Wag Out Loud

Hello there this is Krista with episode number 119 On the Wag Out Loud pawdcast. have you checked out all of the amazing partner products that I highly recommend? These are products that I've tried on my dog Winston that are both safe and effective. Just go to https://www.wagoutloud.com/ and check out the Partner Products section, and I've negotiated discounts for most of them.

What is it with dogs and butt scratches? The reason most dogs like their rear scratched is because that is a very hard area for them to reach themselves. And it's the muscular area right in front of their tail with a lot of sensitive nerve endings, which may be the reason for the pleasure that many dogs take in having their butts scratched.

Welcome to the Wag Out Loud Pawdcast, where we are obsessed with bringing you helpful tips on canine health care, nutrition and overall well being. If you'd like to support the show, check out the amazing online events, products and resources that I personally recommend on the Wag Out Loud website. I'm your host Krista and I'm super excited to be bringing you yet another tail wagging episode.

Hello dog lovers we are in for another great Wag Out Loud episode as Rita Hogan, Canine Herbalist is here to share some very important knowledge. And today we're going to be covering Herbal Solutions for Pancreatitis in Dogs. Rita, Could you please introduce yourself and share how you got into the specialty of holistic canine herbalism.

Um, as Krista said, my name is Rita Hogan and I have been an herbalist for approximately 19 plus years. I learned farm herbalism from my father and I picked it up again. When I was about 29 years old, I started working with dogs. And because I had a pre boarding facility, and I just saw all these really sick dogs coming and boarding with me. And I just knew there was a better way. And I just kept looking at all the similarities between all the dogs. And it was, you know, kibble fed diets, lots of over vaccination, lack of exercise, just not any preventative care. And so I started working one on one with those clients. And it just built from there. And here I am.

Well, we appreciate you being here. You're awesome. Thank you. And if people haven't caught Rita, I mean she speaks at conferences and she is a regular contributor to Dogs Naturally Magazine, one of my favorite periodicals. So Rita is so knowledgeable and we are so lucky to have her here. Rita, I was telling you before we hit record that I selfishly wanted this topic because my dog Winston has had pancreatitis, and it was awful. So why don't we first start with what exactly is pancreatitis?

Well, the pancreas is a little organ that's near the liver and it is responsible for insulin, how insulin is produced and utilized in the body, which is not, you know, the facet of pancreatitis. And then it's also responsible for creating enzymes that break down food. And those enzymes travel from the pancreas, to the digestive system, the stomach, and they're not activated, okay. So they kind of like are shielded, and they go down the chute into the stomach, and then they get activated in the stomach, or what happens with pancreatitis is those enzymes are activated before they get to the stomach. And that is not good, because what it does is it leaks these enzymes into the stomach and small intestine. And these enzymes eat the tissue on their way down. And they that causes tons of inflammation. It can cause internal bleeding. It definitely causes tissue damage with premature cell death. And we don't want that and it's very, very painful. Because those enzymes are eating tissues that they're not supposed to be eating. And you got to get everything to calm down because of the extreme pain and get the pancreas, the pancreas to work again. Right? Because when the enzymes leak into the abdominal cavity they eat through its lining and they damage the digestive track and we don't want that to happen, because you can't reverse that right? Well, you know, you can heal the mucosa for sure. But if it keeps going, they could eat right through it, which would be a terrible situation. But the problem is, is it's very painful for your dog. And you know, people get pancreatitis, and they can tell you that is some of the worst pain.

I know that if pancreatitis is not addressed, that it can really lead to serious consequences, like you mentioned, internal bleeding, cell death, organ damage. So there are two types of pancreatitis, acute and chronic. Can you tell us the difference between the two?

Yeah, so acute pancreatitis can sometimes just happen like one time. And it's usually something you never forget. And it comes on quickly, but it can be very severe. It also can have very mild symptoms. So it is just a disruption in the pancreatic activity, but it doesn't usually happen multiple times. And when it starts happening multiple times, it becomes chronic. Okay, and chronic pancreatitis is when a dog gets pancreatitis more than one time. And it's also usually an enzyme deficiency. And you see it in dogs with nutritional imbalances and that have low absorption that don't absorb the nutrients like they should, or endocrine disorders. And those type of conditions lead to the pancreatic insufficiency. And then usually you'll see an entire imbalance in the entire digestive system, which includes the liver, pancreas, and spleen, and the gut. So with chronic pancreatitis, you're going to address all of those things.

And is it true you were mentioning nutritional imbalances, so what are they low in vitamin wise?

