The Watch with Radley Balko

Today we launch my new podcast, which we’ve creatively decided to call The Watch with Radley Balko.

The first episode looks back at the murder of Garrett Foster during a 2020 racial justice protest in Austin, Texas — and Gov. Greg Abbott’s craven decision to pardon Foster’s killer.

I interviewed Whitney Mitchell, Foster’s fiancée. Whitney is a quadruple amputee, and Foster was her primary caretaker. This is the first time she has spoken at length about the incident, Abbott’s pardon, and the aftermath. Mitchell endured a flood of harassment and death threats after Foster was killed. She’s incredibly brave to do this interview, and I’m proud to be able to provide her a platform.

Abbott is now in the closest campaign of his career. Polls have shown a virtual dead heat between him and challenger Gina Hinojosa. This is the first election in which voters will have the opportunity to hold Abbott accountable for his pardon of Foster’s killer, Daniel Perry. But the issue has largely been absent from the campaign.

Abbott’s pardon was a cynical, nakedly political attempt to curry favor with far-right personalities like Tucker Carlson, Andy Ngo, and other MAGA influencers, who began pushing for Abbott to excuse Perry before he had even been tried.

As we’ll see, Daniel Perry conducted searches on killing protesters. He boasted to acquaintances about how he hoped to kill protesters. He fantasized about killing protesters. He debated people online about when killing protesters would be justified. And then he killed a protester.

Perry was also marinating in a toxic online swamp of racism, extremism, and hate created by the very sorts of people Abbott tried to appease with his pardon. The pardon was part of a larger, alarming trend on the MAGA right of excusing and even glorifying political violence against protesters, activists, and their perceived political enemies.

Foster, meanwhile, was doing precisely what gun rights supporters like Abbott claim to champion — he was defending himself and someone he loved from harm. He was also defending his constitutional rights and those of the people around him. Yet after his death, the far right immediately went about smearing Foster with lies about who he was and what he stood for.

One other thing: Mitchell’s disability was caused by a misdiagnosed and mistreated urinary tract infection that caused sepsis and nearly killed her. I learned this from her mother, because Mitchell herself is barred by an NDA from discussing the mistakes doctors made that caused her to lose her limbs.

Abbott of course is disabled himself, the result of a tree falling on him when he was in his 20s. When he was Texas attorney general, Abbott led the charge to impose caps on damages for medical malpractice. Because of that law, if Mitchell had sued the doctors and hospital responsible, she could not have won enough to pay for the care she’ll need for the rest of her life. In order to get the money she’d need, she had to sign an NDA. Abbott continues to receive payments for his injuries, decades later. And because his own injuries weren’t the result of medical malpractice, cases like his aren’t subject to the limits he helped impose on cases like Mitchell’s.

I hope you’ll give the episode a listen or watch. And if you like what you hear and see, please help Mitchell spread her message by passing it on to friends, acquaintances, and on social media.

We hope to have the podcast up on all the platforms soon. So I’d also be grateful if you give it a like, a subscribe, and a positive rating.

Transcript:

Whitney Mitchell:

And I was freaked out. So I had the flag like pointed like this, like toward it because I was afraid like he was gonna get out of the car, whoever this was. And I remember Garrett like going in front of me and bending over and be like,

go like to leave, like basically telling him to go, like to just drive off. And then I, and all of a sudden I hear gunshots Boom, boom. And I see him fall over in front of me. I actually see him fall over in front of me as the car is speeding off.

He falls over in front of me. Everyone goes down like this once the shots start. I jumped out of my chair. I have to throw myself out of the chair. I thought I was shot. I didn’t know. And I was on the ground. And I looked over and I see him on the ground. And he slumped.

Over the flag that I was holding and he’s just limp.

Radley Balko:

That’s Whitney Mitchell describing what she saw in July of 2020 as a man named Daniel Perry shot and killed her fiance, Garrett Foster. Perry had just driven his car into the racial justice protest Whitney and Garrett were attending. Whitney, who was a quadruple amputee, says that Perry nearly struck her.

A jury would later convict Perry of murder for Foster’s death.

Whitney Mitchell:

I can, it’s like what flashes like is his hand just like, like his, it’s just like slumped over the flag. And I scoot, I scoot myself and everyone starts surrounding him. And I, and I, and I realize it’s him like, like, like it, like it, and I start screaming and it’s like, and I, and I can’t describe this, but it’s like this, like when I’m screaming, it’s like a scream that I can’t describe, like it, Like it’s guttural, like it’s something, like I couldn’t recognize my own voice when I was screaming and I grabbed onto his leg and they start pulling him over and yeah, his eyes were just like, just open. They’re just open. And they start, everyone starts trying to like get to him, like cause he’s bleeding and I’m just holding onto his leg. And this, I remember this cop was like trying to get me off and I’m yelling into . . .

Radley Balko:

Daniel Perry told friends about how he wanted to kill Black Lives Matter protesters.

He was obsessed with other people who had tried to kill them. He did internet searches to see how he could get away with killing them. He posted on social media sites that protesters deserve to be killed. And he even fantasized about killing them. Then Daniel Perry got into his car,

drove into a group of protesters, pulled out his gun, and killed one of them. The day after the jury’s verdict, Texas Governor Greg Abbott announced that he wanted to pardon Perry. He did. And now Daniel Perry is free. I’m Radley Balko, and this is The Watch.

[Music]

Welcome to the first episode of The Watch, the podcast with Radley Balko. I’m a longtime investigative journalist who has worked at the Washington Post, the Huffington Post, and Reason Magazine. You can read my current work at my newsletter, The Watch, radleybalco.substack.com. When my producer and fellow journalist, Matt Stroud, first approached me with the idea of starting a podcast, I had to think about what I could add. What would people actually want to hear that I could offer? And I decided that I wanted to do a podcast that would amplify the people and the ideas that I think are undervalued and deserve to be heard.

So when I started thinking about a first episode, a lot of people and topics came to mind. But then the podcast project got delayed by a couple of months while I finished up another project. And then once I finished that and returned to the podcast, the midterm elections were heating up.

Polls started showing signs of a big swing toward the Democrats, and in particular, the Texas governor’s race looked to be unexpectedly close, and still does. Recent poll ranges show a virtual dead heat between Greg Abbott and the Democrat Gina Hinoosa. Greg Abbott has previously been a Texas Supreme Court justice, the state attorney general, and has had three terms as governor. He’s never won an election by less than 10 points. So the fact that this election is so close is pretty significant. And so that’s kind of when it hit me that the first episode really needed to be about Garrett Foster and Whitney Mitchell.

Because what Abbott did in this case is really one of the most cynical and shameless displays I’ve ever seen from a politician. And this election coming up in a few weeks will be the first opportunity for Texas voters to hold him accountable for what he did.

So I think what he did in this case does need to be a part of that conversation. So let’s talk about what happened. In July of 2020, Garrett Foster was murdered while protesting at a Black Lives Matter demonstration in Austin. It was part of that summer’s protests over the murder of George Floyd.

Daniel Perry ran a red light and then accelerated into a group of protesters. Everybody back up! Garrett Foster was carrying a rifle, open carrying, which of course is perfectly legal in Texas. When Perry accelerated his car into the protest, Foster and the other protesters confronted him. According to witnesses, Foster urged Perry to slowly continue driving in order to avoid a confrontation. Whitney herself would later testify that she heard Garrett tell Perry to move on. But Perry then pulled out a gun and fired at Foster five times, striking him three times. Foster would die from his injuries. A jury convicted Perry of murder in 2023.

