The Branding Laboratory

What happens when you stop going to conferences for the content, and start going for the conversations in the lobby? That question became the foundation for one of the most exclusive entrepreneur networks in the world. Hollis Carter, Founder of Baby in the Bathwater, built a sold-out, decade-old community of seven- and eight-figure founders by scratching his own itch.

What You'll Learn:

1: Why curating the room matters more than curating the content — and how Hollis's "current is strong" philosophy keeps the culture intact at scale

2: How to identify the three levels of community participation and why the third level is where the real business breakthroughs happen

3: The hard lesson Hollis learned about "bettering vs. biggering" and how it applies to your business decisions right now

4: Why early entrepreneurial success without the process often leads to self-sabotage — and how to build the experience base that makes success stick

5: How to develop personal core values before your business demands them from you (most founders learn this far too late)

6: The leadership move that transformed Hollis's team meetings: speaking last, and why it creates better outcomes every time

About the Guest: Hollis Carter is the founder and CEO of Baby in the Bathwater, a private membership community and event series for founders in the grow-and-scale phase of their business. He began his entrepreneurial journey at 12, growing a lawn business before he had a driver's license, and has since bootstrapped multiple companies to seven figures across industries including publishing, software, and real estate. Baby in the Bathwater has been running for over a decade with a waitlisted, referral-only membership.

TIMESTAMPS:

00:00 — Introduction & Welcome to The Branding Laboratory

02:30 — Devo on finding Baby in the Bathwater and why it blew him away

04:00 — Hollis's origin story: from dyslexic kid with a lawnmower to serial entrepreneur

08:00 — The accidental birth of Baby in the Bathwater

10:30 — The lobby theory: why conversations beat content at every conference

13:00 — How Hollis decided to manufacture serendipity

15:30 — Defining the community: who Baby in the Bathwater actually serves

19:00 — New app launch, membership model, and the decade-long journey

21:00 — Attention span vs. passion: why Hollis is in year 10 and still fired up

23:00 — The three levels of community participation and competitive giving

28:00 — What collaborative leadership actually looks like in practice

31:00 — How Hollis defines leadership (and why it's not a canned answer)

36:00 — Hollis's single superpower: curating and connecting

39:00 — Nature vs. nurture: how Baby in the Bathwater built its culture

43:30 — Working on yourself before working on your business (Jim Rohn principles)

47:00 — Personal values as a leadership foundation

53:00 — Core values Hollis lives by: bettering, saying nice things, and doing what you say

58:00 — Final gift: why experience is the only thing that matters

Connect with Hollis Carter: https://babybathwater.com/

About The Branding Laboratory:

A podcast hosted by Deevo that brings together entrepreneurs, leaders, and brand builders to explore what it takes to break free from uninspiring systems, build a genuine personal brand, and lead with purpose. Visit thebrandstoryteller.com to learn more. Subscribe so you never miss a conversation. New episodes drop regularly.

What does it take to build a brand in a category that barely exists yet? Milan Martin walked away from 20 years in advertising, including work on some of the world's most recognized campaigns, to found Free Spirits, a company making non-alcoholic spirits for people who love cocktails, not people trying to quit drinking.

That distinction matters. Free Spirits isn't a sobriety brand, but a choice brand, built for drinkers who want to stay in the room, enjoy the ritual, and skip the regret later on.

In this episode, Deevo and Milan dig into what it really takes to introduce something new to a market that doesn't know it wants it yet. Milan shares the brand strategy behind 'Drink Like You Mean It,' how Free Spirits is disrupting a trillion-dollar alcohol industry without wagging a finger at it, and the near-death shipping disaster that almost killed the company in year one.

What You'll Learn:

• Why the biggest misconception about non-alcoholic spirits is who they're actually for
• How Milan positions a challenger brand against a deeply entrenched cultural narrative around alcohol
• The 'and not or' philosophy that shapes everything from product strategy to marketing
• What actually drives brand loyalty (hint: it's not product, it's community and identity)
• How baby steps and compounding progress can take you further than a dramatic leap ever could

Connect with Milan:

Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/milanmartin/

Website: https://drinkfreespirits.com/

Instagram: @drinkfreespirits TikTok: @drinkfreespirits

What actually makes someone worth choosing in the modern dating landscape? In this episode of The Brand Laboratory, host Deevo sits down with Chelsko Thompson — known to her community as Chelsko — a relationship coach who helps men understand women, attraction, and themselves.Chelsko pulls zero punches.

From unpacking attachment theory to explaining why leading with desperation repels the very people you want to attract, she lays out a clear-eyed framework for what it takes to show up grounded, clear on your values, and genuinely ready for a healthy partnership.

Topics covered in this episode:

1: How Chelsko built her coaching practice from personal heartbreak and abuse recovery

2: The difference between anxious and avoidant attachment — and how to stop the cycle

3: Why asking the hard questions early isn't scary; it's efficient

4: The five values Chelsko looks for before she'll go on a first date

5: What men and women each need to do before they're actually ready to date

6: How social media is conditioning both sexes to chase the wrong signals

7: The masculine-feminine dynamic — what it looks like when it works.

