The Passionistas Project Podcast | Passionate Women Empowerment Hosts

Laura Beck is an activist and the founder of LottoLove, the first ever scratch off card with a social mission. LottoLove brings charitable giving to everyday gifting. It's been featured on The Today Show and Ellen DeGeneres and included in national publications, such as Women's Day, Real Simple and Redbook. Through her work with LottoLove, Laura is making a positive impact on people's lives by providing a better way to gift that empowers people in need and inspires communities to do good in a fun and exciting way.

Learn more about LottoLove.

Learn more about The Passionistas Project.

Full Transcript:

Passionistas: Hi, and welcome to The Passionistas Project Podcast, where we tell the stories of empowered women who are following their passions to inspire you to do the same. We're Amy and Nancy Harrington and today we're talking with Laura Beck and activists and the founder of LottoLove, the first ever scratch off card with a social mission. LottoLove brings charitable giving to everyday gifting. It's been featured on The Today Show and Ellen DeGeneres and included in national publications, such as Women's Day, Real Simple and Redbook. Through her work with LottoLove, Laura is making a positive impact on people's lives by providing a better way to gift that empowers people in need and inspires communities to do good in a fun and exciting way. 

So please welcome to the show, Laura Beck.

Laura Beck: Hello, thank you for having me on here.

Passionistas: Thanks for joining us today. So what's the one thing you're most passionate about.

Laura Beck: I always get a little hung up on like picking the one thing, but I really, I mean, I'm passionate about the environment and cooking, but I think the most, the thing I'm most passionate about would be relationships and connecting with people. My dad always said something along the lines of, if you have relationships, you'll be rich in life. And that's something that really stuck with me. And so I've really spent a lot of time investing in friendships, which have had a lot of them for over 20 years, you know, with family, coworkers, mentors. And I think, you know, really having a variety of all these different relationships in your life allows you to connect with people on a lot of different levels, which I think is important. And with a lot of love, you know, I don't get to meet everyone that we're helping, but I do feel a connection to them with what I'm doing. And I value that relationship too, even though it's, you know, more distant,

Passionistas: You mentioned your father and your parents really showed you firsthand about giving back when you were a kid. So can you talk about that experience and how it's informed your life?

Laura: So my dad for, I want to say, like, I don't know, for 14 years he was going to Guatemala on mission trips. And then when I was in high school, he wanted to bring the whole family. And I think at that point it was like, my little brother's older, not old enough, I'm one of four. So we all went as a family to small town in Guatemala and he had been working on building an orphanage or every year that he would go to that orphanage was built. And there were like three families in there that had, you know, maybe five kids each. And we went down probably for like 10 days and did a lot of like mission work within the orphanage. But then we would venture out and go up into the, like the most remote villages in the mountains where we were giving, you know, some medical relief.

There was a CR you know, a little religious component to it and just Christianity, which, you know, is the main religion of Guatemala. And so there were, you know, a lot of different ways of helping and connecting with these people that, you know, most of the time never come down from their villages. They never get to see a doctor, you know, they're suffering from arthritis and to fakes and, you know, a lot of different ailments. So they were very grateful when we would come up there and help with, you know, help them just ease pain and play with the kids and, you know, just interact and kind of give them this, give them some hope. And so I did that trip a couple times. And then at right after I graduated from college, I raised money to go to Honduras with my sister and we did something similar there.

So those were, you know, were big experiences. And then just like on a daily basis, my dad had been on the board of directors at the homeless shelter in the home, in the town where I grew up. So, you know, I just grew up with him, always giving his time and not, you know, not just time and money and resources, but so that was always kind of ingrained in our upbringing was, you know, helping those less fortunate and really just taking the emphasis out of material things and putting it more on, you know, these relationships and connections with people. 

Passionistas: So you mentioned college, where did you go to college and what did you study? 

Laura: I went to University of Michigan. I'm originally from a small town in Northern Michigan, like four hours North of Detroit. And then I studied art history with a minor in Spanish. So I was using a lot of, well. I mean, when I went in high school, I took Spanish as well. So I was able to speak Spanish and these in Guatemala and Honduras when we were there. But then after I graduated, I moved to Chicago and I went back to school for art direction and design. And there's this type of, I guess, school, which is called a portfolio school. And that is where you go specifically to get a job in an advertising agency afterwards. So you can study copywriting design or art direction. And the whole it's a really intensive program. And some of them are two years, but the one I took was just one year. So it was pretty much for an entire year, no breaks taking the courses. So that's where I got my art direction background.

Passionistas: What were some of your early jobs after you got that degree?

Passionistas: Tell us about that. That's Tiny Rebels. Right? Tell us about that. And some of the socially good companies you work for there.

Laura: I really enjoy working with brands that needed that I really liked working with them from the ground up, you know, being part of their initial, I guess, the initial phase. And so one of the companies I worked for was called OneGridCandle, and their mission was, you know, to help provide clean energy to people in Africa and sell their candles. And so that one was a company that I was able to, I got in touch with right away, you know, from helped them from logo design, to packaging design, to their website and know pretty much all marketing touch points as well. And that was like, okay, I see them able to, um, giving back in a way, you know, by helping this company get off the ground, I really enjoy doing this and that at that point I was like, I think I want to, you know, try doing this a little more direct and be the one that's, you know, has the company that's giving back. So I kind of, I slowly just start kind of as like not accepting new clients and was just letting the phase, not the phase out naturally happen. And then that's when I took a leap with LottoLove.

Passionistas: So what inspired you to create lot of love cards?

Laura: I wanted a career change and I had a desire to do something that did more good in the world. And I, you know, I felt I could do that, you know, helping client or, you know, the companies I was working with, get off the ground and do that. But I wanted to do that in a little more direct way. And, you know, if you ask yourself the question, why do I do what I do? It really forces you to reflect on what gets you out of bed in the morning? And I knew I had, you know, interesting background and experiences and, you know, different talents that I had, um, honed in on with my past jobs. And I wanted to figure out how I could put all that together and figure out a way to positively impact other people's lives. And if I thought back to a time where I felt like empowered, it was when I went on those mission trips with my family.

Passionistas: It's been awhile, but yeah, we've definitely done them… for sure.

Laura: Yeah, so it's like a matching game. So we've designed icons that represent each charitable prize and then you have to match one of those icons. And then that tells you flip it over and explains a little bit more about the causes that we're supporting. And then we direct everyone to our website where they can learn more about our charities and the efforts that we're supporting.

Passionistas: So tell us about those charities who are they and why did you choose them?

Laura: We have four Austin charities. Solar aid is our solar non-profit and their mission is to eradicate the use of kerosene, which is harmful to health and to the environment. And why really like about their mission is they're working to employ people to sell the lights, which creates jobs and a sustainable markets. So, you know, they're creating sustainability in a lot of different ways, as opposed to just providing a clean energy source. And so they're able to combat poverty and climate change. And they work specifically within Africa, lit world is our literacy partner, lit worlds based in New York. And they work within the U S and also globally. They're putting emphasis on not just learning how to read and write, but to learn how to teach kids, how to tell their story and how to communicate, which helps them build a sustainable life because, you know, communications foundation of a lot of things.

Laura Are a limited amount of like gifting options, but you can either give one week of clean water or four weeks of clean water. So when you go onto our website, you're not going to be able to, as of right now, but we might change this. You can't choose. If you are getting a water winning card or a meal, it's a surprise, but you can either win one meal or three meals, one month of solar light, or four months of solar light, and then one set of literacy tools or three sets of literacy tools.

Passionistas: We're Amy and Nancy Harrington. And you're listening to The Passionistas Project Podcast and our interview with Laura Beck. To learn more about her scratch cards with a social mission visit, GiveLottoLove.com. 

Now here's more of our interview with Laura. 

Have you personally had any interactions with people that have benefited from the work you're doing and are there any that stand out?

Laura: Yes, actually I think it was two years ago now I was able to go to Kenya and I met with one of the partners of our literacy charity. They work in Kibera, which is like one of the chorus slums in the world. So we spend a day with the Red Rose School and it was all girls and, you know, got to see everything firsthand. They call them lit clubs. So how they run their lit club. So it started with a story and then that story had an underlying message about feelings and like bravery. And so then, you know, we all sat in a circle when it was great, because I got to like sit in a circle with them and I was participating, you know, just like a student with them. And everyone went around the room, talking about the story, you know, talking about moments in their life, where they had to be brave and courageous.

Passionistas: We were reading about that story. And one of the things that struck us was you told, said you played a game with them and did an exercise with them called a rose, a bud or a thorn, which we loved the concept of that. Tell us about that.

Laura: That it wasn't the first time I heard it when I went to Kibera. That was something that actually my parents did with us growing up too. Like, especially around like Thanksgiving, it was like, you know, we'd all be home from college or something and they'd be like, tell us, you know, something good that happened. And you know, and so the rows, the button, the thorn really kind of puts a metaphor to that. I think, you know, arose is something that you're really happy and excited about. The bud is something, you know, you're anticipating, you know, that's going to happen and you're excited. And then a thorn is, you know, something was difficult. Something was a little prickly, a challenge that you faced. And yeah, we went all went around the room and did the Rose about a thorn. It's actually something really fun to do with, you know, friends and family too. And it's just another way to connect with people. And if, you know, for lack of a better word forces, but allows people to open up, you know, cause everyone's doing it. You know, we all have hardships, but you know, we all have something that we can find that we're excited for or something good that happened in our lives. 

Passionistas: You've also added wedding favors to your store. So talk about those.

Laura: I would say it's a little bit of a work in progress, but something that excites me about a lot, all of is all the different ways that you can gift it. You know, we really want people to rethink what they gift and how they, and there's so many occasions why when we need to buy people, things. And so weddings, and I think it kinda came about like when I was planning mine, now people buy wedding favors and they're cute and they're fun. And I it's a fun thing to do, but I really had a hard time wrapping my head around that because one, it feels a little wasteful to me and it's just not where I really wanted to spend the money. And I, you know, I felt like I could gift something to someone outside of a trinket, you know, the header initials on it or something or something that might get thrown away.

Passionistas: What would you like to see as the future for a LottoLove?

Laura: Sometimes I feel like it changes a little bit, but you know, near term, I want to expand our product line, you know, which means adding new charities and increasing the causes that we can support. You know, right now we have four and it's what we call our basic needs line. And I'm really happy with the four that we chose, but I know there are so many more causes out there that mean a lot to people. You know, I want to expand and do like a health card, you know, support breast cancer and Alzheimer's, and I mean, there's so many, you know, maybe an animal card. I know a lot of, you know, people want to support animals and help them. So expanding our product line is something I want to do near term. I want to get into more into corporate gifting because I think that is a way to really reach a lot of people and obviously increase our impact.

Passionistas: So where can people go to get the cards and find out more about what you do

Laura: Our website, which is GiveLottoLove.com. So G I V E L O T T O L O V E dot com. That's where we do pretty much all of our sales through our website and we ship all over. I pretty much ship across the world. We just sent an order out today to Australia. So wherever you are listening, you're not too far. 

Passionistas: You do corporate gifts as well. Talk about that.

Laura: It's been a really fun aspect of the business, which it wasn't something I was thinking about when I first started, but usually mostly around the holidays. That's when everyone's, you know, figuring out how they can gift people, something, but we did something for the Cleveland Cavaliers. They had a yearly summit and they wanted to include LottoLove at this meeting. So anything from meetings like that to including them and gift baskets that get sent to clients or customers, we can do a lot of the fulfillment ourselves. So if you know, we're mailing these out to 500 people, we've done it. And, you know, we try to be as flexible as possible because everyone's gifting needs are different and unique. And you know, some people want a greeting card and some people just want the scratch off. And we create these little custom informational cards, which are a great, like co-branding option where we can put their logo on it and custom messaging. Or if these corporate companies are ordering a lot more, you know, we have like a 500 unit minimum order quantity, but we can customize the scratch off cards, which is a fun way to, to do a little like co-branding where we can add a logo and some messaging. There's not as much flexibility with that, but we try our best.

Passionistas: Is there a lesson that you've learned during your journey that sticks with you?

Laura: I would say one of the biggest lessons is to not give up because they're just in startup life. There are so many roadblocks and times where you feel like, okay, this is too hard. I can't do this, but to just not, not give up and to put yourself in uncomfortable situations, because I think those uncomfortable situations is where you really see growth and to not shy away from those because you're afraid. So, you know, there are a lot of twists and turns and disappointment comes with that. But the one thing we can control is to just keep going, regardless of people's response or lack of response and validation, and then saying yes, because I think fear can creep in and we can shy away from doing things, but I've gotten in this habit of just agreeing to things, knowing even if sometimes my guts like, Oh, I can't do this. I'm not good enough for this or something, but, you know, say yes and I'll figure it out and I'll figure out how to do it. But I think that's where I've seen a lot of like my personal and career growth by putting myself in these situations and just not giving up.

Passionistas: So as the mother of the new baby girl, what's your dream for women?

Laura: My dream is well for my daughter. I want to instill like instill in her the belief that she can do anything and that we're stronger than we know, especially, you know, just giving birth as a woman and being able to give birth, I think is a beautiful and wonderful thing, but it was also one of the scariest things that I've ever done. But after that, I was like, you know what? We can do anything. Like we're so much stronger than we know. And I want women to feel empowered in all aspects of their life because they should, because we're strong and you know, we need to, you know, rise above the fear or whatever's like keeping us down. What's your definition of success? You know, since I had violet, I think that changed a little bit, but you know, I think it's really enjoying what you do and, you know, success, I think looks different. Day-to-day especially now, you know, I think success is okay, my daughter's happy and she's alive. And that is success. Like every day right now is successful for me. If I do that. And if I get a little bit of work done, it's a bonus. But I think success is feeling nourished at the end of the day. You know, whether that's working, whether that's not working, but as you know, feeling that fulfillment and nourishment at the end of the day, I think is success.

Passionistas: What's your secret to a rewarding life?

Laura: Well, can I still be figuring it out a little bit, but I think one now being a new mom is having really good time management. I have learned I work better under pressure, but I don't have that luxury. Like if I get a minute, I need to use that minute wisely. But, and I think having good time management, it can really either make you feel fulfilled or it can deplete you if you're not doing it in the right way and being an entrepreneur, you know, weekends and weekdays blend together. And they can all the days all feel the same sometimes, but you have to really allow yourself to have the fun, the self-care and do the work. And I think that's keeps your mind and body in check. But then at the end of the day, I think it's, you know, doing something that one thing that brings you joy every day, if you can fit in one thing, you know, whether it's a workout or reading a book or meditating, you know, really, I think gives you that energizes you to keep going. Because there, I mean, a lot of things that we have to get done just to live and to not, you know, to pay our bills and do things, but finding ways to sneak enjoy is really important.

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Sara Ku is the founder of Kaya Essentials, a skincare and lifestyle company based in Koreatown, Los Angeles. The seeds of the company were planted when Sara was a young girl and would make coconut hair masks with her mother. Her research on fair trade coconut oil inspired her to turn those early experiences into a company, which not only creates amazing products but gives back to the Filipino community. She recently expanded the company by partnering with female Filipino artisans to bring their one-of-a-kind pieces to a global market.

More about Kaya Essentials.

Learn more about The Passionistas Project.

Full Transcript:

Passionistas: Hi, and welcome to the Passionista Project Podcast, where we tell the stories of empowered women who are following their passions to inspire you to do the same.

We're Amy and Nancy Harrington. And today we're talking with Sara Ku. Sara is the founder of Kaya Essentials, a skincare and lifestyle company based in Koreatown, Los Angeles. The seeds of her company were planted when Sara was a young girl and would make coconut hair masks with her mother, her research on fair trade coconut oil inspired her to turn those early experiences into a company which not only creates amazing products, but gives back to the Filipino community. She recently expanded the company by partnering with female Filipino artisans to bring their one-of-a-kind pieces to the global market. So please welcome to the show, Sarah Ku.

Sara: Hi guys. Thank you so much for having me.

Passionistas: What's the one thing you're most passionate about?

Sara: I'm most passionate about making a social impact, you know, focusing on how on the individual level each and every person can make a difference and the importance of small steps, small acts of kindness that together have a big impact when you bring community together. And that brought me to create my business Kaya Essentials.

Passionistas: So, tell us about that.

Sara: Kaya Essentials is a clean organic coconut skincare line, and we recently expanded to a lifestyle, um, with artisan goods, but it really started, you know, um, about five years ago when I was first introduced to the concept of a social business. And that was when I was in college, I was studying history. Um, it's something that I wasn't really passionate about doing, but I was so nervous as to what my career was going to be.

So instead of going to art school, which was always my passion growing up, it's really funny how, when you look back and look at your most memorable, enjoyable times, um, you know, it's really the things that you know, that you're passionate about, but you never really realized that, you know, that's going to bring you the most purpose in life. Um, so I ended up studying history and I really knew that I wasn't in the right space. I was trying so hard to, you know, succeed in, in my studies and, and you know, it wasn't something that came naturally to me, but at the same time, I was studying Asian history, which I was really passionate about because I'm half Filipino, half English. I was born in Hong Kong. So I have a very international background, kind of a third culture kid to the max. Um, so I was born in Hong Kong, lived there for 10 years, lived in India for two years, um, Istanbul in Turkey for three years, and then finally moved to the UK and, and lived there for five years before moving to LA.

So yeah, I was really passionate about studying Asian history, getting to know my culture in more in depth, and I saw on our career bulletin board that there was a talk on a Filipino nonprofit called Gawad Kalinga, and the founder was going to talk about entrepreneurship and social business. And I had, had never heard of the word entrepreneurship or social purpose, social impact, um, but being a Filipino nonprofit, I was really interested. And so that's when I attended that talk and he really, you know, spoke about the communities that are most in poverty and their lack of access to diversify crops, for example, in the Philippines, because we have very fertile land. And so for example, we've had Cocao farms for centuries yet there was no Filipino bean to bar, um, Filipino chocolate company. And he was saying, you know, there's really a missed opportunity here.

And it dawned on me that Philippines has a very big import culture. And so they had an internship opening and I immediately applied and I was a research assistant at first. And then, um, after college I continued my work with them. And I specifically helped with in facilitating European business students to help with their social businesses that they created at their farm. And that was everything from, like I said, the chocolate company to using our local dairy, which is from a Carabao, which is our local cow and using their milk to make ice cream. Um, and also from mushrooms, for example, because mushroom, wasn't a big staple in Filipino cuisine, but with the rise of international restaurants, you know, restaurants in the, in the main city was needing it more. And so they worked with farmers from different local communities to diversify their crops and add more value.

So I was helping with that. And then at the same time, as you mentioned, I was my mom. She was a very big DIY or like she would make her own cleaning products. She would use ketchup, vinegar, vinegar. We always had so much vinegar in the house. And also with, um, her skincare, she would always make her own lotions, deodorant and everything. And so one thing that we did religiously was, um, make a coconut oil hair mask. And in the summers, when we were in the Philippines, we would scrape the coconut meat from the, from the actual coconut and then boil it into an oil and then apply that into our skull, you know, to, to promote like growth and get rid of dandruff to our, to the ends of our hair. And at the same time, I also learned that 60% of coconut farmers in the Philippines lived below the poverty line and the particular jar that I was using, I, um, was a French brand called Latuda Anjell.

And then when I turned it over in small letters, it had said made in the Philippines. And then that's when it really sh… you know, struck me that this was going to be my lifetime passion. This is when I say my coconut dream came to life when I really wanted to create a clean coconut skincare brand that, you know, really promoted the Filipino coconut oil as a point of pride for Filipinos and for the rest of the world. And I knew that coconut oil, um, especially from the Philippines dominated the beauty and skincare market, and even, you know, with coconut food products, you know, we have it in everything and coconut sugar, coconut flour yet, you know, I really wanted to break that disparity and promote fair trade farming. Um, and so through, um, the nonprofit that I was working for Gawad Kalinga I connected with their fair trade coconut farm, and really that's where it all started, that I had the first jar of coconut oil.

And the first idea that came to mind was to make lip balm actually. And the reason why was because lip balm was something small, it was something that everybody needed. I wasn't even thinking from a business mindset so much at that point, I was thinking it's for men, it's for women. It's for all ages, it's for kids, I can sell it to everybody. And with each one, we would donate a school meal back to the local community. And that part was really important to me, going back to what I'm most passionate about. I think that with change that we want to make, it can seem very overwhelming. So I really wanted to show that small acts of change, small acts of kindness can really make a big impact and to have something in your everyday life that you would use that, you know, contributed into making that change.

So I started with lip balms. I had two flavors at the very beginning. One was lemon grass, and the other was calamansi. And calamansi is a Filipino lemon that only exists in the Philippines. It's a very light citrus. And that was the second moment where I knew this was meant to be because I had found a family business in the Philippines that made this into an essential oil, because, you know, you need thousands of calamansi to make any essential oil. And when I first made that lip balm, I thought I loved it because I was Filipino. So of course I'm going to love it. But, you know, after sharing it with friends and family, you know, people were very excited to also try something different and, you know, try the taste of the Philippines in a very unique way. So those were the two first lip balms that I had.

Passionistas: What are some of the other products that you offer now, as time has gone by?

Sara: My first pop-up market, I actually only was selling lip balms. And so before I even had a website, I started looking at craft markets, farmer's markets, and I had my lip balms there. And for the lip balm tester jars, I had them into small jars and several customers that were trying the testers were saying, can I buy this jar? Can I, can I, because I use body balms, I use this all over my body. I use it for my cuticles and for my elbows. And I didn't even think about expanding into different products first. And so really that's where the idea came first to get into body balms. And it was also really the idea to have a very minimalistic approach to your skincare so that, you know, you can, you can have something clean and organic and something that was really affordable as well that was really important to me because what I realized in the beauty world is, you know, I would kind of steal some jars from my mom, you know, in her skincare when I was growing up, because, you know, it was, it was for like, it was very luxurious and I would only use like a little pea sized amount and only use it on the weekend and, and only use it when I really needed it. And really skincare is your life is supposed to be part of your lifestyle. Something that you, you, you can use every single day without feeling bad about the price tag that's attached to it

Passionistas: Talk a little bit about the working conditions and the financial situation of a lot of the farmers in the Philippines. Why was it so important for you to work with those people specifically?

Sara: So, it was really important for me to work with fair trade farming, because I think that in the last decade, there's been a strong focus on organic ingredients, which is really great, and we're moving towards the right way because we know that what we put on our skin absorbs into our bloodstream. But the way that I like to explain it is that how these organic ingredients are grown, isn't necessarily grown in a very organic way with the people that they employ. And so that's where fair trade really comes in. Is that it really ensures that the working conditions are safe and that they know their rights. And also that they're not overworked. That was a very big thing that I had learned from the nonprofit that I worked with, that, you know, especially a father who was a farmer and had two or three children and had to, you know, pay for bills and schools and everything would end up working, you know, 12 hour days, 16 hour days, not knowing when their breaks could be not having, you know, sick days, you know, sick pay days. And, um, so that's where the fair trade, you know, really comp like adds onto the organic. And I really love connecting with different customers that really care about this advocacy in supporting fair trade ingredients as well.

Passionistas: What does Kaya mean? Why did you choose that as the name of the company?

Sara: That's the first question I get a lot, um, in pop-ups is, is your name Kaya. Hi Kaya. And I love the Kaya, but my name is Sara, but Kaya in Filipino means we can do it. So, um, Kaya koa in Tagalog means I can do it. And it's really a personal affirmation back to, you know, what I'm most passionate about is, you know, focusing on the individual level that each person can make a difference. And so it's that affirmation and really that when you come together as a community Kaya, nothin, which means we can do it, you really see that's where changes made. That's where the biggest impact is and the power of the people as well. You see in that. So I knew I wanted it to also have a Filipino name because in the Philippines, there's this strong notion that anything that is high quality has a very Western name. And I really wanted to bring that point of pride to Filipinos that, you know, a love for our culture and our ingredients and our language as well.

Passionistas: You use a lot of Filipino phrases in your branding. Why did you want to do that?

Sara: It was really important for me to honor where the, where we're rooted out, which is in the Philippines. And, you know, that is where we source our coconut oil from. And something that we launched this year in 2020 is our artists and goods collection. And really that was my connection to the nonprofit. I've been connected to all these artisan communities that was upcycling fabrics, creating, you know, beautiful jewelry, beautiful home pieces. And going back to my mission, which with Kaya Essentials, it's a lifelong business, it's a lifelong passion. It's not, I'm not here to have an exit strategy and really looking at how, where can I make more of an impact? And so that's where we launched our lifestyle line. And that was really difficult for me too, because I had introduced Kaya Essentials for the last three years as a skincare brand. And I kind of, you know, was scared to kind of go out of my comfort zone or, or, or be put into a different box. And I realized I was limiting myself. And then I realized, wait a second, I'm the founder, I'm a solo entrepreneur as well. I own a hundred percent of the business. Why can't I do this? And so that's where, um, I began, you know, really connecting with the artistsan communities and figuring out the best pieces to first introduce the collection.

Passionistas: We’re Amy and Nancy Harrington and you're listening to the Passionistas Project Podcast and our interview with Sarah Ku. To learn more about Kaya Essentials, visit Kaya Essentials.com. Now here's more of our interview with Sara.

So, what are some of the challenges you face starting your own business?

Sara: So, as I mentioned, I'm a solo entrepreneur, so that it's really difficult when you have to be your own cheerleader and your biggest critic at the same time. And there's not really, you know, strong markers of success because you don't have a template to follow. You don't have goals that you've set with a team. And so really you have to have a lot of discipline. Um, and especially at the start, when you're doing everything, you're like every single part of building your business is a whole new template for you to learn. And so there was a lot of Googling. Luckily I'm very autodidactic and would connect with any expert in one particular field, but it really got to me because a lot of days it felt very slow. And I realized I had to lean into those slow days and realize that, you know, slow progress is the best progress because I really wanted to focus on getting this right, and really having an organic growth that would last for decades to come.