That varies, it's just completely varied. But one of the things that is different with chronic pancreatitis, Krista is that a lot of times it can be asymptomatic, from like, just like this obvious perspective, right? Like, just like when he's a little, you know, he's been a little weak, but, you know, he looks normal, he's doing everything normal, but some of the symptoms of chronic pancreatitis, one of them is a dog that, you know that yoga move the downward dog.? A lot of times dogs with chronic pancreatitis, do the downward dog a lot. And they also arch their back a lot, like more than normal. And then they tend to have like a lack of appetite. They don't feel like eating a lot, a lot. They can have irritable bowel syndrome, they definitely usually have chronic loose stool, and they do chronic vomiting, and chronic loose stool and chronic vomiting, aren’t like vomiting, like on a Tuesday, three times, that's not chronic is they vomit, you know, often throughout the month, and they have loose stool throughout the month. It's consistent. It may not be every day, but it's consistent. And that can also be a symptom of chronic pancreatitis, where acute is just so much more severe and you'll know your dog, you know, they kind of go down. Yeah. And they definitely a lot of them need acute pancreatitis. A lot of them will need vet care for the first couple of days to manage the pain. And then you can bring them home and deal with it. If it's severe. And if it's not severe, then you can manage it at home.

Well, as I mentioned, Winston had it. We were camping. And he got something, you know, something he ate there at the campsite that was left. He was so sick and obviously in so much pain. He was doing the Down Dog and the up dog and hiding in the closet and whimpering. So I always thought it was just eating too much fat that triggers it. But there are other causes, right?

Yeah, there's lots of causes. So just to go through a few. Kibble diets are a huge one. high fat, like very high fat, like if you you know if you kept giving your dog let's just say the Grizzle off of a pork chop. Okay, that could cause pancreatitis, or if you kept giving them let's just say that you gave them all the fat off of your bacon. That could cause pancreatitis, Poor fat. can cause pancreatitis like treats that are made with like canola oil, or peanut oil. Not necessarily peanuts, but peanut oil is very processed oil, being overweight, over eating in general. And one of the things lack of exercise, lack of exercise, the average American dog gets 15 minutes of exercise per day. Which is Sad but true. That's the average. Yeah, proper nutrition, vitamin and mineral deficiencies. disease and that's pretty much across the board that you know, everything's connected in the body, the dogs and ecosystem. So when things start to get off balance, the pancreas and spleen are very temperamental. autoimmune disease can cause pancreatitis. Usually it's chronic pancreatitis, being hypothyroid can cause pancreatitis. Some pharmaceutical medicines, especially anti histamines can cause pancreatitis, stress, painkillers, NSAIDs, both all can have an effect on the pancreas.

So with all of those causes, it must be a pretty common ailment. Right?

Acute is quite common, actually chronic Not, not so much. But acute. Yes, definitely. Quite. I think it's pretty prevalent.

And I think I read that diabetic dogs tend to be prone. But it can also be the other way around where pancreatitis can also cause diabetes.

Yes. And diet, because there's already an imbalance in the pancreas. diabetic dogs usually suffer from chronic pancreatitis. So, especially when I would say, within one to two years of having diabetes, or leading up to being diagnosed with diabetes.

So we take the dog to the vet, because they're obviously in pain. They've been diagnosed with pancreatitis, given fluids, pain is controlled, and then we bring them home. So we all know about this Show that we like to explore natural, holistic treatments. So you're saying that herbs can definitely help. So what is the best way to care for our dogs holistically Once they're home?

You want to look at your dog as an ecosystem, you want to kind of just take a step back and say, How did this happen? Right? Want to look at what your dog is eating. Now. You want to look? Have they gotten like your dogs, it got into something. So you kind of know, like, Oh, that's probably what happened. But you want to do a little assessment. Some people automatically start feeding their dogs, there's kind of two camps, where you fast and rest your dog’s system for about 20 to 48 hours, kind of giving, you know, electrolytes and water, the vet might give some sub q fluids. And then there's another camp where it talks about an alternative theory that you shouldn’t rest the pancreas. And if your dog is vomiting, you should feed them small meals, and kind of forego fasting. So there's two camps in that one. I say, you know, do what's best for your dog, they'll definitely let you know right away what what's gonna happen, and then you start giving small amounts of like bone broth, or you can cook for your dog. If your dog eats raw, that's fine, too. And then you start looking at herbs and homeopathy or supplements that are going to help the healing process. Okay. homeopathically like right away, I tend to give a homeopathic remedy called Aconite or Arnica. 200 C for the inflammation and the pain, and then gently massaging your dog is also good. The entire abdomen. kind of getting the kind of getting it flowing. And then I start administering herbs. And also we make sure that they're on a good diet. Dr. Judy Morgan, I don't know. Yep. Okay. So Judy has a book that talks about cooking for your dog. She has a great, what does it begin? Yin & Yang Nutrition for Dogs: Maximizing Health with Whole Foods, Not Drugs. Yes, she has a pancreatic diet in there that I have used for quite a few dogs in my practice. That is good for that, you know, kind of like that coming home from the vet. And it's nice. It's a nice neutral diet. She has one of those in her book. That's a good source. You want to just make sure that they’re kind of eating neutral foods, you want to get them back on their feet. And then we go for herbs. So here I'll just go over some of the herbs that I like for for different types.