The jury even had the option to convict him of the lesser charge of manslaughter, but they went with murder instead. They clearly believed that this was a murder. A judge then sentenced Perry to 25 years in prison. But from the moment that Foster died, right-wing personalities rallied to Perry’s defense. After the verdict, MAGA or MAGA-adjacent people like Tucker Carlson, Texas GOP chair Matt Rinaldi, Kyle Rittenhouse, and others started pressuring Greg Abbott to pardon Perry. Perry, they said, was just a helpless Uber driver who had taken a wrong turn, found himself surrounded by angry rioters, and then feared for his life. Foster, meanwhile, they called a violent insurrectionist, a rioter, a member of Antifa, and a Boogaloo Boy, the nutty group that wants to use random violence to incite a race war. I’ll get to Perry in a minute, but first I want to talk about Foster. Garrett Foster was none of those things. His politics could best be described as left libertarian.

He had registered as a libertarian ahead of the 2020 election. And he was an avid supporter of both gun rights and Black Lives Matter. As I think you’ll see by the end of this episode, he was also just a fundamentally decent person. You’re going to hear a little bit from Whitney Mitchell, Foster’s fiance.

The Watch is a reader-supported publication. If you find this work important, please consider a paid subscription.

I reached out to her in part because she has yet to really tell her story in its entirety in a public way. She, of course, was beside Foster on the night that Perry killed him. She saw him die right in front of her. And she also knew him better than anyone.

Whitney knows what kind of man Garrett Foster was. The two began dating in high school when both were around 17. About a year into the relationship though, Whitney developed a UTI that got progressively worse until she finally had to go to the hospital. So Whitney is barred from talking about what happened next at the hospital.

She had to sign a non-disclosure agreement as part of her settlement. But her mom isn’t bound by that NDA and her mom told me what happened. The hospital misdiagnosed the severity of Whitney’s infection and sent her home. As the infection got worse, she returned and had to be admitted to the hospital.

The infection eventually led to sepsis and then Whitney fell into a coma. She was given a 12% chance to live. The combination of the infection and the drugs that doctors prescribed to protect her brain then pulled the blood from her limbs. Whitney did survive, of course, but not before doctors had to amputate both of her arms and both of her legs. Garrett Foster remained by her side. He became her primary caretaker. And the two were still together nearly a decade later when they started attending racial justice protests. So when Foster was murdered in 2020, the two were planning to spend the rest of their lives together. Daniel Perry’s defenders claimed that he shot Foster in self-defense. And when he first announced that he wanted to pardon Perry, Greg Abbott specifically cited the Texas Stand Your Ground Law. They claimed that Foster pointed his rifle at Perry, and online a few people even suggested that Foster had fired, and that turned out not to be true.

There’s no clear video or photo of the moment right before Perry killed Foster, but as I’ll explain, I think the evidence overwhelmingly demonstrates that Foster was not a threat to Perry, and this evidence includes not only statements from witnesses, other protesters, but also Perry’s own words. But first I want to look at why was Garrett Foster armed that night? A lot of people have criticized him for carrying a rifle in the first place. By the time of his death in late July 2020, Garrett Foster and Whitney had attended more than 20 protests.

He started carrying a rifle after reading about incidents in which people had started intentionally striking protesters with their cars. These incidents coincided with memes floating around on the right about how protesters who block public streets should be run over, complete with cutesy, horrific slogans like Black Lives Splatter. Between late May and early September 2020, there were 104 incidents in which someone drove a vehicle into a group of protesters, according to researchers at the University of Chicago. Following year, a lot of red state legislatures started passing laws limiting criminal and civil liability for motorists who strike protesters with their automobiles.

Whitney told me that she and Garrett were actually personally at a protest in which a man drove his car into the protest and then started waving a gun around. So that’s why Foster started carrying a rifle as a deterrent. He was angry about these incidents and about people trying to limit his right to protest.

And he was most worried about his vulnerable fiance. Now we can debate the wisdom of openly carrying a rifle at a potentially volatile event like a racial justice protest. And personally, I don’t think it’s wise precisely because it’s so easy to be mistaken as a threat.

But I think it’s worth pointing out that this is perfectly legal in Texas. In fact, not only is it legal, Foster’s reason for carrying a rifle perfectly aligns with the stated principles of gun supporters like Greg Abbott. Foster was protecting the people he cares about, and he was protecting their right to protest.

Again, Abbott cited Stand Your Ground to justify his pardon of Perry. But for Stand Your Ground to apply, Foster would have had to initiate the confrontation. He can’t legally put somebody else in peril. And then claim that you have no choice but to use lethal force when they legally attempted to defend themselves.

Daniel Perry ran a red light and then he accelerated his car into a group of protesters. There’s video of this. In doing so, he committed a crime that put the protesters in peril and in reasonable fear of their lives. At that point, Foster actually would have been justified in shooting Perry or at least pointing his rifle at him. But there’s no evidence that he did either. What we do have is a grainy still photo of the moment before the shooting. But even in that photo, we can see that Foster’s elbow is up and his rifle appears to be pointed down at the ground.

This is what’s known as the low ready position. It’s a position taught by gun safety experts. It’s not considered threatening. And in fact, it’s considered good gun discipline. The barrel of Foster’s gun isn’t visible in the photo, but the context makes clear, I think, that it was pointed down. If you look at the photo, you can see that there’s a woman standing between Foster and Perry’s car, and we can see her arm. If Foster were pointing his gun at Perry, the barrel would be obscuring her arm. But we also know that witnesses say that Foster never pointed his gun at Perry. Whitney herself testified that Foster told Perry to move on.

These are not the actions of someone who was intent on hurting Perry, much less killing him. Now, it’s true Whitney was Foster’s fiance and the other witnesses were protesters, so a skeptic might understandably be suspicious of what they thought they saw. But we could also look at what Perry himself told the police.

Listen to this audio of Perry’s police interview after he turned himself in. If you didn’t catch it, Perry says, I believe he was going to aim at me. I didn’t want to give him a chance to aim at me, you know? So Perry told police that Foster wasn’t aiming at him, that he wanted to kill him or shoot him before he got the chance to aim at him. That’s illegal, even in states with very generous stand your ground laws. At Perry’s trial, a firearms expert testified for the defense that someone can kill from the low ready position in just a matter of seconds.

But that’s true of virtually any way you might hold a rifle while open carrying. It’s why people keep getting mistaken for possible mass shooters while they open carry. If Perry was justified in killing Foster simply because Foster could have aimed his gun at him and shot him within a matter of seconds, anyone could shoot anyone who’s openly carried and get away with it. That just can’t be the law. Greg Abbott has been notoriously stingy with his pardons and commutations, even for a Texas governor. Yet he announced that he planned to pardon Perry the day after the jury’s verdict.

And Perry remains the only person that Abbott has ever pardoned for a serious violent felony. And this is, of course, is of a piece of MAGA Republicans’ more general policy of excusing political violence, so long as it’s carried out in support of MAGA people and MAGA ideas.

We could look at, you know, Trump’s pardoning of the January 6th rioters and insurrectionists. There’s the valorization of Daniel Penny, not to be confused with Daniel Perry, Penny’s the man who choked Jordan Neely, a homeless man, to death on a New York City subway. And of course, there’s Kyle Rittenhouse, the Illinois kid who has been celebrated as a hero on the right for showing up armed at the protests in Kenosha, Wisconsin, after the police shooting of Jacob Blake. Rittenhouse said he took his rifle to those protests to protect property owners from rioters. He then got into confrontations with three men and shot them, killing two.

