The Presumption

Today’s guest Prof. Natalie Ram specializes in examining the intersection between the advancements in forensic genealogy, and its role in the criminal justice system. For 15 years, Prof. Ram has made a case that forensic genetic genealogy raises constitutional and ethical concerns, including 4th amendment violations, based on the lack of voluntariness in genetic relatedness. More specifically, Sara and Jim ask about the protocols (and oversights) that are involved with determining the perpetrator of a crime based on their genetic relationships. They take a deep dive into how the courts and law enforcement are defining the word ‘voluntary’, and also question what aspects of the 4th Amendment are regularly being violated. Later in the podcast they break down two significant cases that Prof. Ram relies on: Carpenter vs US, and State of Maryland vs Andrews. The show wraps with a focus on a burdensome benefit: the role of IGG in exonerating the wrongfully convicted.

Art – Simon & Associates
Music – Caleb Fletcher

Sara and Jim are excited to release their first new podcast of 2024. The hosts welcome lawyer, crisis manager, and political consultant Lanny Davis to the show, and discuss the recent mock trial that Sara and Lanny participated in. They also highlight the importance of the presumption of innocence, and how innuendos in journalism and media create a presumption of guilt instead. The hosts ask Lanny about his recommended come-back strategy for Gov. Andrew Cuomo, as well as his adversarial relationship with ‘cancelled’ Senator Al Franken.

Art – Simon & Associates
Music – Caleb Fletcher

In honor of Hip Hop’s 50th birthday, Sara and Jim are joined by music industry veteran and leading voice in Black music and culture, Naima Cochrane. Naima, Sara and Jim discuss the recent headline-making developments in two unsolved murder cases that have shaken the Hip Hop world for decades: Tupac Shakur and Jam Master Jay. As always, the hosts present an insider’s look at some of the evidence that may be considered, and the unreliability of anticipated eyewitness testimony regarding events that happened many years in the past. Along the way, they also break down the origins of the East Coast vs. West Coast rap feud of the 90s, the impact of MTV, and the state of Hip Hop music in 2023. The Presumption will return in January 2024, have a safe and happy holiday season!

Art – Simon & Associates
Music – Caleb Fletcher

This week Sara and Jim sit down with polygraph examiner Johnny Hartley to learn everything you could possibly ever want to know about the science of lie detection. Johnny speaks at length about just how different the reality of being testing via polygraph is to how the process seems on TV and in movies. He also answers questions about admissibility in court, the history and advancements of the technology, and dispelling the myth that you can somehow cheat the system. As the show wraps up, Johnny talks about going through life as a human lie detector.

Art – Simon & Associates
Music – Caleb Fletcher

Jim is in the guest seat this week to discuss some of the wildest cases he’s defended over the years. Helping to share some behind the scenes stories is surprise co-host, and Jim’s daughter, Hope Griffin. The group dives into the controversies surrounding a drug detection device called the ‘Quadro Tracker’, and why bringing home a present for your daughter can help you win the case. They also discuss Jim’s early appearances on Court TV, relating to a bizarre case involving the death of a cat killer. Later they break down a reverse sting operation involving sex workers and blackmailers. And in the final part of the show, Hope recalls her favorite summer working at her dad’s office, answering prank phone calls from Dick Harpootlian, and more!

Art – Simon & Associates
Music – Caleb Fletcher

First up- some important announcements, and an expression of our gratitude! Sara and Jimmy G. then welcome forensic cell data expert, Jim Persinger to the podcast to discuss his extensive training and background in the constantly changing field of digital and cell phone technology. They talk with him about phone and cell tower analysis software, as well as some of the common misconceptions and mistakes that can be made in the collection and preservation of cell phones and digital data during an investigation. As the conversation wraps up, the trio dig into the Bryan Kohberger and Alex Murdaugh cases in terms of the investigative flaws and plausible explanations related to cell and digital data in each. They close the interview with Jim’s work as an expert in the 2004 Kirby Smith murder case.

Art – Simon & Associates
Music – Caleb Fletcher

South Carolina State Senator, and Jim’s co-counsel on many cases, Dick Harpootlian makes his debut appearance on the podcast. Sara chats with Dick and Jim about the history of their working relationship as well as their decades long friendship. Jim and Dick share some BTS moments that may have landed one of them in a hot tub! They share the latest in the Alex Murdaugh cases, and the overall twists and turns in the high profile case with Sara. Dick also explains how he got under President Clinton’s skin during the Obama Clinton primary in SC, and how this may have changed the trajectory of the race. The episode closes with Dick’s deep dive into the twisted story of Pee Wee Gaskins, and how the convicted killer threatened his family.

Art – Simon & Associates
Music – Caleb Fletcher

Sara and Jim welcome high profile trial attorney Jerome Buting to talk about defending a case with pre-trial publicity. They discuss Jerome’s defense of Steven Avery, the flaws in the criminal justice system, as well as the lasting impact of the docuseries ‘Making a Murderer’. Later, Sara and Jim offer a couple of parallels to what Jim has experienced during and after the Alex Murdaugh murder trial. The episode ends with Jerome’s thoughts on our ‘jail and bail’ system.

Art – Simon & Associates
Music – Caleb Fletcher

Justin Brooks is a professor, attorney, and former Founding Director of the California Innocence Project. Sara and Jim speak with him about his incredible work handling wrongful convictions and freeing innocent people from prison. Justin also discusses his new book, ‘Why You Might Go To Prison Even Though You’re Innocent’, as well as what lead him to take on these very important cases post-conviction. Sara and Jim also ask Justin about his work on the case of the wrongfully convicted football player, Brian Banks, and how Brian ultimately regained his well-deserved freedom. The conversation wraps with stories of Justin’s time teaching criminal justice in Latin America.

Art – Simon & Associates
Music – Caleb Fletcher

Trial guru Thomas Mesereau joins Sara and Jim at the top of the show. The trio of trial lawyers discuss his incredible accomplishments in the courtroom, as well as his relationship with media. They also discuss his defense of Michael Jackson, Bill Cosby, and more. As the show wraps up, Thomas discusses his life-changing pro bono work in the deep south, and why he thinks all defense lawyers should assume at jump that their client is going to take the stand and testify.

Art – Simon & Associates
Music – Caleb Fletcher