I want to just go to a quick commercial break and then we'll come back and you can tell us about these exciting herbs. I can't wait to learn more, so we will be right back. Sponsor Ad

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Great. So a couple things to keep in mind. There are remedies for chronic pancreatitis and there are remedies for acute pancreatitis. Okay. One remedy that I like for chronic pancreatitis and it is a this is definitely for the beginner like someone who just wants to try something out. It's a herbal formulation called GastroElm, and it's I believe it's GastroElm.com, and it's a mix of slippery elm and I believe there's marshmallow root in there and milk thistle and just maybe some licorice root. It's actually really good for dogs that are prone to pancreatitis. So that's a good one to try out right off the bat. Not so much for acute but for chronic pancreatitis. I do like that blend. And again, that's GastroElm. Okay. So single herbal remedies. Okay. When there is acute pancreatitis, I like blackberry leaf, and I use what is called a glycerite. So it's a glycerin based extract of blackberry leaf. And it's really good for inflammation. And it helps dogs get through an acute situation of pancreatitis. the glycerine extract, I would use 4 drops for extra small dogs, 6-8 drops for small dogs, that like a pug is a small dog. And extra small probably like a, you know, a mini Chihuahua. 10 - 12 drops for medium dogs. That's like Springer Spaniel. 15 - 20 drops for a large dog. That's like a golden retriever or something bigger, like a big lab, and 20 - 30 drops for anything bigger than than a lab, like a St. Bernard. Okay. And that really helps with any type of bacteria and inflammation in the gastrointestinal tract. A remedy for I would say, acute and chronic pancreatitis that I I love. And the only thing you don't want to use it for dogs that have had seizures, but it's called black currant gemmotherapy. And it's ribes nigrum is its Latin name and you can use it for an anti inflammatory. It is wonderful in chronic cases of pancreatitis along with acute, it helps with inflammation. It is a tonic for the entire digestive system, it increases the immune system. It's really high in antioxidants. And you can use the 1:200 which is what you're mostly find in commercial searches for this it's called black currant gemmotherapy, You will use 8 drops for extra small dogs, 10 - 15 drops for small dogs, 15 - 20 for medium, 20 - 25 for large and 25 - 30 for extra large dogs. and you give that two to three times a day, two times a day for chronic and three times a day for acute. and then you can adjust the doses to see what your dog's doing.

Another one that I really love and this is for acute pancreatitis. Okay, so what could be one for a dog like yours, Krista is called European Walnut and this is also a gemmotherapy. Gemmotherapies are based on plant stem cells. So they treat at a cellular level. They're using the embryonic buds and shoots and barks of plants. So this one is from the European walnut tree. And it's really good after and during an acute pancreatic attack. Okay, it helps strengthen the pancreas. It brings down inflammation. It also helps support the liver which we need to do and it helps heal mucous membranes and it also helps regulate insulin in the pancreas. So it helps balance out the blood sugar because sometimes that can be affected during these types of episodes. Another thing I like about it is it helps balance intestinal flora and regulate which is very important. during an acute attack it regulates pancreatic enzyme production. So, you would use a 1:200 gemmotherapy. 8drops for extra small dogs, 10 - 15 drops for small dogs, 15 - 20 for medium, 20 - 25 for large and 25 - 30 for extra large dogs, and that would be given twice daily.

Another nice, easy to use remedy is ginger. And these are for dogs that aren't like if you think your dog is a little warm, you don't want to use ginger. But if you don't think if they're not in the Oh yeah, my dog is so warm all the time category. Ginger is really good as you make it as a tea in hot water, let it sit for about 20 to 30 minutes and give just small amounts. Usually dogs will sniff it that are in need of it and actually just drink it. If it's nice and cool. They know that they need it. But the dosage for it would be like one half teaspoon for extra small dogs, One teaspoon for small dogs, Two teaspoons for medium, one tablespoon for large and two tablespoons for extra large and you'd give that as needed. And it really does help with that and sometimes pancreatitis can cause nausea.

Another thing for chronic pancreatitis is you always want to help the liver. You can give milk thistle for that. GastroElm uses the milk thistle for chronic pancreatitis. I also like there's a company called Adored Beast. Yes. And I really liked their their Liver Tonic. It's a nice glycerine based liver tonic. with chronic pancreatitis, you always want to make sure you're supporting the liver. So I like to use that as well.

Another remedy that is in the https://www.gastroelm.com/ , but can be used for acute and chronic. So you use it by itself for acute. It's slippery elm. And that really helps coat everything it soothes the gastrointestinal mucus, if there's any has been any damage. So it's going to bring down the pain, it's going to support the the GI system. It's safe for long term use in small amounts. And I just really think it's a good one and easy to use at home, you would just make a kind of like a grool by adding just adding a little hot water to the powdered herb and you add a little added at a time so you get a grool. And then you just give it to them by the teaspoon. So one teaspoon for extra small dogs, two teaspoons for small dogs, one tablespoon for medium, two tablespoons for large and three tablespoons for extra large. You kind of give it as needed, you'll you'll notice that it's it helps improve it right away. And it's just a really soothing remedy, especially if again if those enzymes are eating tissue. And let me think if there's anything else to consider, like right off the bat. So that's about it. I mean, those remedies are really good.

And when you say give them how are we giving them Is it a tincture? Do we put it in food? Do we put it directly on their gums or in their mouth?

