The Non-Billable Podcast

The Non-Billable Podcast

By Non-BillableBusiness
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The Non-Billable Podcast episodes

  • What lawyers really want from AI: ex-Freshfields lawyer turned legal tech leader on what we’re getting wrong

    Today, we speak with Jack Shepherd.

    Jack started out as a restructuring lawyer at Freshfields before moving into legal tech via the firm’s in-house innovation team. He now works at iManage - the US-based legal tech company behind the document management system used by most major law firms.

    Jack is a well-known voice in the legal tech space and a regular speaker at industry conferences. He often takes a refreshingly contrarian view on AI - not for the sake of it, but because, having been a practising lawyer, he actually understands how lawyers work day-to-day.

    In this conversation, Jack shares insights on the evolving landscape of legal AI and technology. He discusses his transition from practising law to working in legal tech, emphasising the importance of understanding the pain points of lawyers and how technology can address these issues. 

    Jack critiques the current hype around AI, advocating for a more practical approach that focuses on enhancing the legal profession rather than replacing it. He also highlights the significance of project management skills in law, the ROI of legal AI tools and offers advice for lawyers looking to transition into legal tech. The discussion ends with thoughts on future-proofing legal careers and the traits of successful junior lawyers.


    Chapters

    00:50 From Lawyer to Legal Tech 

    03:33 Understanding Legal AI: Current Landscape

    06:20 The Role of AI in Legal Work

    09:25 AI's Impact on Junior Lawyers

    12:19 Identifying Pain Points in Legal Practice

    15:25 The Future of Law Firms and SaaS

    18:40 iManage: Revolutionising Document Management

    27:46 Cultural Challenges in Legal Tech Adoption

    28:27 Understanding ROI in Legal AI Tools

    31:18 Strategic Technology Procurement in Law Firms

    34:41 The Role of AI in Law Firm Marketing

    36:38 Innovative Legal AI Tools to Watch

    40:19 Future-Proofing Legal Careers

    40:43 Advice for Lawyers Transitioning to Legal Tech

    44:08 Traits of Successful Lawyers

    49:25 Recommended Reads for Legal Professionals


    About Non-Billable

    Non-Billable is an email newsletter and media company for modern legal professionals, brought to you by a small team of former City lawyers and finance professionals.

    Visit our website: ⁠⁠https://www.nonbillable.co.uk/

    52 min
  • The City law partner who hit breaking point and is now leading the fight against burnout in the legal industry

    This is our conversation with Richard Martin, a former partner at law firms including Jones Day and Speechly Bircham, who, after experiencing severe burnout and a mental health crisis while he was at the peak of his powers, has dedicated his career to improving mental well-being in the legal industry.

    Now leading the Mindful Business Charter (MBC), Richard advocates for healthier working practices in law firms and corporate environments.

    Richard shares his story, we discuss the state of mental health in the legal industry, which firms are doing good work to address the issue, some advice for lawyers feeling like they’re nearing burnout and how the Mindful Business Charter is tackling the issue


    Chapters

    00:40 Introduction to Richard and His Journey

    03:43 The Impact of Stress and Mental Health in Law

    06:10 Personal Experience with Mental Health Challenges

    09:10 Transitioning to Mental Health Advocacy

    12:10 Understanding the Legal Profession's Mental Health Landscape

    15:15 The Role of Personality Traits in Lawyer Burnout

    18:05 Current State of Mental Health Awareness in Law Firms

    21:20 The Mindful Business Charter Explained

    24:10 Challenges in Implementing Mental Health Initiatives

    27:10 The Future of Mental Health in the Legal Profession

    29:20 Understanding Client Expectations and Lawyer Responsiveness

    34:10 The Role of Well-Being in Legal Practice

    38:42 Balancing High Performance and Employee Well-Being

    39:50 Navigating Burnout and Career Satisfaction

    45:12 Advice for Junior Lawyers and Career Ownership


    About Non-Billable

    Non-Billable is an email newsletter and media company for modern legal professionals, brought to you by a small team of former City lawyers and finance professionals.

    Visit our website: ⁠⁠https://www.nonbillable.co.uk/

    53 min
  • How AI is reshaping Big Law - and why firms can’t afford to wait, with ex-Ashurst digital chief

    In this episode, we talk with Tara Waters.

    Tara is a leading voice in legal tech and a lawyer with more than 15 years’ experience at City firms including A&O, Simmons and Ashurst where she was a partner and chief digital officer - during which time she successfully rolled out AI tool Harvey to all of the firm’s 4,000+ lawyers and business services staff around the world.

    Tara shares her unique journey from technology to law, highlighting her experiences in legal tech and innovation. She discusses the evolution of legal services, the impact of generative AI, how law firms should assess its ROI and her favourite AI tools on the market.

    Tara emphasises the importance of adapting to new technologies, the need for investment in learning and development,and the traits that distinguish great lawyers. She also provides insights into the future of the billable hour model.