I’ve written in the past that I think Rittenhouse’s actions were reckless and stupid and that the right’s attempts to valorize them are dangerous. And I also think it’s easy to see how protesters in Kenosha may have mistaken him for a mass shooter or someone there to do them harm. That said, the evidence also suggests that Rittenhouse was attacked and that he did likely have the right to use lethal force to defend himself.

But what I think is instructive is how quickly the right embraced and valorized Rittenhouse, made him a hero, and how quickly they denounced Garrett Foster as some sort of violent terrorist who deserved what happened to him. Rittenhouse grabbed a rifle and rushed into a hostile protest. Foster began carrying a rifle only after seeing threats to himself, his fiance, and other protesters. Foster also showed remarkable restraint in the face of a threat. He lost his life because of that restraint. Rittenhouse shot his attackers.

Of course, the main difference between the two, between Garrett Foster and Kyle Rittenhouse, is their politics. Rittenhouse armed himself in opposition to racial justice protesters. Foster armed himself as a racial justice protester. Now, when it comes to the law, politics shouldn’t matter at all, but of course it does. It tends to make all the difference in the world.

In 2023, Tucker Carlson had a guest on his show to defend Daniel Perry and the killing of Garrett Foster. That guest, Kyle Rittenhouse. The whole conversation is really surreal. The segment is full of the lies and half-truths you’d expect from Carlson. He claimed Foster pointed his gun at Perry. There’s no evidence of that.

He called Foster a rioter. He wasn’t. He called Perry, oddly, the least powerful person in our society, apparently because he was an Uber driver. That’s a really bizarre way to describe him, especially since Perry was a sergeant in the army at the time. There’s one other video that Perry’s defenders often bring up to show that his killing of Foster was justified. And it’s an interview Foster gave minutes before his death to an independent journalist named Hiram Gilberto Garcia, who was live streaming on Periscope. The day after Foster died, Ken Cassidy, the president of the Austin Police Association, so the police union there, tweeted a clip of the interview and wrote that Foster had been looking for a confrontation and found it. He later apologized for that. But in the video, Foster actually talks about why he doesn’t think he’d ever need to use his gun. But in doing so, he also refers to the right-wing provocateurs and the counter-protesters as “pussies.”

This, Perry’s Defenders Say shows that Foster was itching for a fight. You know, I hear it more as the bravado of a young guy who’s, you know, fed up with people driving into protests with their cars. But I’ll let you judge for yourself. Here’s that clip.

. . .

I think it’s important to add here that whatever you make of that interview, it doesn’t change the fact that there’s no evidence that Foster pointed his gun at Perry or intended Perry any harm. And again, the evidence strongly suggests the opposite. But so far, we’ve only really looked at Garrett Foster and his possible motivations that night.

So now let’s look at Daniel Perry. I’m gonna warn you here that much of what you’re about to hear is pretty disturbing. I’d also point out that all of this information, everything I’m gonna tell you from here on in, was public information at the time that Greg Abbott granted Daniel Perry a pardon.

So he kind of owns all of this. So let’s start with Perry’s internet history. In the weeks leading up to his killing of Foster, Perry did searches for Protesters in Seattle gets shot and riot shootouts. He searched the phrase degrees of murder charges. He also ran a search on the question, “Does the federal government have the ballistics of every firearm sold legally?” You might recall that after his death, right-wing groups accused Garrett Foster of sympathizing with the Boogaloo Boys, that group that wants to push the country into a civil war. Well, there’s no evidence that Foster had any affinity for that group. But Perry’s a different story.

Perry did a search of the group that summer. Investigators also found a Boogaloo Boy meme and a flag saved on Perry’s phone, including in early 2020, which was months before the George Floyd protests had begun. In fact, Perry’s phone and computer were teeming with racism, extremism, and a desire to commit violence against protesters.

One meme showed a young girl with an oh well expression on her face under the text, “When your warning shot hits the b*****d.” Another showed a little girl sitting on her dad’s lap asking, “Daddy, why do you play video games?” And the dad replies, “Because slaughtering people in real life has so many complications.”

In 2020, Perry sent a meme to an acquaintance showing a woman pushing a little girl’s head under the water in a bathtub. And the text read, when your daughter’s first crush is a little Negro boy. So all of that was even before the George Floyd protests had begun. After they began, Perry’s online communications grew increasingly angry and spiteful.

In a group text on May 29th, 2020, he wrote that if he weren’t in the army, he’d probably be on a rooftop protecting businesses from looters. The same day, he texted one acquaintance a white power meme and wrote to another, “I might have to go to Dallas to shoot looters.” In a direct message exchange the next day, he fantasized about standing on a rooftop overlooking looters in Dallas and “just opening up like it’s open season,” adding, “I would live stream this s**t.” On May 31st, Perry had another alarm exchange over a friend, over Facebook Messenger. Perry said, “I might have to kill a few people on my way to work. They’re rioting outside my apartment complex.”

The friend answers, “Can you legally do so? Perry says, if they attack me or try to pull me out of my car, then yes. If I do it just because I’m driving by, then no.”

The friend says, “Make sure to only use one shot on the protesters so if they try to flood you, you’ve got enough rounds for them all.” Perry replies, “I’ll only shoot the ones in the front and then push the pedal to the metal. Dude, I need to save ammo for when I go up to Dallas to visit you. There are at least a thousand rioters and they probably have guns.”

The friend says, “What will be the turnout you think?” Perry says, “No protesters go near me or my car.” The friend then weirdly says, “Can you catch me a Negro daddy? And Perry says, “That’s what I’m hoping.” The friend responds, “Yay.”

The following day, Perry left a Facebook comment in which he compared the Black Lives Matter movement to a “zoo full of monkeys that are freaking out, flinging their s**t.” He also sent a meme to an acquaintance of a large tractor with spikes attached to the front end under the text that read, “Introducing John Deere’s new multi-lane protester digester.”

In the ensuing weeks, Perry’s posts and texts got more racist, more violent, and more paranoid. In June, he copied the Wikipedia entry on the legal definition of murder, homicide, and justifiable homicide, and posted them to Facebook. The same day, he posted a meme with a picture of the Joker under the text, “I’m going to go block traffic.” Below that was a photo of the Joker being struck by a car under the text, “I’m the victim.” Perry also posted a photo of Reginald Denny, the truck driver attacked by rioters in Los Angeles in 1992. With the text, “This is why you don’t break for protesters.”

Perry’s friends and relatives seemed worried about him. Investigators found messages from his mother and father asking him to stop posting racist and violent content to Facebook. His sister was in the comments sections of his posts urging him to please stop. Some friends seemed more irritated than worried. After he sent a group text complaining about the rioting in Dallas, one recipient responded, “Nobody f*****g cares, Perry.”

Perry’s online history just generally shows a man who spent much of the pandemic marinating an online white grievance. He was angry about the movement to take down Confederate statues. He was angry about DEI. He was angry about immigration. In DM and text exchanges, he increasingly expressed the fear that he wasn’t safe in public simply because he was white. He was convinced that Black Lives Matter protesters would attack him, so he needed to remain well-armed at all times. He grew obsessed with cases in which other motorists had driven their cars into protesters, been attacked or fired guns at protesters.

He engaged in multiple debates with one acquaintance in particular about those incidents and under what conditions he would be legally justified to kill a protester. Later, in June of 2020, Perry copied a tweet that President Trump had posted on his Facebook status. It read, “Any protesters, anarchists, agitators, looters, or lowlifes who are going to Oklahoma, please understand, you will not be treated like you have in New York, Seattle, or Minneapolis. It will be a much different scene.”

