The Thriving Abroad Podcast

‘There are far better things ahead than any we leave behind.’

C.S. Lewis

What will 2017 hold for you? For some it will signify another relocation, either to a new location or a move ‘back home’. This can be a bitter sweet experience as I know only too well.

In this week’s podcast, I interview Dr Cate Brubaker, author of the ‘Re-entry Relaunch Roadmap, a Creative Workbook for Finding Happiness, Success & Your Next Global Adventure After Being Abroad.’

I’ve moved ‘home’ from abroad twice. The first when I was seven months pregnant with my first daughter, and while I was pleased to be surrounded by the support of my family I remember finding the first year and my experience of that time surprising in various ways. The second time, I resolved to ‘get it right’ after all I was experienced in frequent relocation by then. The result; an even tougher transition. I was shocked, surely if anyone should cope it would be me. I wrote about transitions, I supported others through transition. Surely I could short cut the process…

What I learned was that no one is immune from the impact of the process of change that comes with international relocation, and repatriation is very much a part of that process.

In this interview, Cate and I talk ‘re-entry’ or if you prefer ‘repatriation’. It is the one area of global mobility that is frequently highlighted as woefully under-supported by many international organisations. There is an assumption that it will be the easiest move, often it is the toughest.

Cate first moved abroad as a teenager when she went to live in Germany to study for a year. Cate caught the travel bug and started a process of regular sojourns abroad which resulted in an intense restlessness when she returned ‘home’ after each trip. For Cate excitement and adventure were synonymous with a life lived abroad.

In this interview Cate talks about:

The challenges she faced in coming ‘home’.

Her process for identifying what she calls, her ‘global life ingredients that would apply wherever she was in the world’.

The questions that will help anyone returning home after time abroad to think through the re-entry experience.

The importance of building a life around WHO you are now. Not who you were before moving or who your friends and family expect you to be.

If you have repatriated recently or will repatriate in the future, then this interview will provide valuable insights and advice.

For further support relating to re-entry you can access Cate’s Book HERE

Cate is also running a Relaunch – Virtual Re-entry Retreat. For Global Adventurers Who Don’t Want the Global Adventure to End. This is a free virtual event running between the 23rd and 27th of January. Every day there will be three interviews aimed to support you as you navigate reverse culture shock, process who you are now and move towards your next global adventure at home or abroad. Go HERE and register for this valuable free event.

So, here we go! Another festive holiday season is almost upon us and I sincerely hope you are better prepared than me!

I have a love/hate relationship with Christmas. I hate the commercialism but love the celebration and sentiment. I believe that one full month per year is plenty enough time to devote to the festive period and therefore don’t start to contemplate its proximity until the 6th of December. Which means, TODAY! Then I descend into panic mode.

Olga Mecking prompted an interesting discussion on Facebook this week. She is Polish and in Poland the tree and decorations don’t make an appearance until Christmas Eve. This was always how it was in my home when I was a child. I can see arguments for and against particularly where my poor Mum was concerned. She was often a nervous wreck by the time she staggered into midnight mass, ready for her final task of the day, playing the organ for the carols.

Olga’s discussion brought all kinds of different traditions to the fore. Christmas trees making appearances for many in late November and many loving the light and fun of early decorations. What traditions do you have? When will you be putting up your tree? Do you even have a tree? I remember as a child, one year we had a branch, painted silver, apparently a Swedish tradition. My brother and I were horrified. Maybe you don’t celebrate Christmas at all, or only specific aspects of the holiday season.

We’d love to hear about this time of year in your life. Pop over the Facebook and share what the holiday season means to you.

Olga is our podcast guest this week as I interview her about her life in The Hague. We recorded the interview in the summer but it is timely to post the interview today because we talk about some fantastic book projects that Olga has been involved in. Perhaps they will solve a gift idea or two for you. Titles and links are shared below.

And the topic of our conversation is also relevant to this time of year. We talk, amongst other things about the loneliness and sense of isolation that can come with expat life. This is something I relate to from several moves and found that even when returning home, I was not immune.

During our conversation Olga shares:

The event that tipped her into action professionally, it is not what you might think.

What she did to build her network, her actions may spark ideas for you too.

The books and online communities that have grown from those ideas.

Olga advises those that are relocating to   

‘Reach out to expat groups even before you move, then you will have a support system when you arrive.’

I believe that one strength we develop as expats is independence. We learn to cope, alone and to become pretty self-sufficient. However, it can be lonely to be independent and truthfully we all need to receive support and give support to flourish. Renee Brown talks about this in this brief interview. She says when talking about her children:

‘I want them to be independent and know their own free will and free choice AND I want them to know that all of those things mean nothing if they don’t need and they are not needed. You know we don’t have to do it by ourselves, we weren’t meant to………… You can acquire, accumulate and accomplish with independence, but you love and live with need.’    Renee Brown

You can read Olga’s blog at European Mama and her contributions at the Multicultural Kids Blog. Look out for Olga’s future books, she is currently working on a novel and a memoir.

