Joseph Smith vs. Warren Jeffs: Polygamy, Power, and Mormonism’s Dark Legacy | Lindsay Hansen Park

On the Jaden Jeffs Podcast, Jaden interviews Mormon historian Lindsay Hansen Park about parallels between Joseph Smith and Warren Jeffs, arguing Mormon culture can normalize coercion by making leaders righteous and excusing abuse. They discuss Joseph Smith’s polygamy (including a 14-year-old), power consolidation in Nauvoo, sincerity versus manipulation, and how his death created martyrdom that helped Mormonism endure. Lindsay describes Mormonism as “catnip for predators,” cites patterns of obedience, complicity, and victim-perpetrator complexity, and compares LDS corporatization with fundamentalist attempts to restore early doctrines. They cover Brigham Young’s influence, the Mountain Meadows Massacre and historical cover-up, Porter Rockwell’s violence, debates over the Journal of Discourses, Adam-God doctrine, psychedelic/trance theories in early Mormon ecstatic experiences, and challenges of healing after leaving high-control religion. Lindsay plugs Sunstone, her upcoming book The Ballad of Juanita Brooks, and her podcasts.

FOLLOW LINDSAY HANSEN PARK
 Year of Polygamy Podcast: https://www.yearofpolygamy.com/
Sunstone Education Foundation: https://sunstone.org/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/lindsay_hansen_park/
Twitter): https://x.com/FemiLinzi

01:19 Meet Lindsay Hansen Park
 06:38 Joseph Smith vs Warren Jeffs
 09:59 Martyrdom and Legacy
 16:19 Victims and Perpetrators
 17:55 Polygamy Then and Now
 21:17 Occult Roots and Boredom
 25:05 Childhood Parallels
 31:37 Gold Plates and Confidence
 39:20 Joseph Smith Sincerity
 40:56 Warren Jeffs Psychology
 45:09 Complicity Shared Delusion
 48:11 Porter Rockwell Myth
 49:33 Joseph Smith Child Brides
 55:40 Predators and Mormon Culture
 01:11:01 Charisma and Primary Voice
 01:19:36 Brigham Young Guilty Pleasure
 01:23:31 Loving a Complicated Father
 01:25:09 Faithful Mormon Bad Manners
 01:25:50 Journal of Discourses Debate
 01:31:10 Mountain Meadows Responsibility
 01:37:46 John D Lee Survival Lore
 01:41:38 Polygamy Denial Conspiracies
 01:49:26 Rulon Jeffs Infiltration Theory
 01:55:26 Why Conspiracies Persist
 01:58:25 Adam God Doctrine Setup
 02:00:55 Brigham Young Origins
 02:02:41 Church Scrubs Doctrine
 02:04:52 Numbers And Polygamy
 02:07:08 Occult Numerology Roots
 02:11:26 Life After Mormonism
 02:30:01 Book And Farewell

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Emily Lee on Growing Up AUB, Abuse, Leaving Polygamy, and Rebuilding After Divorce | Jaden Jeffs Podcast

On the Jaden Jeffs Podcast, Jaden interviews Emily Lee, who was raised in the AUB (United Apostolic Brethren) with a father who had multiple wives and dozens of children and is now the group’s prophet. Emily describes severe anxiety, heavy childcare responsibilities from age eight, favoritism among wives, and physical abuse from her father and a favored wife, contrasting public appearances with private violence. She discusses AUB size, history, and how leadership uses rules, dress codes, and media restrictions to maintain control, including “recycling” women back into the group. Emily explains marrying at 17 to a non-AUB man, becoming an instant mother, enduring infidelity and trauma bonding, divorcing and remarrying him, and later divorcing again, plus ongoing therapy, PTSD, and rebuilding her identity.