But, you know, it's hard. It was hard to, especially at the start, have that motivation had that belief in myself. And so, yeah, that was the biggest challenge. And also, you know, imposter syndrome is very real. And for me, I don't have a business background. I lean towards more of the creative side. So in building the product in, in coming up with my marketing materials or anything that never came from the point of view of, okay, what's the trend right now in skincare? What, what are consumers, you know, gravitating towards? And it really just came from an artistic approach. And so that was really difficult when for example, I would share it with different communities, different people and not having the strength to really believe, um, to, to hold that up. And I really, um, really loved when I heard Sara Blakely. Uh, so she she's, uh, she pronounces her name, Sara, um, the founder of Spanx, the first self-made female billionaire in America.

And she said, when she had the idea for Spanx, she didn't share it for the first year. She didn't even share it with her own boyfriend or her family. And she said, when something is an idea, so close to you so that your, so that's your little baby it's that you're so passionate about. You have to really take care of it. That really made an impression on me. And so I learned the hard way to be careful in, you know, what I would share, how I would grow and, you know, really finding the confidence in myself and carrying that through, even in the very slow days,

Passionistas: What are the challenges of working internationally?

Sara: Luckily, I have a business partner here in LA and we source our coconut the fair trade coconut oil together, which, um, you know, when you find, I really believe in the law of attraction and we were both connected to the Filipino nonprofit Gawad Kalinga. And when that happened to be, it, it was just, it laid it all out. Um, but you know, there's a lot of planning ahead. And for someone who, I'm a type of person who wants instant gratification, and also I have a huge attention to detail, which I really think that your best qualities can also be your worst qualities. And so it is really great, especially as a solo entrepreneur, because, you know, getting your website, ready, doing packaging, doing customer service, everything it's, you know, it's good that, you know, I have my lists and everything, but at the same time, especially with international, um, orders, for example, in sourcing the ingredients, you know, there is that, you know, that over time where you have the waiting period and also that period of uncertainty sometimes, and not only from the international side of things, but just in the business side of things that I personally find really difficult.

Um, and so again, it's just, you know, going with the flow, going with the ride and realizing and accepting that, you know, every single day something's going to come up, there's going to be things that are short-term focuses for the next month. And then, you know, some things that are long-term, but, um, you know, carrying that through is, is a challenge, but it's also really exciting and really, really, um, gratifying as well to challenge yourself, um, and see what you can do.

Passionistas: How has the COVID-19 crisis affected your business and maybe in particular working international?

Sara: Yeah. So with this COVID-19, I mean, for everyone, you know, especially small business owners that have a face-to-face, um, element, you know, we've been put out of stock and for key essentials, that was mainly our pop-ups our farmer's markets, our, um, you know, craft markets and everything that is where a lot of our businesses from as well. And also with distribution too, you know, we're in over 20 boutiques all over the US um, you know, unfortunately they've had to close as well. And so, um, what we've been doing is kind of, you know, putting our focus into our online community and recognizing that, you know, social distancing doesn't mean that it's a time, you know, to shut off and really finding ways to connect with one another. Um, so that's been our main focus during this time. And we, um, launched a program this week where for every single body bomb we sell, we are donating a body bomb to the front lines and seeing how we can best, you know, make an impact again, during this time. Where, where possible

Passionistas: Tell us a bit about your production process? Do you make everything yourself?

Sara: Yes. So, uh, everything is handmade by me in my studio. So everything is made in small batches and really where I started, which was in the lip balm that took me over a year to formulate. And even though it's three simple organic ingredients, it's [inaudiable], mango, butter, coconut oil, um, all the different levels of the texture of butter and how that works in, um, you know, in the heat when you have in your bag to when it's cold and the coconut oil and how that blends in. So that took me a really long time to perfect, but from there, it gave me a base to create our body balms. And also our body balms are all infused with essential oils. And that was really important for me too, because one of the biggest chemicals in skincare is fragrances and fragrances is basically a chemical construct to smell like a certain things.

So for example, anything that smells like a banana isn't from a banana, it's impossible to get it from a banana. Um, so it's all chemically formulated. And so that's where essential oils are really great because they come from the actual herb or flower. And yeah, so everything is made in small batches. And that's really important too, because we don't use any silicones. So that's where the formula, um, you know, to get a very smooth formula silicones provides that gel consistency. But for us, we make it in small batches so that we don't have to use any silicones.

Passionistas: You talk about the cold centrifuge, virgin coconut oil? So tell us what that is and what are the benefits of it?

Sara: Cold centrifuge, coconut oil is a spinning process that spins the coconut meat out from the coconut oil. And as it's the spinning process, it doesn't use any heat to boil the coconut oil out. And really that gives a more refined coconut oil that has that retains more of its antioxidants, vitamins, nutrients, and really is coconut oil for your skincare that goes directly onto your skin or your hair, which is different to coconut oil that you cook with, where they boil it, because you're going to heat it up anyway. And it's much faster for production, um, to heat it up and really in the Philippines they've been using this type of process, um, for coconut oil for decades. And, you know, that's something that, that differentiation, not a lot of people know about. And so I really wanted to share, you know, their specialty and how they take care in processing this coconut oil that takes over three days to process from the coconut meat to the oil.

Passionistas: What's your dream for the future of Kaya Essentials?

Sara: My dream for Kaya Essentials is really to focus on how more we can make an impact. So something that we also launched last year was our Conscious Coconut Club. And really that came from the idea of bringing community together to give back where I recognized that there was a space for galas and, you know, those, these big events, but usually the, the cost for, you know, a meal ticket. Wasn't a, and I really felt that there was a lot of people that wanted to be part of giving back part of this initiative. And, you know, they weren't able to take part in something like that. And so we hosted a dinner where each person, you know, came together. We had a meal and we provided a meal back to the Philippines and something that we've also introduced is providing school meals back to our local communities in the US and that's our partnership with no kid hungry. And that really came from our community as well. That really wanted to take part in giving back locally to, you know, now with this new lifestyle line that we have, um, it's also just looking, you know, expanding our brand, um, but always focusing on where we can more make an impact.

Passionistas: What's the biggest risk you ever took and how did it pay off?

Sara: I think the biggest risk I ever took was really focusing on what success meant to me and canceling out the noise and not comparing myself to others. And I say that because, because when you don't have that business background, when you are every single day, not knowing where the template is, and, you know, even just being an entrepreneur is a risk in itself. It, it, you know, um, it's not the easy path. It's not comfortable. You have to find the comfort in the uncomfortable situations, and that's a big risk. Um, but like any risk, you know, it's very satisfying. It's very, um, it's great to put yourself out of your comfort zone and after having lived all over the world and also, you know, having parents that are, you know, that take a lot of risks. My dad left England when, you know, he was in his twenties and lived in and is a civil engineer and worked in Africa, worked all over Asia. I think that just from a young age, kind of just going over the cliff and just going for it is, is, is the way that I've operated. Um, but I would say that's the biggest risk.

Passionistas: You just mentioned finding out what success means to you. So what is your definition of success?

Sara: Definition of success is really in a business sense, looking at what is my mission, where I want to make, where I can make the most impact and how that all fits with the rest of my life. I think balance is so important and I know balance gets thrown around a lot, but really crafting recognizing that you are the one that crafts and cultivates your life. And so you are in full charge of that. And, you know, really living the life where, you know, you don't want to look back and have regrets. And really trying, you know, as the most, you know, trying, despite having any fears, um, you know, to me, is living a very successful life.

Passionistas: Is there any particular trait that you have that you feel has helped your success?

Sara: I would say the particular trait that's really helped me succeed with Kaya Essentials is being very frugal and scrappy and not afraid to get into everything. I think that first had the idea for Kaya Essentials. I was in my early twenties. I didn't have a lot of savings or any savings actually. Um, and it was an idea that I had that I said, okay, that's going to, I'm going to do that. Maybe in my early retirement. That's how far ahead I was thinking, because I didn't know, you know, what you, like, I thought you needed so much investment and, you know, capital to really start a business. And also not trusting myself that I would be able to learn all the different areas. And so, as I mentioned before, being autodidactic, and just not afraid to learn everything from building a website on Shopify, to researching all the different packaging. That's something that I underestimated as well in building a business is how much thought and care has to go into packaging and how, you know, that really depends on, on so many things.

And, um, I, my friends will always say that I am the most frugal person that they've ever met. Um, and it's just something that always came naturally to me. My mom was a domestic helper. Um, when she was 17, she moved from the Philippines to Hong Kong. And, you know, she, she grew up in poverty in the Philippines. And she worked, um, you know, under the table with, with her mom, with my grandma, um, in the factory because my grandma was paid on the quantity of snacks that they were producing, that they were packaging, you know, without an hourly wage. And so she brought her daughters, um, you know, to help out. And my mom always taught me, you know, to have a really strong work ethic and, and not being afraid to, you know, do the tasks that are, you know, um, that are very time consuming as well.

Because I think that when you start a business, um, you really have to do every single part. And so, for example, like I mentioned, I, um, crafting all of our products and also packaging as well. And with each package, I write a personalized note to our customer. And that's something that I never want to let go of because for me, someone who's joined our community and given me their hard working dollars to, you know, part of this, you know, it really means a lot. And so, um, you know, I really love connecting with my customers in that way. And so that's something that I'm never going to stop doing, but yeah, not being afraid to be scrappy. And when I talk to other female entrepreneurs that have an idea that are starting out, um, you know, I really say that there are so many different ways to grow a business and, you know, do what feels right to you.

It's really good to know every single pathway and whether that's going down the investment route, route, you know, having angel investors or, you know, um, whatever it is and knowing your strategy as well. So is that going to be wholesale? So do you need a manufacturer? How much quantity do you need? Do you want to be able to produce and breaking that down as well? Because you know, your profit in the end is different for all of those outcomes. And really focusing on what makes sense for you not being afraid to start small either. I always share that, you know, the lip balm formula took me over a year to perfect. I was selling it, you know, first with just friends and family. And then with, you know, in pop-up markets, farmer's markets before I even had a website, because I couldn't even, you know, put that on my plate to begin to think how it would look like to have a Kaya Essentials website, you know, and I, and I still cringe at the first iteration of the website, you know, and I love sharing that because I say, you know, taking your time organically going through it, um, you know, is the best way because I learned so much that I couldn't rush. Um, so not being afraid, you know, be frugal scrappy and take your time and define your own success as well and how you want to build your passion.

Passionistas: Thanks for listening to the Passionistas Project Podcast, and our interview with Saraj Ku. To learn more about Kaya Essentials, visit KayaEssentials.com.

And visit ThePassionistasProject.com to learn more about our podcast and subscription box filled with products made by women owned businesses and female artisans to inspire you to follow your passions. The winter box — with the theme Passionistas Pamper — is on sale now, and will ship just-in-time for the holidays. Sign up for our mailing list to get 10% off your first purchase.

And be sure to subscribe to the Passionistas Project Podcast so you don't miss any of our upcoming inspiring guests.

Until next time stay well and stay passionate.

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Chandra Beckman is a retired US Air Force fighter pilot who knows a bit about working in and managing difficult situations. Maneuvering through the many challenges in being an extreme minority as a female fighter pilot with children, Chandra continually found ways to overcome. The willpower, grit and determination that saw her through tough times in military and parenting situations was exactly what she needed when she faced the largest challenge of her life: her own health crisis. Undiagnosed multi-systemic issues for over a decade left her in long periods of house bound (and occasional bed-bound) states, discarded by the conventional medical realm. Based on her journey she is now creating a life in which she can use her “battle scars” to assist others who find themselves stuck in places where it seems no one can help.

More about Chandra.

Learn more about The Passionistas Project.

Full Transcript:

Passionistas: Hi, and welcome to The Passionistas Project Podcast, where we tell stories of empowered women who are following their passions to inspire you to do the same. We're Amy and Nancy Harrington and today we're talking with Chandra Beckman, a retired us Air Force fighter pilot, who knows a bit about working in and managing difficult situations. Maneuvering through the many challenges in being an extreme minority as a female fighter pilot with children, Chandra continually found ways to overcome. The willpower, grit and determination that saw her through tough times in military and parenting situations was exactly what she needed when she faced the largest challenge of her life — her own health crisis. Undiagnosed multi-systematic issues for over a decade, left her in long periods of housebound and occasional bedbound states discarded by the conventional medical realm based on her journey. She is now creating a life in which she can use her battle scars to assist others who find themselves stuck in places where it seems no one can help. So please welcome to the show. Chandra, Beckman.

Chandra, what's the one thing you're most passionate about.

Chandra Beckman: The one thing I'm most passionate about now is inclusive, inclusive healthcare options for all Americans. My journey was on laborious and costly, and I realized that if I was not in the financial position, that I was very fortunate to be in, I would not have been able to obtain the care that I did. And so I think it's very, very important for all of these health care options to be available to all Americans.

Passionistas: We totally agree. So let's start at the beginning of your journey. Why don't you tell everybody what you were doing for a career when your journey began?

Chandra: I was flying fighter jets for the United States Air Force, and I was 10 years into my career when my health started to fail. And it was very, very odd symptoms ranging from abdominal pain to GI issues, to headaches, to sinus issues, to things like mood changes, where I had previously been really optimistic and, you know, I loved challenges. I wanted to tackle anything that that could be done. And I started just getting snippy and short and angry. And my physical strength just started going away. Like literally I'm going to the gym working out more than I had been in the previous two years. And the number of sit-ups I could do was going backwards. And my physical strength just got zapped

Passionistas: Before we get into your journey to discover what that was all about. Tell us a little bit about being a fighter pilot. What inspired you to become a fighter pilot? And what was that like?

Chandra: So I was inspired to be a fighter pilot by the movie top gun. And I think I saw that way back in 1986 and I was sixth grade or so, but I loved the energy. I love the passion, the speed pushing yourself to the limit. And I just decided that's what I wanted to do. I had no idea how to get there. I had help along the way, very, very fortunate to link up with an Air Force recruiter who steered me down the path that I needed to take in order to achieve that goal.

Passionistas: It's not a very female dominated industry. So what was that experience like for you as a woman?

Chandra: For me personally, it was difficult. Although I don't think at the time I realized how difficult it was. I was so focused on doing the best I could. Every single day I was focused on completing the requirements I needed to complete. I was focused on flying to the best of my ability. And then when I went home, I was taking care of my kids with my husband. And so I didn't have time to step back and really take a look at how difficult is this position really to be in.

Passionistas: I can't even imagine how stressful that type of work must be.

Chandra: Yeah, I think for anyone, it is a very stressful job. I am pretty petite. So you know, about 5’ 4”, 115 pounds. And so every single day when I was flying, I was reaching my limits and beyond in order to perform and in order to fly the airplanes, you know, the seats are fixed. So they're really made for a range of sizes, but that range is not for the really small people or the really big people. And so you accommodate you adjust, you, figure out how can I make this situation work for me? And I can't reach the rudder pedals if they're not all the way up or I can't reach the stick in the airplane. When I'm looking over my shoulder, checking behind the airplane, flying the airplane upside down, you know, at 315 knots. And if I don't put my seat at just the right place, I can't do this physically because of that.

So every single day I was operating at the edge of my limits and then not to mention being the lone female in the all-male environment, it definitely had its challenges.

Passionistas: How did the men react to you?

Chandra: I didn't really pay attention to that. I know when I first entered that there were men that did not want me or any woman there, others didn't care either way, some were welcoming, but honestly, I really never paid attention to that aspect because I was doing everything I could to survive. And I think you have to, in that case focus, because if you open yourself to the negativity that may be existing around you, you easily drown.

Passionistas: And was there camaraderie among the women or was it competitive?

Chandra: I had a, a female in my pilot training class with me and we actually had discussions on that and we commented on that very aspect because her and I got along very well and we would pass other women in the hallway who wouldn't even say hello to us. And so we would just kind of ponder that, well, why is this? There's very few of us? Why would we not even just acknowledge that they're there? And I think there is there at least then 20 years ago, there was some of that, you know, you have to be tough and climb your own way up because there's only so many people that will get to where you want to go. Later on. As I moved into the, my career, my first assignment, I was the only female. So there wasn't any anyone to fight with. Right? I do remember my, what would you call the unit commander?

The squadron commander came to me at one point though, because they were ha they were getting another female to the larger organization and they were wondering, where do we put her? Do we bring her into our squadron with you? Do we put her in the other squadron? What do we do? And I actually really appreciated the fact that he came to talk to me about it. I didn't know the individual. And, and I did tell him, honestly, listen, sometimes these situations work out great. We have new issues, we're a team player. We're just trying to do the best job we can. But other times there's a lot of hostility and I unfortunately don't know the individual, so I could not give him, you know, a definite answer either way. But I did answer it as honestly, as I could, based on the situation and scenarios I had seen.

Passionistas: Where did you fly?

Chandra: Yeah, my first assignment operational flying was actually stationed at Eglin Air Force Base in Florida. And there I was flying the F 15 C. We did have a few deployments for different things. And after that assignment, I actually went and flew the F one 17 out of Holloman Air Force base in New Mexico. My only official overseas assignment was to the Republic of Korea. And in that assignment I wasn't flying.

Passionistas: So you are in this very intense career and you start to have these health issues and these symptoms talk about going to a doctor for the first time. What diagnosis were you given?

Chandra: The first time I actually went to a doctor because of all of these random, strange, unusual symptoms. I was actually in the Republic of Korea and I had been kind of observing what was going on for the past four months. And I had been to the doctor for just acute things, you know, like a sinus infection, but I had never gone into this whole conglomeration of symptoms that were occurring. And at the time I was weak to the point where, when I tried to climb up the two flights of stairs to get to my dorm room after work, I had to stop because I did not have enough oxygen to continue walking up the flight of stairs. And, you know, for someone who had been doing a very physically demanding job, the fact that I can't go up two flights of stairs without running out of oxygen, the fact that I'm working out and getting weaker, the fact that I'm having significant digestive issues and that my mood is changing and that I'm starting to have a lot of pain.

You know, these are all really, really big concerns. So I finally take them to the doctor and this was my introduction to conventional medicine. And I call it really the opening bookend. I explained to her everything that was going on and her response was you miss your kids. You'll be fine when you get back to the States. And honestly, I was like shocked, like my jaw kind of, you know, if it could, or if it did, I don't know that it did in front of her. I'm not sure I would have shown her, my reactions. I usually keep them hidden, but my jaw dropped at the same time. I'm like, I can't walk up two flights of stairs and you're telling me, this is because I miss my kids. Can I punch you in the face? You know, what's what, how, how is this even?

Okay. So that was the opening. Along with that, I had my right. I had some blurriness to it that was passing. And honestly the only thing that came out of that appointment, it was that she got me to the optometrist to, to try to see if we could get some lenses to help with the blurriness in my eyes. But other than that, there was nothing. And yeah, like I said, that was the kind of the opening bookend to my experience with conventional medicine that lasted over 10 years.

Passionistas: So then what's the next step? Your health continues to deteriorate. And do you go to a different doctor? How do you move forward?

Chandra: Yeah, over the next several years, I was seen by, I, I, to be honest, I don't have the actual count. I never did count the probably hundreds of doctors because I was transferred back to the United States back into a flying position.

And I became so weak that I could not fly. You know, another interesting factor here is, as this is occurring, the flight medicine doctors, who, some of them were very helpful. Some of them were understanding. They actually were, you know, told me to my face. I believe you. And I do honestly think something seriously is going wrong. And they were helping me get to the next step. On the other hand, you have the flight docs who told my boss she's scared to fly. And I get this. My boss happens to tell me this one day. And I said, really I'm scared to fly. Well, how am I still flying my own airplane at home, which has no objection, seat and still wanting to do it still wanting to fly Air Force aircraft. Yet my physical strength is so weak that I can't do it. And eventually my physical strength got so weak.

I couldn't even fly our own airplane at home. So, you know, individuals and it used to be just women, but it's getting to be more and more men are facing this kind of behavior, this kind of mindset from the doctors who are there to help us supposedly. And so it became very, very difficult for me to navigate that system. And I had to continue going and continue fighting for the next doctor who was going to be able to help me. I was sent through the Air Force’s medical center at the time. At the time it was called the Wilford hall. They did the full workup. They did find some minor things. And eventually I got to the Mayo clinic. They also did a full workup, some very minor things that, you know, of course, if we found, we took action on throughout this process, I went through two necessary surgeries.

Had we known what we do now, the Jews went to the unnecessary and finally in the fall of 2015, early 2016, my health crashed so much again, that I was begging the doctors to help. Meanwhile, during this, you know, almost 10 year period, I'm working a full-time job in the Air Force, not flying. It was, you know, doing various what you would call desk, desk jobs. And I'm trying to navigate the medical system while performing at work to the best of my ability.

Passionistas: And you're raising children.

Chandra: Yes. Yeah. At the time began having the serious symptoms. I was dating my now husband, but I have two grown boys and he had three girls and so five kids together while this is going on. And you know, you're like here I am someone who is used to performing and getting things done and doing whatever it takes to make things happen.

And, you know, not understanding what is it that these doctors can't help me. And as we roll back to the 2015, 2016 timeframe, when I'm bed bound several days a month, like literally do not have the strength to lift my arm off the bed. I can't work more than half a day. Most days, if that, and the doctor who I'm begging to help me tells me, you have fibromyalgia, no further workup puts it in my record. And so within the military system, you're only allowed to go to these doctors and I fought and fought and used every Avenue I could within that system and find the, I said, I'm not going to sit in the system to die. And I made up my mind to do my own research and find the doctors that could help.

Passionistas: How did you do that? And what did you eventually find out?

Chandra: Yeah, I did that by significant self-research and really it began, it, it became reading books by doctors, doctors who were in the trenches, helping patients, doctors who are specialists in areas based on symptoms I had based on the lack of energy, the energy was the biggest thing for me. And so I started researching that and eventually it brought me to the fact that I needed a functional medicine doctor and I had done the research. We had one in Las Vegas. I had spent three to four months trying to get the insurance company to pay for that because she did accept a version of my insurance. It wasn't the one I had, but if I had been my children or my spouse, I could have walked into her and made an appointment and gone to see her. And finally, I said, you know what? This is ridiculous.

I'm not going to live like this for the rest of my life. And I paid cash first appointment. She took down all the symptoms. They were the same things. I had been telling people the, for the last almost 10 years, and based on all of the intake paperwork I had filled out for her, which was over 15 pages worth. She says, you have Lyme disease and why is no one seeing this? She followed it up with,ulab tests, which were confirmed. And for anyone out there who's not familiar with Lyme disease. Not only is Lyme disease prevalent or present, but usually there's any number of co-infections present with the Lyme disease and other viruses, things like mold toxicity, things like heavy metal toxicity. Your, your, your body is basically a toxic heap of trash inside. And especially when you've been living like this for 10 years.

And that day she told me, listen, it's going to take you two to five years to recover from this. You have been sick for so long. I was one of the worst patients she had. She had one of the most complex and worst patients, as far as the kind of shape I was in at that point began a new journey. Little do you know that when you get a diagnosis such as Lyme disease and, a complex chronic illnesses, the treatment often puts you into worse spaces and places than you have been through just living with it. And that journey was to me, the worst part, the most difficult part, but it also brought about the most learning experiences that I would have never had. I see the world in such a different place, in a different space, and then in just a different way than I did before. I'm very, very grateful for this journey and to be this far along in it, to where I can actually talk to people now, because the, the self-care that comes along with this is never ending. So, you know, one day you may be able to work for an hour and the next day you're in bed for all day, because you don't know how your body's going to perform, and you do the best you can to get the max performance out of it.

Passionistas: You're listening to The Passionistas Project Podcast, and our interview Chandra Beckman to learn more about Shondra and her business Soul Central Coaching and Consulting, visit Chandra beckman.com., visit Chandra, beckman.com. Now here's more of our interview with Chandra.

You said that this has made you look at the world differently. How did you look at it before? And how do you look at it now?

Chandra: Before? I don't think I was as accepting of people, accepting of others. The perspectives that I see now are so much more interesting and enriching to me. This has really allowed me to really expand that view.

Passionistas: But at what point did you leave the Air Force and why did you make that decision?

Chandra: I actually ended up retiring at the time that I became so sick. I couldn't function normally in the military, you go through what's called a medical evaluation board so that they can take a look at your case, determine whether or not you're capable of remaining on active duty to serve. And at the time when I should have went through one of those, I had already had an approved retirement date. I was getting CA better care than what that the military could provide. And so if we had pursued the medical evaluation board, it would have just extended my time on active duty a lot longer at that point I was allowed to retire. So I actually did 20 years.

Passionistas: So you have had intimate experience with our health care system. What have you taken away from those experiences and how has it made you look at the system that exists in the United States?

Chandra: While I was in it, it was atrocious at that point though, I did not realize how handcuffed, how not blind, but there are blinders on our medical system and how entrenched they are in one way of medicine. And it is not the individual medical care providers faults. It is the system that has been created through the insurance companies, through the pharmaceutical companies and the system that our nation has bought into, if you will, and there's history behind. If anyone wants to go look into it, I think it started back in about the 20 1920s when we kind of discarded the other medical care options. And now I feel so sorry, I guess, for people that are stuck in that system, I feel empathy for the people having to work within it and having to go to work day in and day out and not have answers for people or not be allowed to take the time, to really sit down and understand people, understand why things are happening.

And that's, what's required in order for wellness to thrive in order for healthcare to be healthcare instead of sick care. And when you get out into the integrative and functional health medicine options and natural pathic, there is a, a plethora of options available to people yet we're not even educated on them. And I think that was a big thing for me is these options are available. These options were out there. They're legal, they're in the United States yet. None of my conventional medicine doctors even knew about them. So, you know, it's one thing if they could tell me about them so I could go pursue them, even if I had to do it at my own cost, but they aren't even educated on them.