Perry responded in the post: :Send them to Texas. We will show them why we say don’t mess with Texas.”

So there’s one other aspect of Perry’s online life that I think is worth mentioning. Remember a few years ago when right-wing pundits, politicians, and influencers began accusing LGBTQ people and their supporters of grooming children, right? These accusations were almost always baseless. But Daniel Perry appears to have actually been grooming minors. He did searches online for phrases like, “good chats to meet young girls.” And then he used a messaging service called Kik, which has been used to share child pornography and is used by groomers to basically reach out and make contact with underage women.

According to court records, Perry, who was in his 30s at the time, was messaging suggestively with multiple underage girls, including one who told him she was 16. Some appeared to have sent him nude photos, and his communication suggests that he had a sexual relationship with at least one of them. You know, it’s of course not an all unusual or inconsistent for a white man to be racist while also sexually exploiting black women or girls. There are multiple incidents of this throughout all of U.S. history.

But it is noticeable that he was pursuing these black underage girls while also posting just blatantly racist stuff online. So, you know, I think all of this makes Abbott’s pardon of Perry just so outrageous and brazenly hypocritical. Greg Abbott doesn’t support gun rights because Garrett Foster was doing exactly what people like Abbott claim gun rights are for.

What Abbott supports are gun rights for people who agree with him politically. Anybody else who arms themselves is a threat and doesn’t deserve to have any gun rights. Greg Abbott also clearly doesn’t give a damn about protecting children from child predators. I mean, he knew all about Perry’s online predatory behavior, or at least he should have if he did his research before pardoning. This is all public information. But thanks to Abbott, Perry’s now free. And the Texas Department of Criminal Justice has said his record may even be just completely expunged.

So now you know all about Daniel Perry and his history and the kind of person that Greg Abbott thinks deserves to be valorized and pardoned. A couple more things to say about Abbott at the end of this episode.

But now I want to let you hear from Whitney Mitchell because I think she deserves to tell her story. So here’s my interview with Whitney Mitchell.

Radley Balko:

Thank you for agreeing to do this. I know there’s probably going to be difficult in places, but I think this is a really important story that needs to be out there and needs to be told. Let’s start just by talking about Garrett. Can you talk about how you two met and started dating and how things happened between you?

Whitney Mitchell:

Yeah. We met each other at 17. We’re both seniors in high school. Met him through like a mutual friend. It’s kind of like, you know, like very like, like teenage love story. He saw me on MySpace. I saw him on MySpace type of thing and like started talking to him and like for like a good like couple of months and then we started dating. He was like my first everything, very much first person. And only for I’ve fallen in love with. And we went to different schools. So we still saw each other on the weekends. I basically grew up with him.

So pretty much everything that you go through at that age, we went through together. So it was always nice to have him there with me. And so he stayed with me when I lost my limbs as well. We’d only been dating a year. Which is wild for when you’re that age because most teenage boys of that age,

I don’t know that they would do something like that. Stay with me through me losing my limbs, but he stayed there the entire time. He slept outside my door. He stayed until he was getting sick himself. I don’t know.

If he wasn’t there for a lot of it, I definitely don’t know how I would have been able to do it. My family was there, but it just... Every time I opened my eyes, he was always there. He was there when I had to relearn how to put my shirt on.

I had to learn how to eat, and pretty much relearning all the things that I had already done. He was at rehab with me.

He was with me when I had to relearn how to walk. It was pretty much the hardest part of my life. He was there every step of the way, even in the good parts of my life. He was so supportive to me. In so many ways, even at the detriment of himself.

When I went through that, when I used to do costume design, I used to sew. He went to school with me in New York for that. He took me to the classes. He would help me put everything together. Everything throughout my life, he was always there. I’ve never met anyone like that.

I feel like I won’t ever meet anyone like that.

Radley Balko:

I don’t know that very many people like that exist. When you say you slept outside your door, have you been at the hospital?

Whitney Mitchell:

Yeah, I was in ICU and my family was there like every day and he was there every day like he would work but then go straight to the hospital right after work. And that’s what all he did really. So he would stay there overnight like my family would too.

So like there wasn’t a point where he wasn’t there. Yeah.

He was literally sleeping like outside my door or sleeping with my face, you know, like, yeah. And we were only 18 and only been dating for like a year. So.

Radley Balko:

And then, and then you were together for the next, what, 10 years after that until his death, right?

Whitney Michell:

Yeah. Yeah.

Radley Balko:

Can you talk a little bit about like what kind of person he was? What did he enjoy doing? Like what, what were, you know, what were his dreams? What did he want to do for a living when he got older?

Whitney Mitchell:

I learned a lot from him in terms of everything going on. And I know when we were teenagers, he wanted to be a meteorologist. We talked about that a lot. But I guess as we got older, like, I don’t know, it kind of changed into him, like, taking care of me. But, like, he put a lot, like, of time into, like, the things going on politically pretty much around us. Like, he was very self-aware. He was very, like, I don’t know, he’s very... I don’t know if that makes sense. He was also very much a super nerdy guy.

When I met him, he was a super huge gamer, super into tabletop games, super into Warhammer 40k, was very huge into that. He still played that up until he died, and I would play that with him. He’s a kind of like a prankster. He used to prank me a lot. He used to prank his friends a lot. He’s like very like silly.

I always felt like even when we’re like in our 20s, I felt like it just kind of felt like you’re like hanging out with like your best friend or like we’re like teenagers, like like they’d always felt like that. He was very goofy and like and we were like on the same wavelength and like just like really like deadpan. He’s very funny and like just He’s the most compassionate and caring person as well. He loves lizards, he loves reptiles.

He’s the one who got me super comfortable with snakes and lizards. We used to have a snake called Little Rick named from Rick and Morty and then we had an Argentinian tegu and his name was Beetlejuice.

And he loved Beetlejuice dearly. And I honestly was not super into reptiles or anything like that until he kind of introduced them to me. But he was very sweet and passionate and funny and weird in the best way. I don’t know. Yeah, I’m sorry.

Radley Balko:

He sounds like somebody I would have liked to have known. Can you talk about why the two of you started attending protests in 2020? Or was it before then?

Whitney Mitchell:

I mean, I think we’ve been to like maybe one protest one other time in Dallas, but it’s mostly just because what was going on in 2020. We talked about it a lot. We’d always have conversations. He’d always be mostly online because he debated people online. He had lots of conversations online about what was going on.

That was just something I cared about deeply and he cared about deeply. Also, with us being together for so many years, he saw a lot of the things that I experienced as a Black woman.

Also, I just feel like a lot of that shaped basically his beliefs and everything. So that’s something he cared about and something I cared about. And I wanted to do more because I felt like I was just kind of sitting at home and I was watching it happen.

And he was always supportive of anything I wanted to do. And that’s something he believed. And so we just decided to just go and Go one day, like it wasn’t, there’s no question to it. We just decided to do that. And then we just kept continuing to go.

Definitely didn’t expect it to turn into what would happen, but like we started doing that. And then we also decided to start this thing called Awesome Direct Action. But just like me and him and like roommate that was living with us at the time. And so we wanted to like feed like the homeless under the bridge because it would be protesting at APD. But also the people who are homeless would also be protesting with us. So we were like, OK, so they’re protesting in the hot sun with us. So we should at least give them something back. So we would go like every week. And like cook food.

And we bought these tables and bought like clothing and we like go under the bridge and like, we would just like, like giving food and like clothing and like water and everything. Cause we wanted to give back cause they’re also in it with us too. So that’s, that’s what we started doing. So it was just no questions.

