What does “work hard, play hard” really mean and why won’t it die?

In this episode of Trash Talk, Erica and Erin sit down with Meghan French Dunbar, author and co-founder of Conscious Company Media, to unpack the cultural myth of “work hard, play hard.”

Drawing on Meghan’s new book, “This isn’t Working,” this conversation explores how play has been commodified, as well as why, despite our best efforts, hustle culture from decades ago still sneaks into modern work.

Don’t forget to leave us a review and call the hotline to share your favorite or most cringe-worthy cliches:

719-819-2175

Show Notes & Links

Buy Megan’s Book, “This Isn’t Working”

https://www.hachettebookgroup.com/titles/meghan-french-dunbar/this-isnt-working/9781541704862/

Visit Megan’s Website https://www.meghanfrenchdunbar.com/

Subscript to Megan’s podcast, “Better Than This”

https://www.meghanfrenchdunbar.com/betterthanthis

Follow Erica Breuer: LinkedIn
Follow Erin Thomas: LinkedIn
Visit the Trash Talk Website: Buzzsprout

Citations

John Morison, Religious Improvement of the Poorer Classes, London: Fisher, Son & Jackson, 1827, p. 277.

The Normal Instructor and Teachers’ World, Vol. 32, 1923, p. 92.

Quoted in The Rotarian, Vol. 77, No. 3, Sept. 1950, p. 35.

Erin Thomas and Erica Breuer  talk about everyone’s favorite decision-making mantra: “If it’s not a hell yes, it’s a no.”

They trace this phrase back to its roots (surprisingly, it's not an influencer carousel) and get into into the messy stuff (privilege, trauma, hustle culture) that makes this cliche difficult to apply everywhere. They also review the neuroscience that proves your brain isn’t always the best hype-man when you’re chasing a hell yes. 

 📞Listener Hotline

Have you ever made a “meh” choice that turned into the best decision of your life—or dodged a hell yes that blew up later? We want your stories.

 Call us at 719-819-2175 or DM us.

Links & Notes

• Follow Erica Breuer on LinkedIn
  
  
• Follow Erin Thomas on LinkedIn
  
  
• Trash Talk Website
  
  
• Related Episode: It’s All About Your Mindset (Season 1)

Erica and Erin are back from summer break and they’re examining the lifecycle of a cultural darling, “Let Them.” In this episode, they explore why society (sometimes) eats meaning for breakfast. 

If you’ve ever wondered why some advice hits hard one day and feels hollow the next, you’ll enjoy their examination of how “Let Them” and other cliches become wallpaper for the internet.

Resources & Mentions:

→ “Let Them” poem (2019) by the original author, Cassie Phillips:

“Just let them.

If they want to choose something or someone over you, LET THEM.

If they want to go weeks without talking to you, LET THEM.

If they are okay with never seeing you, LET THEM.

If they are okay with always putting themselves first, LET THEM.

If they are showing you who they are and not what you perceived them to be, LET THEM.

If they want to follow the crowd, LET THEM.

If they want to judge or misunderstand you, LET THEM.

If they act like they can live without you, LET THEM.

If they want to walk out of your life and leave, hold the door open, AND LET THEM.

Let them lose you.

You were never theirs because you were always your own.

So let them.”

→  Cassie Phillips Contact Links

https://www.instagram.com/cassie.phillips.letthem

https://www.tiktok.com/@cassiephillips.letthem

https://www.cassie-phillips.com/

→  “Public Pressure & Mel Robbins”

https://sagejustice.substack.com/p/public-pressure-and-mel-robbins

Trash Talk: Season 2 Trailer 

Welcome back to Trash Talk for season two, where Erica Breuer and Erin Thomas dive into the cliched advice everyone repeats like gospel (even when it’s garbage). 

Got a cringe-worthy cliche to share? 

Call or text our new Trash Talk hotline at 719-819-2175. 

New episodes of Trash Talk drop Tuesday, September 9th—subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to stay up to date.

This isn’t a goodbye: it’s a see you in September. 

We’re taking a well-earned summer break (because seasonal girlies need rest too), but we’re already cooking up a trashier, spicier, more unhinged Season 2.

In this episode:

• A heartfelt thank you to our listeners (yes, you, with the fire DMs and existential side-eyes)
• Listener highlights, PLUS feedback we’re incorporating into next season
• Why poking at popular ideas isn’t the same as canceling them
• How to send us the clichés you love to hate

Erica and Erin dig into the creative cliché they actually love: “Steal like an artist.” Inspired by Austin Kleon’s book and a long lineage of remix-friendly wisdom, they explore the difference between influence and theft when both humans and AI borrow from what’s come before

If everything’s an echo, what makes something yours?

Resources & Mentions:

Austin Kleon
 → Steal Like an Artist
 → Also by Kleon: Show Your Work, Keep Going
 → Website: austinkleon.com

Julia Cameron
 → The Artist’s Way
 → Known for: Morning Pages, creative recovery tools
→ Website: juliacameronlive.com

If happiness is a choice, let’s talk about who gets to choose it, and who’s just trying to survive a system that tells them it’s their fault they’re miserable.

Erica and Erin are joined by William Davies, political economist, author of The Happiness Industry, and one of the sharpest critics of how governments and corporations turned happiness into a metric, a mandate, and a market. 

Together, they dig into the cultural scaffolding behind our obsession with happiness: where it comes from, who benefits, and what it’s costing us.

Connect with William Davies:

https://williamdavies.blog/

https://bookshop.org/beta-search?keywords=William+Davies

No full episode this week. We’re stepping away from the mic to touch grass, eat carbs, and avoid small talk. Back next week with more delightful dumpster fires.

Erica and Erin trace this phrase from its New Age roots to its Instagram glow-up, digging into how “the universe” became a rebranded higher power for people who’d rather not talk about God. What looks like faith might actually be a filter for avoidance, especially when it’s used to explain away failure or justify a $10K group program that never delivered.

From prosperity gospel to “trust the process” culture, they ask: Is this cliche (belief) helping people heal, or is it a cosmic cop-out?

You know that phrase, “Be your best self”? This episode rips it wide open: from its shiny, self-help packaging to the industrial shame complex underneath.

Erica and Erin are joined by media scholar Laurie Ouellette to break down how makeover reality shows (Extreme Makeover: Home Edition, The Biggest Loser, Wife Swap, etc.) didn’t just make for good TV;  they quietly rewired our ideas about help, worthiness, and personal responsibility. What we mistake for glow-ups, might be about control.

Find out more about Laurie Ouellette…

Buy one of her books: https://bookshop.org/contributors/laurie-ouellette

• Viewers Like You?: How Public TV Failed the People (2002)
• Better Living Through Reality TV: Television and Post-Welfare Citizenship (2008)
• Reality TV: Remaking Television Culture (2009)
• The Media Studies Reader (2012)
• A Companion to Reality Television (2014)
• Keywords for Media Studies (2017)
• Lifestyle TV (2016)

Read her work as Editor-in-Chief of the academic journal "Television and New Media:" https://us.sagepub.com/en-us/nam/journal/television-new-media

Or as a Columnist at Film Quarterly: https://filmquarterly.org/tag/laurie-ouellette/