The Panel

By Justin Jackson & Brian Casel

When it comes to bootstrapping and building software, there's rarely one right answer. We want to dive into the nuance. In every episode, veteran founders Justin Jackson and Brian Casel bring together... more

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FAQs about The Panel:

How many episodes does The Panel have?

The podcast currently has 13 episodes available.

The Panel episodes:

June 06, 2025Changed my mind: AI is actually good for coding
Big episode! Brian shares the results of his launch of Instrumental Components (sales numbers, and how he's feeling). He also talks about his next project: helping devs and teams navigate how to use AI in software development and design. This episode was recorded live, with tons of folks joining us in the "panel" chat. Adam Wathan ended up joining us last-minute to talk about how he's changed is mind on AI and coding, and how AI is affecting Tailwind's business.

Timestamps:
(02:50) - What is Instrumental Components and how has the launch been?
(11:06) - Why not go for something big?
(24:26) - What you hear online vs the reality of what's going on
(29:24) - Pricing change for Instrumental Components
(34:04) - Where Brian's going next
(51:42) - Adam Wathan on how they're using AI
(01:06:14) - Writing PRD for AI instead of prompt writing
(01:09:39) - How is AI going to affect Adam's business?
(01:24:03) - Vibe coding personal projects
YOU ARE THE PANEL – send us your thoughts 🗣️
🎤 Send us an audio or video message
📧 Email us: [email protected]
📺 Leave a comment on YouTube
🦋 Reply on Bluesky
Links mentioned in this episode
Instrumental Components - Brian's new product
Clarity Flow - Brian's SaaS product
Transistor.fm - Justin's company
Integrate Open AI and Anthropic APIs into your Rails applications (video)
Rob Walling's Stair Step approach
Vercel's new V0 AI tool
Thorsten Ball's article: How to build an agent
Mostly Technical | 85: Screencasting.com Launch Failure
The Steve Ballmer Interview: The Complete History and Strategy
TaskMaster AI Solutions
Claude Code Overview
AI Video Editor
Figma AI Creativity
Rand Fishkin on Marketing
...more
1h 33min
May 30, 2025Back from London UK – so much to talk about
Justin just got back from a big trip to London UK for the podcast industry conference, and honestly, it's got him thinking about some big thoughts about the podcasting medium. This episode starts out with an honest chat between Brian and Justin: 'How are you feeling about the podcast so far?'

Timestamps:
(00:06) - Just the two of us
(01:06) - The struggle with guests on a podcast
(10:33) - What if we did it live?
(16:46) - What's Justin been up to?
(20:28) - How does the shift in podcasting affect Transistor?
(24:50) - Justin's universal theory about podcasting
(39:51) - One reason Justin is hopeful
(43:42) - The pipeline problem is a big one for startups
(51:19) - How could Transistor work in a video podcast world
(57:53) - Why Justin is hopeful about Apple Podcasts
YOU ARE THE PANEL – send us your thoughts 🗣️
🎤 Send us an audio or video message
📧 Email us: [email protected]
📺 Leave a comment on YouTube
🦋 Reply on Bluesky
Links mentioned in this episode
The Podcast Show
Instrumental Components - Brian's new product
Clarity Flow - Brian's SaaS product
Transistor.fm - Justin's company
...more
1h 10min
May 16, 2025Brian's launch – how did it go?
Justin and Brian talk about how Brian's launch for Instrumental Components went. "Some things are way harder now that I'm older." Brian describes some of the technical challenges faced during the launch. There's also a meaty section about how much AI to use in software development (and how Brian uses it). At the end, Justin provides some feedback on Brian's pricing and marketing strategy.

Timestamps:
(00:05) - Introduction
(02:00) - Brian's early access launch
(04:15) - The fear that nobody is going to buy
(06:45) - Sass vs product
(09:43) - How does it feel to launch a product as a solo person?
(13:11) - Hiring vs doing it yourself + AI
(24:20) - Are we losing the shared experience?
(37:20) - Why are you batching invites out?
(46:23) - The pricing decision
(51:13) - The importance of positioning
(55:40) - Why should this be a subscription?
(01:04:38) - The importance of getting other people telling your story
(01:09:23) - How to ask for social support from your people
(01:17:16) - What's Justin up to next
Tell us what you think! 🗣️
🎤 Send us an audio or video message
📧 Email us: [email protected]
📺 Leave a comment on YouTube
🦋 Reply on Bluesky
Links mentioned in this episode
Aaron Francis' tweet
Adam Wathan
How About Tomorrow?
The REWORK Podcast
Replit
Statamic
Gravity Forms
Tailwind UI Components
Radical Design Course
Instrumental Components - Brian's new product
Clarity Flow - Brian's SaaS product
Transistor.fm - Justin's company
...more
1h 19min
May 09, 2025"I hit my initial goal for my business – what's next?"
Justin is wrestling with strategic decisions for Transistor after hitting his initial "success goal," while Brian is two weeks away from launching a new Rails components product and grappling with how to reach his target audience.