Okay, so good question. So for the BlackBerry Leaf, that's a glycerite. you're going to just put it right in your mouth, okay. And the black currant is also a glycerin extract. It has a little a small amount of alcohol and glycerin. You just put it right in their mouth. It tastes actually quite good. Let's see what else other the European walnut is also a liquid right in the mouth. And if your dog won’t take it in their mouth, put it on a little treat or in in some type of food. The ginger is a liquid. So that's an infusion, it's like a tea. You're going to put it in the mouth or have them drink it. Milk Thistle. You can use a glycerin extract for that you can put it right in the mouth and as a powder if they're eating you can put it right on the food. slippery elm is going to make a grool. it's kind of like a thick, a thick liquid very thick liquid. You're going to have them drink it or give it to them by the teaspoon. Or you can put it in a little bit of a syringe with a kind of a thick tip.

And Rita as we were wrapping up where do we find these herbs? I know you mentioned the Liver Tonic from Adored Beast but the other remedies where do we find them and how do we know we're buying quality products?

Okay, so the gemmotherapies depending on where you live, in Europe, you can find them at https://www.santi-shop.eu/en/ In Canada you can go to https://www.canada.ca/en/health-canada.html , which is a homeopathy site and get them there. Or you can get them from a company called https://www.herbalgem.fr/en/ . And the ones that I'm talking about on this interview are called 1:200 and they would be on the label. one colon 200 you can get them in In the United States from a company called Gemmo, you can get them from https://www.boironusa.com/ . You can get them from a company called Genestra or you can go to my website at https://www.canineherbalist.com/ , and I can get any of these remedies for someone, they just have to send me an email. And some of them are in my shop. Okay, what do you say that makes it easier just going to you one stop shop? Yeah, some of them are in my shop. If they're not listed, just send me an email. And I have most of them. I use a lot of the Phyto embryonic therapies in my practice, those are some places most people that make most companies that make the gemmotherapies are quality products. Okay, there's not a lot of them out there. So there's, there's a few companies and and most of them are really good. Awesome. The slippery elm and the powdered products, I like to use a company called https://oregonswildharvest.com/ . They make really, they have good sourcing, all of their herbs are organic. And it's Oregon's wild harvest, or a company called HerbPharm also makes good products except for they don't have a lot of the powdered herbs. And then there's https://mountainroseherbs.com/ , which is out of Oregon, they they're wonderful.

And just so everybody knows all of these links of all of these companies will be in the show notes. And if I didn't mention it before this interview came out of an article that Rita did in Dogs Naturally Magazine. So I'm gonna include that link in the show notes. So you have her exact protocol, you know how much and when and all of the How to administer all these herbs. So we are about to wrap up any last words Rita on pancreatitis and the healing herbs?

I would say just go slow. Always start at the lower dosage and work your way up. And if your dog is in extreme discomfort, bring them to the vet for pain management and fluids, definitely.

Great. And in case anybody's interested, Rita is making all of our listeners an amazing offer,. you will get 15% off anything in her online store, 15% off of a consult with her or she has a new energetics course. And that is 15% off one discount per customer. You just have to use the code WOL at Rita's site https://www.canineherbalist.com/. . Rita is that also where they go to find out more information about you and your practice?

Yeah, absolutely.

Great. So again, https://www.canineherbalist.com/ Rita, thank you so much for being with us and giving us this amazing information. We so appreciate you.

Thank you so much.

Hello there this is Krista with Episode Number 118 on the Wag Out Loud pawdcast . Did you know that Chihuahuas share a common trait with human babies? Both are born with soft spots on their skulls that close up as they get older. Did you know that? Sponsor Ad

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Welcome to the Wag Out Loud pawdcast where we are obsessed with bringing you helpful tips on canine health care, nutrition, and overall well being. If you'd like to support the show, check out the amazing online events, products and resources that I personally recommend on the Wag Out Loud website. I'm your host, Krista and I'm super excited to be bringing you yet another tail wagging episode.

A big thank you to our friends at Bonne et Filou. Like many of us, they believe that our dogs should be treated like royalty and that's why they created French inspired dog macaroons. Bonne et Filou were the two favorite dogs of French King Louie XI4th that were treated with a private chef, satin sheets, diamond collars and more. And we want to pamper our pups too. These are not your ordinary dog treats, but handmade with human grade all natural ingredients and packaging that looks better than what you buy for yourself. These are definitely the best gift for the dog who has everything. And unlike human macaroons, these are actually healthy for dogs, handmade in small batches right here in the US. These look so decadent, that you'll want to try one. isn't it time to give your dog the royal treatment? use the code WOL to receive a 15% discount off of your first order at https://bonneetfilou.com/. That's https://bonneetfilou.com/. You can also find the link in the show notes.

Hello, dog lovers. we so appreciate you for advocating for your dog's health. And today, our friend Emily O'Neil is going to share how You Can Take the Leash and Help Your Dog's Health. Emily, why don't you introduce yourself and tell us about why you are, “crazy for canines”.

