to dwell too much on his earlier career success, no matter just how definitive that was.

“I’m always all in with the new stuff. If I wasn’t I would just retire. It’s always a moment of total commitment. I like the danger of writing and recording. There is gold in them there hills and you have got to go and find it”.

Dear Life is led by rhythmic singing and short-story style writing, underpinned by unusual song arrangements. But the songs catch on, almost every one a ‘grower’. It’s one of those records that is shot-through with reflection, philosophy, mortality. You could say it’s a mid-life record and there is nothing wrong with that, given how well it stands up to his classic breakthrough work White Ladder and his first decade of popular success.

“I feel like these songs are strong enough to go shoulder to shoulder with the big songs”.

His instincts this time around, are good. When David Gray takes to the stage on his extensive 2025 tour to play songs like Leave Taking, Fighting Talk and (recent single) Plus & Minus, he will not need to precursor them with an apology.

The understated quality of the past 10 years' work is a run of form that may have gone unnoticed by the music industry mainstream, but also suggests that Gray has been building to a head of steam. If this was 2004, he would be releasing Dear Life into the world as a surefire classic album. But here we are in 2024 - algorithm powered and neck deep in social clips. Releasing a magnificent record into the content void of today guarantees nothing. Especially when you are running your own small record label as Gray now is.

“You’ve got to go on a cookery show just to get the opportunity to play a song for two minutes.” 

White Ladder was one of those CDs everybody had. It came at the end of the CD era, one of the last albums that achieved cultural ubiquity. Lest we forget, the record was self-funded (on a budget of £5,000) and self-released. Inventing a sub-genre is one thing, and with White Ladder, David Gray did that - folktronica was the label the music press attached to it. But there was much more to it than that. In a sense, Gray pioneered bedroom pop, 20 years before it became huge on Spotify. Rex Orange County, Yellow Days, Alfie Templeman and a whole generation of others owe something to him. But his huge success with White Ladder will always leave him with something to prove. 

“The disaprovers are waiting every time you do something new. But I’m a very determined person. But then I love doing what I do. There is no trout farm for me. I just love doing this thing. And it’s getting richer and richer. There is always more to put into song”. 

He is literally making music for Dear Life. It shows. 

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My guest for this pilot episode is Gale Paridjanian of (the magnificent) Turin Brakes.

If you listen to the song Underdog (Save me) by Turin Brakes, it will tell you a lot about how Gale plays and what he brings to a song with his guitar playing. Gale is an underrated and understated guitar god - as all Turin Brakes fans know. Olly Knights, singer in Turin Brakes describes Gales playing as “the real deal since the very beginning", and also “band cheat code” which Gale & I explore further in this conversation.

Gale's choice of guitar is a Charvel electric-acoustic model from his days working in the acoustic department of one of the music shops in London’s famous Denmark Street, for which he paid something like £469 (roughly £1,200 in today’s money).

“It’s got my sound in it. If you plug it in it just sounds like The Optimist and that’s our sound. It’s a battle to play but there’s something about how it sounds when it’s recorded. It sounds like me”.

An inexpensive one-off model, in Gales hands, the Charvel became the signature sound for Turin Brakes - Gales says “it feels more honest the more acoustic we are” - and it’s true - the band were pioneers of the acoustic-led pop that followed, paving the way for singer-songwriters like Newton Faulkner, even Ed Sheeran. But Gale and the band are on fire, still. 

His own influences include The Stones, Chuck Berry, Chris Whitley and Derek Trucks. 

Gale plays some of his own and Turin Brakes fans’ favourite pieces - a lot from the band’s debut LP The Optimist - and tells stories of the band, his own life as a guitar player and the Charvel he holds dear, even if it is falling apart. Let’s hope he gets it serviced soon. 

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When I heard the Chilly Gonzales song Neoclassical Massacre, I immediately got in touch with his management and label to get Gonzo on the Art of Longevity. Not only are his views on AI and background music incisive, but Gonzo has some strong opinions about the music industry and the modern culture in which it operates.

The ever-evolving tension between creativity and commerce has been a career-long exploration for Gonzo. It makes him the perfect guest for The Art of Longevity. Indeed, his own career has been a perfect metaphorical rollercoaster of ups and downs. After a few years on the scene as an alternative/performance artist (which he very much is right now) he had surprise success with a quiet piano instrumental album Solo Piano (2004). Only to follow up with a full-on 70s influenced pop album, launching a brief and unspectacular phase as a major label pop artist.

“That first Solo Piano surprise success was a foundational moment in encouraging me to continue to take risks. When and if I wanna go back there it will be a very beautiful thing, so long as I am doing it for the right reasons, there is something fluffy and safe about it for me.”

As for the pop record Soft Power, it became his “misunderstood masterpiece”, demonstrating very nicely that you can always make failures part of your narrative after the fact.

“It became an opportunity for me to make it a retrospective part of my mythology - injecting a bit of drama to my career”.

Fluffy and safe isn’t a typical Chilly Gonzales career choice. Indeed, on the new self-titled album, he returns to his alternative origins, rapping on most tracks. And without doubt, he is a scholar of Rap - not only on a musical level, but on a cultural level. Rap seems more influential on his career than his impeccable classical training. No other musician I can think of blends the two in such an inimitable way. As such, on new album Gonzo, the songs come across as both avant garde and yet hugely entertaining at the same time.