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02:59 Growing Up AUB 04:37 Dad Behind Closed Doors 06:10 AUB Size And Image 12:05 Prophet Power Shift 19:29 Funeral And Burial Talk 22:07 Teen Years And School 30:18 Sneaky Romance Marriage 34:48 Trauma Bonded Marriage 45:38 Recycling Women Doctrine 50:59 First Divorce Escape Plan 55:14 Stepdaughter And Mom Guilt 01:00:04 Why They Reunited 01:00:56 Divorce and Coparenting 01:02:26 Remarriage Decision 01:06:30 Grief After Divorce 01:08:40 Faith After AUB 01:10:04 Dating and Red Flags 01:16:51 AUB Future and Polygamy 01:28:10 Identity After Cult 01:46:17 PTSD and Starting Over 01:53:14 Closing and Channel Plug

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Ex-Mormon Madison Sparkles on Purity Culture, Temple Anxiety, Mental Health & Leaving the LDS Church | Jaden Jeffs Podcast

On the Jaden Jeffs Podcast, ex-Mormon writer Madison Sparkles (Substack: Confessions of a 30-Year-Old Virgin) discusses growing up devout LDS in Iowa after moving from Utah, strict modesty and chastity expectations, bishop worthiness interviews, confusion around coffee vs. caffeine, and the pressures of Mormon dating and singleness. She describes serving as a temple worker, loving baptisms for the dead, but feeling intense anxiety during the endowment ceremony, including discomfort with temple clothing and symbolism. Madison recounts receiving a mission call to Daejeon, Korea, getting severely ill at the Provo MTC, coming home early with lasting stigma, and later leaving the church after worsening anxiety, depression, and scrupulosity, plus learning about the second anointing, LGBTQ issues, and troubling church history. She shares post-exit backlash, the fear of members wanting ex-members to fail, and her message to stop “shrinking.”

01:07 Podcast Introductions 02:28 Growing Up Mormon Iowa 04:46 Obedience And Rules 05:48 Coffee Caffeine Confusion 10:43 Modesty Shoulder Signals 12:31 Bishop Worthiness Interviews 18:03 Dating Marriage Pressure 20:04 Purity Culture Upsides 22:28 Masturbation Sex Education 25:22 Mission Call Korea 27:30 Height And Mormon Norms 39:57 MTC Training And Age Change 44:54 Missionary Surge Buzz 46:06 Church Mission Mindset 46:53 Everything Proves True 48:25 Sick Before Korea 53:31 Early Return Stigma 01:02:39 Trying to Go Back 01:07:12 Resentment and Rumors 01:09:59 Temple Devotion 01:14:45 Endowment Anxiety 01:21:18 Leaving and Scrupulosity 01:25:07 Scrupulosity and guilt 01:27:28 Grace never enough 01:29:48 ADHD and inspiration overload 01:32:33 Leaving makes you enemy 01:36:14 History cracks the shelf 01:37:45 Mental health breaking point 01:44:50 God said it’s okay 01:48:59 Second anointing shock 01:52:52 Joseph Smith parallels 01:55:08 Life after leaving 02:01:29 Purity culture fallout 02:06:47 Don’t shrink message 02:09:03 Breaking the cycle

Amelia Miles on Leaving the LDS Church: Shame, Women’s Inequality, Trauma, and Alleged Abuse Cover-Ups | Jaden Jeffs Podcast

On the Jaden Jeffs Podcast, Amelia Miles, a northern Utah mom of four raised in an orthodox LDS family in southern Utah, shares her experience leaving the church and the guilt, anxiety, and scrupulosity she says shaped her life. She discusses sheltered upbringing, learning to swear and drink without shame, cliquey Mormon culture, and marrying her husband in the temple in 2009 before later separating while both leave the church. Amelia describes being assaulted in high school and contrasts her parents’ support with stories of bishops blaming victims. She cites women’s inequality and her daughter’s bishop interview question about women leaders as major catalysts, and says researching “We Are the People” podcast led her to claims of church-related abuse cover-ups, including the Glenn Pace memo and allegations about Gordon Bowen, while urging belief and support for survivors and witnesses.