Passionistas: And you would have to do them at your own cost, which as you said earlier, is prohibitive to people who don't have those means.

Chandra: Absolutely. And I'll tell you, that's one of the big things that I had to let go of, you know, the first six, eight, maybe even 12 months of recovery, once I was accurately diagnosed, I would hurt. I would feel for the thousands, if not millions of people in the United States that are suffering and you know, what we would consider S you know, the, the most well off nation on earth. And we have these people who are suffering because they can't afford this kind of care that is available and would help them get better so that they can be more productive in the future. How is this right? How is this even happening? Yeah. So I had to add that point, you know, I had to take a step back and say, okay, you've got to focus on using your financial resources to recover, to take care of yourself, to get stronger, to heal so that you can help those who maybe aren't aware of it, or maybe can't financially afford it.

Passionistas: So how are you helping people at this point?

Chandra: I am very fortunate to be at the point where I am able to be a resource for others. I was able to start my own coaching business so that I can be a source of education, a source of resources, a source of accountability for those that are going down this path. And I won't even limit it to healthcare because the clients that I work with really don't come from the same path that I walked, but really about transformation and digging deep into yourself and finding ways that you can affect your own life in much more positive ways. And that has been very rewarding that I am now to the point where I, I do have time and I do have energy to help others.

Passionistas:  So what are some of the services you offer?

Chandra: I offer personalized one-on-one coaching and my role as a coach is to help people with whatever goal they have. It can be a personal goal, it could be professional, it can be transformational, it can be a health goal. And we walk together down that path options and the resources that are available for them and allowing the individual to really dig deep inside themselves and figure out what is going to work best for them. And my role is to be a partner. It's not to tell them what to do. It's really to be a partner in walking that path of discovery.

Passionistas: What advice would you give to someone who's in a similar situation to what you went through and not getting the information they need to get better?

Chandra: The first thing is don't give up. That was one of the beliefs that I had from the beginning when I started doing my own research. And really, you know, as you're age 40 and you're in bed saying, this is not the way I want to live the rest of my life. And there's answers out there. I know there is, and I'm going to find them. And so for anyone that finds myself there, don't give up because the answers do exist. They are out there. And when you start exploring, you will find that the next step will become available. It will appear before you, as you start researching and having to dig in and do that work. And then the other thing I would say with that as well, is that nutrition, nutrition is foundational for healing. And so I went through a number of dieticians and nutritional consultants, and it wasn't until we figured out what nutrition was best for me, and really strengthened my body and helped my body heal, that I could really start moving forward. And that's different for every single person. And so it takes a lot of time to relate to figure that out.

Passionistas: And how are you feeling today?

Chandra: Today? I'm feeling pretty good. I, you know, when you're dealing with people with invisible illnesses, it's easy to show up and have other people look at you and say, Hey, you look great, but they don't know everything that goes into you just showing up for that 10 or 15 minutes or showing up and sounding happy for that 10 or 15 minutes, or the fact that your body inside right now, it feels like 65 years old, but your face looks like you're 30.

And so I am doing so much better today than I was six months ago and six months prior to that. Now in six months prior to that, the journey is very slow. And as a former fighter pilot, I just want to take the actions, do the steps that are required to fix it and go on. And that's been one of the biggest learning points of this journey is like, okay, the body heals at the speed, the body heals, and you have to have patience for it.

Passionistas:  Now that you're helping other people, what's the most rewarding part of this journey?

Chandra: I think the most rewarding part of the journey is that I now have an even bigger toolbox, if you will, to be able to help and empower others to grow prior to this, I had never experienced getting close to suicide. I didn't even understand it, but it was never something that I would consider going through this journey and hitting the, and hitting that black wall of, I now have a decision to make, I can choose to keep fighting and keep living, or I can choose to end this. Now I now understand how people can get to that position. I would not have understood that before. I now understand why when people say I couldn't get out of bed, no, you physically can't get out of bed. It's not like you're making this up, you know? And it happens.

Passionistas: What do you think is the biggest lesson you've learned about yourself on this journey.

Chandra: Self-Love kindness really becoming okay with the fact that you can love yourself and you can love yourself first, because if you don't do that, eventually there won't be anything left of you. I think that's really important. I know it's really important for women. I don't know how much this can apply to men or to, to anyone else who from an early age, we're taught that at least I was taking care of yourself and giving yourself that self-love was not okay. It wasn't appropriate. There was something wrong with it. And I think that that is probably the most important factor.

Passionistas: What's your dream for women?

Chandra: To feel free, to feel free, to be who they are, and to understand that other women can be who they are and it's okay. And we can all be who we are without condemnation without having to judge. And there's beauty in that.

Passionistas: Thanks for listening to The Passionistas Project Podcast  and our interview with Chandra Beckman. To learn more about Chandra and her business Soul Central Coaching and Consulting, visit ChandraBeckman.com.

Please visit ThePassionistasProject.com to learn more about our podcast and subscription box filled with products made by women owned businesses and female artisans to inspire you to follow your passions. Our winter box with the theme, Passionistas Pamper will be on sale soon. Sign up for our mailing list to get 10% off your first purchase.

And be sure to subscribe to The Passionistas Project Podcast so you don't miss any of our upcoming inspiring guests.

Until next time stay well and stay passionate.

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The Passionsitas Project welcomes Jessica Craven from Chop Wood, Carry Water. Jess gives phonebank training and chats about ways to get involved in the final weeks leading up to the November 3 election.

Jessica Craven is a community organizer, activist and member of the California Democratic party’s County Central Committee. Jessica is the author of "Chop Wood, Carry Water," a daily actions e-mail that’s been published five days a week since November of 2016. Her emails provide detailed text and scripts for the everyday person to reach out to their Congress people and Senators to take action on the important issues of the day. She’s made it her mission to get regular people more involved with politics on both a federal and local level.

Hear Jessica's full episode here.

FULL TRANSCRIPT:

Passionistas: Hi, everybody. Thank you so much for being here with us today. Um, anybody who's been reading our posts, especially lately knows how anxiously I have been about the election and where things are headed. And, uh, our guardian angel spirit guide in this entire process has been our guests today. Uh, Jessica Craven, who does an amazing newsletter, um, which is how we first were introduced to her. It's called chalkboard carry water. We'll let her tell you about that, but it gives you daily actions so that you can be involved politically and make a difference. And, um, and then when we did our summit in August, uh, we asked just to do a workshop that she has called activism one Oh one, and it was an incredible hour where she gave us all these different things that we could do to be involved and help, um, make a difference during the election period.

And we had been doing them tirelessly. We've been writing letters, we've been sending postcards. Uh, we have been texting, they've done everything but calling cause we're still a little shy, introverted when it comes to that, but just assures us that even introverts could make calls. So she's going to tell us about that today and a bunch of other things. We're just going to talk with her about what we can all do in the six weeks, 39 days. I think that we have left, um, to make a difference. And she's going to maybe talk a few of us off the Lake, um, anxiety and nervousness, no pressure. Um, but so welcome to our group today, Jessica grade.

Jessica Craven:  Thank you. Thank you for having me. Um, thanks both of you.

Passionistas: You've been such wonderful advocates and, uh, this is a great group and I'm very glad to be here. And, uh, yeah. Do you want me to start by just talking about the thing that Nancy and I were talking about before we started?

Jessica: Okay, well, you know, we, Nancy was saying that she was having some anxiety and I think that a lot of people were having a lot of anxiety because of the news is extremely anxiety provoking right now. And, uh, I was just saying simply that I, my tactic right now is just to stay very, very, very busy. Um, I feel that there is an enormous amount of fear-mongering happening in the news right now. And there is a, um, you know, there is a payoff for Trump and for his side, when we are all freaking out and running around, um, you know, wringing our hands about the fact that he is going to steal the election, because every minute that I'm doing that, I am working to get out the vote.

And honestly, I see what's happening right now is a very successful form of voter suppression. They are very successfully getting people to feel like it's hopeless and we're gonna lose cause he's already going to steal the election. And so what's the point. And in that sense, he's a giant bully who is successfully bullying the entire school yard right now with a threat that he can't even possibly carry out. And I know that people read the Atlantic article and I know that people feel that he's going to get all these people to sort of line up and do these horrible things to, um, and I just am not, I'm not there. I actually still have enough faith in the American system as a whole, although parts of it are very broken right now. Um, and I, I subscribed to this wonderful writer or Hubbell who writes a political, uh, newsletter every night.

And, um, you know, he, he said exactly this this morning, he was like, it's quite frustrating to see people so quickly buy into this kind of, you know, Trump says all kinds of things. He says insane things all the time. And like, I never believed anything that he says. So I don't know why we're all believing this part so much that he is going to successfully organize a coup right in front of us, that the entire country will participate in, um, or enough to carry it out successfully. It's I have a very sort of, you know, my, my spiritual practice is such that what I, what I have learned to do no matter what is happening in my life that is troubling or scary is to stay in the day and do the thing in front of me that I can do. And that's where the Chop Wood Carry Water comes from is just instead of freaking out about something that might happen in six weeks.

Um, what can I do right now? And, and frankly, I'm distressed at the level to which his tactics right now are successful. I'm distressed at how many people I see who normally would be busy making calls right now who have spent their entire days sending frantic emails back and forth about is he going to still be election? Well, yeah, he's going to win the election if we don't work. So work. You know, I mean, as I try to remind people, if Trump were this able to steal an election, he would not have, let us win. In 2018, we would not have won Doug Jones's seat in the Senate. We would not have won the governor seats. We won last year, we flipped to Virginia state house. We flipped essentially the New York state house, although they were Democrats, but they caucused with Republicans. We got them all out.

Like we have voted so many bad actors out and nobody, one time has said, Oh, that election wasn't valid. Sorry, people accept the results of an election. Trump won't. But Trump is a malignant narcissist. He's insane. So who cares? I mean, he he's, I won't even begin to list the delusions that guy lives under, but there are a lot of people who would have to cooperate with him. And I fundamentally don't believe they will. Um, and, and whether or not okay, even if they will, there's nothing we can do about it now. But what we can do is wind so overwhelmingly that that's not even a possibility. And if our numbers are enormous, which they absolutely can be, we absolutely have the numbers for it. All indications are that early voting is overwhelmingly on our side. So just keep it up. Don't let this total loser, baby man distract you from saving the country.

He's seen, does not work the gum on the bottom of my shoe. This man and people are giving entire days and weeks to worrying about what he's going to do, who cares? He's a loser, the guy is a loser. So let's just make sure that we have so many votes that even he, with his total delusions and delusions of grand jury or whatever else he has cannot lie. I keep thinking of the inauguration crowds. You know, he said over and over again, that it was the biggest inauguration crowd ever, but history and all of us know that it wasn't. So he can say we're all cheating or we're all, but everybody else will know that that's not the case. And frankly, I don't think that the military is so behind them at this point that they're going to enable him in a coup it's just not going to happen.

So sorry. I'm very passionate about this because my job is to recruit people into action. My job is to get people busy making phone calls, which is a proven tactic for winning elections, right? Sending letters, sending postcards, texts, making these things work. And when people are wringing their hands in this kind of like fear mania, they're not doing that. So I just got off the phone with, I mean, often about call with flip the West with their team of people who were working to flip the Senate. It's an enormous team of people who are so committed and working so hard. Don't let all of these people work so hard and then give all of our attention to the, the ninny and the white house instead, you know, come and join us in the work. We will win in the work. So that is my sermon. Sorry. I'm just drinking my tea. So I'm very thankful.

Passionistas: It's, no, it's excellent. We need to hear it. Yeah. We need to hear it, everybody already saying great advice and thank you.

Jessica: It is true. I mean, I wake up every day, I feel like totally panicked. And then I go through the list in my head like, Oh, am I freaked out about this? Now this now I'm going to go, Oh, to see a lecture. And then I roll out of bed and I pick up my posts in my list and I just start writing and I wait until I can get onto the texting. And I start flexing and I feel better, you know?

Yeah. Action is the antidote. And it is every time. And you know, I'm doing these activism one-on-one classes. And so many people were coming, which is great. So part of my job is just to let other people know how many people are doing this work right now. So w in my workshop, you know, you heard me talk about the drop of water, right. And it's very easy for us all to feel like that individual drop of water, like, Oh, who cares? I'm just, I'm so small. And if I just make like one hour of calls, who cares, like it's so insignificant, but you have to remember all the other drops of water who are also doing their little jobs. And when you get that many drops of water together, that's, as I say, when you start to carve stone, like then you are participating in something so much bigger than yourself.

And there are a lot of people doing this work. I am telling you because I do it with them. And I see them. And I hear about the groups that are phone banking and post carding and sending letters to voters in Milwaukee and just little groups that have got brilliant ideas for ways to help and are doing them. And, uh, the news doesn't talk about it. And I remember before 2018, the news didn't talk about it either. I was like, am I crazy? Because I feel like with this much stuff happening, we are going to win, but everyone keeps saying we're going to lose, but I see what people are doing. How could we possibly lose? And we weren't. Right. But the news is not going to say, Oh, we're going to win because that doesn't get clicks. And we, these little, you know, we middle-aged women, activists, we definitely don't get clicks.

Right? Like nobody cares about us. We're middle-aged women. But the work that we're doing is massive. And we are going to save the country. Don't get me wrong. That is what is going to happen. And the news will not carer until after it's happened. And then they'll give the credit somewhere else because no one wants to credit people like us, but it doesn't matter. We're not doing it for the credit. We're doing it for. Right. Right. So who cares? But believe me, I remember this from 2018, no one covered the resistance back then either, even after the fact, no one covered us, but it's fine. We're still going to do the work and we're still going to win. You can attribute it to the tooth fairy for all I care. I don't really care, but we are doing the work and we know how to do this work.

And let me tell you, people are doing this work in vast numbers. So, but that's not what I came here to talk about. I came here to talk about phone banking, but I just, you know, I get passionate because it's important. I want to wear a big t-shirt that just says less news, less news, more action. Because honestly, even I can get sucked into Twitter. And after five minutes on Twitter, I want to kill myself. It's over. Right. But that's not reality. That's Twitter. And there's, uh, you know, there are aspects of reality on it, but there's also a lot that is not real on it. The work is real, you know, talking to voters on the phone is real. I've phoned banks several times already this week. And when I get someone on the phone who was like on the fence and I convinced them, that's real. And, uh, you know, you guys and the people doing this work, we are real. And we, we will make a difference. So I guess I'm here to do the opposite of what Trump is doing today, right? Like I want to power people and give them their faith back and remind them that they have power. And that, you know, you have agency, you can make a difference. Every single person listening to this, it's hugely powerful. Don't let Trump take that away from you. He doesn't deserve to have anything of yours. Nothing.

Passionistas: Thank you. I needed to, I needed to hear that. Thank you. Thank you. I had one other question for you about something I read this morning. Did you read that Esquire magazine article about, um, maybe people who can, should vote in person?

Jessica: I didn't. Okay.

Passionistas:  Because it was just saying that it was just that, you know, this whole, his whole scam right now is based on, you know, mail in votes and de-legitimizing the mail in votes. So what do you think about that? Do you think it it's better? If people can take the chance and go boat in person, is it better to mail it in person?

Passionistas: I don't know. I think that I know in California, we were told that if we mailed our ballots by October 10th, that they would be counted by election day. Um, but again, we've had so many elections where the results were not determined for weeks after and nobody cried foul. No one said that election is not valid. Katie Porter, her election was determined like two weeks after the fact, no, she's there in Congress kicking . I mean, Trump can say what he wants. It requires more than him saying that something is fraudulent. And frankly, I really don't see Mitch McConnell as awful as he is. He's he made a statement today saying like, we're going to respect the results of the election. He's not going to go down that road. I just don't. I mean, so I think vote, however you feel I'm voting by mail. I'm going to mail my ballot right after I get it.

And I'm going to track my ballot. Just vote. I don't think when we vote is as much at issue. If it makes you feel better. Sure. Go vote in person. Most States have early voting. We go to the grocery store. I don't actually think that voting is like a super dangerous activity. But if you're someone who's highly at risk vote by mail. Yeah. I don't think it matters. Just vote, vote and track your ballot, make a voting plan and get three friends and family to vote. Especially those who probably wouldn't have voted unless you prompted them. Because honestly your friends and family are more likely to vote. If you ask them to then if I, some stranger calls them, you know, this is relational organizing. It's really critical right now that we each take responsibility for getting three people who maybe wouldn't have voted otherwise to vote. I'm working on my niece. That's my, that's my goal. No, she's one person who is right now is thinking of writing into candidate and I'm working on her with everything I know to get her not to do that. And it doesn't matter the reasons, this is just really important to me. And if I fail, I'll work on someone else. But if we all do that, think about the power of that.

Passionistas: You bring up a good point too, which is you can track your ballot once you send it. And everybody should do that just to…

Jessica: Not in every state, not in every state. Sorry to interrupt you. But in many States you can. Yes. Yes.

Passionistas: Okay. And where do you find, where do you go to do that?

Jessica: Secretary of State website? The secretary of state website is really your friend. You just Google your state secretary of state, and then all of your questions are, are, can be answered there. So, and yes, in California, they make it very easy to sign up where you can actually, you'll all get a text message when they received my ballot and the text message when it's been, um, you know, entered into the system. So I don't know that every state does it as well, but look into your state and find out.

And another really important thing about voting by mail is to follow the instructions very carefully. Yes. Yeah. If you sign, if you sign in the wrong place or you sign your signature sloppily and it doesn't match what they have on record, or you don't steal the inside envelope or whatever it is, you do wrong. That vote will be disqualified. So I need to make sure that you follow the directions very carefully.

Well, and in Pennsylvania, in particular with this whole naked ballot thing, if you mail in your vote by mail ballot, put it in the inner envelope, because if you don't put it in that inner envelope, the secrecy sleeve, they will not count it, which is absurd. But you know, we have to work with a lot of servers right now. So yes. Being educated about what the rules are in your state is incredibly important.

Passionistas: Particularly if you live in a swing state or voter suppression state, right?

Jessica: Yeah. And like, I'm going to, I'm getting together with some elderly relatives. I told them once they get their vote, that we're going to go to lunch, we're going to take a risk and you go to an outdoor restaurant and I'm going to walk them through it. I'm going to make friends to do it exactly. Right. And then we're going to go wherever they can go to drop it off. We're going to drive there with them. We're going to make sure.

Passionistas: So if you know anybody that might not, you don't think a hundred percent is going to understand the process because it's so different than what they used to offer to help them.

Jessica: Yep. Yes, absolutely. That is exactly right. Yeah. And elderly people. Don't always, a lot of times when we phone bank, we'll find someone who has, you know, 81 years old. Yes. I want to provide them, but I don't have internet. I mean, not everybody has internet. Right. Um, and so those people need, sometimes some of them to show up at their door with a form or, you know, help ordering the form for them and having it sent to them or whatever. But yes, I think we all need to think of the older people, the less tech savvy people and reach out to them.

Passionistas: Yeah. Yeah. And as Lisa said in the comments, also, if you add a stamp, even though a lot of votes on ballots, don't require a stamp. If you add a stamp, it will make sure that it's treated as first-class mail. Yeah. So that's how that plus what supports the post office, which is exactly win-win. Yeah.

Jessica: Yeah, totally. And you know, and try to remember, I just want people to remember that the majority of America desperately wants Trump out of office. The majority, like, yes, he has got a very devoted small following, but the rest of the country will, is desperate to have him out. So people are going to work very hard to vote and make their friends vote. It's just, I know there's so much fear. And I, I mean, look, I share it, but I also, I want us to have faith in each other. And I want us to have faith in this country. It's not broken fully yet. It's very broken, but I still believe there's enough of an infrastructure in place that we can have a fair election, as long as enough of us show up. This is not an election that anyone can sit out. We need numbers.

Passionistas:  So can we talk about phone banking now?

Jessica: Excellent.

Passionistas: I want to say one thing though, I today started to, um, to write postcards for Jon Ossoff. You know, him for everybody who doesn't know is running for Senate in Georgia. And I really wanted to point out that the thing I love about him, which is his hashtag is his name is Jon Ossoff, O S S O F F. And his hashtag is hashtag #VoteYourOssoff.

Passionistas: Oh, he deserves to win.

Jessica: So I just wanted to give him a little plug. That's great. Georgia is doing really well. Stacey Abrams released some statistics today about, uh, early vote and vote by mail and Georgia. And it's already off the charts with, you know, typically voters who vote our way. So she's been working her butt off in that state. People are working very hard. I have a lot of faith. I have a lot of faith.

Passionistas: That made us all feel better. So, um, so now what do we do? How do we make it happen?

Passionistas: Well, let's talk about fun banking for a second, because this is the, you know, this is the big challenge right now. So first of all, people are voting already, right? In a lot of States, the election has started. We are officially in the election and starting next week, that's it like it's election month. We are fully in, GOTV get out the boat. Right. So, um, all of the big organizations are having their big weekends of like training and phone banking starting next weekend. So Y Mo you probably all know this, but why do we phone bank? Why can't we all just send postcards until the election? Because postcards increased voter turnout somewhere between one and a half to 2%. Right. Which is a nice little bump in turnout. Um, as I always say, in my workshop, Donald Trump won in Wisconsin by seven tenths of 1%, right?

So we're not going to sneeze at one and a half percent because that would have won us Wisconsin. He won the entire election by 77,000 votes. You guys, it's just not a lot of votes, um, or you peoples are very much trying to stop saying you guys. Um, but, um, so those postcards about one and a half to 2% bump don't forward letters, which are amazing. And I know you are doing those as well, and I've done a bunch of my husband does them. Those letters are great. They increased turnout by about 3.4%, right? That's their studies have shown. So phone banking is a significantly more than either of those things, right? Phone banking, talking to a person, voice to voice can increase turnout by maybe twice what the vote forward letters can when we're lucky. So again, these don't sound like huge percentages, but that's more than enough if we can get enough people on the phone.

And, um, there's a great phone banking video that I'm playing in my workshop now that, um, this woman is just talking about why we fund bank. And it's not as many people think to persuade Trump voters. And I think that people think that they're going to be forced to get on the phone and argue with somebody like their uncle in Alabama. Who's, you know, got the mag ahead. You're not going to, first of all, campaigns are generally having you call lists of people that they think, or at least potential supporters. They're not sending you to call heavily Republican list. That's just counterproductive. It's a waste of their time. But even when I do get somebody on the phone who is just like, you know, girl Trump or whatever, or I only vote Republicans, the response is thank you so much. Have a great day. And we hang up the phone.

Our job is to find our people reluctant Democrats, who almost never vote independents, who are persuadable, um, declined to States. People who are just low propensity voters or people who want to vote, but are fuzzy on the process. Like, yeah, I do want to vote, but I still haven't gotten my absentee ballot. And they're like busy doing something else. So they haven't taken care of that yet, but we can help them. So most of what we do when we phone bank is help people who want to be helped if they don't want to be helped, they'd get off the phone. But it's not about trying to persuade someone who has totally drunk the Kool-Aid and is like screaming about things that are just, you know, upsetting. And we don't want to talk about those. People are not who we're trying to persuade. We don't need them.

It is a waste of time. The campaign doesn't want you wasting your time with them. So when I get someone like that on the phone, again, I'm going to say, thank you so much, have a great day quick. I'm going to Mark them as strong opposed. And the campaign's going to take them off of their list, right? They don't want people like that on their lists either. They want to maximize their time and our time by looking for people who are potential votes. So part of what we're doing when we're phone banking is just finding those people and sort of sorting them into piles of like, that's not someone who's going, gonna vote for us. That's someone who maybe they definitely need more attention. That person is so into us that like, we're going to put them in this pile over here. We're not going to bother with them again until the day before the election, just to make sure they voted because there are definite supporter and a high propensity voter.

Then we're also right now doing stuff, we call it cleaning the lists. So if for those of you who like to clean, we're basically just making sure everybody's phone number is still the same. You know, we're calling lists that are from elections two years ago, mostly. So some of that information is outdated. Sometimes people no longer live in that place or their phone number has changed, or they've moved. Sometimes they're deceased. Sometimes they've changed parties, whatever their thing is. So that's what we're doing. We're sending that data back to the campaign. So we're both gathering data from the voter about who they support, where they are and their thoughts. And we are bringing data back to the campaign. Hey, that person now lives in California. So take them off the list. And that's the wrong number. It's disconnected. Take that off. This person wants to volunteer, call them.

This person wants to drive people to the polls, reach out to them. This person wants a yard sign. So it's a lot of data exchange. And, but there is something about calling and talking to someone voice to voice, which every time I run a phone bank, I have a volunteer say, I just talked to somebody who was on the fence. And we talked about like our kids and healthcare. And by the end, they they're going to vote for Biden or, you know, so it's not like every person we talk to is a massive victory. But again, we think about our own tiny contribution. And if I phone bank for an hour and I get three people or two people who were on the fence and are maybe going to support my person, now I have done my job. Other than that, it's a lot of not home.

It's a lot of leaving voicemails. When, when the campaigns want you to leave voicemails, they do sometimes. And they don't sometimes. Um, if you're nervous about using your own phone number, which a lot of people are, a lot of the campaigns now are using something called an automatic dialer or predictive dialer. You can just make sure that you use one of those and it all goes through a computer program. So your phone number never comes into it. And you literally just sit there on hold until somebody picks up and it's great. And you actually talk to more people. And, um, it's all very scripted. And I guess the last thing I'll say is that in my experience between texting and phone banking, I mean, I love canvassing. That's awesome, but we're not doing that right now. Um, I actually find people are much nicer over the phone.

My craziest meanest responses from voters have always been, um, texting. I actually don't text all that often because people are so much nicer on the phone. I would just rather deal with the, the politeness. I had someone today just tell me to F off on a text bank. And I'm like, Oh, I had asked him was how he, you heard of the candidate. No one would do that over the phone, but on texts, do they feel like they can do that? So I like calling people tend to be nicer, especially when I speak with a smile, which is one of my big tips for phone banking is smile talking, which is as a woman, I don't like to be told to smile, but in my experience that when I smile talk, it's the same thing that anybody who does any work on the phone knows like, I sound different when I'm talking like this.