And we just started, it’s just something that we wanted to do. Like he believed in it. I believed in it like deeply and so did he. So yeah, like, there’s no question that we would not ever have been out there, you know.

Radley Balko:

How many protests did you end up going to before he died?

Whitney Mitchell:

Yeah, like, before he died, like, because it, like, they started in May, like, at the end of May of 2020. So we started going, like, pretty much almost every day, like, even if there’s a day in between that we, like, obviously you have to, like, cause like, it’s a lot like, so like there’d be a break, but we would still go day after day after day after day with like a few breaks in between. So it was like, it was just every week, like every week we go. So I don’t know how many days that, I mean, I know people kept saying 50 days.

I don’t know if that’s the case, but it was pretty much every day, like from May until the time that he died, like we were going and it was getting smaller. Like the crowds were getting a lot smaller. Like they started off really big in May. And then as we got into the summer, we were still going, but it was small.

So, But we were still going, regardless of like how many people, we were still just going, kept protesting and still kept going under the bridge to feed the homelight. We still kept doing that.

So yeah. So after his death, you saw a lot of like right wing groups and even some mainstream news, you know, describe him as, you know, Antifa and some sort of radical activists. And as I understand it, I mean, he was kind of a Maybe left libertarian, probably best described as politics.

Radley Balko:

Can you talk a little bit about what he believed in and why he was at the protest and what kind of protest he believed in, what kind of change he wanted?

Whitney Michell:

I mean, I feel like he just basically proved black lives better, obviously, to be treated as a human being, maybe not being gunned down. For like the smallest of things and sort of the police brutality, basically just wanting everyone to- Incredibly radical. Yeah.

Radley Balko:

Incredibly radical to think that Black people shouldn’t just be gunned down.

Whitney Mitchell:

Yeah. Like apparently that’s a crazy thought or that’s a crazy like, yeah, concept to have. Just like, like believing that everyone should have the freedom to do what they would like to do, to live as they want to live. Like he believed in open carry. So like. He was like for gun rights completely, which I feel like that’s probably the thing that like messed with everybody’s heads, I think, I guess, because he was, we were at a Black Lives Matter protest, but he was pro-gun and it’s like, it’s like, it didn’t fit like a box or something. I don’t know if that’s what it was, but like, it’s like, it could be multiple things.

Radley Balko:

Well, let me ask you this. When did he start open caring? Was there some incident that made him think that he needed to start doing that? Or did he do that from the start?

Whitney Mitchell:

Well, at the protest, they were kind of there.

It was getting like it was aggressive, like people getting tear gas and things under the ground. There was one incident where like a car like actually did drive through the crowd and he started waving a gun around. And then like he was pulled in like at the end of the I don’t know, like at the end of the block, I think, in one of the parking lots by the police. I don’t. And that was crazy because he almost ran over us. And then there’s basically what why he open carried was pretty much an escalation of that happening.

And then our roommate getting arrested, like at one of the protests that night, and then he was, so he was in jail. So then he was like, I’m going to, he’s like, I’m going to open carry. Like, obviously it’s a deterrent not to like, because that’s the thing I’ve had to explain is like, well, why would you take, like, why would he like take that there? Is he going to use, like, no, it was a deterrent because there’s people driving through crowds, people, counter-protesters, it was so that people would like, okay, back up and leave us alone to protect everybody. That was the whole point.

It wasn’t like he was going there with the intention of using that. We talked about, we literally had conversations about this. I remember when he got the gun and we were talking about that, he was an advocate for this. He was literally taking the test to get the license.

While we were at the protest, like he was like on his phone, like doing the whole, like to like get the permit. Like, so it’s like, he was like super adamant about, like he was smart about it.

Radley Balko:

I mean, he was carrying legally though, right? He was getting, trying to get the permit to conceal?

Whitney Mitchell:

Yes, yes.

How did the other protests react to him carrying the other protesters?

I mean, a lot of people questioned him about it. They, like, they asked him, like, why are you carrying this here? And he, like, explained, like, to protect everyone here. But, like, I would see people often come up and ask him questions about it. Like, some people were genuinely, like, okay, like, they’re with it.

And some people were just, like, just curious about it. But I feel like people, like, knew why. And it’s because he’s, like, the only one that, he’s the one that started, like, that started doing that in that protest. And then I know, like, the day of, like, When everything happened, I remember a group of people had came and they were carrying, open carrying too. So, and that was like the first time I think I’d seen that like at the protest, but it was like only on that day that I saw other people like carrying too. So it’s like he, cause like,

I remember when he started carrying, like, I remember we were standing outside the police station and people, they would be staring him down from like the, like inside the precinct and stuff. Like, Mind you, we’re just standing there. It’s not like he’s doing anything.

He just has it downward, and they’re just staring so intensely at him from the precinct. People questioned it, but they weren’t scared or anything. I feel like they knew why he was doing it. I know there’s a video that people take out of context when one of the streamers is like, asking him directly, like, hey, why are you carrying this? And he explains it. And I feel like that’s been taken out of context. And he literally explains why he’s doing it and why it’s happening. And I feel like people took a piece of that and then just ran with it.

And even though he literally tells you what, I don’t know. I’m sorry, I don’t know if that’s related, but I just wanted to put that out there. But yeah.

Radley Balko:

I know that there was, or I guess I had read that there was an incident at one of the protests where you had an incident with a police officer. And I guess you were somehow fell or were dumped or you fell from your wheelchair.

Whitney Mitchell:

Yeah.

Radley Balko:

Can you talk about what happened there? And did that have an effect on him? Did he feel sort of protective of you after that?

Whitney Mitchell:

That happened after he died. Yeah, that was when I was protesting.

I was basically marching for him and it was for him and the other family members who have lost their loved ones to police brutality. And that’s what we were marching for. And so I had a banner that we were all carrying, carrying a banner with his name on it and his face.

And we were going past where it happened, where he was killed. And I don’t know. I left the banner. The banner was left on something. We were just kind of breaking right there. And then for some reason, they came and they took the banner. And I just wanted the banner back.

There was no reason for them to do that. It was just kind of like, We were just taking a break because we had been walking and we’ve been marching for like a good bit. And they just took the banner and I got upset because I just wanted the banner back and they refused to give it back.

And I think it’s because we were like in the street and we were marching. So it was that, but we had, at that point we had got on the sidewalk and because we were at the location where it happened and they just decided to take the banner and that’s what started it and they wouldn’t give it back.

So they wanted me to like move on to the side. They wanted me to just like, There’s basically telling me no. And so I was upset. I just wanted the banner back. And so they ended up arresting my friend instead of arresting me. And then, so then the police officer tries to like push me onto like the curb, but then ends up dumping me. And I fell out of the chair. And I know like at the time people were like, she like wiggled herself out of the chair.

And it’s like, mind you, if I’m falling, like I’ve had to learn how to fall. Like in case I fall, like I have to fall on a way where I’m not going to break something. And I feel like, That was insane because I was just trying to get a banner back. That’s it.

There’s no reason for them to do that. It just felt like it was just taunting. And it was like right next to where he was killed. It was like right there.

Like it was.

Radley Balko:

You had like a memorial for him and didn’t they, they kind of rode through on horses and broke up the memorial.

Whitney Mitchell:

Yeah. I wasn’t present for that at that point because I was like inside at that time. And I think people are making death. Threats at me at that time, but I remember people coming back and telling me what happened. They were destroying the memorial, throwing a plane on the memorial, and they were protesting.

I know there are people protesting. I just wasn’t present for that because I was staying inside for my own safety. Because I’ve been getting messages upon messages and just threats. I knew what was happening. It just was told for me through other people. But yeah, that’s... Yeah, just also Steven Crowder coming as well.