01:40 First Drinks And Mormon Guilt 06:57 Orthodox Mormon Upbringing 10:32 Moving Away And Finding Herself 16:32 Meeting Husband And Temple Marriage 27:03 Scrupulosity And Mormon Mom Cliques 33:25 Family Anxiety and Guilt 34:05 Deconstructing After Leaving 37:33 Swinging Rumors and Curiosity 41:25 Patriarchy and Women 45:41 Marriage and Church Pressure 48:25 Mormon Mom Social Mask 52:37 Home Feeling vs Spirituality 01:00:43 Podcast That Changed Everything 01:06:47 Survivors and Receipts 01:09:24 Gordon Bowen Allegations 01:13:47 Power Spirituality and Abuse 01:19:32 CIA Mormon Recruiting 01:24:22 Holy Ghost vs Morality 01:34:43 Coming Back to Body 01:50:26 Identity After Leaving 02:00:45 Final Thoughts and TikTok

Guest links:

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Ex-Kingston Clan Insider Josh Kingston on The Order: Hiding Wives, Abuse, Queerness & Escaping Polygamy

Follow Josh on tic tok: https://www.tiktok.com/@kingstonkaboodle?is_from_webapp=1&sender_device=pc

On the Jaden Jeffs Podcast, Jaden and co-host Amanda Rae interview Josh Kingston, who left the Kingston Clan (“The Order,” DCCS). They discuss the group’s polygamy, incest and underage marriage allegations, financial exploitation of wives, and strict control tactics including forced displays of happiness and corporal punishment. Josh describes realizing he was gay young, repression in the group, and how coming out led to family estrangement and only a few relatives acknowledging his husband. He recounts being sent at 17 to help run families hiding in Colorado to avoid DNA warrants, the harsh living conditions for wives and children, and leaving at 19 with little money after unpaid labor. They cover the group’s schooling, cheating, distrust of medical care, Josh’s mother’s preventable death, and the ongoing impact of trauma, identity, and rebuilding life outside the cult.

01:06 Podcast Introductions
02:08 Kingston Family Ties
04:17 Coming Out In Polygamy
08:55 Hiding From Authorities
13:57 Polygamy Economics
16:45 Abuse And Obedience
23:26 Medical Neglect Stories
28:13 Daily Rituals Explained
30:29 Prayer Rituals and Doubt
31:40 Puberty Without Sex Ed
35:18 Privacy Policing at Home
37:59 Body Shame and Siblings
43:05 Marriage Pressure and Opting Out
45:57 Kids and Fostering Dreams
49:24 Leaving the Order in Colorado
52:38 Cut Off After Coming Out
54:00 Money and Bloodline Status
59:52 Schooling and Cheating Scandal
01:03:31 Education Catch Up
01:03:53 Whitewashed FLDS History
01:05:14 Missing Pop Culture Basics
01:06:07 Rebuilding After Leaving
01:08:04 Spotting Cult Red Flags
01:10:31 Dating After Brainwashing
01:12:19 Finding Your Social Self
01:14:53 Therapy Drugs and Normal
01:17:01 Cult Leaders and Charisma
01:18:50 Family Ties and Judgment
01:22:27 Faith Doubt and Heaven
01:29:57 Death Anxiety and Ghosts
01:34:08 Trump Shooting Conspiracy
01:37:25 Daycare Abuse Coverups
01:38:11 Biodiesel Fraud Fallout
01:39:26 Vanguard School Money Laundering
01:40:45 Cheating and Accountability
01:42:25 Healthy Narcissism Talk
01:44:31 Therapy and Healing
01:46:02 Future of The Order
01:49:08 Polyamory vs Polygamy
01:50:43 Monogamy Betrayal and Consent
01:57:34 Leaving Cult Life Reflections
02:02:16 Recruitment and Mormon History
02:05:47 Shoutouts and Wrap Up

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Escaping the Kingston Group (The Order): Andrew Robinson on Abuse, Forced Labor, and Leaving Polygamy | The Jaden Jeffs Podcast

On The Jaden Jeffs Podcast, Jaden interviews Andrew Robinson, who was born into the Kingston Group (The Order/Davis County Cooperative Society) as the son of Daniel Kingston’s third wife; Daniel had up to 14 wives and an estimated 160 children, and Andrew says Daniel was abusive, controlling, and kept families separated. Andrew describes childhood forced labor at the farm, limited schooling and sex education, social anxiety, and a marriage process requiring approvals from Paul Kingston and parents, with expectations to propose on a first date. He recounts his mother’s cancer being treated with a YouTube-found regimen, his sister Rachel running to police over abuse, being returned home, and later dying by suicide, after which his mother died soon after. Andrew says COVID and cult-exposure videos helped him recognize the group as a scam, and he and his wife left with help from Holding Out Help; he urges members to “unpack the boxes” and stop lying to themselves. He promotes his book, "Escaping the Kingdom of God."