The books Olga talks about in the interview are as follo...

Rolling the Dice on Life      

The headline statistic from our research in 2012 was that 78% of participants wanted to work while living abroad but at the time of the survey only 44% were working in some form, 16% in full time employment.

Other studies have found similar results, a survey of French expatriates in 2015 found that only 50% of partners who wished to work when expatriated did so and 62% believed that expatriation was negative or very negative for their careers (Expat Communication, Alix Carnot).

Of course, career is not everything and many of the participants to our study talked about the value of the international experience from family and cultural, experiential perspectives as well.

Life is a balancing act. Whether we relocate abroad or stay home the relevance and importance of career will change over time to match our changing personal, professional and family needs.

Partners who relocate with children often tell us that their support role comes first, career second. We can absolutely relate to that, having taken time out of our careers to devote to our families when our children were young. A decision we don’t regret for a moment. We were lucky to have the opportunity.

Then, the time came when we knew we wanted to start to pursue our professional interests again. It was then that we wished we had kept our professional interests and networks active. Getting back, at times felt like an uphill struggle.

Whether the desire to pursue professional interests hits at the beginning of an assignment or further down the line… and years, it is important to be prepared.

Today’s interview is with Jacquie Kane. Jacquie is Scottish currently living in Boston and working as a director in a global tech PR agency. 

We got to know Jacquie when she worked with us on the launch of Thriving Abroad providing valuable PR advice. She is an eminent professional and someone who loves her work and values her career.

When her husband first popped the international question, having been offered a position in Shanghai, Jacquie felt that a curve ball had been thrown. She loved her life in Scotland, had a great work and social life and hadn’t anticipated moving abroad. After much discussion and a fact-finding trip to Shanghai, Jacquie decided to commit to what she hoped would be an ‘incredibly transformative experience’ and said ‘let’s do it!’.

Jacquie does not have children and knew that her career was going to be hugely important in helping her to adjust.

‘I’d anticipated that my husband would be out at work, working long hours, and I didn’t fancy the idea of sitting alone in my skyscraper wondering what to do with myself.’

So, she set to and found herself a role in a large American global PR firm.

In this interview Jacquie shares with us her strategy for securing not one but three international roles while living abroad.

This interview is longer than our usual ones but the advice contained within is extremely valuable for anyone wishing to pursue and/or develop their chosen profession while living abroad.

We recognise that not every expat partner can or wants to work while living abroad. However, we recommend that everyone is cognisant of their skill set and strengths so that different future choices can be made. This is part of Jacquie’s heartfelt message and advice.

There is something for everyone in this interview wherever you are currently at in terms of your professional interests and development.

Jacquie says:

‘The art of managing your career abroad is to be open minded, adaptable, resilient and tenacious. Having the focus and energy to want to do something different demonstrates to a prospective employer that you’ve got grit… which most expat partners have in bucket loads. Because,

This week Thriving Abroad is delighted to introduce you to Amel Derragui. You may already know Amel from her own podcast series, Tandem Nomads, dedicated to partners who are interested in developing their own portable careers and businesses.

Amel describes herself as a serial migrant, global citizen and expat partner who just so happens to also be a marketing expert having built a career in branding, marketing and communications. Through Tandem Nomads Amel is committed to helping other expat partners build their own success.

This interview is perfect for any expat partners who are wondering how to make the experience work fully for them from both a personal and professional perspective.

During the conversation Amel and Louise talked about

How it is easy to become a chameleon in adapting to new cultures and how important it is to also know ‘what we stand for.’

The value of planning in terms of understanding your ‘reason why’ for embarking on an international relocation. Amel suggests when deciding to relocate we need to know,

‘Are we escaping something or are we doing it because we want to discover something?’

Why flipping the coin and seeing the opportunities that emerge from the challenges is such a valuable approach to developing a new life abroad. In talking about her podcast Amel explained,

‘I wanted to mix my personal and professional experience and bring them together to help expat partners take leadership of their lives, because it is all about turning challenges into opportunities.’

The value of authenticity in terms of personal and business branding.

And loads more!

Amel is excited to share with you her new free resource, 4 Steps to Turn Confusion to Confidence. An ebook for expat partners who want to build a portable career and thrive in their global nomadic life. You can also join her Facebook group Tandem Nomads HERE

As always we would love to hear your views and opinions. Come over the Thriving Abroad Facebook page and leave your comments there OR join our Thriving Abroad closed Facebook group.