“The best works of art will always function on a superficial level that brings you in - everybody is on the same page now - we are all trying to succeed by having a catchy song that can live on 20 second snippets on TikTok but artists who are doing it at the highest levels are still managing to sneak in a deeper artistic meaning or holding up a mirror to society. “Billie Eilish, Chappell Roan or Melanie Martinez…you can tell their goal is for their music to exist on both levels…that’s something that Rap gifted culture”.

It also gifted us Chilly Gonzales and for that we are eternally grateful. 

The full interview write-up is on https://www.songsommelier.com/

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In this day & age of abundance, you can easily forget what’s precious - like your favourite bands. If you are anything like me the question “what’s your favourite band” now has an official top 40. As in I have a rolling 40 favourite bands. Making a welcome return to the top 40 is Nada Surf, the ‘New York’ (now firmly remote) indie band that first hit my favourites list way back in 2005.

I always remember how I discovered a band, in the case of Nada Surf it was on a Mojo or Uncut free “covermount” CD (do they still do those?). The track “Do It Again” from The Weight Is A Gift Album (2005) has one of my all-time favourite basslines. Indeed, in our Art of Longevity chat, Matthew Caws and myself ended-up riffing on a playlist of pop songs in which the first thing you hear is the bass line. If playlists were still a thing, that would be a good one. It was a pleasant digression from the important matter of surviving the music industry.

Nada Surf is one of those bands that’s easy to forget about when music is so abundant and that would be a big mistake. Stumbling upon a new Nada Surf record every 4-5 years is a highly recommended balm for modern day life. I can’t think of many bands (or in the case of Matthew Caws, songwriters) who provide the soundtrack to fumbling through life in the way we sometimes do, especially if you recognise the traits of attention deficit, as Matthew does - the origin and subject of the band’s superb new song ‘In Front of Me Now’, which I have adopted as a theme tune for the time being. In my head, if you will, this song is a number #1 hit single.

Over the years, Matthew’s subject matter for Nada Surf’s songs covers life’s day to day tribulations, the mangled thought processes that cycle through our brains and how to see light from the dark patterns that surround us. We are essentially keeping Matthew company as his life has played out.

“Most of the time a song is just impressionistically how I’m feeling”. 

Nada Surf is one of those bands that made their way through a 30-year career and nine studio albums without disturbing the charts. Yet the band has never made a bad record and indeed Matthew, modest to a fault, is somewhat coerced into being proud of never making a dud album.

“It has felt great in terms of longevity for a very long time. Unbelievably when we were making The Proximity Effect (the sophomore album in 1998) most of the bands that we toured with had broken up and we were sticking together. That felt unusual”.

Whether new album Moon Mirror will change the trajectory for Nada Surf remains to be seen of course, although it’s unlikely. That’s just the modern music landscape in the streaming era. Perhaps what matters more, is that not only is the new album very much not a dud, but one of the best indie sets you are likely to hear in 2024. And that’s saying something, since guitars and indie bands are back in fashion, albeit the modern kind i.e. a new crop of cult bands. Let’s hope some of this new crop of indie guitar bands can stay the course the way Nada Surf has done. Turns out surfing on nothing can be a lasting pastime. 

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In Mark Oliver Everett’s autobiography “Things The Grandchildren Should Know”, the author, otherwise known as E, the frontman and band leader of Eels, wrote of Bob Dylan’s self-proclaimed destiny as a musician:

“I wish I had something like that, but I didn’t. At all. All I had was an aching sense of desperation. I didn’t have any idea what the hell I was doing and was only doing it out of not knowing what else to do”.

Despite this, or perhaps because of it, E simply continued to keep on keeping on with music, leaving his home in Virginia to seek his ‘lack of destiny’ in Los Angeles. Low and behold, he wound up being signed to a major label - not once but twice - and at the second bite of the cherry, found significant and lasting success.

No wonder then, E suggests we rename this particular episode as “The Unconscious Art of Longevity”.

Some 23 years after signing his first solo record deal, E has found his way to a 15th Eels studio L.P., the aptly named Eels Time! Recorded in Los Feliz, Los Angeles and Dublin, Ireland, the album was made by the current line-up of E himself, Little Joe (Drums), Koool G Murder (bass) and The Chet (guitar), featuring Irish folk musician Sean Coleman and new collaborator Tyson Ritter (on five songs). Ritter is the lead vocalist, bassist, pianist, and songwriter of the rock band The All-American Rejects but is better known these days as an actor. In a twist typical of the Eels story however, Ritter - who on this occasion was connected to E by his manager - turned out to live close by. But The All-American Rejects shared the same label as Eels (Dreamworks) back in the early 90s. Almost two decades on, Ritter was finally reeled into Eels orbit.

It’s a microcosmic example of Eels' career story - a series of unplanned events driven by E’s whims - whatever he felt like doing at the time - a series of creative zigzag turns that often turned out for the best through luck or dare I suggest…a more similar destiny to Bobby Dylan’s than he once believed.

“I’ve been doing it so long now that everyone pretty much leaves me alone. I don’t tell the label I’ve made a record until after it's mastered and finished. I pay for the whole thing myself to have the freedom of nobody putting their two cents in”.

So in some ways yes, E’s career has been “The Unconscious Art of Longevity”. But look deeper and all the signs are there - the self-belief, single-mindedness and willingness to follow his own instincts and obsessions - these factors have underpinned Eels’ journey and kept the wheels connected to the rails. And each and every one of those 15 albums has a lot to offer

“It’s all a miracle to me that I still get to make music as my job. I’m lucky, but you have to get yourself in the best position to receive it when luck strikes”. 

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