00:59 Meet Andrew Robinson
01:50 Marriage Age and Hierarchy
02:56 Abuse and Farm Labor
06:24 Kingston Leadership Explained
07:46 Incest and Normalized Praise
11:38 Puberty Without Sex Ed
18:52 Resenting a Violent Father
20:40 Shyness and Forced Isolation
24:32 Sunday Night Dread
28:31 Dances and Mom’s Push
34:08 Direction to Choose a Wife
38:41 First Date Proposal Pressure
40:45 Fighting for Permission
42:58 Engagement Yes Moment
43:51 Quick Wedding Culture
45:30 Order Money System
48:46 New Marriage Reality
51:26 Shelfing Doubts
54:17 Mom’s Cancer Control
01:00:16 Rachel Runs Away
01:07:07 Aftermath and Blame
01:17:15 Leaving the Order
01:26:09 Polygamy Pressure
01:30:50 Rewiring as a Parent
01:36:41 Therapy and Trauma Humor
01:41:07 Faith and Final Advice

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On the Jaden Jeffs Podcast, Steph recounts a childhood marked by repeated sexual and physical abuse in LDS-connected homes and the ways church authority, secrecy, and “repentance” were used instead of protection. She describes her father’s abuse and conviction, abusive stepfathers, frequent moves while homeless or evading child services, and being exploited for labor after being pulled from school. At 15, she reported an attempted assault by her stepbrother-in-law Richard; her family blamed her, and an LDS bishop bailed him out and supported him before he fled and later was convicted of several felonies after additional victims. Steph also describes being groomed at 16–17 by a 28-year-old LDS leader, being shamed and disfellowshipped by a bishop, and later being denied church aid unless she paid tithing. She connects these patterns to her sister Cindy’s later life sentence for a 2009 killing and to her niece’s trafficking case, arguing for mandatory reporting laws.

00:47 Podcast intro and guest
03:07 Parents and early abuse
06:15 Bishop knew for years
07:08 Stepdad Alan and violence
13:05 Midnight moves and homelessness
17:42 Utah motels and crash
21:28 Mom marries Mike fast
25:39 Richard the abuser
28:20 Pulled from school and exploited
30:04 Child labor at Business Habitat
37:04 Abandoning brother and Oregon
42:39 Church life and mistletoe sales
45:27 Back to Utah Again
47:14 Assault and Blame
50:14 Bishop Bails Predator
52:26 Closet Punishment
58:19 Running to Hospital
59:58 Kinship with Brother
01:01:58 Move to Florida
01:04:26 Milton Grooms Her
01:10:57 Bishop Disfellowships
01:16:08 Forced Teen Marriage
01:20:32 Hawaii Teen Mom
01:30:02 Divorce and Tithing
01:32:31 Tithing Or Groceries
01:35:09 Phasing Out Of Church
01:35:40 Early Doubts And Racism
01:37:27 Cindy Left Behind
01:39:38 Isolation And Suicide Attempts
01:41:52 Cindy With The Kids
01:44:31 Murder Plot Unfolds
01:48:28 Life Without Parole
01:51:29 Trauma And Accountability
01:54:23 Little B Abandoned
01:57:14 Tinder Predator And Trafficking
02:02:00 Seeking Help From OUR
02:08:02 Trial PTSD And Jail
02:13:34 Rebecca Dies Family Twist
02:16:08 Cut Off After Leaving
02:16:42 Family Fallout After Death
02:18:05 Predator Warning to Kids
02:19:35 Church Covers Abuse
02:21:16 Hotline and Moving Abusers
02:28:09 Affairs Worse Than Abuse
02:31:21 Tithing and Exploiting Poverty
02:35:51 LDS and FLDS Similarities
02:37:01 Tim Ballard Controversy
02:42:35 Push for Mandatory Reporting
02:46:16 Marching and Final Wrap