For us, nothing pulls more at our heart strings than seeing our children worried and unhappy.

In our experience, international relocation is the one sure fire way of upsetting our children and leading to some guilt riddled moments as parents.

Conversely and happily, it has also been the catalyst for fantastic experiences, very smiley faces and some fabulous proud parent moments. 

A mixed bag of highs and lows.

And a never ending circuit round these two questions:

Am I handling this right?

What more could I be doing?

This week we are delighted to welcome to the Thriving Abroad Podcast, Kate Berger. Our conversation gives insights, suggestions and we felt validation to at least some of our parenting efforts.

Kate is a child and adolescent psychologist, consultant and the founder of the Expat Kids Club which, since its inception has provided counsel to hundreds of youngsters and their families, as well as major corporations from the UK, Germany, Singapore and the USA.

In this podcast we talk about:

The benefits to children of a peripatetic life.

The challenges that children face as they react to the impact of life changing decisions that are usually totally beyond their control.

Why it is important to recognise that the process is stressful; ‘we cannot put our heads in the sand not acknowledge that stress is a real thing, that it is there.’ Kate

The wide range of support that we as parents can offer.

The importance of understanding yourself and your reactions as a first step in supporting your child.

When to call in the professionals.

The power of mindfulness in managing the impact of change and transition.

We really enjoyed and benefited from this interview and we hope you will too. Please feel free to pass this on to parents in your network who may find the interview helpful.

If you would like to learn more about Kate you can find her at:

The Expat Kids Club

Mindfulness International

Kate’s Facebook Page.

During the interview we mention the organisation, Families in Global Transition, which supports families and professionals working in the field of international mobility. Visit their website to learn more.

For those of us who have relocated internationally, giving birth and raising young children abroad can be simultaneously one of the most challenging and most heart-warming and fulfilling aspects of our experience abroad.

We have both experienced this first-hand and so when the book, Knocked Up Abroad by Lisa Ferland was published in January 2016 we knew that the fantastic stories would resonate with many of you.

As Lisa explains:

‘the most interesting part is not the birth stories in themselves, but more the impact these experiences have had on the authors from a personal transformative perspective, and also the cultural insights the stories provide.’

Lisa knows all about international relocation. She and her husband relocated from the USA to Sweden in search of a better work life balance. Listen to the podcast to find out how that all worked out!

Also discover:

How relocating internationally lead Lisa to the creation of this new career in publishing. Lisa says ‘it is interesting how when you can’t do what you’ve been trained to do, how you can find a new path in an unexpected way and be just as fulfilled by it, or more so’.

How one book is leading to another and her plans for the second book in the series, which is due out later in 2016. You can find out more about this exciting project by viewing the book launch video HERE.

If you are pregnant or considering starting your family while living abroad then the stories in this book with comfort and inspire. You can buy the book HERE.

If you are an expat partner who is wanting to take their career in a new and exciting direction then this interview will inspire you to consider what is possible and how while pushing our own professional comfort levels can be tough, perhaps even risky, the rewards can be substantial.

We hope that you enjoy our conversation with Lisa.

Please share this interview and the Thriving Abroad podcast with your friends and social networks, and as always your comments are welcome.

Ali Meehan’s the creator of a community with 5000 members and a social media following of over 15,000 so it’s a little surprising to hear that the piece of advice she really wants to share with others thinking about starting a business is to “think big”.  Her community Costa Women (which supports women expats all over Spain, not just the Costas) has grown so phenomenally over the last six years that it’s hard to imagine that Ali didn’t start it with this kind of growth in mind.

‘When you create a business, the advice I’d give to anybody is to think bigger. Start small, definitely, but think bigger.’ Ali Meehan

But with Imagineer Ali at its helm, the multi award winning community has grown beyond her wildest dreams. It’s now an online community helping expat women all over Spain to connect with and support each other. It’s also grown beyond it’s online origins; there are now Costa Women meetups all over Spain and an annual Make It Happen conference in March which celebrates International Women’s Day and aimed at expat business women and aspiring business women.

In our interview with Ali, Evelyn talks to her about

Her expat journey and what inspired her to set up Costa Women

The Costa Women community and how it has grown and developed

loads of great thoughts and advice for aspiring expat business people not just in Spain but around the world.

If you’d like to learn more about Costa Women, you can join the community here. It’s free to sign up and you’ll connect with women living all over Spain. There are forums on all kinds of subjects from practical about Spain information, to food and travel, to starting a business. There are also classified ads and a jobs board. In addition, you can find Costa Women on Facebook, Twitter and Pinterest.

If you enjoyed the podcast, don’t forget to subscribe on iTunes so you’re the first to hear about new episodes.