Timestamps:
(00:06) - What are we talking about in this episode?
(01:41) - The importance of a founder or CEO
(05:40) - Learning about marketing from politics
(18:27) - Thinking about the next phase of Transistor
(36:27) - Not knowing how a new product or service will be recieved until you launch it
(48:34) - Being in motion in the direction you think you need to move
(53:12) - Trying to figure out what makes me different
(01:00:26) - Brian sharing his survey
(01:09:35) - How do the rest of us reach people?
(01:21:38) - SEO ideas in 2025
Tell us what you think! 🗣️
🎤 Send us an audio or video message
📧 Email us: [email protected]
📺 Leave a comment on YouTube
🦋 Reply on Bluesky
Links mentioned in this episode
Podcast Movement: The World’s Largest Podcasting Community | Events, Resources & More!
Justin Jackson – SaaS, bootstrapping, marketing
Jordan Gal Voice AI
Marketing Automation
Customer Engagement
Email-First OS
AI Video Editing
AI Code Editor
.NET & JavaScript Libraries
Instrumental Products - Brian's company
Clarity Flow - Brian's SaaS product
Transistor.fm - Justin's company
...more
1h 27min
April 25, 2025"Waiting for the Dam to Break" - Jordan Gal's bet on voice AI
Jordan Gal is breaking the mold with his new startup Rosie. He's targeting non-technical small business owners using consumer-style marketing rather than the B2B approaches most SaaS use. He talks about the opportunities and risks with AI-based startups, and how he's waiting for the "dam to break."

Timestamps:
(00:00) - Intro
(03:42) - Using what I want to listen to to guide what I create
(12:10) - The advantage of finding your audience
(16:26) - What kinds of experiments have you run lately?
(23:28) - What is the marketing strategy for Rosie?
(33:10) - Struggling with content creation
(47:28) - It can be dangerous when your audience is also your customers
(54:02) - Content is not the end goal
(01:05:19) - Building a business on tradespeople
Tell us what you think! 🗣️
🎤 Send us an audio or video message
📧 Email us: [email protected]
📺 Leave a comment on YouTube
🦋 Reply on Bluesky
Links mentioned in this episode
Rosie - AI Call Answering Service
Jordan Gal - Portland, Oregon, rallyon.com | about.me
Post Purchase Offers
Brian Casel
Bootstrapped Web
Wireframing Tools
Instrumental Products - Brian's company
Clarity Flow - Brian's SaaS product
Transistor.fm - Justin's company
...more
1h 9min
April 04, 2025Figuring out what to do next (Adam Wathan)
Adam Wathan sat down with Justin and Brian to talk about the challenge of staying motivated with your own business, even when you've "made it."
However successful you think a well-known product or founder might be, the truth is everyone's dealing with stresses and challenges and things that don't work and figuring out what to do next. That's what this episode is about.
The discussion also touches on the potential of video content and YouTube as a way of getting in motion and regaining motivation.

Timestamps:
(00:06) - Intro
(02:52) - Evaluating past efforts and losing confidence
(27:27) - Do we try and get more of the same thing, or build to a new thing?
(29:58) - Getting excited about building out a new space
(37:51) - Publishing when you're inspired
(59:11) - Are we too old?
(01:03:23) - Finding inspiration in new locations
Tell us what you think! 🗣️
🎤 Send us an audio or video message
📧 Email us: [email protected]
📺 Leave a comment on YouTube
🦋 Reply on Bluesky
Links mentioned in this episode
Tailwind CSS - Adam's company
Tailwind's YouTube channel
Instrumental Products - Brian's company
Clarity Flow - Brian's SaaS product
Transistor.fm - Justin's company
...more
1h 15min
March 21, 2025How do you find Founder-Product Fit?
Brian Casel hosts a candid conversation with Val Sopi and Christian Genco about the realities of launching new SaaS products in 2025. All three founders are at pivotal moments in their entrepreneurial journeys, wrestling with what products to build next, how to balance consulting work with product development, and finding the elusive "founder-product fit" that makes building a business sustainable and enjoyable. They share their strategies for validating ideas, dealing with competition, and defining what success truly means beyond just revenue targets.

The discussion delves into the unique challenges of the current SaaS landscape, from the impact of AI on product development to the importance of building products that genuinely excite you as a founder. Whether you're considering your next product launch or questioning your current direction, this episode offers valuable perspectives from bootstrappers who've been through multiple product cycles and are navigating their next moves.