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In Part 2 of The Jaden Jeffs Podcast with his sister Sienna, she describes being pulled by “revelations” to move with her mother’s family to Fargo, North Dakota, receiving a message claiming she had venereal disease, and trying to start work and businesses while enjoying a brief period of freedom. As more of their father’s family moved in, a harsh hierarchy and conflict intensified, especially around rules, “worthiness,” and even dogs, leading to isolation, secret texting, and punishments after screenshots were taken from her phone. Sienna recounts being cut off from Mother, moving between “good” and “bad” houses, enduring vivid late-night trainings and accusations of extreme crimes, losing pets, and watching leaders bend rules while controlling others. She later reconnects with family, rejects pressure to marry into another group, leaves the lifestyle, and discusses mental health, individuality, and her art business, PaperGardenArt.com.

01:05 Fargo Move Order
07:45 Winter Survival Mode
10:45 Freedom Then Family Arrives
13:04 Dog Drama Hierarchy
18:34 Lonely Internet Escape
29:34 Terrestrialized Ultimatum
38:36 WiFi Deep Dive
40:57 Caught By Screenshots
45:44 Exiled And Shamed
50:19 Mechanical Room Breakdown
52:25 Rash and Relocation
53:09 Mothers Forced Out
54:32 Girls Move Without Her
55:10 Alone With Mothers
56:27 Suicidal Thoughts Surface
57:37 Back With Good People
57:56 Midnight Revelations Marathon
59:49 Fear and Silence Rules
01:02:05 South Dakota Land Rush
01:02:39 Dogs Taken Away
01:04:33 Sheriff Becomes Escape
01:05:56 Scribes and Selective Punishment
01:07:31 Downgraded and Rebellious
01:10:39 Hegeman Permission Control
01:11:39 Getting Saffy the Puppy
01:12:38 Jaska Goes Missing
01:16:04 Telling Mom the Truth
01:17:59 Girls Cut Her Off
01:19:36 Williston With Good Girls
01:21:20 Dogs Trigger Isolation
01:23:13 Cameras and False Accusations
01:25:21 Begging to Leave
01:26:27 Escape to Horus
01:27:28 Learning the Real Dad
01:28:45 Tarantula Targeted
01:30:54 Two Month Reality Crash
01:32:30 Barlow Visit and Marriage Pressure
01:35:03 Why She Finally Left
01:37:13 Fast Freedom Spiral
01:39:23 Forgiveness and Tyrants
01:43:03 Idaho Trauma and Healing
01:44:39 Rexburg Existential Reset
01:45:41 Escaping Rexburg Trauma
01:47:33 Starting Over in North Dakota
01:48:53 Unlearning the Rush
01:49:32 Boundaries and Distance
01:52:17 Individuality After Cults
01:55:42 Seeing Cults Everywhere
01:58:02 Depression and Identity Loss
02:01:48 Mental Health and Victimhood
02:07:35 Did Dad Dismantle the Cult
02:18:01 Art Business and Farewell

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On The Jaden Jeffs Podcast, Jaden interviews his full sister Sienna Haze about growing up as Warren Jeffs’ children in the FLDS. Sienna recounts early life in Hildale/Short Creek, moving to the Yearning for Zion Ranch in Texas, strict community schooling, and her cleft-lip surgeries that exposed her to the outside world. She describes the 2008 Texas raid, separation at the Pavilion, DNA testing, and being repeatedly reassigned because she was “too much to handle.” The conversation follows the family’s post-raid years of hiding in Colorado, shifting “worthiness” rankings tied to living arrangements (Texas new house vs. original, South Dakota, hiding, Short Creek), and escalating punishments, isolation, and control. Sienna details manipulative “revelations,” name changes, forced separations from their mother, and ultimately being told to leave and “earn their own way,” leading to work and life in the outside world and later upheavals in Idaho and directives to move again.