If you are thinking of moving to France or have already moved to live in France, then this is an interview for you. Jo-Ann Howell is the creator of French Admin Solutions, a business which provides a neat and cost effective way to overcome the bureaucratic challenges that arise when navigating a move to France.

If you are considering moving to another country, this interview is still relevant to you as is will give you a sense of the issues that you should be considering and looking to address from a bureaucratic and administrative perspective. Jo-Ann also shares five generic expat tips at the end of the interview.

Listen to the interview here.

Jo-Ann is the child of a British army officer and says that she knew that she wanted to learn to speak French from an early age. During a year out between school and university Jo-Ann lived in Belgium with a school friend to improve her French. However, this was just the start, and now, after 4 départements and 8 moves Jo-Ann lives on a boat offering bilingual services to English speakers in France.

Jo-Ann’s story is an engaging and inspiring one which she shares in our interview.

We also dared to talk ‘Brexit’, and Jo-Ann offers perspectives and ideas on what Brits in France can be doing to protect their interests.

Jo-Ann has kindly provided the following links to sites and resources for those who are considering relocating to live in France, or even planning a visit and looking for interesting places to visit.

The Good Life France

Survive France, Helping you live and work in France

English Informer – English Informer in France is an English language online magazine offering a variety of articles, important information, news and features. 

In English, a place to find English speaking entrepreneurs in your area, or to advertise your own business free of charge. 

And last but by no means least, Jo-Ann’s own site French Admin Solutions. You can also join her Facebook group or find her on Twitter

This week we are happy to welcome Sibylle Eschapasse to the Thriving Abroad Podcast. We are sure that her delightful story and personality will charm and inspire you.

Born in France, educated at the Sorbonne, Sibylle spent her teenage years in Morocco. She studied History and Geography and her interest in this subject and her enthusiasm for travel and adventure took her to the South Pacific where she researched first the impact of man on the beautiful coral reef on the remote islands of Wallis and Futuna, and then the consequences of the cruise industry on Tahiti

In this interview Sibylle shares:

Her experience of living on these beautiful islands.

How she traded this remote area of the world for one of the most vibrant and busy cities on this earth.

Why she decided to arrive on a freighter.

How she developed her career in the ‘big apple’ first working for the French Consulate when she arrived In New York, to her current position, working in the Counter Terrorism Executive Directorate of the United Nations.

Her passion for ‘style’ and her voluntary role writing a column in the weekend edition of the Epoch Times.

Advice for people considering an international relocation.

We hope that you enjoy this interview with Sibylle and perhaps it will spark for you, as it has for us, a fascination with these amazing places.

For those of you in the Northern Hemisphere, wherever your summer vacations have taken you this year, we wish you a wonderful relaxed and enjoyable time with family and friends.

This week’s interview with Molly Sears Piccavey, encouraged me to take a trip down memory lane.

I was so enjoying it that I almost got my photos out for you!

Spain has enchanted tourists and expats for generations. From the delights of cities such as Salamanca, Madrid and Barcelona to the beautiful and varied scenery of the long coastline, the character and history of Andalucía in the South and Galicia and Austrias in the North. There is so much variety and depth to the Spanish culture.

I (Louise) lived in Spain in the late 90’s and have very special memories, many related to the wonderful food, tapas and jamon, and wine, my favourite, rioja. I lived in Madrid and loved the vibrancy of the city that never sleeps, especially during the long hot summers when partying on the Castellana is the welcome antidote to the scorching heat of the day. Our winters were interspersed with weekend breaks to the mountains to ski; the Sierra de Nevada in the South and the Pyrenees in the North. Our summers were filled with wonderful trips to Galicia and Andalucía.

Molly arrived in Barcelona Spain at about the same time as I arrived in Madrid. Unlike me, she never left, living first in Barcelona, then in Granada.

In this interview Molly shares:

How a Spanish school exchange as a child ignited her passion for the language and culture of this amazing country.

The discipline required to persevere and learn to speak Spanish fluently and the wonderful payoff it has delivered, if you need inspiration to keep going with a new language then this is it.

How her willingness to share her local knowledge and her love of research led to the creation of her charming world class blog.

Her advice for people thinking about relocating internationally to Spain.

Molly’s experience has taken her to two very different parts of Spain. Situated at opposite ends of the country, they are worlds apart in lifestyle and character but both have a very special place in Molly’s heart.

Molly’s blog; Piccavey.com. Won the FITUR Best Content Award 2016 for travel bloggers. (FITUR is a massive global Trade Show and Exhibition held in Madrid). On her blog she shares wonderful articles about Spain, it’s culture, it’s food, fashion and lifestyle.

You can visit Molly’s blog HERE.  Where you will find extremely well researched articles about Spain, it’s culture and food.