And when I'm talking like this, it's just different. So when I kind of talk with a smile and, and I, myself, I'm I'm, I am me on the phone. I don't pretend to be somebody else. I act like myself. Um, if I make a mistake, I say, Oh God, I'm so sorry. I'm a volunteer. And I'm, you know, I'm a mom and I've been doing homeschool all day and I'm tired. You know, that's how people actually connect with us. They relate with us through our humanity. So, um, I emphasize the fact that I'm a volunteer. I recognize the fact that I'm barging in on people. And I say even sometimes I hate when people call me, but this election is so important and people appreciate it. So, um, I just encourage people to try it. We really do need more people on the phone. And, and, and the last thing really I will say is, you know, my daughter is very obsessed with “Hamilton” right now, right?

So we're talking about the revolutionary war, revolutionary war a lot. And you know, we talk about the fact that during the revolutionary war, the people who fought to found this country like died in massive numbers, right? To sort of defend the idea of our freedom and eventually our democracy, right? They died to form this country or they lost legs, or they were blinded, or, you know, people suffered horribly. If I am being asked to get on the phone and be a little bit uncomfortable to literally save our country, we are literally talking about saving this country. Then I am going to do that. And I am pretty sure that all of you can, I know YouTube can cause your, you know, the worst that can happen. What does it mean to me? I get to keep my legs. You know, I don't have to walk through a snowy valley with leather straps wrapped around my feet.

I mean, yeah. The stories from the revolutionary war pretty normally we're just being asked to make some phone calls. We can do it. You can do it. All of you can do it. I will turn it on to my phone banks. Yeah. How do people go to your phone beds? Well, um, you can there's uh, let's see. Do you guys do like show notes or anything like that after this? Will you post some information?

Passionistas: Yeah. And we can put you post things in the chat and everything. Yeah.

Jessica: So you can post my email address. Uh, the, the chop wood carry water, email address, see WCW daily [email protected]. People can email me and I can add you to my big list. I invite people to a bunch of phone banks and you can come or not come as you see fit. But every phone bank I do either I or somebody else will train you.

Um, you always do them on Zoom. They're all remote. So you're with a group of people. And if somebody is mean you can come back to the group and just say like, Oh, somebody just called me the devil. And then everybody laughs and people send you hard emojis, and then you go on, right. Um, and if you have a victory, then you come back to the zoom and you share that. And people are really excited for you. Uh, so you can do that. I highly recommend flick the West if you're concerned, particularly if you want for RBG, if you, if you're concerned about flipping the Senate flip, the West is an extraordinary organization. They do great bone bank trainings, like four times a week. Um, they just launched a training called demystifying phone banking for geo TV. That is apparently amazing. Um, there were these women who do a phone bank training called bone banking for introverts, which I can provide a link for.

Um, and that's supposed to be great, actually, it's on my Google doc. You, you have access to my group. So it's in their phone banking for introverts. That's supposed to be great. Um, you know, it's one of those things like you'll try it once or twice, and then you'll be like, Oh, this is actually just mostly kind of boring. Like mostly I'm just getting people who aren't home and it's model that exciting, but it does feel so good when you get somebody who needed your help. So those are a few of the ways. And I mean, my God, you can just Google like phone bank for Biden or, you know, there's million ways to get involved, swing left. Um, flippable any number of organizations can guide you to phone banking, but, um, you can post the link to my Google doc, which has a gazillion phone banks in it.

If po choice is your thing planned Parenthood does phone banking. If environment is your thing, three fifty.org does phone banking. So there's a million ways in, and they'll all basically take you to the same kind of event. You know, we're not reinventing the wheel. This is something that we've all done for a long time and it works. And you know, scientists say that getting out of your comfort zone is actually very good for you. People who get out of their comfort zone regularly actually live longer. So, you know, this is an opportunity for us all to do something that we don't want to do, but that is good for us and good for our country. How exciting is that?

Passionistas: That's good. Yeah. And I don't think anybody wants to look back on November 4th and wish they had done more. That is for sure.

Jessica: That is for sure. And that's what this great. I should I'll, I'll get you the link to the video too. And maybe you can post it in the chat after this great three minute video about phone banking, but she says that she's like, yes, it's uncomfortable, but you know, what will really be uncomfortable is waking up the morning after the election and finding out that we still have Trump in office. Like that will be devastating. And I definitely don't want to wake up the morning after and think I could have done, I could have done more. And I I'm happy to say, I am not going to wake up and say that, but I, I, you know, I don't think that anyone wants to feel that way.

Passionistas: Yeah. So, yeah.

Jessica: And it feels good to be part of a win. You'll love it. You'll love the feeling of having helped us win. Yeah. It's a wonderful feeling.

Passionistas: And I should say this wasn't something you've done all your life. I mean, this is something that you chose to do in recent years and you've educated yourself and now you're really comfortable doing these things, but it's not like, I just want people to know, like, it's easy to sometimes look at somebody who's talking like this and say like, Oh, well, but you know, you've dedicated your career to this. Like, this is something that you came to in after 2016 is not really opt in.

Passionistas: Right. And so you can, you can make the choice to make the change in your life to make this a priority.

Jessica: Absolutely. I am not a, I'm a volunteer. I'm not, uh, I, you know, I mean, I have Patrion sponsors, but like I'm not paid by anybody. Um, and I only ever phoned bank during presidential elections before Trump was elected. So yeah. And I think people come to my workshop. I always tell the story of Sally. She came to my workshop a couple of months ago and she, you know, my age, very, you know, just by, I don't know what she does, but definitely does not work in politics. And she was like, I mean, I will try it once, but I'm telling you, I'm going to hate it. And I'm dyslexic. I can't read those scripts and I'm going to suck at it, but I'll do it one time because you're telling me I should. And she came to my phone bank and God love her.

Ended up staying on. After we all got off the zoom, she was like, I'm still calling. She got us three volunteers her first time out and then just started putting banking all the time. And now I don't even hear from her anymore because she's just off phone banking. She found out she loved it and she was good at it. And she was positive. She would not be. So for some people, it really is underbelly uncomfortable, but you won't know until you try. And for most people it will not be unbearable. Um, and, and if you find out that it is, at least you tried, at least you gave it one try, but for 90% of us will be like, huh? I mean, it's, you know, I'd rather be taking a bubble bath, but you know, I'll do it, bring the phone into the bathroom phone, into the bathroom.

Passionistas: I obviously haven't phone banked yet, but I have been texting and you're right. People can be really harsh on texting. Um, but the other day I got a text, you know, the first question I was supposed to ask was, can we count on your support? And, uh, and I got this really like inappropriate response back. And I was gonna just, you know, send back the thanks, have a good day. And then I was like, no, I'm not going to do that. And so I forget how I replied, but I kind of replied like, what are your issues kind of thing. And, and, you know, it felt not to be judgmental, but it felt like, like a 16 year old boy texted me back. Um, and he was like, if I get a hell, yeah, I'll go to provide me.

I'm like, how much, how long am I going to let this person jerk me around? And I was like, doesn't really hurt me just to text back and see what he says. And so I texted back hell. Yeah. And then he texted back and he was like, wow, you must really want me to vote for bud light. Cause I'd stuck with it for these few comments now it's like, yeah, I do is really important. And I gave like, check the rate registration email, and it ended up in this like really long chat with this person. And by the end they're like, all right, well, awesome. It didn't hurt. It was like, you know what? I can let this person intimidate me because they think they're cute and funny interview noxious. Or I can just see where it goes and give it five minutes of my time. And it felt really good at the end. It was like, all right, well, that's not the back in line. What's next. It's amazing.

Jessica: I did a lot of texting with Open Progress for a long time. And you would see these conversations that people would post in the Slack that were so incredible where someone starts out very mean and hostile. And then when you send them a reply that lets them know that you're a real person, half of the time, they're like, Oh, I did not know that you were real person. Like they genuinely think you're a bot. And then once they find out you're real, sometimes they will actually have a conversation. And yeah, sometimes there were some people who are so unplugged from politics that they're basically like, I don't, I don't really care. Like what's the difference. And if you're like, okay, this is actually really important to me. They'll, they're like, all right, fine. I'll do it for you. Like I, I had that experience before and, you know, whatever, whatever gets them.

Yeah. Well, anyway, I don't want to share that story publicly, but I mean, whatever gets somebody within reason to vote, you know? Yeah. That is just a persuasion. It's wonderful. That's great. And yeah, texting can be really effective. Sometimes it does require a bit of a longer conversation and sometimes you got to get creative. I saw one texting conversation where the person they were texting with was started talking about Fortnite and the volunteer fortunately knew a lot about Fortnite. So she started responding with these very like insider comments about Fortnite and she won his vote because of that. Whereas I would have had no clue. So, I mean, it was just kind of good luck that he got her and then he was like, you're amazing. I'm going to vote. It was a whole thing. So, you know.

Yeah. But that's what it's all about. Right. It's all about reminding everybody that we're all the same common interests. We all worry about similar things. Right. I mean, we all want our kids to grow up in a safe world and we, you know, most of us worry about the same things, not all of us, but generally I can find an area of connection with a person on the phone.

Passionistas: Yeah. And I have to say both ways, like I've also, I started yesterday morning texting with a friend and feeling really angry and down about Republicans and Trump supporters. And in the course of texting yesterday, I had a few people who are like, I'm voting Trump and you know, you just say, all right, great, thanks for letting me know, have a good day. And they lived, there were a few people that are back on like half a nice day. And thanks for checking, you know, and it was just not like, I don't understand the fundamentals of the decision to vote for the man, but it doesn't mean everybody who is, is the person. And it kind of just re renewed my faith and the other side, like, I still can't, can't forgive anybody that's going for them. But at least I felt like it was a reminder. Like there are people too, and they, some of them are really nice people, you know, they just are misguided for whatever reason. Um, so in that regard, it made me feel slightly more optimistic about some of the people in that.

Jessica: Exactly. Oh, that's good. Yeah. But I couldn't turn them that texting is hard too, because I think they cast a very, very wide net with texting. So I think that you will tend to get more Republicans. Um, I feel like phone banking. They're a little bit more judicious about where they're sending you to call and I'm not sure why that is, but it's, it's just, I think because they can cast a wide net texting. They do. So you do, you end up getting a lot of people who were like Trump 2020, and you're just like, Oh my God, really? But calling, I don't get that. I don't know that I've ever had somebody just yelled Trump 2020 at me. Okay.

Passionistas: Oh yeah. You can definitely get that yelled in the, it may just be my imagination, but I honestly feel like between last week and this week I've been texting in Arizona mostly. And um, since RPG passed away, I swear to God more people there have been fewer Trump, 2020s, interesting work and more either neutral or onboarded by which, because the first couple of days I did it within her, it was like really depressing. And it was like 90% of the people were Trump 2020. I mean, and take me off the list. And then she passed away everything every time since then, it's been like a very small fraction of the people. So maybe I'm just trying to keep myself positive or maybe there is some shifts that happened.

Jessica: Um, well, yeah, I think you're going to actually like phone banking. I do feel like, I feel like

Is very comparatively is very draining and phone banking. I find very uplifting. So, um, I, I'm not sure everybody feels that way, but for me, I tend to get depressed when I'm texting. I think because there are so many Trump people because they're casting such a wide net and calling it's not, I don't know. I always feel pretty uplifted afterwards.

Passionistas: Wow. I'm definitely going to try it. I'm terrified of it. I am too, but I'll do it.

Jessica: Um, come to my Biden phone bank on Monday. It's it's great.

Passionistas: Okay. Yeah. It's not Monday. I can't Monday thought through with all that.

Jessica: I'll send you my whole schedule. Yeah, definitely. We'll definitely get, we are going to commit right now that yes, we're committed.

Passionistas: I definitely check out the Flip the West trainings. They're really good there. Those are definitely in my Google doc. Also, you can post them for your people wherever that's fabulous. And

Passionistas: Does anybody listening have any questions? Just pop them in the comments and we'll pass them on. So just, do you have any thoughts on flipping the Senate and whether that's going to happen or what, what do you, what's your gut it’s going to happen?

Jessica: It has to happen. Yes. It's going to happen. I mean, you know, none of us can see into the future, but I believe it's going to happen. Um, the polling in Iowa is extremely good. The polling in Kansas is really good. Um, pulling in Arizona is outstanding. Obviously. Uh, Georgia is somewhat competitive. Alaska is competitive. Um, Montana is somewhat competitive. I mean, I think we still have a little bit of work to do there. Uh, Colorado is extremely competitive. North Carolina is competitive. There's a lot of seats. We just need four, if we can win the presidency. Um, and we need to hold Doug Jones seat. But, um, yeah, I mean, it's, we have a lot of money. There's been a lot of money raised. So financially we are destroying the other side. I actually think, uh, Jamie Harrison is to win Lindsey. Graham was on Twitter, crying about how desperate for money he is, you know, he's awful. And I think he's going to get punished at the ballot box and Jamie.

Passionistas: Yeah. I think if we get him in McConnell out then…

Jessica: McConnell, I mean, we get McConnell out by winning the majority. McConnell will then become a minority leader and that will actually almost be worse for him. Yeah, no. And I mean, look, I'd love to see Amy McGrath win, but that's a, that's a tough, you know, that's a tough seat, but it doesn't matter if we win the Senate for me, that's enough. That's enough. I don't care. Mitch McConnell can crawl off into obscurity and you know, I don't even want to start all back under his wing. I shouldn't say on Facebook, but yeah. Yeah. Just, you know, flip the West is a great organization. If you want to flip Senate seats, I really recommend them very highly. And um, yeah, we should all be working on that very, very hard because if we flip the Senate, I feel that that will bring us also Biden. Um, and, and you know, if Trump steals the election, but doesn't have the Senate, he can kick and scream all he wants. He's still not going to have really much he can do. So I don't think that's going to happen, but I'm just pointing out that it is another way that we can protect ourselves. So, um, but yeah, I think we're going to do it. I know we're going to do it. We're going to flip the Senate. We're going to hold the house. We're going to beat Trump and we're going to flip a whole bunch of state legislatures. It is going to happen, mark my words.

Passionistas: You heard it here.

Jessica: People also, if, if we flip the Senate, it's harder for Trump to claim you won. Right?

Passionistas:  Right.

Jessica: Well, that's, that's the thing is that in order for him to claim that he actually won, he has to say that every election in the country was invalid at which point, okay. Then that's just chaos. Then what do we do then? Like, we don't have elections anymore because we're holding elections the same way we always have. So you can't have one and not the other, this is why it's not going to happen. He can't it's, it's not just ignore him. Okay. I rarely  talk about this. I'm going to say something right now that I rarely, rarely, almost never talk about, but my dad was a filmmaker. Right? He made horror films. This is something I do not talk about, but it's applicable here. He made a movie called “Nightmare on Elm Street.” Right. And I don't know if you've ever seen it. Probably some people have and some people haven't, but there's, you know, the bogeyman is Freddy Krueger. And in the end, the way the woman in the film beats him, her whole thing is you turn your back on them and you take away their energy. And then they literally just evaporate. And I'm not comparing Trump to Freddy Krueger. I actually, so much of his energy from us, you know? And so my whole thing with him is just a screen. I don't give him, I don't talk about him. I don't read his tweets. I don't re I don't listen to him talk. He does not exist for me to the best of my ability, because what he wants is to exist for all of us all the time. So, um, turn your back on him. He's just Freddy Krueger. He is, uh, he is, defeatable just like further Krueger was and just like everybody is defeatable, he's not a supernatural being, he's just a human politician. So, um, that is the, probably the last time for 10 years that I will talk about that publicly again. But I just wanted to

Passionistas: I'll say it. Yeah. I always think of, um, since we're using movie references, I always think of “Labyrinth.” When she finally realized that realizes it and says that line, you have no power over me.

Jessica: Right. Right, right. Right. So like, why am I giving you of my energy? It's a classic abuser and abused relationship at this point. And we as women, especially, you know, the, the middle-aged women who are running this army right now, it is our job to say, like you can't the second I turned my back on you, you have no power over me. And we are working very, very, very hard and we will demand. And this is a female business. We are fighting the patriarchy I could go on. But like, our job is to not be bullied by this man. And the way we are not bullied is we get on those darn phones and we text and we write and we call and we talk to our friends and family and we get people to vote. And that is how we defeat this man. We women.

Yeah. And especially these almost all women. Yeah.

Passionistas: And especially in honor of RPG, since it says he's going to replace her, he thinks that he can say, I'm replacing her with a woman and we're all stupid. I'm going to be like, Oh, that's great. I'm fine. He's destroying her legacy by planting, whichever one of these, your, so we need to fight harder in her memory, in her honor to be the women that, you know, don't, don't stand for it.  

Jessica: Right. And he can't destroy her legacy. He can't destroy it if we don't let him. Yeah. Yeah. Her legacy is in us to win. That is how we carry her legacy on is we win. We destroy him at the ballot box. And uh, and then who's destroying who at that point, when he can't destroy her legacy, again, her legacy is so much bigger than him. She's worth a million of him literally. Right?

Passionistas: Yeah. Did you see his visit too?

Jessica: I just, I did. And this is the thing I want people to remember is that when you take him out of his little supporter bubble, America hates him. And it's really easy for us to forget that because all the press shows us is his supporter bubble. I don't know why, but that is what they choose to cover. But the majority of the country hates him. So it is when you take him out of that bubble, it's the same thing with the town hall he did last week. People don't, he's awful and people know what Americans are not stupid. So that is why I just want people to stop watching news. Yeah. And do the work. That's how it was fed.

Passionistas: The town hall was fascinating because fascinating. You couldn't see most people's mouse because they had their masks on their eyes were. So every answer was like, every person's eyes were like, that's not what I asked you. Or like you're a or whatever it was, but just like in their eyes. Yeah. Really interesting. Yeah.

Jessica: And he's just, you know, he never lets himself be in those situations, but as we get closer to the election, he will. And he has to, and yeah. I mean, yeah.

Passionistas: I was going to say, what's your thought on how the debate's going to go next week?

Jessica: I don't know. And I don't care quite frankly. I mean, honestly, I don't really care again, like to me, that's all part of the, the press, the end of the show, like the circus, like, I mean, I know who I'm voting for and there's obviously no question. Like, we all know we don't even need these debates. I don't know if there was an undecided of Oregon left and if there is good, the debates, right, right. That's great. And they should watch them. I'm not, I am not. I mean, if anyone really has a question right now about who is more fit to be president than they're insane, quite frankly, so sorry if I'm offending anybody, but not in this area, then we lost them a long time ago. I probably lost them in the first part of this podcast. But I think, I think that, you know, Trump will be insane and crazy and Biden will hopefully, uh, I think Biden is going to do great Biden. Hasn't been doing great. And Trump is destroys himself every time he opens his mouth. So yeah, but I will not be watching. I can't watch Trump. I don't, I don't watch him. Freddy Krueger.

Passionistas: No, it's really, it's good advice. It's I do it to myself because I feel like I need to stay informed, but I guess I have all the information I need right now. Yeah.

Jessica: I don't think, and you're not getting informed by him anyway. You're getting lied to so it's not information. Yeah. Yeah.

Passionistas: No, for me, it's not about informed about what he, he is saying or doing. It's more like we watch at least an hour of Fox news every day. Oh God. Oh yeah. Because it's really interesting to hear how the other side is getting brainwashed. I don't know what the talking points are and what's avoided. So it's, it actually is really interesting in the context of this, like talking to people and texting people or having conversations with people that I know that might be on the fence. It's like, I, I understand like if you, if you buy into that at all, like Fox is brilliant at making it seem real and logical, you know? Um, so you know, it, sometimes it makes you think like, wow, am I is brainwashed by the other side as these people are that this side has it, it makes sense if you're crazy, if this medic Nazi, this makes sense.

You know? Um, so it's just interesting. I can only do it in short skirts, but we do watch a bit every day. Um, and, uh, and you see you, it just gives you, I mean, all you see is Portland burning the block of Portland that's burdened, which makes it seem like if you buy into that agenda, it makes it seem like the country's role, unless you stop and say, it keeps showing me the same law of Portlands over and over. Or we'll say like April 21st, 2020. It's like, though that didn't happen yesterday. It it's just interesting from, from that perspective to, um, to kind of just keep an eye on what's what the dialogue is. Um, but then it gets like insanely frustrating and I either have to leave or I get angry. So I do it in little, little spurts. Yeah.

Jessica: You're way more emotionally resilient than me. I couldn't do it. Yeah. I can't do it. I can't do it. I don't know. Maybe I'm just more of a masochist, but I think we should end this the way we started, which is, I agree. I am hopeful that there are enough, strong-willed good people out there that are going to vote the right way and convince as many people as possible to do it. And all we can do is, do, do as much as get up every day before the time we have, you know? Um, so you know, we thank you because you really have, um, we've learned so much from you and you really do inspire us. And, and now what, you can get a God willing more than you've been to try and get some other people to join us. Yes.

I think flip the West even has the training tonight. They have, I think every Tuesday and Thursday, twice a day. So yeah. Check them out, go check them out, come, come join me at one of mine. They're short and easy. And uh, yeah, it's like, one of those come on in the water is fine situation, but of activism one-on-ones coming up this week. So if anyone wants to come and do a one hour free workshop, that'll give you other ways you can help, uh, you know, email me and I'll send you the schedule. I've got one in about an hour. Actually. I've got one at five o'clock tonight.

Passionistas: Yeah. Cool. So the same, the same email address as before. And they can reach out to you and then be, yeah.

Jessica: And I'll send them the Zoom registration. Like I've got one at 5:00 PM tonight, Pacific time. And then, you know, one on Saturday, one on Sunday, a couple of next week. So yeah.

Passionistas: And we have, like we said, we have done Jessica’s workshop as part of our summit. And it's amazing. There's so many different things you can do that are in your comfort zone. If you are afraid to do one thing or another, we get it.

Jessica: You know, we're not trying to pressure anybody into doing anything they don't want. There are enough things you can do. I just said, even if it's, it makes a difference of 1%, that's huge. So do what you feel comfortable doing and get used to it. You know, I think I feel ready to do phone banking because I feel so comfortable with all the other stuff right now that it's like, Oh, why not give it a shot? So start by doing what you can.

Passionistas: And there's also, I want to say there are, um, Nancy what's at organization. You sent me today that to do, I know it can be expensive to do letters and postcards. If you got to buy the postcards goodbye to stamps, you know, it's not always easy for people, but we'll post a link in the chat of an organization that you can, even, if you can't afford the postcards, they'll send you postcards and stamps

Jessica: Is that Sunrise, it's gotta be at Sunrise.

Passionistas: You posted about it today. Jess, I did. I posted about it. I got the information from you.

Jessica: Yeah. It's pay what you can. So if you can afford to pay for it. Great. And if you can't, they will literally send you all, everything you need for free, which is great. Yeah. That's really good. And they're beautiful postcards.

Passionistas: They're beautiful postcards. And the other thing about them is that they're, um, they're, they are trying to mobilize younger people too, which is great.

Jessica: The young voters. Yeah. Which is great. Sunrise is a fantastic organization. I can't say enough good things about them. I am a member of, but I'm really too old. So I'm like, I'm like a sunrise grandmother, but a great organization for young people.

Passionistas: Yeah. Yeah. So, um, so we will post that link as well. So if, if you can't afford it, you can afford it. That's all. Um, yep. So, well, this has been amazing. Thank you ladies. Six weeks away, everybody. So 39. Yes. Follow chop wood, carry water on social media as well. And stay on top of what justice is doing because there might come a day where you think you don't have time and you find you do and see what Jess is doing. Because the other thing I'd have to say is what's great about dress is she sends out a daily email blast election aside. There's a daily email blast that goes out and it gives you action items that you can do on a daily basis. Like these are the things you should do today. Call this person, emailed this person, you know, the representatives. And this is what you have to say. This is what you should write in your email. It makes it so easy. And in five minutes you can make a difference and you can do it every day. And it's an amazing, amazing resource. Thank you. Just trying to stay safe.

Jessica: Hope is an action. Woo.

Passionistas: All right, well thanks. Have a great day. See you next five. Next time. Bye.

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Selene Luna is best known as the voice of Tia Rosita in Disney Pixar's Coco. She is an established presence in Hollywood with multiple roles in movies and TV shows, including Margaret Cho's "The Cho Show. " The Mexican American actress, who lives with a physical disability, has also broken ground as a featured burlesque dancer in five national tours of the undisputed queen of burlesque Deeta Von Teese. She is also an advocate for people living with disabilities including a 2019 trip to DC to meet with legislators and speak at a rally on Capitol Hill.

More about Selene.

Learn more about The Passionistas Project.

Full Transcript:

Passionistas: Hi, and welcome to the Passionistas Project Podcast. We're Amy and Nancy Harrington. Today's episode is Part 2 of a two-part interview with Selene Luna, best known as the voice of Tia Rosita in Disney Pixar's Coco. Selene is an established presence in Hollywood with multiple roles in movies and TV shows, including Margaret Cho's "The Cho Show. " The Mexican American actress, who lives with a physical disability, has also broken ground as a featured burlesque dancer in five national tours of the undisputed queen of burlesque Deeta Von Teese.

In 2019, Selena went to Washington DC to meet with legislators like US Representative Maxine Waters at the 2019 Conference on Independent Living to advocate for disability rights and spoke at a rally on Capitol Hill alongside US Senator Chuck Schumer.

And it's not too late to get your tickets for tonight's event. Chronically Funny: A Comedy Revolution Featuring an All-Disabled Lineup of Women. This virtual comedy show will be followed by a round table discussion with the performers.

So please welcome to the show Selene Luna.