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42:48 Colorado Hiding Adventures
43:44 Lost On Mountain
44:22 What Hiding Meant
47:43 Hiding Becomes Punishment
48:14 Dad Jail Phone Calls
51:19 New House Worthiness
58:56 Inside New House Rules
01:01:24 Off Limits Dad Wing
01:04:17 Short Creek Triplex Hell
01:05:42 2012 Whiplash Moves
01:07:11 Scribes Mental Torture
01:08:58 Summoned to New House
01:11:21 New House Privilege
01:13:08 Pressure and Favorites
01:14:25 Texas to South Dakota
01:16:13 Forbidden Family Contact
01:16:39 Towers Built and Destroyed
01:20:35 Duplex Non Member Life
01:21:41 Midnight Supply Run
01:24:36 Mother Shena Illness
01:27:30 Hiding House to House
01:29:31 Immorality Accusations
01:32:34 Colorado House Peace
01:35:23 Quaker House Gathering
01:37:59 April Sixth Dread
01:39:06 Sent to Short Creek
01:41:06 Uncle Nephi Message
01:42:15 Privileges and Garden
01:42:56 Service and Confinement
01:45:04 Uncle Lyle Arrives
01:48:25 Sent Away Forever
01:52:25 Learning the World
01:58:05 Denver Work and Rules
01:59:50 Seven Month Deadline
02:03:48 Cedar Meetings Begin
02:05:29 Split Up Again
02:09:27 Letters to Nations
02:15:18 Naomi Takes Control
02:22:44 Fargo Escape Order

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On The Jaden Jeffs Podcast, Jaden talks with Michelle Michaels (known as “Ava” on Escaping Polygamy), who was born and raised in the Kingston polygamist group (The Order). Michelle explains her family ties to leadership, including that her father Jesse (Paul Kingston’s brother) had over 200 children and that her mother is his niece. She describes severe physical abuse in her home, including punishments with belts and boards, being told at age eight who she would marry, and learning that fathers often delivered babies. Michelle recounts her mother going to jail after an 18‑month‑old child died in their care, alleging her father beat the child, and explains how fake names and inaccurate birth certificates were used. She details planning her escape, creating a fake Facebook profile to contact ex-members, working to gain emancipation, appearing on Escaping Polygamy, and struggling with emotional disconnection, dating, and learning “normal” life after leaving in 2017.

01:16 Podcast Introductions
02:52 Escaping Polygamy Fame
04:22 Hair Rules and Culture Shock
06:08 Blunt Questions After Leaving
08:25 Dating and Birth Traditions
21:37 Mom Jailed Baby Death
25:02 Incest Laws and Plea Deal
39:19 Beatings and Learning Not to Cry
43:41 Dad’s Favoritism and Abuse
44:34 Hardest Ages Growing Up
46:08 Weapons and Beatings
47:40 Assigned Marriage at Eight
49:50 Perfection Wife Expectations
51:37 Mom’s Dangerous Pregnancies
55:10 Life at Fifteen and Fear
59:09 Comic Con Toy Runs
01:05:41 Toys Over Family Values
01:11:14 Wives Servants and Control
01:14:37 Marriage Pressure at Seventeen
01:26:52 Planning the Escape
01:29:21 Leaving With Escaping Polygamy
01:35:49 Aftermath and Tattoo Talk
01:38:28 Tattoos After Leaving
01:41:03 Biker Stereotypes Flip
01:44:22 Dating Outside the Cult
01:52:08 Vulnerability and Trust
01:57:46 Sharing Your Cult Past
02:02:44 Finding Joy and Favorites
02:04:58 Food Choices and Control
02:09:18 Hobbies and Peace
02:11:58 Bluntness and Empathy
02:25:54 Fake Birth Certificates
02:28:28 Fake Dad on Paperwork
02:28:50 Jail and Kid Injuries
02:29:26 Drinks and Being Blunt
02:31:24 Tattoos and First Impressions
02:35:25 Caffeine and Panic Attacks
02:40:06 Dating Struggles
02:41:40 Therapy Debate
02:52:53 Love Feels Like a Cult
02:55:44 AI as Therapist
03:03:26 Bad Doctors Story
03:08:02 Kingston vs FLDS Brain
03:08:27 Men and Therapy
03:09:49 Leaving FLDS and Healing
03:11:03 Logic Versus Emotions
03:16:54 Combining Empathy and Reason
03:19:39 Victim Advocate Explained
03:22:13 Morality After Cults
03:24:41 Bad Therapists and Stigma
03:30:05 Politics and Human Respect



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