Radley Balko:

Got it. So he, he came, I know other kind of right-wing people came and well, let’s, let’s, let’s talk about that after this. So I know this part’s going to be a little difficult, but can you kind of tell me about what happened in the moments kind of leading up to his death from your perspective?

Whitney Mitchell:

Like, I remember just like, we were at the Capitol and like, one of the people At the birth that they were speaking, we’re all standing. And I remember that that’s the last time I, like, that’s one of the last times I, like, had talked to Garrett. Like, we were just kind of talking and there was nothing chaotic that was happening. We were just talking, they were giving speeches and we were all listening. And then, so then we started marching from the Capitol towards that direction where, you know, where everything happened.

And then we stopped at the W, I think it’s called the W Hotel. That was the last stop we made before that happened. And that’s the last time I talked to him. That I even talked to Garrett and it was fine. It was just like they’re giving speeches and there was nothing chaotic about it or anything.

It was just kind of like typically what happens when we go to the protests. And then so then once that was over, then once they stopped speaking, then we just kept. Marching towards that way. And I remember like our roommate was, he was pushing me actually. Cause he was pushing me.

I was holding his, his flag is like the transgender flag. I was holding that flag and Garrett was like behind us. Like he was, cause I remember looking back, you know, like, and he was falling behind us, but he was like carrying along with the other people in the back that were also there that night carrying.

And like, that’s, I remember like we’re going or, and Like I remember being on this side and then I just remember like seeing a car like just like speeding like towards what looked like towards us. And so we all just kind of back up and disperse and the car just goes like jerks like this.

And I’m over here. The person that’s like the roommate, like he’s over here. We’re just kind of freaked out because the car like practically just tried to run over us. Everyone’s freaked out. And I remember like from this side, like I remember Garrett, like coming up like in front of me, because I remember being in this direct line of sight of where he was. He was right here, and I was right here. And I was freaked out, so I had the flag pointed like this toward it because I was afraid he was going to get out of the car, whoever this was.

And I remember Garrett going in front of me and bending over and be like, go to leave. Basically telling him to go, to just drive off. And then all of a sudden, I hear gunshots. Boom, boom. And I see him fall over in front of me.

I actually see him fall over in front of me as the car is speeding off. He falls over in front of me. Everyone goes down like this once the shots start. I jumped out of my chair. I have to throw myself out of the chair. I thought I was shot. I didn’t know.

And I was on the ground. And I looked over, and I see him on the ground. And he slumped over the flag that I was holding. And he’s just And I still to this day, what flashes is his hand just slumped over the flag. And I scoot myself and everyone starts surrounding him. And I realize it’s him.

And I start screaming. And I can’t describe this, but when I’m screaming, it’s like a scream that I can’t describe. Like, it’s guttural. Like, it’s something. Like, I couldn’t recognize my own voice when I was screaming. And I grabbed onto his leg. And they start pulling him over. And, yeah, his eyes were just, like, just open.

They’re just open. And they start, everyone starts trying to, like, get to him, like, because he’s bleeding. And I’m holding onto his leg. And I remember this cop was, like, trying to get me off. And I’m yelling at him to Get away from me, get away from me. And I’m screaming and I’m freaking out and I’m crying because I realized it like it’s, and they pull me away from him. And so they’re like, like they put the tape up and they’re just trying to revive him. Like they’re doing compressions. They’re just trying to stop the bleeding. And I, and I’m on the other side and I wanted to go to him.

They wouldn’t let me and I’m crying and I, and At some point, I remember they put him in the ambulance and I’m on the other side of the tape because they put me back in my chair at some point. And then I’m with another friend and the roommate that lived with me and Garrett.

And I’m asking the police, is he okay? And they’re not really giving a straight answer. They’re saying they sent him to the hospital. And so I get in the car with the friend that I met at the protest, which, mind you, I didn’t know her very well at the time, but she rushed towards me. She was...

There and like we go to the hospital and they wouldn’t let me up. They wouldn’t let me upstairs. They wouldn’t let us upstairs. So I was just sitting there just waiting. And then this lady comes downstairs and she just kind of like gives it so callous. It just felt like so callous the way she said it.

She was just like, oh, you don’t know. He passed away. Unfortunately, she just was saying it in such a way of like it didn’t feel like it. I don’t know. It It’s just jarring. And so I freak out and I will, I will, I push myself out of the hospital, out of the, like, it’s like the main area. It’s kind of like in between the doors. Like, it’s not like in the hospital, but it’s like the double doors. And I just freak out and I’m crying. And I remember, like, just crying outside.

And I remember calling my mom and telling her that he was shot. And then she had to call his mom. And it was, it was horrible. It was, yeah. Yeah, that’s what I remember of that night. And it’s vivid because I watched him die in front of my eyes.

And I don’t know how to describe that. Yeah, and it’s something that I still have to live with. And it’s been six years later and I still see that all the time. It’s so vivid. It’s like it happened yesterday. But it’s like he was already gone. Like, cause it’s just like his eyes.

That’s what I remember, you know? So it’s, I feel, I hope it’s not too much. I don’t know how else to describe, you know, that night, but that’s how, yeah.

Radley Balko:

You can only tell us, yeah, what you remember. I, you know, I’m sorry you had to go through that. And then, you know, I really appreciate you recounting it cause I know it can’t be, it’s gotta be really difficult for you.

And I want to talk about why you want to recount it and why you want to go through it also. And we will definitely get to that. So after his death, you know, then we start seeing people talking about it. It starts getting a lot of national media coverage.

And like we said, you know, we talked about earlier, he gets portrayed as kind of this, you know, radical or some sort of violent, you know, revolutionary. And that all seems like nonsense, given what you’ve already talked about, about who he was. But can you just talk about, I mean, you know, I’m guessing he was not a violent person, right?

I mean, he wanted a peaceful change in protest, right?

Whitney Mitchell:

Yeah. No, he was, like, not at all. Like, I don’t know where that narrative came from, maybe just because he was open carrying. It was literally just to protect me and everybody else. I mean, like, honestly, I would never hurt a fly. Like, it’s very much... Like a cute, softy.

It’s just like the person that I saw them depicting was not the same person that I’ve literally spent my whole life growing up with, which is a completely just goofy and silly nerd that enjoyed life with. He enjoyed life as a big foodie and he just wasn’t a super serious person, but his principles and what he believed and he stood on that. And I feel like nobody ever really took the time to even ask that. I know like with these kinds of things, people don’t really care to ask or think about those things, but it’s like they just spent the whole time talking about the person who did it rather than the humanity of the person who was killed.

Radley Balko:

So there was a lot of debate about, you know, there’s a very grainy picture that was taken from a surveillance camera or maybe of somebody’s phone right before. The incident. And so there was this huge debate about whether he was pointing the gun at Perry or, and could you just talk about, I mean, I know he was a big gun rights person. I mean, did he, did he know kind of the, the etiquette of, of how to hold a gun, how to, you know, do, cause I mean, I could tell, you know, he didn’t have his finger on the trigger.

You could tell from other photos, you know, and you know, it seemed like he was, the gun was down when all of this happened.

Whitney Mitchell:

It was always down. He was in the military. So it’s like, yeah, he was in the Air Force. So it’s like, this is something that he had learned. He grew up with guns. He always knew gun etiquette. He knew everything about guns. I mean, anything that I learned was from him.

And he was always adamant about anything in terms of safety with carrying a gun or any... So it’s just... Like that whole narrative with the picture and like, like, look how, like it’s, it’s always down every picture and every, and I was there the whole time. He always had it down. There’s never a point where like he like pointed it up.