In 2017, you voiced the character of Tia Rosita in the Academy Award and Golden Globe winning film "Coco." So talk about that experience and how did that come about and how did you feel about doing that movie?

Selene: It was such an unbelievable experience for me personally. It was validating not only am I a disabled woman working under the Pixar brand, but I'm a Brown person, you know, a Mexican doing, you know, Disney Pixar. So that was, I couldn't believe it was happening in my lifetime. And that had everything to do with the team at Pixar and Disney. They went through great, great measures to make sure this film was not whitewashed. And so what was very special about it is that it's the very first film in major studio history to have an all Latino cast. And so I feel like I'm part of history and that film means the world to me. And also because they told the story in such a beautiful way, that absolutely honored my Mexican culture. And so for the first time in my life, I had family relatives who were in like so deeply engaged and proud and just having my family and extended family proud that I was in something that finally represented our people in a positive, beautiful light.

Passionistas: I love that it explained to other people beyond the Mexican culture, what the day of the dead symbolizes.

Selene: I even know my friend's kid, you know, they're white and, but the little kid, an altar, you know, he has a little day of the dead altar and it just those little things that, like, it means a lot to reach someone from a different culture and to be embraced for the beauty that your culture brings. Yeah. It's been really giving film in so many ways, like on so many levels.

Passionistas: What kind of doors has that movie opened up for you professionally and as an advocate?

Selene: It really has opened doors for me. As far as advocacy goes. Right around the same time that the film came out, that's when I started to have a real awakening about disability justice. The timing kind of just really sinked up. And the reason was that I didn't become involved with disability justice until that movie came out. It's only been a few years. And I'll be brutally honest is because up until that point, I was really riddled with self-loathing ableism. Like I was, I, I was not okay with who I was, even though throughout, you know, my entertainment career. It may appear, it may have appeared that I was great. I was totally fine. I embraced who I was, it was all fake. It's not true. I hated myself. It didn't I didn't feel accepted by, you know, most communities ,by anybody really.

And it was very painful for me, but I just happened to believe, well, it's not a belief what actually happens. It's just my level of maturity and finding myself as a complete woman. It all just kind of happened at that time in my life. And it all just kind of came together. So "Coco" had a lot to do with it because at the time I was attending a lot of events you know, you do a big film suddenly everybody's interested. So I kept getting invited to various events. I was receiving recognitions and awards from various Latino communities and organizations. And through there I was connected with with the wonderful organization, which I, which has mentioned in my intro. It's SCRS-IL, a big long acronym for Southern California Resource for Independent Living. It is a disability advocacy group that serves the state of California and mainly Los Angeles County.

They're the largest disability rights organization in Southern California. I became involved with them mainly because they serve the population that I grew in the the Latino population. And through them, I began to learn about what's wrong with this world and how, and what we need to do. And the more I learned the angrier I became and decided I need to do something. And I took advantage of having this platform of the media attention I was getting because of "Coco." So I thought I better take advantage of this opportunity because in showbiz, I mean, you're hot one minute cold the next, and that's real for everybody. So I married the two.

Passionistas: Tell us about the trip you took in 2019 to Washington.

Selene: Well, the trip I took out was to Washington was specifically with SCRS. I became, I, I became involved by being on their board of directors. So as a member of the board of directors, I was invited to travel with them to Washington DC for the Nickel Conference, which is the National Council of Independent Living, which is the, the disability rights movement that started just over 30 years ago. So every year in June, they have a conference on Capitol Hill, along with a week-long of activism. There's a huge March a parade we take over DC. And so with them, with SCRS, I had the privilege of participating and it was life-changing for me. It was the first time in my life that I was in an environment where it was all disabled people, as far as I could see of all variations, all different conditions.

And it was the most powerful feeling of like, wow, this is the first time in my life where I'm not the only one. And it was so... Talk about Passionista and everybody there was like so much fire in their belly, such a, I felt so much passion and pride for who I am and, and really, really, it resonated for the first time in my life. Like we deserve as much as anyone else. And so that was an incredible experience for me. So as part of the week long events, I gave a talk on Capitol Hill about education discrimination against individuals with disability. I focused on education because of my personal experience. Throughout my entire childhood. Growing up in the Los Angeles public school system, I was cheated from getting the equal education that other kids got simply because of my condition ha it had nothing to do with my IQ or my mental ability.

So, I spoke about that and then throughout the week we had meetings, individual meetings with various legislators to talk about what SCRS does as far as they advocate for STEM education for children with disabilities. And so we went to go and meet with legislators to secure funding.

Passionistas: So what can people do that did not have a disability? How can we be better allies?

Selene: To be a better ally... Here's a great example. You, you and not you guys, but you weren't one enabled bodied or just an abled person is not an ally by simply posting something on Instagram, like a guy in a wheelchair, lifting weight, lifting weights, and claiming to be inspired by this individual. We don't care for you to be inspired. The true definition of being inspired means that you were moved to take action. So if you're actually inspired, if you actually want to help, we need you to take real action.

And that starts at the ground level. That starts at your local community, make sure that every building in your town and every sidewalk is accessible. For example, a huge issue in big cities right now is we have a homeless epidemic in this country and which is heartbreaking and horrific. And as a result, a lot of the sidewalks in major metropolitan areas are packed with homeless encampments. So I don't know what the solution is because I don't know where the homeless are supposed to go. I don't have that answer, but just imagine being an individual with a physical disability that has to get to the bus stop in a wheelchair, but there's nowhere on the sidewalk to wheel up to the bus stop. How are you going to get to work? So it's those simple everyday things, you know, talk to your local government, get involved in trying to figure out what the solution is, provide a path. Simple things, daily things help provide paths and accessibility for disabled people who need to get on that sidewalk that are packed with homeless encampments. So it's that kind of thing. Really just take action in your own local community.

Passionistas: Is there a question that we should be asking that we're not asking?

Selene: Yes. The question is for me, and I think for a lot of people in my shoes, why is it legal in 38 States to pay disabled people less than minimum wage for the same work executed by abled individuals? I have a lot of there aren't many laws in place set up against individuals with disability. It's overwhelming to try to list all the problems, but here's another example that people don't realize and it's in our faces. It connects to Black Lives Matter more than 50% of Black individuals who are murdered by police are disabled. So not only are they Black, they're disabled on top of it, nobody addresses that the Sable population being murdered under the Black Lives movement.

And why isn't anyone talking about this? Not only are they black, they're disabled, and these kinds of things need to come to light. I'm guessing it's probably attributed to individuals with mental illness because they're not able to communicate with the police. Also, if you're a deaf Black man, you are a dead immediately, dead. Police officers are not trained to deal with anyone who's deaf or has a hearing impairment. So if a deaf individual is at gunpoint, how are they going to sign? How are they going to motion? How are they going to communicate? Hold on. I can't hear you. And then they get shot. People really need to realize the social injustices against disabled people. It's something relevant to all of us.

Passionistas: We're Amy and Nancy Harrington. And you're listening to the Passionistas Project Podcast and our interview with Selene Luna. To learn more about Selene visit her website, SeleneLuna.com. Now here's more of our interview with Selene.

I know you've had a podcast, but have you ever considered doing a podcast about these issues?

Selene: I did start to do one, but I put it on the side. The podcast that I started was called "Little Woman, Big Crimes." And I was going to focus on crimes against individuals with disabilities. Here's another statistic. God, I can't remember the specific numbers, but it's something like a disabled individual is murdered every hour, every day by a caretaker usually. And the media does not report on this because sympathy is directed towards the person who murdered the disabled individual because disabled individuals by society are considered a burden and they, a journalist will always find the angle where, well, you kind of can't blame the murderer. The murderer tends to be the caretaker.

There, a wonderful website, that is a Memorial to all individuals throughout the entire. It's an international list of individuals who have been murdered by their caretakers. And the stories are devastating, brutal, gut wrenching. They're not covered by anybody. And I went as far as recording four episodes, but the stories are so horrific. I didn't have the stomach to continue. And so I kind of shelved that project. I just, I couldn't do it. It made me sick inside. I was having nightmares and these stories are horrific.

I mean, for example, I don't know if you want to hear it now, but one of the stories that covered was a woman in Russia who was a paraplegic, was boiled alive by her daughter-in-law her daughter-in-law was her caretaker and boiled her alive just cause she was sick of taking care of her. There was a, a father who, and this is a very tragic example. There was a father here in America, the father had mental illness. He was schizophrenic and he was off his medications. He had an eight year old son who used a wheelchair. The father was having an episode where he thought his son in the wheelchair was not human and decapitated him too, because he thought the son was a robot and he wanted to rewire him. So and this isn't like 20 years ago, this story was like, you know kind of I think maybe 10 years ago. So there was a lot of horrific violence against individuals with disabilities. The numbers are staggering and it's something, no one addresses media won't cover it rarely, rarely is a caregiver ever prosecuted at all. Everybody just feels sorry for them cause they were burdened with the caretaking task.

Passionistas: What about coming to terms with your own feelings about yourself and what a struggle that seemed to be for you for such a long time? What advice do you have for someone who maybe hasn't come to that place yet?

Selene: That's a really good question because growing up, I always wished that there was somebody like that in my life. It would have made all the difference in the world. It would have changed me as an individual. But I think at this point, the wisdom I can offer to anyone struggling to live, not so much live in their body, but to navigate through the blatant discrimination we experience on a daily basis is to just do not let all these messages develop the opinion of yourself. That sounds hypocritical because that's what I did. I was told that I was, I was not told directly, I was taught that I was not worth. I was not a complete human, barely human, and that I should remain invisible. So when I started to vocalize who I am and pride in myself, that really changed my paradigm. So all I can say is use your voice. Don't back down. Don't allow yourself to be denied anything just because society says so. Do what you have to do is fight, scream, be angry. Let people know you are a complete person and you have, you are entitled to access, to equal access that everyone else in society has. It is your entitlement. You are not invisible. Don't stay quiet, speak up for yourself.

Passionistas: And you said that when you got into the entertainment business, your hope was that you could change the story being told. So do you think that the story has changed and do you feel like you've had a part in that?

Selene: I don't know that I had a part in it on a grand scale, but I know, I, I believe that I have had a part in changing people's perspectives towards someone like me simply because I've had the privilege of performing to thousands of people live and they saw me, they heard me, so I know I've made an impact. And but I think Hollywood is starting to change. Things are going in the right direction, but it's, I think we have a long way to go. And until images of individuals with disability are changed in the media, then culture will not follow anything. The media sets the sets, the stage sets the tone for our culture. And so until that happens, we won't see it, but it is happening.

I mean, look at us, we're talking about it five years ago. I wasn't talking about it with anybody. Nobody cared two years ago, nobody cared, but I think that's kind of the silver lining about this COVID situation, where now forced to take inventory and reflect all of us. Everybody able, not abled everybody. We are all now sitting at home taking inventory on what matters, what does it matter? You know, everything we've taken for granted, we are now confronted with. So I really see this as the silver lining in the disability movement. So because for the first time in my life, I'm talking about it. People are want to hear people want to learn. So I'm very excited about that. I never imagined, never in a million years than I imagined anybody would care about disability and disabled justice in my lifetime. And I have to add, I gotta, I gotta cut Hollywood some Slack this year alone through COVID I'm now getting auditions for like real human beings. You know, I'm getting like legitimate human auditions. In fact, I just had one yesterday for HBO, you know, that never happened in my life ever. So that's very exciting.

Passionistas: And do you attribute that to COVID or do you think there's a bigger movement?

Selene: I attribute it to the Black Lives Matter movement that has opened and I'm grateful. Black Lives Matter has opened the flood Gates to the injustices in this world. And now people are starting to speak up. People are now saying, Hey, you know what, me too. I understand. I, I, you know, my people w we, we get the short end of the stick too. And also because of social media being on lockdown, there's so much information now being thrown at us. And so it's kind of been a great opportunity. People are now listening.

Passionistas: Looking at back on your journey, what do you think was the most courageous decision that you made that changed your path?

Selene: The most courageous, just decision I made, I think, and I still benefit from it is to stop caring about what people think and just commit to creating my own narrative, no matter how painful it is, no matter how difficult. And I'm actually a very shy individual. I really am. I, I don't like unnecessary attention because of how I grew up. I was always, I never went a day without being laughed at, stared at, it was really brutal. And then people ask, well, then why did you go into show business? You're going to get nothing but attention, but it's on my terms. When I say I'm doing it when I want, you're going to look at me and you're going to laugh when I say it's okay.

But outside of being on stage on camera, I'm a complete introvert. And I just like being quiet and alone. It's a protection thing. And so, but building up the courage to just stop caring and just be free to live, to just be myself and just, pardon my French. Just a case of the fuck-its.

Passionistas: Do you have a mantra that you live by?

Selene: It's really silly and a little bit vulgar, but I stole it from Judy Garland. You know, there was a, an, which I thought for many years was an urban legend, but it turns out it was confirmed. Before getting on stage, Judy Garland would stand behind the curtain and just say to herself, "fuck 'em, fuck 'em, fuck 'em, fuck 'em, fuck 'em." And that would give her the courage to go on. And I w I heard that throughout my life, and I just thought it was urban legend.

And but I started doing it myself before going on stage. And it's really empowering. It shakes off the nerves. It shakes off the anxiety. And later in my career, I became friends was this great producer. And she wants, worked on the Bob Hope show and confirmed that she saw Judy Garland do that. So it's true. And I don't know, you know, and, and I implemented it into my life. And even my internal dialogue, I still have triggers, you know, go to the store. It's like, Oh God, here's a mob of people staring at me. You know, just things like that. And I just go in my head, what would Judt do? "Fuck 'em, Fuck 'em, fuck 'em." It gets me through the day. It gets me through some tough times. It's so simple, but it feels so good.

Passionistas: What's your definition of success?

Selene: My definition of success is having the love and respect of my family and friends.

Passionistas: What's your secret to a rewarding life?

Selene: My secret to a rewarding life is to be kind, I have found because I was very angry, very resentful, very resentful. And so in aging and just growing up as a woman, I realized that kindness goes a long way because anytime you're kind to someone you're really being kind to yourself, it cuts the edge. I know it's really simple, but I have found that it has helped me to heal in many ways. And so the more kindness and generosity that comes from out of me that I share with people, and that has also developed in my advocacy for disability, for disabled justice. The ability to speak for others who are not able to speak up for themselves and to have compassion, to do it compassionately, not angrily, although I can't help it, sometimes I'm very angry a lot, but when I have an element of kindness to anything that I'm doing, I find it very comforting and very personal personally rewarding. And that's all really, it goes a long way.

Passionistas: Thanks for listening to the Passionistas Project Podcast and our interview with Selene Luna. To learn more about Selene, visit her website, SeleneLuna.com.

And find out more about Chronically Funny: A Comedy Revolution, Featuring an All-Disabled Lineup of Women on October 28th at 8:00 PM Eastern | 5:00 PM Pacific at thepassionistasproject.com.

While you're there, you can learn more about our podcast and subscription box filled with products made by women owned businesses and female artisans to inspire you to follow your passions. Sign up for our mailing list, to get 10% off your first purchase and be sure to subscribe to the passion needs just project podcast. So you don't miss any of our upcoming inspiring guests until next time stay well and stay passionate

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Selene Luna is best known as the voice of Tia Rosita in Disney Pixar's Coco. She is an established presence in Hollywood with multiple roles in movies and TV shows, including Margaret Cho's "The Cho Show. " The Mexican American actress, who lives with a physical disability, has also broken ground as a featured burlesque dancer in five national tours of the undisputed queen of burlesque Deeta Von Teese. She is also an advocate for people living with disabilities including a 2019 trip to DC to meet with legislators and speak at a rally on Capitol Hill.

More about Selene.

Learn more about The Passionistas Project.

Full Transcript:

Passionistas: Hi, and welcome to the Passionistas Project Podcast. We're Amy and Nancy Harrington.

Before we start our show this week, we wanted to tell you about a podcast. We just discovered through the OSSA collective, the show was called Brunch and Slay, where they remember that "if she can, I can, we all can." Host Ameerah Saine is the founder of the lifestyle brand Brunch and Slay which she created to inspire women to live their best lives every day. We think you'll really enjoy the show. So be sure to check it out wherever you get your podcasts.

Now for today's episode, which is Part 1 of a two-part interview with Selene Luna, best known as the voice of Tia Rosita in Disney Pixar's Coco. Selene is an established presence in Hollywood with multiple roles in movies and TV shows, including Margaret Cho's "The Cho Show. " The Mexican American actress, who lives with a physical disability, has also broken ground as a featured burlesque dancer in five national tours of the undisputed queen of burlesque Deeta Von Teese.

In 2019, Selena went to Washington DC to meet with legislators like US Representative Maxine Waters at the 2019 Conference on Independent Living to advocate for disability rights and spoke at a rally on Capitol Hill alongside US Senator Chuck Schumer.

And this October 28th, we're collaborating with Selene to produce Chronically Funny: A Comedy Revolution Featuring an All-Disabled Lineup of Women. This virtual comedy show will be followed by a round table discussion with the performers.

So please welcome to the show Selene Luna.

Selene: Hi ladies. Thank you so much for having me

Passionistas: We're happy to have you here. We're really excited to talk to you about all of these amazing things that you've been doing. What are you most passionate about?

Selene: What I am most passionate about is disability justice. And I guess you could call me an advocate for disabled justice. And it's not necessarily a fire in my belly that II must do this. It's a necessity that I have to do with, I have better things to do with my time. Uh, being an advocate for social injustice is really exhausting. And it's an absolute shame to me that we have to go to such measures just to be heard. Um, and so that is why I am, uh, I guess you would say an advocate for disability justice because it impacts my life personally and those and those around me, uh, people in my life and I, as, as early as I could remember, as a little child, nothing got under my skin, then things that were not fair unfairness drove me nuts and it still does. And so, so I guess you could say I'm very passionate about injustice when it comes to, uh, individuals with, and it's driven by my own personal challenges in a society that openly discriminates against people with disabilities. So, um, it's not a joyful passion. It's just a necessity in my life.

Passionistas: Why do you think, I think it is still this way. Why do you think that we've come such a small distance to tackle this issue? It feels like we should be further along.

Selene: I agree with you and I have the same question. It absolutely blows my mind, but then the same question could be like, why is this country still racist? Um, you know, so many questions. Why do women not, uh, have income equality in the work force? So these are all great questions I have too. It's like, what planet are we on?

I guess, to have some sort of an answer. I think, um, I can't understand exactly why, but we are in a society for generations, hundreds of years. I mean, as early as time going back to the early days of Egypt, uh, people with disabilities were, uh, mutilated discriminated against, um, violently tortured simply because they were born in a body that they can't help. They, as a disabled person. The most frustrating thing is my response to society is how do you think I feel? I didn't choose this body.

You know? So then you're punished on top of something. You had no choice over. So it blows my mind. And I can say simply put, that the biggest struggle as a person with a disability is not my actual disability. It's society's perception of disability. Because like many disabled people I know myself included, uh, we are fine in our bodies and our different bodies with different abilities. And I, I have to give a disclaimer, I hate the term differently abled. And I think I just kind of used it. So bad on me, but, um, we're totally fine. We just need equal access to what everyone else has. And for those watching who weren't familiar with me, you can't tell on camera, but I'm a little person I'm only three feet, 10 inches tall. And, uh, and it's not easy. I do have a lot of, um, physical things. I mean, I have, I suffer from chronic pain, intense, debilitating, chronic pain due to the structure of my skeleton. So, so the right things I I'm, I have to get through, but it's the least of my troubles. My greater troubles are society's open discrimination.

Passionistas: So take us back to when you were a young girl and what your childhood was like, and when you first knew you were funny and why you think you sort of became funny.

Selene: My childhood was I'm riddled with adversity. Uh, I'm a Mexican immigrant. So my parents brought our family to the, uh, to the United States from Mexico when I was three years old. So I don't really have a memory of that, but, uh, but the challenges we faced were like a lot of racism and bigotry because we were Mexican, we were new to the country. Um, and I'm, there was no, I was the only person who with a disability in my family.

Actually correction. My father is actually disabled as well, but he wasn't born with a disability. Like the majority of statistics, uh, say the majority of people with disabilities were not born disabled. And so that's why it blows my mind that people are so dismissive of it because you never know who's next. I mean, you could be hit by a car and in one second, your life changes.

So that's what happened to my father before I was born, he was in a horrific accident when he was 18 and he lost his entire right arm. Uh, he's an amputee. So, um, but I forget honestly, because the way we grew up was, um, never really talking too much about it. You know, we were, I grew up in the seventies, my parents are old school. You just suck it up and you get on with life. So that was great for me in many ways, but it also was not good for me because then I felt very isolated. None of, no one in my family was a little person and nobody really had a disability that was addressed, um, directly, uh, everyone's needs were met, but there wasn't a conversation about disability at all. And my dad was busy working two jobs, you know, it wasn't, we just don't even talk about feelings.

And, um, so what I'm getting at is that's a little bit of my background. So my upbringing upbringing as a disabled little girl, it was very isolating. I, it was very dark. I felt very alone. I was never immersed in any type of support network. I was never exposed to a disabled community. And my only point of references were, uh, disabled people being ridiculed on television. And like, you, you know, I grew up watching, um, like Billy Barty, the Buggaloos , uh, you know, things like where the creatures on television were, little people in costumes. It was very dehumanizing. And the irony is, and I grew up to do that myself, but as a child that had a lot of internalized shame, enablism, it's the only images I identified with, were the d humanizing images of little people on television and movies, including the Wizard of Oz that brought up a lot of anxiety for me.

Uh, and I didn't feel human. I didn't, I felt like I'm not a human being like my siblings or my parents, like I'm something different and it must be really shameful cause we don't talk about it. So it was really awful, no gentle way to say this. Uh, but grew up old school, you just bare and grin it and you chug along and you don't complain. And so that's where the funny comes in at a very young age, I think around the age of five. I think that's about when you start having a little self awareness, maybe five, six. I remember in kindergarten, I remember really in first grade that's when it really hit me that I was not like the others. And when I started to have this self-awareness as a defense mechanism, I was really joking all the time and never serious. And it was really a distraction. It was really to help me survive.

And I think a lot of kids or dealing with a heavy things at home use humor to protect themselves. I mean, I'm always concerned now as an adult, I look back if there was a class clown in the room in the classroom, that's a pro... There was a problem at home. And so I was a clown. I was always, uh, using humor as I just figured if I can make them laugh, they'll forget about what I look like. And so I think anyway, long story short, I think that was my childhood.

Passionistas: You had these experiences seeing these images on television and in movies, and yet you chose to go into the entertainment industry. So what drew you to that in as a career?

Selene: What drew me to it is while I was having this realization of, you know, when I was very young realizing what I was, I didn't understand what I was, but I knew I was different and in a shameful way, not like cute different. Um, so I, and I grew up in Los Angeles. So Hollywood was very much on the radar, uh, socially. And, uh, so as a little kid, I thought, well, if I can make them laugh and I figured I can go into showbiz because I thought I could be the one who changes the images that make me feel ashamed. And also it would be an opportunity to be in control of the dialogue. I figured if people were gonna laugh and point at me, it would be on my terms. And so that's how I saw that platform. On top of having no real education, I thought, and I'm not implying that you don't need an education to get into entertainment, but I just thought my talent would be to entertain people and make them see me the way I want to be seen and heard. And, uh, but you know, once I did it, it was a very different reality.

Passionistas: So, tell us about that reality. Tell us about how you broke into the business. What, what were your first gigs? What were auditions like?

Selene: Well, the reality was a pretty harsh in the sense where, um, I, you know, I had my mind made up that it's going to be up to me to create a new image for people like me, but I didn't really realize that I wouldn't have the actual platform to execute my plan. Uh, I, you know, I'm 20 years into this career to this day. I can tell you easily, maybe 98% of my auditions or opportunities are to play a creature or a monster of faceless character to this day. And, uh, but I mean, things are actually literally just changing now. I mean this year, uh, there are new roles now, but, um, that we never had. Uh, so that was sobering for me. So what I did was I, and this is like the mid-nineties, early- to mid-nineties. I am, I was five years old, kidding.

Um, this is around the mid-nineties. I took a workshop class, summer workshop of how to write, stand up comedy at the, uh, at the world, famous Hollywood Improv. And so I took like a summer kind of workshop and I fell in love with it. I was like, this is it. I have a microphone. And people just have to sit and listen ‘til I'm done. And, um, and it went really well. I really excelled and so much so that, um, one of my greatest regrets in life was a failed opportunity on my part, Bud Friedman who's a legend in the comedy world. He started the Improv. Uh, he saw one of my workshop like showcases and he came over and he pulled me aside. I mean, this man created careers for people like Roseanne Barr and he's major. And he pulled me aside and says, it was really old school.And he's like, "You got it kid, you know?"

And he invited me to perform at regular shows. And so I started performing at the Improv, but I was riddled with so much shame and self- loathing and so insecure and not fully developed as a person. Then I was easily intimidated. Uh, even in the nineties, it was still very much a man's world, the comedy club. And, um, I, I just felt really scared and intimidated being around all these funny men. And they weren't welcoming to me at all or warm. Um, but that's not their job. You know, my friend and I, one of my dearest friends in the business Murray Hill, he's a comic in New York, uh, we have an ongoing joke. It's called showbiz, not show therapy. So you can expect to be coddled if you're feeling nervous or anxious, you either gonna do it or you're not.

So I wasn't ready. I didn't have the skin. And after a year of Bud Friedman, you know, bringing me under his wing, I quit. I quit like an idiot. I throw in the towel. It was so scary. It was never fun for me. I practically wanted to cry after every show. And just the guys, the men were so tough and I just, um, I was invisible to them. And, um, anyway, so that's how that all started. But flash forward, about 10 years after that, I went back into it, ready to go. Uh, I was much saltier.

Passionistas: What experience did you have in that 10 year period that made you so salty?