Emily is mom to Flynn, a 5-year-old Border Collie, as well as host for the podcast Dogs are the Best Friends where guests share stories about their best friends and Emily shares some hard earned wisdom on training and care. Emily and Flynn are about to travel in their tiny home on wheels to see her birth parents who she just found in the summer of 2019. She is sharing her story and travels on her YouTube channel: Emily O'Neil.

Thank you so much Krista. I appreciate being here. I have my own podcast and I had you on I want to make sure that people know to go and listen to your episode as well. And I'm so grateful to have a friendship with you. Because we get it we are crazy for the canines. And we love our dogs so much they've taught us so much. And they inspire us all the time. And so on my podcast people, you know, they share their stories, their love of their dogs, what they've learned from them from training or health or whatever it is. And I'm grateful to be here because I learned a huge lesson through my dogs of how to advocate how to be pro dog and take care of my dogs in a way that sits well with me. And we all have to do that we have to be in charge of that we understand that, you know, we can take charge in that basically. So that's why I'm here today to do that. And I'm grateful to share my experiences and and to just, you know, to be able to speak on that because it's so close to my heart. I'm a researcher by trade. I'm a dog mom. And it just this is this is what I believe in. I'm so excited to be here. Thank you.

I am so thrilled you're here. Right now you have Flynn, who is adorable. Why don't you tell us a little bit about him and what he means to you, you know the bond that you guys have?

Yeah, Flynn is five years old. Now. I got him when he was one and a half. He was not a puppy. And I still can't believe I did that. Because I always said, Oh, they have to be a puppy so you can bond with them. But I had lost my beloved dog she was I call her my soul dog. That was my Mazie. And she was another Border Collie. And she passed on at 13 1/5. And sadly, it was due to cancer. I'll tell you that story, you know, in a little bit, but I was heartbroken. And I was so lonely and devastated that I thought I'd never want another dog part of me and the other part just couldn't live without a dog. So three months later, ended up finding Fynn and I went to find a puppy. But the the man said no, you know, you might like this dog. He is a year and a half. He's a very nice dog. And I went thinking No way. I'm going to get a puppy but I saw Flynn and he was so happy to see me and we just bonded in that few hours that I sat there and and petted him and played with him and get to know him. So Flynn is just a joyful friend that I'm so grateful for. He's definitely become a heart dog and I don't know he must be on the way to a soul dog too. he's a wonderful inspiration. Yes.

That’s a. great story. Well, am I right that you've had three dogs so far?

As an adult. as a as a kid, we had a bunch. Yeah. And we weren't the best owners. I have to admit, up front straight up. Oh, gosh, definitely. And that the first dog Morgan, I learned a ton with her. I was not the best dog mom with her in the beginning, because I was so green I she was not well behaved. And I didn't feed her the best food. And yeah, she's the one that started off the learning process for sure. Yeah, what's great to say, I can start .Yeah, Morgie, Oh, my gosh, well, I got her as a puppy. She was adorable. She had just been spayed. I got her from the SPCA up in New York State, I lived in western New York at the time. And she was just so cute. I just was in love as soon as I found her, but I took her home and, you know, feeding her I'd like to say the brand, but you know, just really bad food. And the poor dog developed horrible skin problems. And she's this gorgeous dog, but she literally smelled and she had skin problems. And like she was itchy. And, you know, like the worst situation you can pick, you know, like the hot spots, everything the poor, the poor dog. And so I started to try to figure out what was wrong with her. And you know, you take them to the vet, and they say something, or they want to give them you know, different shots or different medicines and things. And I already was on the path of not believing in and just going ahead with what other people told me to do. So I started asking other people what they did, and doing research and looking into it the best I could. And the more questions I asked the more, you know, of course, more answers you get, but also it gives you you start to see patterns, like and people that you feel that you can trust, and you understand their point of view. And they also if they're somebody that really cares about the truth, they'll lead you to like, you know, different articles or books or whatever, that have great information. And I'm so grateful for the people that led me in the right direction for poor Morgan because she, you know, was just a tortured soul. I think to that point, because her mom just didn't know any better. But once I learned about raw food, and you know, like that, right there cleaned up 90% of her problems, getting her on the right food that was crucial. And then also just her mental health, I had to get her out more right walking and taking better care of her and training her giving her boundaries. So all that came together. And again, I'm grateful to the people that helped me, because that started me on the right path of looking for more natural ways to heal and heal myself. Right. We learn through our dogs sometimes. Sure. And then we realized we can apply it to ourselves, which, you know, sometimes it's backwards, but that’s us humans. were we sometimes care more about our dogs than ourselves. So yeah.

Ok. So, there's a happy ending with Morgan. How long did that whole process and journey take to get her back on the road to wellness?

