In this episode, hosts David Luy and Maurice Lee return with Dr. Michael Mawson to deepen the discussion on Dietrich Bonhoeffer’s understanding of the church and pastoral ministry. Building on themes from Sanctorum Communio and Life Together, they explore Bonhoeffer’s dialectical view of the church as both flawed and faithful, fractured yet held together in Christ.

Dr. Mawson reflects on Bonhoeffer’s theology of hope, his realism about church life, and how his ecclesiology equips pastors to remain grounded—even amid failure, tension, and the scandal of community. It’s a wide-ranging conversation on the mystery of Christ’s presence in the church, and what that means for ministry today.

Referenced in this episode: The Oxford Handbook of Dietrich Bonhoeffer, edited by Dr. Michael Mawson.