The CAFE team is taking a break from our usual programming this week to share another show we think you might like. 

It’s a show called “The Gray Area,” hosted by Sean Illing, that explores issues across culture, technology, politics, and the world of ideas, all through a philosophical lens. 

In the episode we’re about to share, Sean Illing and his guest, historian Edward Watts, discuss how America today feels a lot like ancient Rome…right before its empire collapsed. 

We hope you enjoy their conversation. You can listen to more of the show here.

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