Selene: I had a very interesting experience that really helped me to develop as a performer. And it was one of those things that it was something I needed that I didn't know I needed. Literally two weeks after quitting the Improv, I found myself at a party. And at this party I met some women who are still great friends of mine. Some of my closest closest friends is this grow a group of girlfriends and they were all doing, um, a dance troupe called the Velvet Hammer Burlesque. And at the time, uh, there was no one else doing it. I mean, I know burlesque is very popular now it's had a huge resurgence, but this was the very early days of the Neo Burlesque Movement at the time, the only people doing it were the stupa girls that I befriended the Velvet Hammer, Deeta Von Teese, who is now world famous and Catherine Delish and also a handful of gals in New York.

And when I was introduced to this, I didn't even, uh, couldn't wrap my head around what they were doing. I didn't totally get it, you know, other than having seen maybe some burlesque and like old timey movies, but I didn't quite understand what they were doing. And it was very punk rock. And, uh, so they invited me to perform with them. And next thing I know, I ended up performing and developing as a burlesque dancer for about 11 years. And I got to tour the country a little bit of Europe. And that's where I really found my footing as a stage performer. And, and it's not that I was like excited about stripping in front of anybody. To this day, I mean, I get dressed in the dark, but I had a, I have a very confrontational attitude about what I do because my entire life I've been told what I cannot do because of what I look like.

One of those things was, and every disabled person relates to this. You weren't neutered. If you're disabled, you are neutered. You are never seen as a sexual person with adult desires in any way, shape or form. Uh, it's almost angelic you're on this like, sorry, pedestal. Like you can't be a full human with full human desires. So that is what drove me to do it. I agreed to perform with these women because I just thought, you know, this will be an opportunity to show the world that I am as feminine as any other woman in the show. And, um, my first time performing, it was to over a thousand people and I was just luck here goes nothing. And I really thought I would get laughed off stage, you know, for being the freaky looking one. And the audience was amazing. They loved me and I kept doing it for another 11 years.

Passionistas: We're Amy and Nancy Harrington and you're listening to the Passionistas Project Podcast and our interview with Selene Luna. To learn more about Selene, visit her website, SeleneLuna.com. And find out more about Chronically Funny: A Comedy Revolution Featuring All-Disabled Lineup of Women on October 28th at 8:00 PM Eastern | 5:00 PM Pacific at ThePassionistasProject.com. Now here's more of our interview with Selene.

You were talking about how the world of comedy was so male dominated and that contributed to you not being ready to be in that world at that time. Do you think the fact that this was women who were supporting each other and surrounding each other with positive energy, do you think that helped you overcome that? Not liking to be undressed in front of people?

Selene: 100%? Absolutely. It was like a different planet compared to the comedy clubs. There was no male energy. Uh, not that I don't enjoy male energy, but, um, and also there were men involved in the show, but they, they were like feminist guys, you, they were like really cool creative dudes. And still great friends with them to this day. I mean, we were like a family. And we're all still in touch and love these, this group of people madly. And they helped me grow up as an artist. I felt like raised by them. And, um, they were, a lot of them were experienced artists and been doing it much longer than I had. And I learned a lot from them. And the, the women in the show made me feel like I was part of a sisterhood. They were very nurturing about it. They embraced me, everyone supported each other.

But I also want to clarify that this wasn't some feminist group. It wasn't like a feminist movement. It wasn't like I'm woman hear me roar. That's why I'm stripping it. It wasn't that these were just rock and roll chicks who were really wrapped up in the vintage lifestyle. And we had a lot of fun getting dolled up and glamorous. And, you know, we, it, it was a real bonding thing. It was kind of like almost like a quilting circle. We would make our costumes, we would, you know, get together and have a costume making circle, you know, it was bonding like that. And it was very like glitzy and glamorous. And so it wasn't like some feminist thing. We were trying to be pretty, you know, we're trying to be cute, but it was a bunch of bad-ass girls.

Passionistas: What do you think was the most important thing you learned about yourself from that time in the burlesque show?

Selene: That's a great question. I think what I learned about myself is that I am in fact, a complete woman and, um, and I deserve and have the right to be as feminine as I want to be and claim my sexuality. It made me feel like essential individual. And it gave me the permission to do that.

Passionistas: So then how did you transition from that back into the world of standup?

Selene: Well, during that period of time, uh, that's when I met my now very dear friend, Margaret Cho, um, world famous comic. At the time, her husband, Al, he was involved with our troop. Actually it, he was, uh, he had his own kind of performance art group, either really cool artists. And, um, what we would do back then is, um, our show's producer, well, our show's creator got him on board and, uh, him and his, um, performance art friends would do a fake picket in front of our show. Cause we were a bunch of ladies stripping. And so, um, so he and his buddies, uh, they would dress up like priests and have big signs and, uh, and they would picket in front of the theater and that's how we would sell out because it would draw attention. It's like old school marketing. And, and, um, so it was just, we always had a real sense of humor about what we were doing. We didn't take it seriously.

And, um, so, so he was involved with us at that capacity. And, uh, and then that's how I met Margaret Cho, uh, at the time, they're no longer together, but at the time, uh, she would come and watch the show. Cause you know, her husband was kind of part of our marketing gag and it was really funny. And um, and then eventually she and I had a lot of friends in common. We became friends. She actually started doing burlesque performing. She's actually a dancer herself. She's a belly, uh, trained belly dancer. And she started doing burlesque and then she started producing a burlesque comedy show. She asked me if I wanted to be in it. And so that was really the start of our relationship. So we were starting to share the stage. She would do comedy. And I was one of the featured burlesque dancers.

And over the years doing the show, we did the show for years and over time, she and I got to know each other more and more, and we became friends and she began to encourage me to do stand up. And, uh, she w I'll never forget, you know, one day she pulled me aside and she said, you know, in stand up comedy, nobody cares what you look like and you have full control of your dialogue. So, uh, so she really encouraged me to go back and do it. And that's how I went back. But, you know, it's a craft that it takes many, many years to develop. And so my little stint for a year, you know, at the Improv was barely scratching the surface. I felt like it was as if I'd never done it, you know, compared to where you need to be. And, uh, so yeah, and Margaret became my mentor in stand up and was my greatest support and encourager.

Passionistas: What unique challenges do you face doing standup as a woman with disability?

Selene: I'm very fortunate, uh, to say, I don't think I've really encountered many. I really haven't. I'm now, uh, uh, pretty bold. I'm, I'm, I'm now pretty bold and aggressive and I'm not shy about getting what I need. And I think that energy just comes off of me and I get what I need. Um, I really honestly have not had many challenges, but I'm very fortunate in that way. There are other performers with disabilities, you know, I know personal friends of mine who are also disabled comics and they face challenges that I don't face.

For example, being in a wheelchair, uh, there aren't any stages with ramps. It just doesn't exist. I mean, that's been my experience. And so they face challenges like that. And then, so, um, individually, for example, somebody in a wheelchair has to be put up onto the stage, uh, by my staff. That's not accessibility, you know, it's invasive and, uh, but that's a comedy clubs idea of accessibility. So those are the kinds of challenges I see from my peers face.

But I'm fortunate that I haven't really, I mean, other than, you know, as a dancer, I did tour tremendously and, uh, in many old, old, old theater houses and they're not accessible. I mean, like there's crazy flights of stairs. You gotta go like, you know, five flights of stairs to get to your number. And then I gotta run back up. There's no elevator went back up, do a costume change, you get three minutes and you gotta be back. Well, I don't have that physical ability to fly up and down stairs. You know, I gotta take my time. I gotta hang on. I could barely walk in heels. So it's those kinds of things.

Passionistas: And how, how has the world of standup changed for you during COVID? Is it all virtual? Are you doing virtual shows and everything?

Selene: Yeah, it's all virtual and it's strange. It's weird. It's absolutely not the ideal for a performing artist, a live performer, because especially with comedy, the audience is equally as important as the comics material. It's, it's a bad way we're doing together. If I don't, you can't feel the same kind of human energy that like invisible energy, you can feel in a room like a room that's alive or dead. And you just don't feel that I'm doing, you know, shows on Zoom. So it's been a learning experience. I'm still stumbling through it. I'm still trying to, uh... It takes real finesse.

Because with Zoom, as we addressed earlier, you know, there was a delay. So you deliver a joke. There was a two second delay, uh, for the audience to get the G to receive the joke. And then there's another two second delay for the comic to hear them laugh if they're laughing. So then we're looking at a four second delay. So you just delivered your punchline and you're just sitting there quiet for four minutes and you have no idea if what you said even works. It's very uncomfortable.

Passionistas: What kind of topics do you cover in your, your act? And are you ever concerned about the reaction you're going to get to it from the audience?

Selene: For the most part I mean like 99% of the time. I mean, I should just say all the time, uh, I just cover my own life, experience, my own observation. Uh, I try to make my life experience relatable. I work hard to make it universal because if people are, if people are laughing about my experience as a disabled person, you know, they're laughing with me and if they're relating at the same time, uh, that's huge for me. I feel heard. And so many times people have come up to me after a show. And they'll just say, now I understand, like now I get it. You know?

So being able to craft something where just about anyone can walk in your shoes and just the humor of it, people relate to that. You know, humor is very disarming. It's, it's a real unifier and that's why I gravitate to it. It's not something that's easy for me to execute. I struggle. I am not like this. I'm not like this talented joke writer. I don't write like amazing punchlines. I have to work really, really hard, but that's because it's important for me to be heard. I'm never concerned with anyone's reaction. I haven't been embraced. I'm not embraced all the time. I bomb all the time. And that's just part of the process. I don't care.

I mean, offending somebody, Oh, gee, that's the worst that could happen to me. That's child's play. I don't, I don't care. You know, and I, but I think that's a general kind of comic attitude and look, I'm not looking to offend anyone. And I know I have, and I've learned from it. I don't enjoy that. That's not at all what I'm driven to do, but it happens sometimes with, you know, I, I haven't quite figured out my footing on a concept and I have offended people and I feel horrible because I never want an audience to have a bad experience or to walk away, you know, feeling bad about something. But, um, but there were, so it's a balance of feeling free to speak your mind, but also being inclusive.

Passionistas: Is there a show or a performance that you've had that really stands out to you as like your best night in comedy?

Selene: One show that stands out in my mind is, um, I was lucky enough to open for Margaret show at the Wiltern, which is, um, a very well respected, huge theater here in Los Angeles. And, uh, so I, I was really nervous leading up to it and to speak. There was a lot of pressure. I mean, you know, doing a show in LA is very tough. Uh, it's like everybody's in the business. You know, the first front row is like folding their arms. They're all industry people. It's like, make me laugh, come on. And, uh, you know, I had friends and families, I, everybody came out. And so I was really nervous, but, um, I killed it that night. And so I felt very proud of that.

Passionistas: What's the most rewarding part of your career?

Selene: The most rewarding part of my career, I would have to say, and I hate to keep beating a dead horse, but is, uh, people respecting my narrative. I created a certain image. I've done certain works and have been, uh, respected by my fellow artists and also audiences. And that's been incredibly validating and it's made me feel like a, a whole, a complete person.

Passionistas: Thanks for listening to the Passionistas Project Podcast and Part 1 of our interview with Selene Luna. Check back next week for Part 2. To learn more about Selene, visit her website, SeleneLuna.com.

And find out more about Chronically Funny: A Comedy Revolution, Featuring an All-Disabled Lineup of Women on October 28th at 8:00 PM Eastern | 5:00 PM Pacific at ThePassionistasProject.com.

While you're there, you can learn more about our podcast and subscription box filled with products made by women owned businesses and female artisans to inspire you to follow your passions. Sign up for our mailing list, to get 10% off your first purchase and be sure to subscribe to the passion needs just project podcast. So you don't miss any of our upcoming inspiring guests until next time stay well and stay passionate.

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Heike Yates is a fitness and nutrition expert with over 30 years of experience. She is empowering women over 50 to take back their health and strength by designing balanced and straightforward fitness, nutrition, and mindset programs. Heike is the creator of Pursue Your Spark and host of the Pursue Your Spark Podcast. She has developed a reputation for creating real-life solutions and lasting results.

More about Heike.

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Full Transcript:

Passionistas: Hi, and welcome to the Passionistas Project Podcast. We're Amy and Nancy Harrington and today we're talking with Heike Yates, a fitness and nutrition expert. With over 30 years of experience, she is empowering women over 50 to take back their health and strength by designing, balanced, and straightforward fitness, nutrition, and mindset programs. Heike is the creator of Pursue Your Spark and the host of the Pursue Your Spark Podcast. And she's developed a reputation for creating real life solutions and lasting results. So please welcome to the show. Heike Yates.

Heike: Hey ladies. So happy to be with you. Thank you for having me on the show.

Passionistas: Oh, it's our pleasure. So Heike, what's the one thing you're most passionate about?

Heike: Well, that's a tough one because if you have to just pick one thing I would say is empowering other people. And in this case, empowering women, that's the most, what I'm most passionate about. I know that's a broad term empowerment, but if you're giving somebody the tools to do something, whatever it is, it's mindset, body, or nutrition or exercise, whatever it is, you've given them the tool to do something, to get better at where they're at.

Passionistas: How does that translate into what you do for a living?

Heike: I don't just say here's a diet, here's an exercise program. Now go do it. It's more like, what do you want to do? Where are you in your journey? What have you experienced already that worked and didn't work? What would you like to do in the ideal world? If you go all crazy, all out, well, what would it look like for you? And then rebuilding around those things and putting them all together with the spark system to, to first figure out what somebody wants and their background, how they can put this in a plan for them that works for them and not for me or anyone of you. Um, but that it works for them personally, and that they also can continue to build on the baby steps. As I like to call them, to grow with the system, to grow with what they're learning and they're not stuck.

And once let's assume the program is over, you're like, okay, now what? That there is something afterwards that you can take the tools learned and go, okay, this is great. Now I know how to put a meal together. What, what does a meal involve? And I don't have to go and say, Oh, now I have to find a recipe. And now I have to, Oh, can I eat this? Can I not eat this? No, this meal will have all components and you just make out of them what it is you would like to make out of them.

Passionistas: So let's take a step backwards for a second. You grew up in Germany and then you moved to DC. So what brought you to the States? What was that journey?

Heike: I love to travel. This is my, one of my other passions. I love to explore new things and this passion for empowerment travels into everything that I do. And I wanted to literally just travel the world, the world, and a job at the foreign service here in Washington, D C and well, that's where my travel ended. I met my first husband. We had two amazing kids and my kids are now all over the world. And I'm still here in Washington, DC and people wonder why I'm still here. I'm like, I just love it. I mean, you can say about what you wanted about, do you see, and it's a government city and so forth, but it has everything that I need and want. And I can do my little travels to the beach from here. It's three hours to the beach and I can go hiking within an hour. So it has that sense of freedom and independence that I'm looking for when I initially started out in Germany.

Passionistas: So then why did you leave that nine to five corporate life that you had come to have here?

Heike: It's so boring. I'm so sorry. It's just really boring to sit on your butt ski. As I like to call it for such a long period of time and there's, to me, there was no adventure. It was sitting from nine to five in the same office, on the same chair, on the same desk, doing the same work. And he just kept doing the same things over and over. And I didn't feel like it in besides I had two amazing kids and I draw, they wanted to spend my time with them and sitting somewhere, doing boring work. And my husband at that point, he was working. So we had an income, even though it was small, I still was able to stay home with the kids at least one at first and, um, hang out with him at this point. And I said, you know, let's just go.

I mean, I gotta bite the bullet and let go of the money. But staying home as a mom, wasn't that easy. Why not? Because you're home alone suddenly with a toddler and you don't have any conversations. You don't go anywhere. You have a couple of friends who basically on the same boat and we're all like, okay, so our careers are left behind and now you're here with the kids. Now what, where is us? Where's the person that I was before I became a office worker before I became a mom. What happened to Heike at that point? Where does she? So that was a little tough.

Passionistas: So how did that lead to a career in fitness and nutrition?

Heike: It goes with empowerment and my freedom of independence, my seeking independence. Well, I got really big when I was pregnant. I had, before that I had quit smoking. Cause I guess I was smoking back in the days everybody smoked. And, uh, you know, if you stop smoking, you eat more clearly. So I was ginormous ended at month eight. I looked like a pink elephant. And I remember the day when I wore this pink outfit with golden glitter on and I was, I thought I was looking so cute. My husband said, you're look fantastic. And I look at the picture and I said, Oh, I look like a pink elephant.

And having children, sometimes the weight just doesn't come off. Many women say, Oh, you just go nurse the baby. And the pounds will fall off. And you look like before, well, none of that happened. I had still 30 pounds to lose. And my girlfriend said there is a class at the church from the local YMCA, a, uh, community service based, uh, exercise programs and just, I did music. It's like dancing, let's go. And so we took the class and I could bring my son, which ended up screaming for the entire time in the nursery. But I didn't know that. So I was fine and I loved the class, but I would have not thought that I was going to teach this class, but they were looking for teachers and they said, Hey, you moved a well in class. Why don't you start teaching for us?

And they actually teach, you're trained me for the program. And so I had training, I had my son in daycare who kept screaming. I don't know. He kept screaming and screaming, but at some point I think things went better, but, and that's how I started out. And that gave me just a little bit of money and a little bit of away from home, away from the kid and gave me my own identity. Back to that, I hike. It can create now something brand new that has nothing to do with office work and government and all this kind of stuff. It's something that I would have never, ever thought I would ever do. Teaching aerobics classes, me, but that's how my fitness journey third. And then when did you bring the nutrition element into it? Once I started teaching classes, people ask you all kinds of things.

And, well, I didn't know that much about nutrition, but I knew how to eat healthy and cook healthy meals. And that was always part of how we grew up at home. But then I became also certified as a personal trainer along the way. So as I kept teaching classes, I was just interested in more things. It's like, Oh, if I can teach glasses, what else can I do? Oh, I can become a personal trainer. I can teach somebody how to lift weights. Oh, this is cool. But most people want to get in shape and want to maybe lose a couple of pounds. Well, how do they have to eat? Oh, okay. They have to eat this way. They have to exercise that way. And then it translated actually into what I was starting to do personally, you know, growing up in Germany, you exercise automatically.

You don't, uh, oftentimes at least back in the days gyms were there, but people would bike and walk everywhere and we'd walk to the grocery store and you take public transportation. It's not like in the States where everything is in the car, in the Metro and people move very little. And so being exposed, this new fitness environment, I was like, this is really cool. How can I help somebody that I'm not training with weights and bands and all this stuff to get in shape? How can I help them eat better, get more energy. And like I said, maybe lose a few pounds or answer questions about, should I eat more protein? Should I have a high carb diet or what, what is Keto and all these things. And so I took what I've learned through certifications and educational classes, um, for my own training. And the first thing I did, I became a bodybuilder.

So a bodybuilder needs to know how to eat correctly or not eat or hydrate or build big muscles. I mean, guys, I never got huge. I was much more muscular than I am now and much more cut, but this is another whole different learning process of how can you eat this way in order to get bulk? How do you eat this way in order to lean out? Um, and that was another perfect learning environment. And that then translated, you know, the story goes on and on. I became a runner as a runner, you eat completely different than you eat for building mass. So I started marathon running. So now I had to learn about endurance training and endurance nutrition. And what should you eat when you're out for a 20 mile run? Or how should you, as everybody loves to do the cart loading before a big race. Uh, and so all these steps then going into becoming an ultra marathon runner. So that's over 26 miles. So I ran the JFK 50 miler and again, another completely different way of eating. Cause when you think as a marathoner, you eat your goos or your liquid gels, that is all sugar. And you're done in a relatively short period of time. When you train for longer, Oh my God, you eat chips and M&Ms and salt and cookies. You would not believe [inaudible] told me about that a long time ago.

Good stuff is out there on a trail race that is offered. But you, again, you're out there for 15, 20 hours or even longer for longer races. So you need a whole different type of nutrition. And so then I was like, okay, this is great. And I want to do something different. So I got into triathlons. Well, here we go. Another completely different system. You're swimming, you're biking and you're running. So I had this running nutrition under control. I didn't know anything about the bike nutrition or what do you do when you swim two miles, you clearly don't stop and have a sandwich or, you know, and so it was a learning process of the different sports that I chose, uh, that taught me a lot about nutrition. But along the way, I've always believed you need solid education and or certification or a really good ground where you can grow from.

So I became a precision nutrition certified coach for, um, sports performance. And that really helps a lot explaining why something is and why your body metabolizes this way and how you can get the best nutrition for different sports. And it's the same works for anybody. If you come to me, it's a hike. I walk, well, I can tell you the same thing because it's all about biomechanics kinesiology and, and metabolizing foods and so forth.

Passionistas: So now how did all of this lead to working with women over 50?

Heike: I am almost 60. So I experienced what a lot of women around me experience slower metabolism, no energy, belly fat, um, here, not shiny, uh, lack luster. And you know, when I look at how I have trained, I got to a point, despite all my training, I'm changing hard, I'm doing everything right. I kept gaining weight.

I nothing really works. So I, once again had to switch gears and going, okay, so everything that's worked until my mid forties, early fifties doesn't work now anymore. My thyroid is not the way it should be. I had changes in, I don't have a thyroid at all, but it's still I'm affected by different hormone changes in my body. As funny as it sounds right? So I'm past menopause, but I'm still going through the hot flashes or I can tell in your listeners probably can hold their ears, but I can tell if I were to get my period, my stomach gets rounder. I get these bloated feelings that if you ask somebody, they're like, Oh, you're just making this up. This is really not happening. And, and you way past this, but it's not true. And my endocrinologist choose these as your body will continue to go through hormone changes.

And so we have to adapt your thyroid levels based on where you are. Every six months, we need to test so many women around me have said the same things. And they're like, man, nothing's working. What can I do if I exercise my butt off and still nothing happens. So we need to do things differently than we've done them before. And with the 30 years in the experience in the field, I think I have a lot to offer when it comes to over 50 and how to do things better. Now that we're older and that we're not the spring chicken, we're not with the same metabolism and also not the same needs. I mean, I am not particularly crazy about a high intensity interval, crack class. I don't know about you, but my knees are not. I mean, yes, I run, but I can take care of my knees, but jumping around and doing some super hard stuff is just, and that's what I hear from many women.

They, they feel the same way. And so that's, I'm here to help. And you also fitness nutrition, and then mindset is kind of the third component. So why is that an important element in all of this? I would almost go the backwards it's mindset, exercise nutrition, or you can the change the last two pieces. But I think the mindset is really where it starts with self care. It starts with, how do we feel about ourselves? How do we empower ourselves? What do we think about ourselves? The self value that we have, the old stories, the old beliefs that we, we keep telling ourselves that we are not good enough, not smart enough. We don't know these things. And they translate into a fitness and nutrition package. Let's put it that way as well. Because if you start out not taking care of yourself, you don't know how to exercise, right?

You don't know how to eat, right? You do everything maybe for somebody else or you as I call it, you dim your light and you just stay under your little light and never shine for what your true potential could be. And that's why I think the mindset component is really the key to the success in overcoming these obstacles that we come along in over 50 lifestyles. And then yes, we can't help our skin gets saggy. I mean, it's just the whole hormone changes again, but we definitely can do about something about how we think about ourselves and how we treat ourselves, how we treat ourselves, right?

Passionistas: We're Amy and Nancy Harrington and you're listening to the Passioistas Project Podcast in our interview with Heike Yates. To learn more about her, Pursue Your Spark Podcast, visit HeikeYates.com. Now here's more of our interview with Heike.

Talk about Pursue Your Spark and what spark stands for.

Heike: Pursue Your Spark! Pursue Your Spark is in simple terms, the cook, the opposite of sim your lights So pursue your spark came out of a whole bunch of reinventions of this brand. It had different names before, and none of them really grabbed me and, and expressed what I wanted to be it's that any woman can pursue any spark in their lives. Does it mean, uh, you want to get a new haircut? That's a spark. You want to try new lipstick. That's a spark. You want to empower yourself to eat better. That's igniting a spark. It's the catalyst. And they become the catalyst, something bigger. There's this gateway that they can open up with, pursue your spark, to become something bigger than themselves. Something more than they thought they could reach and something that empowers them to do better than they did before.

Passionistas: And what is the SPARK method?

Heike: Oh, this is my top secret. No, I'm just kidding. Secret SPARK method. And it is built very similar to what I just mentioned is you first, you evaluate where you are. So you start, you look at where you are, you see where, uh, where you need help with and, and, uh, where you can grow where your basis is basically, then you take your basis and then you start a plan, a thing, things like I'm a Walker. I know I can walk two miles, but I would love to do a 10 K race. That'd be like, I always dreamed about this. Okay. So you currently work walking two miles. So how this is your base. What will be the next step is to create a plan that is sensible and doable for you to get to the 10 K that we'll be planning phase number two.

And then you go into also the dream and this, in this case, it will be the dream thing. Okay. The 10 key is my stepping stone to the next thing to maybe something bigger, but it doesn't have to be. And then you're looking at what's possible and what's not possible. And that's where the roadblocks come in. The mindset like my feet hurt after three miles, this sucks. It's hot, it's raining. Um, I don't know if I can do this or I don't have good shoes. So what do I do now? And these roadblocks that sometimes are just imagined roadblocks, but they're there. And then as I say, in the end, we kick ass and we're going to follow up on the plan that we had from the get go. And so you keep evaluating each phase and you're like, okay. So here's my dream. Here's my goal.

Here's the first plan that I had. Okay. This works great. So we keep going, Oh, we'll tweak it. If it's not working great, let's get the roadblocks out of the way. So we're not thinking of things that are maybe not there, or if it's a new pair of shoes, we'd get a new pair of shoes. And then we'll pursue that goal. That spark till you get to the finish line and you go like, I'm over the finish line, whether I want it rented or anyway, but you did it. And that's a spark method. Talk about what your clients sign up for with your services and maybe how that's changing right now. So I have a brick and mortar business, which I've had for a long time. And I've pivoted these people that I've known for many, many years into an online program. And that online program is, is an, I offer this to anybody, even if you haven't been my client before one-on-one is like, I work with you over zoom or any other channel that's convenient to you.