Timestamps:
(00:00) - Welcome
(01:35) - Guest introduction
(03:31) - Why are we considering a new Saas business in 2025?
(12:07) - Have we thought about doing something else besides Saas?
(22:09) - How do you convince yourself that your new idea is going to work?
(28:15) - How do we view competition in Saas?
(32:43) - Thinking about founder fit as much as market fit
(37:43) - What is Christian thinking about for his own product?
(44:07) - How to think about competition in 2025
(52:29) - How do we stay excited about our products or projects?
(59:09) - What does success look like for you this year?
Tell us what you think! 🗣️
🎤 Send us an audio or video message
📧 Email us: [email protected]
📺 Leave a comment on YouTube
🦋 Reply on Bluesky
Links mentioned in this episode
Instrumental Products - Brian's company
Clarity Flow - Brian's SaaS product
BlogMaker.app - Val's current SaaS
FileInbox.com - Christian's SaaS
Cursor - AI coding tool discussed in the episode
Rails Components Library – Brian's new project
Paddle - Payment processor Val mentioned for his new product
Justin's MicroConf talk on founder-market fit
Brett Victor - Human Computing
...more
1h 11min
March 07, 2025Is doing YouTube a good business?
Marie Poulin and Aaron Francis join us to discuss the realities of building creator-driven businesses. We talked a lot about YouTube (they describe how each got traction there) and their current video making process. They also challenged conventional wisdom about sticking to one niche. For them, pivoting between projects keeps them fresh and prevents burnout, even when the traditional wisdom is to "just focus."

Chapters:
(00:06) - Introduction
(03:23) - What is happening in Marie Poulin's world?
(07:32) - What is Aaron Francis up to at Try Hard Studios?
(08:48) - Why is open source software important to be involved in?
(11:20) - What is the marketing flow for Marie and Notion Mastery?
(14:34) - The power of YouTube to find new people
(16:52) - Personality as a brand vs a studio brand name
(25:03) - The tensions of being a creator
(33:49) - What is your month to month routine for your business?
(39:16) - When does creative work feel like a grind?
(01:00:47) - What negative attention have you recieved creating content?
Tell us what you think! 🗣️
🎤 Send us an audio or video message
📧 Email us: [email protected]
📺 Leave a comment on YouTube
🦋 Reply on Bluesky
Links mentioned in this episode
💼 Notion Mastery
💪 Try Hard Studios
Marie's YouTube channel
Aaron's YouTube channel
Screencasting.com - Aaron's upcoming project
ChatGPT lists Marie as #1 Notion influencer
🧰 Instrumental Products
🎤 Transistor podcast hosting
...more
1h 11min
February 21, 2025Should you still build in public? Peldi (Balsamiq) and Jay Clouse (Creator Science)
Peldi is the founder of Balsamiq and pioneered transparent business building in 2007. In this episode, he came to the Panel looking advice on "build in public." We invited Jay Clouse, of Creator Science, on to share his wisdom. Jay had tons of practical suggestions for SaaS founders looking to build community and build in public in an authentic way.
Chapters:
(00:08) - Introduction of The Panel
(04:24) - Why is Peldi interested in build in public in 2025?
(09:32) - Build in public has become brag in public
(20:44) - Can Peldi give back in some way?
(28:25) - Could you teach people how to build in public again?
(35:13) - How much work is it to maintain community?
(40:46) - Sharing your struggles in public
(47:57) - Why does Peldi still share revenue numbers?
(51:46) - Could Balsamiq sponsor a community?
(56:34) - What do current founders need to know?
Tell us what you think! 🗣️
🎤 Send us an audio or video message
📧 Email us: [email protected]
📺 Leave a comment on YouTube
🦋 Reply on Bluesky
Links mentioned in this episode
Instrumental Products
Creator Science
Balsamiq Mockups
Transistor podcast hosting
...more
1h 1min
February 07, 2025The business of open source - Caleb Porzio (Livewire) and Taylor Otwell (Laravel)
Is web development still a good career choice in 2025? What's the future of open source? Justin and Brian dive deep with Taylor Otwell (Laravel) and Caleb Porzio (Livewire, Alpine.js, Flux) about the state of web dev, building a business on open source, and the anxiety of managing competition.
Chapters:
(03:31) - Should people still pursue web development as a career?
(11:04) - Are we still excited about the web? Why is Laravel growing?
(16:27) - How big are your customers?
(25:23) - How interested are developers on the business side of Saas?
(34:39) - How did you think about open source when you were getting started?
(41:19) - How do you think about being a creator when you have a large business?
(55:57) - The next generation pipeline
(01:00:47) - Rethinking open source
(01:10:52) - What's your anxiety level towards competition?
Tell us what you think! 🗣️
🎤 Send us an audio or video message
📧 Email us: [email protected]
📺 Leave a comment on YouTube
🦋 Reply on Bluesky
Links mentioned in this episode
🚀 Laravel
🧑‍💻 Laravel is hiring
🐙 Livewire
🎸 Alpine.js
✨ Flux
🏗️ Instrumental Rails Components
🎙️ Transistor podcast hosting
...more
1h 19min

FAQs about The Panel:

How many episodes does The Panel have?

The podcast currently has 13 episodes available.

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