You know, this is like over 20 years ago. So trying to think I think it was, you know, it took months to detox. There's all that junk that was in that food, like corn, corn is like the worst thing for dogs, right? So there's things like that, I'd say, probably a year before she didn't need a bath every week, we could go like, you know, and Morgie never got to go beyond like a couple months. My other dogs can go beyond a couple months without a bath. But Morgan, I think because of that start, you know, and then I also let her get all the vaccinations that they always told me she should have. And I believe that is another reason that poor Morgan needed a bath like every four to six weeks. But yeah, I say within a year, she had detoxed a lot in her skin, and her body and her stomach, everything was just so much better. And speaking of vaccinations, just really quick, I have to make sure I share this, I would let her get the distemper shot because of course it's recommended every year. And the last time she got it. She was almost five years old. And she came home and she was a completely different dog. And I know that sounds dramatic and ridiculous to some people but she literally was not my Morgie. She was not as sweet, or as patient or anything. She just became a different dog. She was not. She didn't want to be touched, you know, like snuggled anything. And so that was a huge red flag to me that I needed to research like, are these things really needed or not? And so after that, with Morgan and every dog since I do not over vaccinate, I refuse to give my dogs everything that they recommend other than what I have to do by state law, which in Florida and New York state where I used to live you know, that's rabies. But yeah, I'd recommend people really do some research on that too. Just so your dog doesn't become a different dog. It broke my heart but I learned again on poor Morgan right. my first dog so yeah,

Well, she was there for a reason. She was your teacher.

Yeah. Very true. Yeah. I hope she forgives me. Thank God. Yes. Is True, very true.

Okay, so that was Morgan. And then your second dog.

Yeah, Mazie. So Mazie, I guess, I would say that Morgan was so smart, I had to get a border collie, because Morgie was a mixed dog, she was supposed to be a German Shepherd. And actually think she was a German Shepherd or a Malinois and a coyote. I know sounds ridiculous, but it's true. So I got a border collie. And Mazie was, again, my soul dog. I just loved that. We just clicked and she wanted so much to please me and do what I want. And that's one of the great things about their brains, but they’re high energy, and I also called her Crazy Mazie, because she was. So Mazie Lou, she, Oh, my gosh, when she was nine months old, I was already in love with her. She developed this tumor on her throat, that just kept growing, I felt it grow all the way up to the size of like the top half of my thumb, it got to be pretty big. And I took her into the vet. And the vet said, You know, I could cut it out. It might grow back, I don't know what to tell you. And she did withdraw a syringe full of fluid out of it. And it took a couple of days. And then she got back to me, called me and said, You know that fluid is pre cancerous. And that was devastating because I thought I could lose my dog in months. Or maybe maybe she'll even be around a couple years. But you know, you're already crazy about your nine month puppy, and you don't want them to go anywhere. So what happened was my friend had been bothering me, I call it to try what she I called it her crazy energy medicine, which I know sounds not very nice. But that's what it was to me. I did not understand the concept of it at all. And so I told her, I said, Well, my dog has been diagnosed with pre cancerous fluid in this tumor that will stop growing. And the vet doesn't know what to do. So if you and your crazy energy medicine can fix my dog, I will believe in it. And so what happened was that my friend tested her and discovered that she had all these different toxins in her body from the vaccinations, like the cocktail shots, that they like to give puppies, and yes, very scary. And so we detoxed her and I kid you not, with that one first remedy, but went all the way down to the size of a pea within like a week, maybe two weeks or something, it's been a little while sorry, it was like within two weeks. And then it went down to nothing, and it never came back. And so that was my that was that convinced me that there's obviously other ways to heal the body, whether it's dogs or humans, or whatever it is. And so Morgie started me on the path of eating right and looking at those things. But then Mazie started me on the path of looking at completely different types of modalities that I might never have considered before. Because they just seemed just not logical to me. But once I started studying, and looking at the different ways that people are able to heal, and your shows, your episodes really help highlight that. There's so many different things that people are using to help their dogs, whether it's CBD oil, or you know, whatever you have, of course, food always and like you said you had mushrooms on recently. So there's, there's so many ways that people can help. And I know that can seem overwhelming. But I would just say start looking start asking questions. And you might be surprised at what can actually help your dog heal. A lot of people don't believe in homeopathy. I do. I've seen it work I've seen it help heal. Well, me and my dogs to be honest with you. So I think that if we let ourselves learn, like you said, Morgan was my first teacher, Mazie was my second teacher, I'm learning things with Flynn as I go. And if we let our dogs teach us, you know, it's just, it's amazing. It can literally be the difference between death and life. Now, I did lose Mazie years later to cancer, but that was 13 and a half? Well, let's say she's nine months or so, over 12 years later. So I got 12 years with that dog. I mean, and what amazing 12 years we had. we traveled all over and just had a wonderful life together. So was it worth it? Yeah, it's totally worth it. And I'm grateful. So again, my second teacher. Yes, it is.

So when you say homeopathy with Mazie, what was that? Yeah. Besides the energy work, herbs, or did she have acupuncture or anything else as far as treatments?