So I can see you in person. And we're doing basically the SPARK methods to start with and determining what you need, what your goals are. And based on that, I'll train you over the internet virtually for one hour. So that's one part. I have small group training programs where you're in a small group of up to 10 people and everybody is in the small group together, and everybody does the same program. And this group also will meet online through a Facebook group. So you have connections and contacts. And I offer larger programs for individuals that are three months or 12 week programs that are geared exactly to who you are, where you are, where you want to go in a three months span. So these are those programs. I am about to start the 4-Week Lean program. And that is a 28 day program for women over 50.

They want to boost their metabolism, learn about intermittent fasting. And now I'm a huge fan of intermittent fasting, and they want to take their life now and say, okay, I want to learn how to exercise and includes exercises for the whole 28 days, strategies, habit, building strategies, and help somebody to kickstart or tune up their fitness lifestyle. So if you, if you're the person who knows everything about intermittent fasting, that's not the program for you. If you're the person who wants really hard, tough busting exercises, this is not the program for you. And so these are the programs that I offer. And then I have a couple of free guides that I offer the five, four 50 lifestyle, again, a tuneup guide that you can get for free on my website and the kick quick start to intermittent fasting. That's also a free guide for anybody that wants it.

So I'm thinking, keeping busy over the Corona virus, building programs, and, and finally, in a good sense, I had time to sit down and create this content, shoot the videos for the programs, write out everything and put it together. And you know, everything that goes with it, the behind the scenes stuff that nobody sees. And they're like, Whoa, look at this. And you're like, yeah, this took me a year to do. And I mean, I can't complain. I'm sorry about the situation. And I do miss my friends. Then I do miss seeing my in-person clients. But on the other hand, I'm meeting some amazing women online that I can connect through this way and can offer services that I know make a difference.

Passionistas: And you also have a podcast which is called Pursue Your Spark. So tell everybody about that and what you hope women take away from that podcast.

Heike: My podcast started out solely me and, uh, I'm talking about fitness, nutrition, mindset strategies for the woman in midlife and specifically the women over 50. And I coach everything through my podcasts that you may get in block form, or you can, um, get on my posts on social media. But my, my podcast is really a free source for you to learn more about intermittent fasting, more how to exercise, um, how to deal with mindset strategies when it comes to overeating or whatever the components are that we're talking about. But since I'm a very social person, I'm inviting guests as well. And my guests come from all walks of life. What they all have in common is that they overcome or overcame an obstacle. You find anybody. And this week's guest is, um, somebody who's battled breast cancer for a long time with a double mastectomy. So she will be on this week's podcast

Or you can find somebody that is a much more crazy runner than I am, who ran into Infinitus is a 888 mile, 888 kilometer race self-supported. So you can find her, or you can find somebody like my friend, John Dre, who is a, what used to be a jet fighter pilot, who had to battle the health system too, which is where she is now alive, because she said, if I didn't fight the healthcare system, I would be dead today. So what do these women have in common? They overcame obstacles. They empower you the listener to take action. And you may find yourself in those stories and saying, man, yeah, I know about this one that had Lyme disease. Oh, I can talk to her and ask her questions or the bladder. I have problems with my bladder. Oh, I can reach out to hike this podcast and talk to the person that she had as a guest.

And these stories help us not only be empowered and learn about each other, but also know that we're not alone, that you're not alone in your struggles that somebody else somewhere in the world has probably the same or a similar problem. And we'd love to connect with you, or we'd love to love for you to listen to their story and to help you out with what they experienced and what they've learned along the way. And that's my goal of the podcast. I love my podcast.

Passionistas: What do you think is your best habit?

Heike: Best habit is I'm very disciplined. I am extremely disciplined. If I set a goal, I'm going to go and do it. And, or oftentimes get myself in situations where I said, this sounds like a great idea, like becoming a bodybuilder and I'm at it. And I'm learning everything. And I'm very disciplined when it comes to the practice, to the, doing it, to the executing it. And just a little side note for the bodybuilding story, my girlfriend who got me into all of this, she did not compete she's I just couldn't get it together. I come and cheer for you. And I was like, Oh, I thought we were doing it together. I think that's my I'm very disciplined.

Passionistas: What's the most rewarding part of your career?

Heike: I get to kick everybody's buttski. I wouldn't say that. Um, but, well, it's true though. No, I get to help people be healthier. You know, my clients in my career have ranged from kids age eight to now my oldest client is 94 94. And when you look at the range of needs, these different people in different age groups in brackets have, it's just you, you I'm like your cheerleader by the side. Oh, you get to stand up from the toilet. Yes. Winner. Or you can run a race. Me and yes, I want to see the metal. It's just helping people to move forward with their health and not get stuck in what is so prevalent in the U S is heart disease overweight. I'm like, I'm here for you and you don't have to be definitely not perfect. And you don't, I will always cheer you on not no matter how little your accomplishments are.

Cause it doesn't matter to me what Susie down the road does or how wonderful she did, whatever it matters to me, what you do and what you can accomplish every day. And when somebody comes in and says, hi guys, I've been really bad. I'm like, what do you mean by that? Well, I didn't eat a clean diet. I may have had a muffin or whatever this week. And I didn't stick to the plan that I was thought I was going to do. And I'm like, well, if you only had one muffin, that's a win right there. You didn't need the whole box.

Passionistas: Do you have a dream for women? And what is it?

Heike: Not really a dream. But I would say, I like to think of it as a more of a reality that we need to step up to the plate without fear too much. And right now in the past, in the past with the me too movement is like, we're sitting there hoping that somebody will do something for us to fix something or to make it better. And instead we need to step up to the plate with a clear message of what we want and how we want things to be and what we're not standing for. That's what I, my, my vision is. Um, and I hope I raised my daughter this cause she doesn't stand for any of that. She is like, Nope, she's after it. But I think instead I like rather than a dream, it's, it's really a reality cause we're right in the midst of it.

And there's no better time for women to step up to the plate then right now to speak their mind. But clearly and succinctly. And um, one of my podcast guests has actually helped me through her book to do that in a, in a part of my life that, um, and it was about asking for something and not instead of saying yes, I wish could you potentially, and maybe wouldn't it be nice if to say, no, I deserve this because I do this and this, and here is why I deserve this thing or this raise or whatever it may be that we really step up and not be afraid of the consequences that the reaction is from the other person, which I think a lot of women still, and I'm not excluding myself. They're either grapple with that. I'd rather sometimes not say something because I'm thinking, Hmm, what are they going to come back with? And this is something we need to move forward.

Passionistas: What do you think is your secret to a rewarding life?

Heike: Happiness. It's all there is to it. If you're not happy from the inside out, then your life could be as beautiful as shiny inexpensive and whatever. But if you're not happy, happiness to me is everything. And it's like, what I tell my kids is like, are you healthy? Are you fine? Yes. But then my next question is, are you happy? Because if you're not happy, then to me, at least nothing really matters.

Passionistas: Thanks for listening to the Passionistas Project Podcast and our interview with Heike Yates. To learn more about pursue your spark visit HeikeYatescom.

We're currently taking orders for the fall Passionistas Project Pack, subscription box. Our theme this quarter is Passionistas Persist and the box is full of products from women owned businesses. We hope these items inspire you to stand in your power, roar at the top of your lungs, take care of yourself and remember to laugh because without joy, what's it all for. If we all support one another and stay persistent, great things will happen.

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Jennifer Reitman is the founder and publisher of DAME Magazine, a digital news site covering the issues of our time through the lens of women. DAME provides critical context around the political, cultural and societal issues of our time. Independent, women-owned and women edited, DAME breaks through conventional narratives to deliver the insight readers need to understand today’s complex cultural landscape.

More about DAME Magazine.

Learn more about The Passionistas Project.

FULL TRANSCRIPT:

Passionistas: Hi and welcome to The Passionistas Project Podcast. We’re Amy and Nancy Harrington. And today we're talking with Jennifer Reitman, the founder and publisher of DAME magazine. DAME provides critical context around the political, cultural and societal issues of our time. Independent women-owned and women-edited DAME breaks through conventional narratives to deliver the insight readers need to understand today's complex cultural landscape.

So please welcome to the show. Jennifer Reitman.

Jennifer Reitman: So happy to be here. Thank you

Passionistas: Really looking forward to talking to you. What's the one thing you're most passionate about?

Jennifer: It's clearly about driving equality in the media landscape. We live in a world where women are just over 51% of the population, but we own only 11% of all media. And this is coupled with holding only 37% of all media and journalism jobs. And I always say that that when you look at those statistics, what that tells us is that the stories that are being told the framing of the news is an, is an incomplete picture because those voices aren't equally reflected.

Passionistas: How do you make sure those voices are reflected through the magazine?

Jennifer: First and foremost, of course, is that we're a hundred percent women edited. And our stories themselves, the news we cover is bylined, I would say 99.9, 9% by women. Occasionally we'll publish a story by a man, but nearly everything is bylined by women. And that, that matters. And it matters because the language we use, the framing, the context and the analysis, when you're looking to create equality in media, you have to have that reflected in the stories and in the coverage.

Passionistas: Tell us your journey from before you started DAME. What happened leading up to that?

Jennifer: I've worked in the publishing industry for very long time, the reason I came out to California in fact, was to work for a small, independent print publishing company. And one of those titles happened to be what at the time was called a laddy book at guys magazine, sort of in the Maxim, FHM, Esquire category. And what I, what I found working there was here was this, this magazine that was targeting young men and it was humorous and irreverent, but it had great long form reporting. And it didn't talk about men's bodies. It didn't talk about how to be a better lover. It didn't talk about rooming tips. Maybe it did a little bit, but it, but it wasn't front and central and, and sort of the, the germ of, uh, of the idea for DAME really started then that I thought, gosh, women's publishing just doesn't really look like me or my friends or the, or really reflect the kinds of conversations that I was having.

And so the idea primarily started then, and this was a, you know, the nineties, but I had always been influenced by magazines because my father, funny enough work to publishers clearing house when I was a young girl. And so we had stacks and stacks and stacks of magazines in the house all the time. And I realized sort of the power of the written word, probably as young as, you know, seven, six or seven. And so it's always been in my bones, but I think that the idea that there was a place in the market for women's media, that wasn't about fashion beauty or sex tips really started the nineties. And, and as we got into the, you know, the two thousands, I started to sit down and really write down the business plan for the brand.

Passionistas: Having worked at magazines, how did you figure out how to actually launch your own?

Jennifer: Um, gosh, I don't even know if I figured it out yet today when I first came up with the idea for DAME, the plan was to be in print, frankly, because it was 2008 when the original idea came to me. And so I, I just took years of having worked in the business in terms of what does the right advertising model look like? What is the right circulation model look like? And who are the people that I know can carry forward from an editorial standpoint, the vision that I have for the brand, but that's evolved, you know, like any smart business. And I, I hope that we're a smart business. We change we've pivoted many times because people change culture changes, society changes it's happening right now, as we're on this call. So the original vision was, I think cheekier more irreverent, more in the vein of Jessica Bell perhaps, or even Jane the original vision was not something so focused on social justice, but, but we had to evolve over the years. And that that pivot really came, I would say in 2012 backstory, we had to close down for a little while when I originally launched because of the great recession, like so many media outlets. And so Dame really came back in, in full effect in 2014, but, but we started testing a new model in 2012. So the business evolved over the years, but, but the original concept, you know, was really just best practices in terms of publishing publishing and reaching an audience. And that's, that's grown over the years.

Passionistas: Talk a little bit about the current state of media and how it's changed and some of the challenges that you're facing.

Jennifer: Is this the part of the interview where I start to cry? Well, the current and the, you know, the current state of our union, as we say, the current state of, of, of media is dire it's frankly dire, but it's not, it's not as a result of, of this administration necessarily. That's been amplified with his enemy of the people language. My beloved industry has been suffering for a very long, long time. And so I worry tremendously about it because there are lots of sayings about journalism, right? The first drafted history, but really you don't have democracy without a free and fair press. And while on the business side of things, there's been a erosion for years and years in terms of what works from a business model and how to survive financially, what brings me great, great concern is the erosion in trust of, of the institution of press today.

And so on the business side, I think you'll see things, you know, things will change and models will pivot and tech, new technologies will come out and, and those who survive, and those who don't. But so I'm a little less concerned about that and tremendously concerned around how do we, as an industry, how do we encourage people and get them to understand the role of, of our business in their daily lives? And this is particularly important at the local level. DAME is obviously not a local news outlet. Many of our stories are pegged to local news issues, but, but we don't, we're not a beat outlet and say, you know, Bennis, California, we are the guard rails in so many ways. You know, we, we are the ones who, who, it's not about the big stories that you read in the New York times or Washington post, as important as those are.

We're the ones who talk about embezzlement at your city council level, right? Or, you know, school, board issues, pothole fixes, and, and those that's important as essential as, as anything else that goes on at the federal level. And so when you see such a distrust of the media and such disdain for the reporters who are in large part, not all of them, but in large part, the majority are here to help you. The citizen. It really is heartbreaking as someone who works in this business, we're here to protect you from bad people and bad things through information, through context and through analysis. And, and so my, my short, but very long answer is that is what worries me the most.

Passionistas: So how do you combat that?

Jennifer: Transparency. The very quick and dirty answer is you change administrations first and you get a government in place that actually believes in the first amendment believes in freedom of the press and, and does things to, to support it. But, but we all know that already at the, at the business level, at the, at the platform, at the outlet level, it's about transparency in so many ways. It's about, it's about putting faces to your writers and editors. It's about showing your work. There's a little inside baseball thing. When you're editing a story. A lot of times you'll send a note back to a writer saying, show, don't tell meaning, where are the sources on this? Explain, you know, explain this in detail. Don't just tell us what, what you see, give, give examples to demonstrate why this is such, you know, such and such.

And, and I think we have to, we have to do a better job as a, as an industry at large at showing what is fact checking me, right? What does, when we call sources, what's the process of that? Why did this story get picked and not another story? There's lots of work around that in terms of, of, you know, solutions, journalism as well, not just sort of hyperbolic headlines, but actually really tying in what's happening in certain communities. And who's actually doing the work to either fix or solve or change that brings about transparency as well because it's public interest reporting in large part. And so I think there are solutions that technology can support right there, little things that sites can do many sites already do it. Dame is small. So we don't often have the opportunity to do some of those things on the fly. But I also think that there, there are some bad habits that the Beltway press has, right? And we know them. We can, we complain about them. Both side is forced neutrality and objectivity. And we live in an era with those things that may be 50 years ago worked. They don't so much anymore in the absence of a fairness doctrine. And the reality is that journalism is not AI. There is a person who writes every story and to one, you know, assume or demand that there is not some kind of biases to fool ourselves in some part, all of us readers and, and outlets. And so I think there's a little bit of growing up that the established sort of benchmark media needs to do in terms of the way that they handle headlines, the way that they tap dance around certain words like why you know, we've spent three and a half years watching the biggest newspapers in the country avoid the word lie.

When, when everyone knows that it's a law, and these are, these are habits that wall, they may have served a purpose in the past. I think it's time to dispense with some of this stuff, but, but that's, you know, that's me small publisher who could make change quickly. Right? I don't have a board of directors. I don't have shareholders. I don't have stock. I'm not on the, we're not a publicly traded company. And so we have a lot of control and we also don't position as a breaking news outlet, right. We're, we're for all intents and purposes and editorial site with long form reporting. So we can take a position, we can take a saw and we don't shy away from it. And I think that's, you know, in part our special sauce,

Passionistas: And there's no umbrella organization saying these are the rules of being a journalist of being a media outlet. Right? So how does that change?

Jennifer:  And we don't really want that, right?

Passionstas: Right.

Jennifer:  You know, there's lots of discussion that goes on, you know, should, should, should all media be publicly funded, right? You hear these conversations should the government funded. So when you don't have, uh, you know, uh, uh, there are plenty of bodies that, that work to unify standards of course. Right. And there are tons of nonprofit organizations that are supportive of, of different, of different media outlets. Uh, but you're right. There is no overarching, this is the way this industry is supposed to, you know, that's why I brought up the fairness doctrine. And so, yeah, and it's also democratized. I mean, I'm not young, right? And so I came up a Vinny long before there was the internet and long before, you know, publishing was print or a newspaper or union magazines and newspaper. And so, you know, anybody can say anything now on the internet and lots of people who are not media or journalists, or refer to themselves as that.

And, and you run into a slippery slope because who gets to say what you can't, you can't tell people they can't publish what they want to publish. Of course they can. The issue becomes who do you platform for me, that's the issue, right? For established media, whose voices are you platforming? So anybody can say anything on their own. I, I fully stand behind that. What I, what I don't stand behind is for those, you know, benchmark outlets to give voice and platform to everybody because not everybody deserves to be heard. They deserve to write what they want, but they don't deserve necessarily to be heard. And that can be controversial. I don't know, but that's my personal opinion.

Passionistas: You're listening to The Passionistas Project Podcast and our interview with Jennifer Reitman to subscribe to DAME visit DAMEmagazine.com. And while you're there, be sure to check out their comprehensive guide, to voting in all 50 States and the District of Columbia. You can see the voter registration deadlines for vote by mail and in person options, get details on early voting and requesting an absentee ballot, learn about your voting rights and get your polling location. Now here's more of our interview with Jennifer.

Passionistas: You mentioned that 99.9% of the by-lines are by women and that women speak differently. So to you, what’s the voice of a DAME journalist and how has it,

Jennifer: There's actually a few things that are really consistent across the board without all of our contributors and writers. The first thing is they're unabashed, right? They are confirmed in their thoughts and not in, not in an obstinate way and not in a, a sort of defiantly ignorant way, but they are subject matter experts. Most of our writers are coming from a place of lived experience. And so the voice, one aspect of their voice is just this, this core authenticity. They know what they speak of, and that, and that really does come through. I think the other thing that's been that I notice in all of our features, whether it's reported, whether it's a first person, op ed, is the thoughtfulness and the care in the voice and the approach to the topic that they're writing on, we inherently are so blessed that the people who write for us and agreed to write for us, or are just good, decent kind people.

And that, that part of them comes through in their voice. Without question. I think that the, the other thing that's consistent for us is there is, you know, a bit of provocative tour in, in almost everything we write. And I think in some ways you could attribute that to the subject matter, but I think it's also, you know, I think it's also who, who feels that we're the right platform for us consistently. Some of the feedback we get from writers is their appreciation of the freedom we give them to be themselves. And, and, you know, I look at that again is the authenticity, but it's also, we allow them to push their own personal boundaries in their writing, which in turn, our hope is that pushes the boundaries for anybody reading those features, because that's what we want to do. We want to, you know, we want to stimulate dialogue and in turn, hopefully change an action

Passionistas: In the last few years there have been several key turning points. It seems like in the women's movement on the, you know, the me too movement, the time's up movement, and even the women's March that started in 2017, have those things changed what you guys have been writing about as well?

Jennifer: I don't think it's changed. I think it's funny you point that out. I was going through for our newsletter today. I was pulling a selection of links of some of the most read pieces we've done on race. And it's interesting when it comes to sort of feminism, some of the stuff we've done on, on feminism, I see an evolution around that. Not necessarily on the site, but just out there, right. This sort of, you know, I think the acknowledgement that, that feminism for me, but not for me, has really impacted women of color and black women and, and the commodification of, of white feminism in so many ways and sort of the discounting of the true issues. But what I found slightly disheartening, frankly, is as I went through the archives, the same issues that we're talking about today in terms of, of equality and racial justice, we've been publishing forever and, and amongst many other outlets, right?

We're, we're certainly not, you know, exclusive in that category, but, but, you know, I was particularly struck reading some of them that I, there were several pieces that I realized that we could have published yesterday, literally. And they would have been as timely and as, as newsy as they were in 2014. And I think that that speaks volumes and not in a, not in a great way. And so I think that that what has changed is, you know, on the positive side is no shortage of things to talk about. Whereas we've been covering these topics for a long time, because this is what we do, but I look at it in context of some, you know, newer entrance into the, into the industry, or perhaps some outlets that have been around for a long time, I'm heartened by the fact that their pages include these topics.

Well, as well, because they're nobody shouldn't be considering publishing on all of this. Right? So the, you know, everyone needs to have social justice and center on their site, racial justice, front and center on their site or in their pages, paper pages. But I don't, I don't think we've evolved. I, I think we've done this for so long that that it's simply we've gone where the narrative goes. Right. And so if the, if the debate in 2015 was about, you know, is it finally time for a woman president the question today? You know, maybe why wasn't it. So it's, it's just, it's more about, um, how the, how our culture changes. And I think our editorial reflects that more than anything else.

Passionistas: What is DAME’s plan moving into this intensified election period? How do you guys handle election coverage?

Jennifer: It's interesting. There's a few things that we'll be launching that are, will be a little different for us. In fact, we're going to be launching a lot more coverage of disinformation and that's because I personally have such an incredible fear of the impact, you know, with the hindsight of 2016, I feel a responsibility to do a lot more coverage on what just info ops are out there to debunk it as much as possible, because that really is a service to the electorate, right? We, we have to inform, we've always done a ton of election coverage, right? We, we, you know, we did ongoing series leading up to 2060, obviously in 2016, we did a ton, but, but leading up to the 2018, we covered all of the congressional women candidates running, leading up to the presidential primary. We had a series running on all of the, a weekly series on all the women candidates running for president.

And so we'll, we'll stay there in terms of Senate races. Now we've moved onto the Senate races. So I don't think we'll change much of our election coverage in terms of actual races. That is not our core expertise. We're not DC beltway reporters in that way. We'll probably stick with what we're best at, which are the issues that are relevant to any race. So we've got a lot more disinfect work to do, and we'll probably do far more explainers around the core issues that will be on the ballot, basically what we're voting for when we vote in 2016, not so much about the candidacy, but, but more about, you know, all of the things that go into the federal government. We did a piece that was sort of overarching, right? What we're voting for in that way, but we'll drill down into each of those issues like the judiciary or, or the, you know, federal agencies. So I think those will be two, two big things that we'll focus on is leading it

Passionistas: As we are recording this. Now the country is seeing an uprising like we haven't seen in decades, and there's a lot of protesting around the horrible death of George Floyd. And in fact, DAME magazine sent out an email this morning about elevating the Black voice. So what kind of steps are you taking in that regard?

Jennifer: Well, we've always taken that step. I have to say that, that we're very conscious as a white owned, uh, I'm white and I endeavor whenever possible to be publishing black women, but we need to do more, you know, we need to do more and I need to spend some time making sure that there's parody within our own digital pages. I think one of the things that I've consciously tried to make an effort around is to not relegate our black journalists, to just writing about race, right. That, you know, I want black women to be writing on the economy and on, you know, technology and cultural issues. To me that that's one of the best things I can do to continue to expand outside of, of sort of saying, well, the only thing you can write about, and we do that in all of our categories, frankly, but, but I think it's essential for me to, to every single day be conscious about that. That for every story we assign that I really am not just talking the talk and making sure that that if there is, is a black writer who, who is an expert in tech or an expert in, in economic issues or the law that, that we're publishing that voice, it's essential, but, but we've published, you know, so much over the years. And I think I'm, I'm proud of the work we done. I just know that we can do better because everybody can do better. I don't care what business you're in beyond amazing diverse voices.

Passionistas: What's your overall vision for DAME in the years ahead?

Jennifer: Stay in business in a, in a crazy media world. You know, it's funny, people always ask me, like, they asked me this question and consistently, and as much as I joke, stay in business, it really is stay in business. And I don't mean that from a sort of like, Oh, you know, the industry is, is, is embattled. And it's so hard to keep publishing. I made it in the context of women only own 11% of all media. And as I see many outlets that are either owned or run by women fall by the wayside and go out of business. I, I worry about that. I feel, I feel a deep responsibility to keep going every single day. And, and so my vision is to, you know, is to keep doing what we do to try to do it better every day than we did the day before, to always ensure that if our mission is to elevate and amplify marginalized voices, that I, that I remind myself to do that.

And that as stories come in, that the language we use is careful and considered for, for all groups. But I don't have ambitions to be, you know, some trillion dollar media company. That's not my goal. My goal is to, is for us to, you know, survive and thrive, but in a meaningful way, big isn't always better. And, you know, being a little bit ears to the ground and, and, and boots on the ground, I think affords us a, an intimacy with our readers that a lot of other outlets don't have. So, so my vision is to, is to keep us going, to keep us going in a direction that improves the work that we do every day and in turn, hopefully improves our reader's lives.

Passionistas: Thanks for listening to The Passionistas Project Podcast and our interview with Jennifer Reitman. To subscribe to DAME magazine and get lots of voting information for your state visit DAMEmagazine.com.

We're currently taking orders for the fall Passionistas Project Pack subscription box. Our theme, this quarter is Passionistas Persist, and the box is full of products from women-­owned businesses. We hope these items inspire you to stand in your power verse at the top of your lungs, take care of yourself and remember to laugh because without joy, what's it all for. If we support one another and stay persistent, great things will happen. You can find out how to subscribe to the box at the ThePassionistasProject.com.

And while you're there, don't forget to sign up for our newsletter to find out more about our upcoming Passionate Project Women's Equality monthly events, and subscribe to The Passionistas Project Podcast so you don't miss any of our upcoming inspiring guests.

Until next time stay well and stay passionate.

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Charlotte Harrington is the host of The Fresh Lens Podcast and our niece. At just 12 years of age, Charlotte is a social justice advocate whose passion for women's rights and support of the Black Lives Matter movement, among other issues, has inspired her to launch her own weekly show to tackle the tough issues.