Whether you're re-entering the dating world or trying to figure out why the same patterns keep showing up, this conversation will give you language for things you've been feeling but couldn't name.

Guest Bio:

Chelsko Thompson, known online as Chelsko, is a relationship coach, musician, and actor who built her practice the hard way: through two abusive relationships, years of self-work, and the realization that the best thing she could do with what she'd learned was stop giving it away for free. She specializes in helping men understand attraction, dating, and healthy relationship dynamics, and has built a community known for honest, direct conversation about modern dating. Her upcoming course, Unshakeable, guides men through the inner work of becoming the kind of person a high-quality partner is drawn to.

LISTEN / WATCH YouTube + all major podcast platforms.

Instagram: @chelskocoaching

Website: https://chirp.me/chelskonellie

Host: thebrandstoryteller.com

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Camilla Calberg flew in from Copenhagen to join Deevo on The Brand Lab — and she did not come to play small. A former BP and IBM executive turned emotional intelligence coach, Camilla helps high-performing women in the C-suite break through the internal glass ceiling that no amount of talent or grinding can dismantle on its own. In this episode, they unpack her origin story (a four-year divorce battle and courtroom nervous breakdown that changed everything), her 3-step Identity-Inspire-Influence framework, and the commercial challenge of packaging personal healing as a measurable business advantage. If you've ever felt like you were doing everything right but still not getting the seat at the table you deserve, this one is for you.

Episode Summary

Deevo sits down with Camilla Calberg, a Copenhagen-based emotional intelligence and leadership coach, to explore why so many high-achieving women in the corporate world still feel invisible, overlooked, and stuck — and what to do about it.

What You'll Learn

• How childhood wounds quietly shape adult behavior in the boardroom
• Why playing small is a learned behavior — and how to unlearn it
• The real difference between surviving and thriving after trauma
• How to position emotional intelligence as a strategic business tool
• Camilla's Identity → Inspire → Influence framework in action

Key Takeaways

1. The glass ceiling is both external (systemic) and internal (self-limiting belief). You have to address both.
2. Most high-performing women Camilla works with are in their mid-50s, have been headhunted, and still wonder why the CEO calls the EA instead of them.
3. The source code of playing small often traces back to childhood — specifically, not receiving enough unconditional love from a parent.
4. Camilla's 3-step program: Identity (limiting beliefs), Inspire (bold leadership behaviors), and Influence/Innovate (leading others from authenticity).
5. Lived experience is a legitimate credential — but it must be translated into client language, not just personal narrative.

Guest Bio

Camilla Calberg is a Copenhagen-based emotional intelligence and leadership development coach who helps high-performing women in the C-suite break through the internal glass ceiling holding them back. Drawing on 20 years in top-tier corporations including BP and IBM, and a deeply personal journey through a high-conflict divorce and court proceedings, Camilla developed a body-based, identity-first coaching approach that helps women leaders stop playing small and start claiming the influence they have already earned. Her clients are typically senior executives in their mid-50s who have achieved everything on paper — but know there's another level waiting.

Connect with Camilla

• Website: camillacalberg.com

This conversation between host and Nate Fochtman cuts straight to the intersection of personal transformation and professional leadership. Nate — a 17-year solopreneur in the adult beverage space, 3 years sober, and the founder of Free Mind Group — shares how his lived experience (rock bottom, sobriety, two divorces) became the operating system for how he coaches founders today.

The episode explores why culture problems almost always start at the top, how to actually diagnose them through a qualitative culture audit, and why the era of leadership masks is over. It's raw, honest, and practically useful for anyone leading a team or scaling a business.

Key Topics Covered

• The 'onion model' of founder coaching — how deep Nate goes based on client need
• Why Nate's 17-year business is still intentionally one-on-one, with no buffers between him and the client
• The culture audit process: 10–15 spontaneous probing questions, employees first, founder last
• The C-suite client who discovered mid-sessions he was only there for the paycheck
• Nate's personal journey: 21 years in alcohol, addictive personality, three years of sobriety
• Why recovery taught him more about leadership than any academic program
• The 'founders assume everyone is as passionate as them' problem — and how it dehumanizes teams
• The death of the corporate mask: same person at work, at home, everywhere
• How Nate's unfiltered LinkedIn newsletters went from dormant to 40K+ monthly organic views
• The masculine/feminine energy balance conversation — and why men are confused about how to show up

Guest Bio:

Nate Fochtman is the founder of Free Mind Group, a one-on-one founder coaching and brand strategy consultancy serving the adult beverage space and beyond. With 17 years as a solopreneur — and a personal journey through addiction, sobriety, and rebuilding — Nate helps founders, operators, and executives face what they've been avoiding: culture gaps, identity drift, and the human cost of growth. No textbooks. No checklists. Just real, situational leadership coaching rooted in lived experience.

Find Nate at fmgstrategy.com and @FreeMinNate on social media.

What if your burnout isn't a productivity problem — it's a design problem?