Yeah, yeah, good question. That's a really good question, because I don't believe in just one modality. So in her case, we did this thing that, you know, basically, it's really hard to explain, but I'm going to try to do it. And I actually became a practitioner, I studied and I became a practitioner because I became to believe in it so much, and I would work on dogs and people up in New York state when I used to do it. But what happens is you can actually test the body, through kinesiology to see where the weaknesses in the body, you know, so let's say in the heart, and then you can test to see which toxins are actually making the body sick, it might be just one, it might be a few different things going on. And you can actually carefully detox it out of the body so that it can heal. And then you can go on and keep helping the body heal and see what comes up the next time. So that is actually what we were using with that first initial remedy, that helped get rid of that tumor. And then I kept going, and we kept detoxing, and they explain it and I think someone was on your show before they explained this too, but it's like, an onion, and you have to pull off the layers, you know, to get get down into really, how we're supposed to be much healthier, and we are healthier when we're born. But all the toxins in our environment, our food and everything really add up. And so it adds on these layers that your body's trying to fight through. And we can help our bodies. And that's one of them, that's one way to do it. And there's different practitioners that do that all over the world. And so that that's something that I still help, you know, work on myself and my dogs with that. And then also homeopathy dovetails nicely, because that is, that is like, something that's natural that the body knows how to deal with. But if the, you know, how do I say…the symptoms, if they're looking like that, then and even if it's not related, let's say it's like a bee sting, like you're having the symptoms of a bee sting. And if you give your dog, you know that remedy, the homeopathic remedy can actually help the body know what to do, and heal that as well. And then there's Yeah, there's acupoints like hands on pushing at different points to their bodies that can help them heal. So there's so many different ways that we can learn. And I know people might seem over overwhelmed at first. So just start with one start to learn about one and figure out what you're comfortable with. I've used everything from tuning forks, which I, when I first heard that, at that, that was crazy. But let's face it, when we hear music that we enjoy, that lifts our spirits, it is healing. And so the same thing with the tuning forks. Yeah, it's like this, again, it's kind of energy, but it's, it's the tuning forks, I have are musical notes. And there's just, it's beautiful. And I was able to help a neighbor the other day, who is in extreme pain, and we were able to reduce her pain. And she had more movements, like within 20 minutes in her neck, which was totally frozen before that. So these things are powerful. They get, like, I hate to say it, but you know, often what Western medicine doesn't take them into account. And if you can find a doctor that's open minded, and does, you know is willing to entertain that that's wonderful. But it can be tough. And sometimes you have to take their advice and maybe even use their medical tests or something if you want and then look at other possibilities. like find other ways that you can help your dog heal. And and yourself. To be honest, I think this goes along with all living beings. There's different ways I was even able to help a llama I used to have with a remedy. So yeah, it can be for anybody. It's a big deal.

So now you have Flynn. And he's five years. Yeah. So is he 100% healthy? Or did he bring you something that says, Hey, Mom, check this out? What should we do?

Right? Yes, he's the most difficult dog I've ever had with his stomach. He likes different foods, he'll grab different things. See, but it doesn't mean his stomach will like it. So we've had to, you know, go, he can't do raw, which just breaks my heart. I totally believe in Raw. So I do the raw of freeze dried patties. And that has helped him tremendously. He is, oh gosh, I'd say he's like 90% better in that area. And it took me it took that actually took about two years for his gut to heal. And that was adding in like some greens and, you know, just different things that I had to figure out. And through Kinesiology and I can, you know, people can actually look it up, you can teach yourself how to test different foods and things to make sure that it's okay for you or for your dog. And it might be okay, one day and not the next. It just depends on our bodies. Right. And the sleep we've had and the sleep they've had or whatever, or even the water what kind of water have they had to drink today or something too. So I yeah, it's interesting. I thought Flynn. Oh, he'll be perfect. I know what to do about everything. Now. No, no. Yes, yeah. And we're all individuals aren't we like Flynn. You know, he’s had I would say probably some trauma. He was flown over from Ireland when he was six months old. And I don't know it was I hope he was in the cargo or something. I don't know. But you know, that was quite a shock for his little body to go through. And then a man that had him before he sold him to me, you know, he had him almost a year, and then he had to change homes again. And I knew that how does that not affect them? So I think he was just a nervous bellied pup, you know, like, he had different nervous things. And he had to know I was never going to give him up. And, you know, now he has me wrapped around his paw, of course, because he's just a wonderful dog. But I think all these things add up, and just like our own trauma can add up and actually damage our body. Same thing with dogs. So Flynn had a nervous stomach, it's come along way. That's not to say that we can have a setback. we will go a couple months and all sudden, you know, he can have some serious problems. And that that means like, you know, diarrhea or whatever. So we have to then figure out what happened and back up and, you know, if I want to change his food, I have to do it. So carefully, like half a teaspoon, starting to incorporate it and change it. So, yeah, just a heads up to folks that, you know, just because you think you learned it all. No, that's not how the universe seems to work.

So what do you recommend for people? You know, because most of us learn by Oh, my dog was just diagnosed with XYZ, I guess I better figure it out. Now. What is this? Right? versus? Okay, I have a brand new dog, a new rescue, I have a new puppy. How do I set them up for success? So yeah, you can't learn everything right off the bat, because you have no idea what their body is going to do throughout their lives. So are you saying food for sure. Not over vaccinating, plenty of exercise, both physical and mental. And then learn about these other integrative or holistic techniques that do work. And that when you need them, you know, be open to it. Is that a good summary?