    Chapters

    00:30 Introduction to Tara and Her Journey

    03:034 Transition from Technology to Law

    06:20 Building a Diverse Legal Practice

    09:33 Innovation in Legal Services at Ashurst

    12:33 Client-Driven Changes in Legal Tech

    14:55 The Evolution of Legal Tech and AI

    18:11 Generative AI's Impact on Legal Work

    21:05 The Role of AI Assistants in Legal Practice

    23:50 Harvey: A Case Study in Legal AI Implementation

    27:08 Internal Adoption of AI Tools at Ashurst

    30:40 Elevating Voices: The Importance of User Stories

    30:58 Gaining Partner Buy-In for Technology Investments

    33:20 Measuring ROI: Beyond Cost Savings

    36:02 The Evolving Role of Lawyers in the Age of AI

    39:36 Rethinking the Billable Hour Model

    43:24 Legal AI Tools: Preferences and Industry Trends

    48:02 Leading Firms in Legal Tech Innovation

    49:31 Career Advice: Confidence and Continuous Learning

    54:48 Investing in Learning and Development

    56:40 The Value of Knowing When to Pivot


    About Non-Billable

    Non-Billable is an email newsletter and media company for modern legal professionals, brought to you by a small team of former City lawyers and finance professionals.

    Visit our website: ⁠⁠https://www.nonbillable.co.uk/

    1 hr
  • '$20 million is the new benchmark in London’: the City’s top headhunter on the law firm partner hiring frenzy, why firms are paying millions and how the rules of partnership are changing

    In today’s episode, we sit down with Scott Gibson, one of the City’s top headhunters and co-founder of elite partner-level recruitment firm Edwards Gibson. 


    With 25 years in the game, Gibson has seen it all - and according to him, the market is crazier than ever.


    We discuss what’s driving the hottest law firm partner transfer market in years, why elite firms are paying eye-watering sums, which practice areas are in hottest demand and how the rules of partnership are changing. 


    Scott also reveals what law firms are looking for in lateral hires and gives his advice for associates and junior partners looking to make their mark.


    Chapters


    00:00 Introduction to Scott and His Career Path

    02:03 Current State of the City Talent Market

    06:11 The Impact of US Law Firms on the Market

    09:59 High-Profile Partner Moves and Their Implications

    14:07 The Economics Behind Law Firm Investments

    17:58 What Law Firms Look for in Lateral Hires

    21:54 Impact on firms outside the Magic Circle

    26:13 Ageism and Retirement in Law Firms

    30:53 The Pension Dilemma in Law Firms

    32:42 Capital Contributions and Partner Exits

    36:31 Navigating Guaranteed Compensation

    38:30 The Role of Headhunters in Law Firm Recruitment

    46:07 The Partner Hiring Process

    55:20 Career Advice for Aspiring Partners


    About Non-Billable


    Non-Billable is an email newsletter and media company for modern legal professionals, brought to you by a small team of former City lawyers and finance professionals.


    Visit our website: ⁠https://www.nonbillable.co.uk/

    53 min
  • The A&O trainee who built (and sold) a legal tech startup as a side project during his training contract

    In this episode, we sit down with Alexander Kardos-Nyheim, a lawyer who remarkably built a legal AI company as a side project during his training contract at A&O. In 2024 - just as he was qualifying - he sold the business to Thomson Reuters for a life-changing sum of money. 


    Alexander shares his inspiring journey from a young advocate fighting against a developer threatening his community to becoming a lawyer and co-founding his legal tech startup, SafeSign Technologies. He discusses the challenges of balancing a training contract at A&O with the startup, the dynamics of the legal market, and the eventual acquisition by Thomson Reuters. 


    Chapters


    00:00 Introduction to Alex's Journey

    02:49 The Catalyst for Becoming a Lawyer

    05:36 Navigating Law School and Early Advocacy

    08:07 The Appeal of Big Law Firms

    10:31 The Impact of Rising Salaries in Law

    13:14 The Shift in the Legal Market Dynamics

    15:45 Starting a Tech Business During a Training Contract

    18:22 Building a Legal Tech Startup

    20:56 Balancing Work and Startup Life

    22:58 The Challenges of a Dual Career

    29:30 Navigating Dual Careers: Law and Entrepreneurship

    31:50 Pivoting to Legal AI: The Birth of a Startup

    35:18 Building a Legal-Specific AI Model

    39:21 Funding and Team Dynamics in a Startup

    42:49 Acquisition Talks: The Thomson Reuters Interest

    49:52 Life After Acquisition: New Beginnings at Thomson Reuters

    54:36 Advice for Aspiring Lawyer-Entrepreneurs


    About Non-Billable


    Non-Billable is an email newsletter and media company for modern legal professionals, brought to you by a small team of former City lawyers and finance professionals.


    Visit our website: https://www.nonbillable.co.uk/

    1 hr 1 min

About The Non-Billable Podcast

From the publisher's feed

The Non-Billable Podcast takes UK legal professionals beyond the billable hour, bringing you interviews with top lawyers, law firm leaders, industry experts and legal tech innovators to uncover actionable insights on the business of law, career growth and the future of the industry.