And I was like, so he had like a strap around, like. Like the gun and like I was like because I remember like the strap was almost like it was too small. So it’s like he couldn’t have really like done that because he was ordering a new strap because the strap was actually too small.

That was like around his body that like that he was carrying. So I remember that. So it’s like and I know that I always should have mentioned that in the trial like when they asked me. But like, yeah, it was it was always down like. There’s never a point where. He pointed it out.

I was right behind him. I feel like I’ve had to overly explain that. It’s just insane with people that weren’t even there. It’s absolutely insane for someone to be like, this happened. And it’s like, no, because I was there. This is somebody. I know him. This is my husband. I talked to him. Yeah, it’s very frustrating. Yeah.

Based on the grainy picture. And even with the picture itself, I feel like it doesn’t really, it shows that it’s downward. I’ve seen it so many times because it’s the right and the moment before it happens. Like it’s, yeah.

Radley Balko:

You had mentioned, you know, the death threats that you got. Can you talk a little bit about like the aftermath and what effect that had on you when, you know, clearly the way people were characterizing it spurred a lot of really Really ugly and hateful reaction. Can you talk about how you experienced that?

Whitney Mitchell:

It was pretty horrible. Like, I couldn’t stay at my own house for about, like, a month or so because people were actively, like, at the time, because I wasn’t going to the protest that happened after he died, but they were, like, threatening to kill me and And so I stayed with a friend for like a good month.

And I got a flood of like in my inbox memes of making fun of his death.

People sending me pictures of dead bodies and making fun of his death. People sending me like sexual, like almost like rape threats, which is absolutely insane. Amongst other like racist, like it was blatantly racist, like stuff in my inbox calling me like All types of things. So like, yeah, mostly just graphic racist things being said in my inbox, people going into like my social media comments, like rest in piss to Gary, like just, just a lot. It was a lot of that. And I was kind of isolated for a bit. So I was like an at home, like just trying not to like look at my inbox, trying not to go back and forth with people, which was It’s hard for me not to do that because my family and everyone around me would be like, hey, you should just take a break. Don’t do that.

But it’s hard because I kept wanting to defend what they were saying, the things that were being said. It was hard. It was hard with that and then not being able to go home. And then he was my caregiver, by the way.

So I had to like, rely on like people that just met, like they were taking care of me. Like, so that, that whole structure changed. So it was hard. It just, it literally, like it destroyed a lot. Like it destroyed my life.

Radley Balko:

We talked, we talked about this when I first reached out to you that, you know, you’re putting yourself out there again with this. And, you know, I think that’s, it’s incredibly brave of you to do that. And I guess that, I want to ask you about that. Like, why are you willing to do that again?

What is it that you want people to know about Garrett, about what happened? We haven’t really talked about the pardon yet, but about the pardon.

Whitney Mithcell:

I want people to know who Garrett was. I mean, not just, like, his death and what happened to him and being reduced to that and also what actually happened. And also just, because I feel like people just kind of swept under the rug and forgot about it. And also just, like,

It’s not like just a headline because people kind of like read it and then they detach and they go on to the next thing.

But the people that like me, even his family, like you still have to live after all of that. Like you still have like you still you’re still living with the consequences of that, like and just of what what has been done and like and how that affects people afterwards. I don’t know, like if that makes sense,

I just want people to know, like, The human side of it, like humanized Garrett and the people that, you know, like the tragedy that it happened to, like me, his family, like that’s something that it’s still, it’s still, it still affects me to this day.

And even his family, it hasn’t stopped just because six years have went by. I just, I just really want people to know Garrett, to know him as a person, what he stood for, what we were out there for and the actual truth of what happened, not the narrative that was spun to like fit a certain like Agenda or, or for like a political, like for to get voted and again, like, you know what I’m saying? Just like the actual truth of it. That’s, that’s just what I want, honestly.

Radley Balko:

So, you know, people like, like Governor Abbott, they talk about, you know, victims of crime a lot and they, they talk about how they claim to speak for the victims of crime and You know, I’m just curious, before Abbott announced that he was going to pardon Perry, did anybody from his office reach out to you to let you know that was coming? Did you hear from any like victims advocates?

Whitney Mitchell:

I mean, like, do you mean just like telling me that like the pardon happened or just like, or that he was like, I mean, cause I did, there are victim advocates that talk to you, which tell you like, Hey, this is the status of like this, this going on. But like, I got the call. I remember getting the call of them saying, okay, like they’re letting him go.

Like the pardons went through. I remember getting that call, but it’s just kind of a waiting game the whole time before that. Cause like his family went and talked to the board of pardons and I went to talk to the board of pardons. And then after that, it’s just kind of like us waiting and waiting and hoping that like, that it was just, they listened and they weren’t going to do what they were going to do. And then, then the call just came one day in May and Yep, that just kind of hit me like a truck hit me. I don’t know.

Radley Balko:

Did this guy, Perry, you know, during his trial, all of this evidence comes out of, you know, his history online and the searches that he had done and the text messages he had exchanged with people. And, you know, it seemed pretty clear that he was, you know, looking for a confrontation with protesters.

Were you personally, like, worried or afraid when you learned that he would be getting out?

Whitney Mitchell:

Oh, yeah, for sure.

Like, because, I mean, how would you feel safe? I definitely didn’t feel safe after that happened. And then on top of him getting out, then, like, the media, like, just jumping onto it and then, like, adding more to the field like that. Yeah, that definitely did not feel safe. Like, I mean, he’s from the same area.

Like, my family is, like, It’s all in Dallas. Definitely felt really terrified, but I just try to, I don’t know, I feel like during the past couple of years, I try to feel composed about something that it’s kind of impossible to be composed about. So, yeah.

Radley Balko:

I think you’ve been remarkably composed given what you’ve been talking about for the last 40 minutes. So as I’m sure you know, Abbott has a disability, right? He uses a wheelchair. And he’s, you know, pardon this guy who murdered your primary caretaker. And, you know, I guess there’s nothing about being disabled that means you have to, you know, that you have the same politics as other disabled people or anything like that. But, like, it does seem, you know, there’s something about this, like, I don’t know. He took away kind of the person that took care of you and like he should know more than other people how important that was to you.

I mean, I don’t know. Is there something, am I getting at something here?

Whitney Mitchell:

No, you are. Yeah. I think it’s, yeah, it’s ironic. Like he’s disabled himself, but like, I don’t think that that’s connecting for some reason. I don’t, I don’t, I don’t get it. As very ableist, I, which is, I, Yeah, I guess. But like you said, like.

He doesn’t seem to have given it a whole lot of thought. I mean, I feel like he did it because Tucker Carlson kept telling him to do it.

Radley Balko:

Yeah, that’s basically what happened. Yeah. I’m just kind of like called him out on air, I guess. And it’s like, hey, like. You need to do like like like a bullying. I don’t know. It’s just. Yeah.

Is there anything that you would want to say to like. Tucker Carlson or Steven Crowder or all these other people who, you know, spread kind of these, these lies about Garrett and, and you know, about what he believed in. And I mean, I don’t know, maybe, maybe they’re just not even worth your time, but if you had a chance to say anything to them, would you want to say something?

Whitney Mitchell:

I, I kind of know like what the kind of things that they do and the kind of things that they say and speak, like, I kind of, I’m not surprised about any of the things that they’ve said and they still continue to do those things now. I could, I mean, I’ve always asked why or what do you gain from this? But I mean, I know what they gain, but like, I mean, that’s, that’s always what I’ve asked.