In Episode 87 of The Branding Laboratory, we sit down with Stefanie Carlstedt, a human design business coach and manifesting generator who spent years following every marketing tip, guru strategy, and morning routine she could find — only to lose herself completely in the process. She built a big business. Then she burned it down. Not because of failure, but because it was profoundly misaligned with who she is.

Now Stefanie helps entrepreneurs infuse their unique Human Design into their business strategy — their marketing, their messaging, their offers, and how they lead. The results? Clients who walk away with a completely different business model than the one they came in with — and one that actually works for them.

In this episode, we explore:

• What Human Design actually is — and how it differs from Enneagram, Myers-Briggs, or strengths finders
• The five energy types (generator, manifesting generator, projector, manifester, reflector) and what each means for how you work
• Authority: how you're designed to make decisions — and why leading with your mind is costing you clarity
• How Human Design acts as a GPS to your highest potential — not a box that limits you
• Why the burnout epidemic among entrepreneurs is a sign of design misalignment, not time management failure
• How to use your design to shape your marketing voice, business model, and team leadership
• The Chiron return, energy centers, and what makes two people born in the same place at the same time different

Whether you're a skeptic or already obsessed with Human Design, this episode will make you rethink how you're showing up — and why the most productive thing you can do might be to stop working the way everyone else does.

About The Guest

Stefanie Carlstedt is a human design business coach who helps entrepreneurs align their business strategy with their unique energetic design — so they can stop copying someone else's success and start building one that actually feels like them. Free Report: stefcarlstedt.com/hdreport

Get your free Human Design report + 10-part audio: stefcarlstedt.com/hdreport

🔗 Connect with Stefanie Carlstedt:

Website: stefcarlstedt.com

Free Report: stefcarlstedt.com/hdreport

What if the pressure you're running from is actually the thing that's supposed to build you? Alex Bolowich — elite mental performance coach and son of a legendary college soccer coach — spent four years at Creighton playing through injuries, online harassment, and a nervous system that shut down under pressure. That experience became his life's work.

Key Topics Covered

• Why mental performance isn't therapy — it's a trainable skill with real science behind it
• The performance identity trap that breaks athletes and entrepreneurs alike
• The 4 core mental skills: strength, flexibility, agility, and endurance
• How long real mental transformation takes: 90 days to feel it, 1 year to become it
• The car-and-driver analogy: why upgrading your team won't fix a broken driver

Alex Bolowich is an elite mental performance coach and founder of the Mental Edge program, helping high-performers build the mental foundation that no tactic can replace.

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You're putting in the work — the content, the social posts, the funnel. So why does marketing still feel like pushing a boulder uphill? In this episode, Deevo sits down with Kelly Schuknecht (Two Mile High Marketing) to get honest about what's really going on when marketing stops feeling light.

Topics Covered

• The 4-question framework for annual marketing reflection
• Why messaging confusion is the root cause most founders miss
• The marketing ≠ sales ≠ branding equation every founder needs to understand
• Positioning strategy: how to become the go-to expert in your space
• Real founder lessons: cashflow, team building, and hiring carefully

Kelly Schuknecht is the founder of Two Mile High Marketing, specializing in helping business owners and thought leaders find their authority X factor and build a marketing strategy that fits.

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What does it really take to build a business rooted in who you are — not just what you sell?

In this episode, host Deevo, Chief Experience Officer and Brand Storyteller, sits down with Scott Hogan, Founder of SaltWrap Company and author of Built from Broken, for a raw and reflective conversation that goes far beyond business strategy.

Scott opens up about the early injuries and personal struggles that shaped his path — and how his mother's approach to natural healing planted the seeds for a company built around therapeutic sports nutrition and long-term physical health. But this episode isn't just about building a brand. It's about building yourself first.

Together, Deevo and Scott explore what authentic leadership actually looks like in the day-to-day grind of running and scaling a company — how to protect your culture as you grow, how to stay anchored to your values when the pressure mounts, and why self-leadership is the foundation everything else is built on.

They also dive into fatherhood, personal growth, and the role that genuine communication and customer trust play in creating a brand that truly means something.

If you're a founder, a leader, or simply someone trying to build a life and business that reflects who you really are — this one is for you.

What does it take to build a brand from nothing—no inherited network, no industry experience, no AI buzzword on your pitch deck? Jennifer Millard, five-time founder and Maine Entrepreneur of the Year, chose to bet on water. Canned, local, and rooted in one of America’s most beloved states. This episode is a masterclass in conviction.

Key Topics

• The Rising Tides thesis and how Maine Love revives idle breweries
• Raising $2.2M without AI on the pitch—and why capital clarity matters
• Titles vs. real power: how Jennifer builds agile, agency-driven teams
• The 95 corridor growth strategy and the water economy thesis
• Exit optionality: ESOP, priced round, or cashflow dividend business

Jennifer Millard is the founder of Maine Love, a fast-growing canned water brand expanding down the East Coast. She has exited four previous companies, including a sale to MasterCard, and was named Maine Entrepreneur of the Year by Maine Business Magazine.

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