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Kat Calvin is the Founder and Executive Director of Spread The Vote and the Co-Founder and CEO of Project ID. A lawyer, activist and social entrepreneur, Kat has built a national organization that helps Americans obtain the ID they need for jobs, housing and life, and that also allows them to go to the polls. Kat is also the co-host, along with Andrea Hailey of Vote! The Podcast.

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Full Transcript:

Passionistas: Hi, and welcome to the Passionistas Project Podcast. We're Amy and Nancy Harrington. And before we start our interview today, we wanted to tell you about our upcoming event from Friday, August 21st through Sunday, August 23rd, we'll be hosting the Passionistas Project Women's Equality Summit. The three-day virtual event will feature live panel discussions, prerecorded presentations, daily workshops. The Passionistas Portraits storyteller event. The LUNAFEST® short film festival, a virtual marketplace and a Pay It Forward Portal. We'll also be presenting the first annual Passionistas Persist Humanitarian Award to a very special honoree. The weekend is centered around the theme of women's equality and intersectional feminism from a range of perspectives, including racial equality, LGBTQ plus rights, financial equity, voter suppression, ageism, physical and mental health issues, religious persecution, and so much more. And best of all, it's free for the weekend. Go to ThePassionistasProject.com to register.

And now for today's interview, we're talking with Kat Calvin, the Founder and Executive Director of Spread the Vote and the Co-Founder and CEO of Project ID. A lawyer activist and social entrepreneur, Kat has built a national organization that helps Americans obtain the ID they need for jobs, housing and life. And that also allows them to go to the polls. Kat is an advisor to Ragtag and DemCast and sits on the boards of the California Women's List. Kat is one of the Time magazines 16 people in groups fighting for a more equal America, 2018 Fast Company 100 most creative people in business and has been a Business Insider 30 under 30, Grios 100 and more. So please welcome to the show. Kat Calvin.

Kat: Thanks so much for having me.

Passionistas: Thanks for joining us today. What's the one thing you're most passionate about?

Kat: That's an incredibly difficult question, probably movies. I love movies more than anything. That's probably my greatest passion in life. What is it about movies that mean so much to you? I came up in theater and I love storytelling and I love accessible storytelling. And so I sort of studied a lot of theater and sort of the difference between the way theater was during the times of Eschalas and Shakespeare, what it was for the commons. And now it's less successful, but TV and film and took lately. Now that we have streaming, et cetera, it's accessible for everyone. And I think that great storytelling that everyone can see is really amazing. And I come from a big movie loving family. So it's most of my early memories have to do with like Butch and Sundance or Hitchcock or something.

It's pretty much what I talk about all the time. If I'm not talking about IDs or voting, most people like you are the wrong business. If I had to choose one great passion, I'm sure the answers should be something related to what I do for a living, but it's actually movies, which is no secret to anybody.

Passionistas: So let's talk a little bit about what you do for a living. So talk about Spread the Vote. What inspired you to start it.

Kat: At Spread the Vote we help people get government issued photo ID, which they use for jobs, housing, to get food at many food banks to sleep in many shelters, etc, everything you need an ID for in life. And then in many States across the country, they also use them to vote. So we help folks get all of the documents required. Birth certificates, proofs of residency insurance, not insurance identity, etc. We pay for everything. We provide transportation advocacy at the DMV and government offices and do whatever it takes to get an ID of their hands. This is all pre apocalypse, of course. And then when an election comes around, we make sure they're all registered to vote. And then we do a lot of voter education. 77% of our clients have never voted before. So we do a lot of helping just walk folks through the process and what's going to be on the ballot and how to vote, et cetera. And then we take them to the polls. So that's sort of the process A to Z. I started it after the 2016 elections. Actually we're about to have our third birthday. I started December of 16, but we count our official birthday is May 6, which is when we launched our first chapter. And so now we're in 12 States. We're working hard, getting ideas everyday until like a month ago. And now we're all just like waiting for the zombies to come.

Passionistas: Don't watch any more zombie movies. That's not going to help you right now. It's just going to make it harder. That is an incredible mission to be on. Was there an inciting incident that inspired you to do this, or was it just kind of something that had been on your mind?

Kat: I would say the election in November of 2016 was the inciting incident. I had studied voting rights in law school and some done a lot of work around it and sort of the voting rights act, but we still had one at that time. I didn't really feel that it was a really pressing me to like go into voting rights work. And I went into some other spaces. And then when the VRA was declined in 2013, we started to see a lot of things change about voting in America, particularly voter ID laws were being passed pretty quickly. And then the '16 elections were the first national elections where we didn't have the protections of the voting rights act and where we saw the effects of a lot of these new laws and rules. I'm including the effects of voter ID laws I'm and I had run some other organizations and I had some health issues.

I had sort of decided to retire that lasted a year, then the election happened. And so then I knew I had to sort of get started again. And there were a lot of really fantastic organizations trying to fight voter ID laws through judicial or legislative remedies, which have been less successful than would be desired, but there weren't any organizations, national organizations just getting IDs. So that sort of made sense to me as a good place to start.

Passionistas: Talk about the nuts and bolts of it. How do you go about finding the people who need these ideas and how do you help them?

Kat: Well, there are over 21 million people in the country over the age of 18 who do not have government issued photo ID. So finding people who need help getting ideas, not a challenge. We partner with a ton of organizations, uh, any type of organization that works with the same 11% of the population that we work with. Um, if you don't have an ID, then you can't get a job. I get housing, et cetera. So it's a large percentage of people who are experiencing homelessness, a lot of returning citizens, um, a lot of seniors and students with low or no incomes. Um, so we partner with shelters and food banks and prisons and jails and public defenders and schools and senior centers and just all of those types of organizations.

And we either go to them or they refer people to us, depending on the situation. You know, we work with a lot of, uh, domestic violence. I'm the shelters. And so, you know, there, we have to be specially trained and they refer people to us versus if we're going to a food bank once a week. So we really work with each community based on what works best for them. I am. And then we have our mostly volunteers. We have over 600 trained volunteers, but then we also have a few field staff who go into these spaces, um, and, and connect with the clients. Uh, we also get, you know, at this point, a lot of people who call us or email us, or fill out a form online that we have, but they all get connected with someone who then walks them through that process of helping them get those documents, paying for everything, helping them get to final records and the DMV and wherever they need to go and making sure they get the idea in their hand.

Passionistas: Why is this so important right now?

Kat: Now it's important because there are over 21 million people in this country who don't have the ID. They need to see a doctor, right? Like there are really immediate needs. You can't do anything really without an ID. And so when you think about, you know, people who need to get employed, one of the first things that happens almost every time we get someone IDs, they say, I can apply for jobs now, or we have a lot of people who get jobs. I can't start them because they don't have ID. And so, you know, you cannot escape poverty without an ID. Um, you can't get off the streets independently without an ID. And so being able to help someone get that means that they are able to, you know, pursue employment opportunities. Um, you know, a lot of cities and, and shelters have place housing placement services, but you can't get one without 90.

And I'm the reason we work with a lot of government agencies and shelters, et cetera, is because they don't have the capacity and knowledge to get ideas. So, you know, we've got people lining up around multiple city blocks to go to food banks right now, most food banks require ID. So they're necessary for life. They are, they can literally be life and death. And we've seen that more than once, but they are also a requirement to be able to change one circumstance. And then on top of that in a quite few States, you need an ID to be able to vote. And so if you don't have that identification, then you don't have the ability to exercise a basic fundamental rights.

Passionistas: This is also for us an obvious question. I mean, we need to get an ID. We need to know the real ID that's coming out. So we have to gather together our social security card and a electric bill and go to the DMV, but someone who's homeless and living on the streets, doesn't have an electric bill and doesn't maybe have access to the social security card. So how do you help them actually qualify to even get an ID?

Kat: So every state has very long lists of the types of documents that you can bring to the DMV. For most people, it's a mortgage or, or a, you know, uh, electric bill or whatever. And so those are sort of the top things on the list that most people go and get. However, there are a lot of other types of documents. And so it depends on the state and it depends on the person's situation. Um, but you know, we can frequently use a church or a shelter address, uh, to get, uh, to use for the DMV.

One great thing about voter registration is that a voter registration card counts as a proof of identity in most States. So we can use that. We have frequently had to chase down. We're constantly having to chase down records from the Department of Corrections or military records because we have a lot of veterans get IDs and they can't get the VA VA benefits without IDs, but they're veterans don't just get IDs. And so I'm depending sort of on that their background, or we, you know, track down sort of medical records or old school records or sort of whatever. So it, depending on the state and on the person situation, we go through the very long list of what documents are accepted by the DMV. And then we compare that with what the person has or what their history is. And so we figure out what it is we think we can get for them.

Passionistas: The amount of people on your team must have to be enormous. Can you talk about your team and how you've built that over the course of the last few years?

Kat: Yeah. I mean, we certainly need a ginormous team. I mean, we're lucky we have, we have a lot of really incredible volunteers and we have an online training program that they go through to get certified. I mean, I invented this certification, but I can't say, but they get trained to be able to work with our clients and get ideas. We have some field staff members in the, in some of our States who are incredible and sort of just get ideas full time, that's their job. And they do a really amazing job at that. And then we have a, you know, sort of small national team that helps with yeah, you know, our general counsel who is just constantly busy. I am, you know, and, and helping organize things. And our volunteer director, who's one person who's managing a risk, et cetera, volunteers.

We are mostly working with volunteers and mostly just working really hard to recruit and train and support our volunteers and, you know, 12 States with as many people as there are, there's always some adventure every day. There's a phone call with a new situation. Um, and so sort of dealing with all of that while also having, um, you know, we're lucky enough to have some field staff who are able to just everyday do this. We have some volunteers who've been with us since actually, since they helped us get our, the volunteers that helped us get our very first IDs in Virginia years ago are still with us and are now up to hundreds and are now probably the world's leading experts in getting ideas.

And then, you know, we have a field staff who I've gotten hundreds of ideas and I do it every day, um, et cetera. And so for the first year or a little under, if the first year I was our only employee, I sort of did everything. And then I'm just, you know, it's a nonprofit. So it's just all fundraising all the time. I was able to fundraise enough to start hiring staff and was able to bring in some great people. And then we sort of grew and built it out and sort of tried to figure out an experiment, like what makes the most sense as far as staffing and sort of just a lot of this sort of basic startup stuff of you, throw it out there, you figure it out. And I just ended up with this really great team.

Passionistas: Obviously the current state of voting rights issues is a little crazy. There's a lot going on. There's a big election coming up. So why is this issue important and why should people care about what's going on with voting rights right now?

Kat: Life is interesting right now. So there's a couple of things happening. The first is we have zero idea what life is going to look like in November. You know, hopefully I will be allowed to leave my house soon, or I might burn it down. I am, but you know, we don't know what the world is going to look like. And so a lot of us, I think most of us in this space are really trying to build out like 12 contingency plans. Everyone saw the disaster in Wisconsin, uh, forcing people to vote, uh, forcing them to vote in fewer polling places where now we, you know, they've had multiple, I think the last I saw was 19, but it's so highly contagious at that number will go up of COVID cases that are coming out of that situation.

And so everyone, I think, recognizes that regardless of what the world looks like in November and whether we're allowed back out, it's not going to be anything close to normal. We're still going to have to avoid gathering in large groups. And it's going to be very, very important to keep as many people away from the polling places as possible so that people who have to vote in person are able to. So there is a big movement right now towards vote by mail, which is fantastic. I vote by mail is by no means a panacea. It should not be the only option in any state. However, it should be part of a really great comprehensive voting package. And so the goal is to get all of the States that don't have vote by mail or easy vote by mail. A lot of States, you can do it if you are absentee with certain excuses, things like that, to open that up so that, um, anyone can vote by mail, which would significantly reduce the number of people that go to polling places and we'll have some increase on, on voter turnout as well.

So I think that's one thing that's really moving forward. The irony is that no state, well, there's a possible Kentucky exception, which I'll talk about, but the idea's not required when you vote by mail, which is ironic because the only type of voter fraud that exists in a very, very, very small percentage is by mail. However, fraud is used as the excuse to pass the ID laws of it's not. So, you know, that is one benefit to it. Kentucky just took time out of a pandemic to pass an even stricter voter ID law that they already had. And they are trying something new. They are trying to make people have to make a photocopy of their ID to send in with their vote by mail ballot, which I can't imagine standing in courts for one thing who owns a printer, nobody owns a printer.

I like the idea that this is a thing that could happen. I think it's bonkers. I might, but it is something that they're trying. So we'll see. But that is, I think that's a new thing in pretty much every other state, you don't have to show ID to vote by mail. There are other problems with vote by mail studies have shown over and over again, that people of color have their ballots thrown out at a much higher percentage than white voters. And so that is something that, you know, that's why a lot of people of color choose to vote in person, because there is no guarantee that if you vote, your ballot is ever actually going to be counted. I think that there are a lot of things that we can do to try to make that process more secure, but we're also in a global pandemic. And so for a lot of us, the choice will be vote by mail don't. I vote by mail every election because I don't believe in wearing pants when I'm voting. Like where my PJ's, I have a glass of wine. I can vote like vote pantsless. It's just, it's the only way to go.

So I think that's one big thing we're seeing. Another big thing we're seeing is trying to get young people to be poll workers, poll workers are traditionally heavily elderly ladies. My mother is always a poll worker. My mother is always one of the youngest people there and there, there are these wonderful, amazing, dedicated women who do this. And, and you know, a lot of men, there's a lot of older ladies and it is poor work hard. It's a miserable job. I always have to help my mother clean up and set up. And it's a very difficult thing that I think they go very under appreciated. But right now the exact population who we really need to stay inside and be protected is the population that usually works the polls.

And so there are now some efforts being made to really try to get younger people, to be trained, to work the polls. In many States, you get paid some amount of money in order to do it. You know, it's an important service and we really need a different demographic to come out and choose to do that. So there's an effort to recruit folks to do more of that. So I think that, that everyone is sort of trying to figure out there's also, this has really changed the way we do geo TV. I mean, normally, you know, normally my organization would be out getting IDs right now as I speak and we're not, I am. And so we're having to change the way we work and do work virtually and, you know, do more things if state agencies, you know, a jail that we're working with got 27 IDs last week because they can still do that. And so we're trying to do as much work as we can in the ways that we can.

This is right now at the time when voting rights organizations would be out talking to communities of color, low income communities and starting to, you know, not even starting, really being in the middle of the process of talking to people about voting because the get out the vote process is a very long process. It's not something you can just do an October. Um, and there are a lot of communities that don't have access to the internet or to phone. And so we, there's, it's a difficult thing to do right now. So everyone's trying to adapt and trying to figure out, okay, if we can all leave our houses in August, then that gives us, you know, two and a half months maybe to be able to like, get back on the streets and work. And what does that look like? So there are some efforts being made. There's also just a lot of contingency planning and there's some just sort of like, okay, well, we're going to do what we can now have been, wait and see what happens because we don't know what the world's going to look like in November,

Passionistas: We're Amy and Nancy Harrington and you're listening to the Passionistas Project Podcast and our interview with Kat Calvin. We're excited to announce the Kat will be moderating the panel "How far have we come in a 100 years? Making sure all women can vote" on Saturday, August 22nd during the Passionistas Project Women's Equality Summit. To register for free for the online event visit ThePassionistasProject.com. Visit, SpreadTheVote.org and ProjectID.org to learn more about the work Kat is doing. And be sure to tune in, to Vote! The Podcast with her cohost, Andrea Hayley, available wherever you get your podcasts. Now here's more of our interview with Kat.

So during these crazy times, what can the average person do to help you and your organization? And also just in terms of keeping focused on the election I had, what can we do do to help?

Kat: So you can go to SpreadTheVote.org/volunteer. Luckily all of our training is already online. So you can I'm if you live in one of our 12 States, which you can find on our website, you can get trained. We're going to have, we also already do all of our volunteer summits virtually, and we had one planned for this summer. So I, we are working very hard to build an even bigger volunteer army so that the day that we can get back on the streets, we can go out in full force and try to make up for some lost time. I also recommend, you know, I, I am, I am always going to, uh, preach in favor of local elections and say, stop paying attention to the iron throne. It really doesn't matter all that much local elections matter and state elections matter. And Congress matters and candidates are working very hard to make sure that there are virtual conflicts come up with virtual ways to campaign.

And, you know, we had some already text making and phone banking and things like that. They're coming up with creative ways, find some local candidates who you care about, like, who is your Senator? Who is your con your representative in Congress? Who are your state legislative representatives and work on supporting them and helping to get out the vote and particularly looking at and press them on, how are they working to reach communities of color and low income communities that they traditionally would either be reaching out to in person or frankly, most don't really pay attention to even when they should be, because they really need to be thinking about what that looks like, and they really need support. And I think there are a lot of people who think that they can't support candidates right now because they can't like go knock on doors or they can't have a texting party and you still can't. So that's really critical.

And then, you know, I always point people towards Indivisible, which is a fantastic organization, which has a lot of local. I think they have at least two chapters in every district in the country. It doesn't say please, working on finding really innovative and great ways for people to get involved, whether it's virtual, I now, or in person later. Everyone right now is trying very hard to figure out what to do and, and, you know, sort of switch methods as much as possible. And we really need people to help get involved, whether it's doing a lot right now, or whether it's prepping right now to be able to do a lot, the second we can get back on the ground.

Passionistas: Is there a particular trait that you think has helped you succeed?

Kat: Well, I mean, I guess, I mean, I could say perseverance is such a cliche, but it's true. I don't think you can't be a successful entrepreneur without it are probably successful. Anything else, but I've only ever been a successful entrepreneur, perseverance, like just knowing, all right, I'm doing this thing. It's important. I'm going to figure it out. I'm going to fail like 8,000 times and yeah, but that's fine. Like I'm gonna make it work, I think is really important. And so whether that's perseverance or a little bit of grit or both I think is, is really key because you will hit so many roadblocks and have so many tragedies and you know, like I, if I could burn just all of last year to the ground, I would, I am. And like, you just have to really just keep getting up every day,

“Frozen 2,” first of all, if you haven't watched Frozen 2,” turn this off, watch “Frozen 2” come back and finish this. It's incredible. It's not Disney+, which is the greatest thing to happen to 2020, which is a low bar, but still, but the best song in “Frozen 2,” it's "Into the Unknown." Sorry, I'll say it's actually "The Next Right Thing." And it is a sign. As soon as I heard it, I was like, “Oh my God, this is my life.” Because it's all about how, when everything is terrible, you just have to take one more step. If you just have to think, what is the next thing I'm supposed to do? And sometimes that's just like, get out of bed can be really hard. And that's when you are an entrepreneur, when you're trying to do something new or something no one's ever done before, it's going to be really difficult.

And you're going to have a lot of people tell you all of the reasons that you are an idiot and a failure, and this will never work. And you're a terrible person and you're wasting time or whatever. And, you know, things will get really hard. And if you can just do next right thing, just take the next steps. Send the next email. Send the next, you know, fundraising letter or whatever like that actually does get you through. Cause then you look back, if you did 10 things and now you're, you're at a better place. Um, and that, that I think is probably the biggest key to my like still being alive and still running this thing.

Passionistas: Is there a lesson that you've learned on your journey that really sticks with you?

Kat: And I think it's the other side of that. I was very afraid to go into this year because last year was so terrible. And then I was talking to someone and they were like, yeah, but you survived last year and you're here. And I was like, Oh, actually, that's true. If I survived that, I stupidly that I could survive anything, not knowing the apocalypse. I may not survive being stuck in my house for the rest of my life. But I'm, you know, I think that it's the constant lesson and this has been a big lesson just of my entire life. And like the older I get, the more that I learned this is like, things seem so terrible when you're on one side of it, particularly when you're young, like when I was in my teens and twenties, like one bad thing would happen and I thought it was the end of the world.

But then the older you get, you realize, Oh, actually I survived that. And I forgot about it. That thing that I thought was going to kill me six months ago, I don't even remember anymore. I am another thing I was obsessing about for weeks can't even remember that person's name. And so I think that, you know, and then the older you get and the more you do and the bigger risks you take and the more successful you are, the crashes are harder and they're still very frequent, but you get through them more quickly and more easily because you know, I'm going to get through this. I survived that last thing I can survive this. It's okay if I'm super obsessing about this today, because in three days, I know I won't be, you just have that perspective, which you can only get through just living and just failing and just trying things failing again.

It's like, you know, I, I love to run and workout and every run, well, not everyone is easier, but like six months, you know, I can do a run and, you know, like the 10 miles is way easier than I can think back, like, Oh my God, six months ago, like eight was really hard, you know? And it's the same thing with life experience. And I think that that makes you more willing to try big things. I'm and it also, it makes the inevitable failures a little easier because you know, you're going to get through it. You have before.

Passionistas: So what's the most rewarding part of your career?

Kat: Oh, the people who, uh, who we have good IDs and, you know, we get just every day, there's, you know, there's so many stories that come in of peoples whose lives have changed and people who didn't have IDs for sometimes six months sometimes, you know, I think the person who we helped get an ID who didn't have one the longest was 40 years and everything in between. And just knowing that every single day we're able to help someone get the thing that they need to change their lives, that they couldn't get on their own. And that was the big barrier between them living the lives that they, they want to live, that they hope to live, um, and stuck in the same place. So just getting to do that every day and getting to do that with a really amazing group of people, uh, is, is completely rewarding.

Passionistas: What's the biggest risk you have taken and how did it pay off?

Kat: Oh, definitely this, I quit my job and drove my car across the country with some money we raised on, uh, like me have some volunteers raised with a little crowdfunding campaign and was like, I'll just start a nonprofit if it works out. And I'll put all of this on my Amex and figure out how to pay it off later. Um, like that was, was, you know, I've taken a little risks, I've started other things, but this was by far the biggest risk. And I mean, I'm gonna knock on all the words so far has paid off. Like even, even if disaster strikes and we entered the greatest depression and you know, I have to shut all the doors and move under a bridge. I, you know, there are thousands and thousands of people who have IDs now whose lives were changed because of the work we did. And so that will always stand. So no matter what happens in the future, it is 100% worth everything had to go through because, you know, there's that person whose life was changed because of this.

Passionistas: What advice would you give to a young woman who wants to be an entrepreneur?

Kat: Don't go to law school. I could go back. I don't go to law school. Don't do anything that would have you acquire student loans. I, you don't need to go to that incredibly expensive school, go to the great, fantastic state school, state school that will either be less expensive or give you a full ride. So that's my first thing. Like student loans will kill you and it makes it much more difficult to be an entrepreneur. Sure. Also, I know there's a big trend towards trend. I mean, at this point, it's as old as I am, but you know, like being very young and starting a thing, but then there's a reason that we so often see those companies either have horrifically bad managers who torture their staffs or they're running Ponzi schemes, or they're feeling an ethic ways or, you know, going to prison. Sometimes I, you know, there is real value in learning from people who've been there before you, I learned, well, I have had some horrible jobs at places that people think are really great and are actually like insidious hell holes.

And I learned a lot there. And a lot of what I do is like things that I learned not to do and those corporations or those large nonprofits or whatever, but you just, you get so much experience everything that I am using that I used to build, Spread the Vote are lessons that I learned and things I learned how to do, or at least learned the basics of from previous jobs. And I think it's so important. And also, you know, I try to listen and learn from people who are older than me, as much as possible if I'm talking to an older person and they start a story with "during the war," like my whole day is canceled. I am staying there. I will keep buying these during the war. That is literally, I live for that. I've heard great stories from old men at bars about like stuff Vietnam.

And I'm sure 80% of it is a total lie and I don't care. You know, it's, it's so important, you know, um, we know always have people who are older than me, you know, working at the organization or as mentors or whatever. And you can just learn so much from people who've been there before you. And it even feels weird to me to say that, but there's this like such derision against anyone who's not like a 21 year old genius and there are no 21 year old geniuses. And so I think that really being sure you're learning and that you're giving yourself plenty of opportunities to figure out who you really are and what you really want to do. Um, and then that you're studying that space.

I get so many young people who want to talk to me about their businesses and, you know, say I spoke to a young woman, wants to, she wanted to start a business in fashion. And I mentioned something about Women's Wear Daily and she didn't know what it was. And it's like, well, you can't, you can't run an organization, a business and fashion. If you don't know, Women's Wear Daily, it's the like cornerstone fashion magazine. Right? And like, you have to do your research. You have to know the basics. If you're going into voting rights, read every book about voting rights, know the text of the voting rights act, know who came before you and what they've done. You know, we, I think we interviewed everybody that we could find for me, but Brendan center, it's a local organizations, as we were trying to figure out, what do people tried before? What has worked? Why has it worked? You know? And then we would come up with ideas and we'd call back, you know, some of the same people and say, what do you think about this?

And they'd say this is going to work. And that's a terrible idea. And this is why this has failed 85 times. And that's what help is get to a solution that worked. You have to do your homework and you have to be knowledgeable. Um, there's nothing cute or fun or interesting about being an entrepreneur who doesn't know their space and Google is free. So really you ha you have to know what you're doing are know the business you're getting into in order to be able to know what you're doing. And don't go to law school for the love of God.

Passionistas: Thanks for listening to the Passionistas Project Podcast and our interview with Kat Calvin. Visit SpreadTheVote.org and ProjectID.org to learn more about the work Kat is doing. And be sure to tune in, to Vote! The Podcast with her cohost, Andrea Hayley, available wherever you get your podcasts.

Don't forget to register for the Passionistas Project Women's Equality Summit to hear Kat's live panel "How far have we come in a 100 years? Making sure all women can vote" on Saturday, August 22nd. The summit is sponsored by Annette Kahler innovation and intellectual property attorney, LA Pride/Christopher Street West, Luna whole nutrition bars, the premium beverage company Tea Drops, TrizCom Public Relations and public speaking coaching company, ubu skills. To register for free for the online event visit ThePassionistasProject.com and be sure to subscribe to the Passionistas Project Podcast so you don't miss any of our upcoming inspiring guests.

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