Like, is it like, could you ever put yourself in my shoes or anyone’s shoes that you’re, that you’re doing these things to? Like, do you ever think about the fact that it’s a, it’s like, that’s an actual person. They’re real people. It’s like, he was a person, like, you know, like he was a, I don’t know.

I know that sounds very like, okay, well, clearly, but it’s just, I don’t know what to say to them. I honestly don’t. I just, I don’t know. Empathy would be nice, but I don’t feel like that they have that.

Radley Balko:

I feel like empathy has become a dirty word on the right, which is really sad for everyone. So, you know, as you know, Abbott is up for re-election in November, and he’s in a very, very close race right now. And that’s one of the reasons why I wanted to reach out to you,

because I think this whole incident has kind of faded from the headlines a little bit. And from what I can tell, it hasn’t been an issue. But, you know, this was a really, you know, cynical, consequential thing that he did and seemed to do it without really giving it much thought.

And I guess I just wanted to ask, you know, what you... Think of this upcoming election. I mean, you know, I think I have a hunch who you would like to see win, but is there anything that like you want to say to people who are going to be voting for Texas governor, you know, in the next month?

Whitney Mitchell:

I feel like given everything that he’s done for the past couple of years, I feel like I thought that would be an indication that this is not somebody that you should elect again.

He just clearly only cares about certain lives and certain people and is pushing a certain type of narrative. I don’t know if I can say it’s a very white supremacist narrative. I don’t know if I can say it. Can I say that?

Radley Balko:

Sure you can. You can say whatever you want.

Whitney Mitchell:

I don’t know. I just want to say maybe people can look at what happened with what happened to Garrett and pretty much everything else that I’ve heard going on with him. You can add those stories, but also maybe if someone can look at this story and maybe think about, hey, maybe this is not somebody that we should elect again because there’s a lot of people who are in prison right now serving for things that are minor that, I don’t know, could have been pardoned. And for this to be the person to be chosen to be pardoned is absolutely insane.

Radley Balko:

Definitely sends a message of some kind, doesn’t it?

Whitney Mitchell:

Yeah, yeah.

Radley Balko:

I guess, is there anything I haven’t asked you that, you know, you want people to know, you want people to remember about Garrett, about what happened, about what he stood for?

Whitney Mitchell:

I’m trying to think if it was anything else that I didn’t tell. I mean, yeah, I just want people to know the truth of, like, yeah, what happened, because I feel like even, like, six years later, I still feel like that’s the story that gets spun, that, like, it was somehow on Garrett, which I don’t understand.

I just want people to know the truth and how it’s been stuck under the rug, which I feel like it has, and that the governor basically pardoned a murder. It’s... Given all the stuff that followed in the years after that, I feel like it’s all connected.

The stuff with ICE, I feel like all of these things are connected.

Radley Balko:

‘Yeah, there’s so many layers here. I mean, you talk about ICE claiming that people are driving their cars into them and weaponizing their cars. Actually, it’s ICE who’s doing it, doing that. But then also... You know, there was that whole thing during Black Lives Matter where you had right-wing people saying, encouraging people to run over protesters. And you had legislatures passing laws, like trying to give people, you know, immunity when they hit protesters with their cars. And you said, I mean, as you said, you had previous incidents where people had driven. Yeah.

Whitney Mitchell:

Yeah. Like, yeah, I’m sorry. I’m trying to think of, yeah. It’s basically everything that you said as well. I just, because I feel like, yeah, everything that happened to get, like, it connects to everything that’s happened in the last year or two. Like, everything, like, it’s all connected to each other. Like, so I don’t know.

I just, I just want people to know the truth, honestly. Like, I’m glad that you gave me the platform to speak on this, because I feel like It’s not really happened before. But yeah, I just want people to know the truth about Garrett.

Radley Balko:

So there are just a few other things about this story that I think are worth mentioning. First, Greg Abbott likes to talk about law and order and punishing criminals. He recently said that his opponent, Gina Hinojosa, is reckless on public safety and endangers all Texans. So as far as I know,

Hinojosa has not worked to free a convicted murderer who had served only just about a year of his sentence. As far as I know, she hasn’t put a man who sought out underage girls online back on the streets. But Daniel Perry isn’t the first person Greg Abbott has tried to protect from

the consequences of their possibly criminal behavior. Abbott also refused to act on the state of Minnesota’s request to extradite Christian Castro. Castro was an ICE officer charged with shooting a man during the immigration crackdown in Minneapolis. According to a federal indictment, Castro fired a shot through the front door of a home while a one-year-old child was inside.

The bullet hit Julio Cesar Souza Salas in the leg. Souza Salas was in the country legally. Castro is also accused of lying about that incident, claiming that Souza Salas and another man attacked him with a broom and a snow shovel. That turned out to be a complete and utter lie.

Even the Trump administration charged Castro with lying to investigators. Castro has pleaded not guilty to that. Yet Abbott said he would not respond to Minnesota’s request to send the officer there to face consequences for his charges. Second, as Whitney and I discussed in our interview, Greg Abbott himself is disabled.

He’s paralyzed from the waist down and uses a wheelchair. And that’s because of an incident in his twenties when a tree fell on Abbott while he was out jogging. Abbott sued the owner of the property that the tree was on along with a tree service company. As a result of that lawsuit,

Abbott did receive a lump sum payment every three years between 1989 and 2022. The most recent of those payments was for $740,000. But Abbott also gets monthly payments and will continue to get those for the rest of his life. Those were about $14,400 a month in 2013, and they rise by 4% every year.

The thing is, as a politician, Abbott has worked to restrict medical malpractice liability. One reason why Whitney can’t speak about what happened to her is that in order to get a sort of settlement that she needed To provide in-home care for the rest of her life,

which she requires, which she needs, she had to agree to a non-disclosure agreement. Otherwise, the damage that she could have been awarded in a lawsuit would have been capped. And they would have been capped because of a 2003 law that Greg Abbott supported as Attorney General. The sort of injury that Abbott suffered is non-medical in nature,

so it wasn’t subject to the cap on damages that Whitney’s injuries would be. Third, after the pardon, it came out that the Austin Police Department’s interim chief had drafted a letter to the parole board supporting clemency for Perry. The chief never signed it, but It should be surprising that a police group would support a pardon for someone like Perry. Perry shot a man who was protesting police racism and police brutality. He regularly posted Facebook memes in support of police and in opposition to the protests. And it turns out one of the most vocal supporters of the pardon was an Austin detective named David Fugit. Fugit was the lead investigator on the shooting,

and the draft letter cited many of his findings. Fugit has since retired from the police department, and he now works for Texas Attorney General Ken Paxton. So take that for what it’s worth. Finally, there’s been a lot of discussion in recent years about manhood and masculinity. What does it mean to be a man today?

The right seems to have migrated from the idea that masculinity means fidelity, sticking up for the vulnerable, and quiet confidence. For them, masculinity now seems defined by arrogance, greed, cruelty, and might makes right. Garrett Foster lost his life defending the woman he loved and while protesting for people who have been marginalized.

Greg Abbott then pardoned the man who killed Foster. Either because he believed that Perry’s murder of a man who presented no threat was righteous, which is pretty bad, or because Abbott himself lacked the courage to stand up to the right-wing TV pundits and MAGA influencers who were demanding a pardon.

I’d suggest that Garrett Foster was pretty simply a better man than Greg Abbott could ever hope to be.

You’ve been listening to The Watch with Radley Balko. Executive producers are me, Radley Balko, and Matt Stroud. Editing by Cassidy Fisher.

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