Yeah, that's excellent. Absolutely. I mean, food is not cheap. But I would rather spend the money on the food than on, you know, the vet bills. Yeah, totally. Because they're so expensive and heartbreaking. And it's scary. You don't know what's wrong with your dog. So yeah, yeah. All that you said, you know, they need training for their mental stimulation, the physical, the food, everything that you can do. And then there's still going to be things like little Flynn here, you know, there's different things that, you know, set their body off in different ways. You know, and when we're stressed, it just passes on to our dogs. I really believe that. And so, yeah, and I was just sharing with you before we started that, right now, I'm going through a little bit of a health crisis of my own, and that stuff keeps you humble, of course, too. But it also goes to your dog. And so I think sometimes when I'm exhausted and stressed, you know, it's just really, you know, Flynn feels it. So, I yeah, I would recommend that people start with those basics that are so key to all of us, and into our dogs, they really need that. And that's a great foundation, and then look at the different issues that are coming up. And I honestly believe in taking notes. Take notes, like on certain days, if your dog you know, if it's having some problems, you know, and try to see what's going on around you did they just spray the lawn or your neighbor's lawn? You know, look at all the things that are going on. Look at the season, maybe you know, Flynn has horrible pollen allergies, oh my gosh, he's, I cannot believe how bad he was itching a few weeks ago. But in Florida, we just had the pollen just dumped, seemed to dump off in the trees, basically, the oak trees and things and pine was back in February. And it just he'll have ups and downs just from that alone. And he becomes very itchy. And it's not from his food, he doesn't ask him promise because that is because of the environment. So my boy is incredibly sensitive to any kind of thing like that. And so then what I've been doing with him is like the acupoints. And of course the best food I can give him and and he does have to be rinsed off, I don't believe in giving them you know, bath after bath with the soap and things. But I do rinse him off. He needs that pollen and that spray off of him. And that's the thing in Florida, there's major spraying people are, you know, we're really in a humid environment. So yeah, bugs are a problem. But they are trying to solve it, you know, for all these years with spraying. Oh, gosh, yeah, it's horrible. So I think the biggest thing is, yeah, be an advocate for your dog. Number one, go ahead if you want to have the test done and things but it doesn't mean you have to solve it the way that your vet is telling you to solve it. And I'm not saying that they have no value. Of course, ideally, you can find a vet that you do trust, and that you can have open dialogue about you know what you want to do and see if they know anything or are willing to work with you. But also I think we have to go with our gut. There's nothing wrong with saying to yourself, I'm not comfortable with this solution. I'm not comfortable with that idea. So let me go and research it, and take some time to figure this out. So I think, too often we, you know, and we do, we were like, We're exhausted, right? We want to be able to just take what somebody says, go do it. But if you can, step back a moment, go with your gut, and take your time and start asking your friends or ask people that you trust, you know, they, and they might be, you know, the I, that's one of the first people that taught me, I found a wonderful dog food, you know, pet food store owner. And so she actually, not only, you know, sold things, but you know, which, because then sometimes we think, oh, they're just about the sales. No, this woman truly wanted to educate people. And she was tremendous. I can't say enough about her. So if you can find someone like that wonderful. But I think if you can start reading different journals, like I love the Whole Dog Journal, that is a phenomenal journal. So good. And so start there and start reading it, see which writers you trust. And then you know, they might have books or other articles, and start there. And just know that you can empower yourself. There's, I was just looking, for example, at Colorado, like I know, Florida's resources, right, but I wanted to see what does Colorado have. And so Colorado, has completely free databases that you can research and look for articles. And so that's where you can go start looking and looking for, you know, look for articles there. And completely free the state pays for it, use those resources, and empower yourself to, to know that you have your gut, you have your feeling about something for a reason. You might like I had a dog come to me when I was in New York State practicing, and they had recommended this certain type of food. And it turns out their food had cranberries in it, and the dog was allergic to cranberries. So yeah, go with your gut. And if you feel like you know, if you know the food caused it, you know, and if you can find somebody that can help you figure out what's wrong with it. Great. But otherwise, take the food bag, get your money back and try something else. Yeah, I think it's so crucial that and I just as a researcher, myself, I just want people to know that the information is out there. And don't necessarily go to Google. I know everybody wants to because it's easy. But please use some of these really good resources, like the Whole Dog Journal or other things that you've talked about a ton of resources on your episodes. So they definitely need to listen to those. And if they haven't heard them, go back and listen again. Because, yeah, it's crucial. And it's worth it. It's worth it. And don't, don't get overwhelmed. Everybody can do it. If I can do it, anybody can do it.

Well, that's a good point, Emily, because you are such a huge believer and community. And there are others out there who are going through what you're going through. So you don't need to feel alone there. You know, there's groups, there's forums, there's so many resources to your point. Well, as we are wrapping up, again, Emily hosts, the Dogs are the Best Friend's podcast, which is awesome, great guests. great stories. So Emily, what is the main takeaway that you've learned from all of your interviews on the show?

Oh wow! that dogs are such wonderful friends to us. They teach us they challenge us, they help us grow. And their love is just like, unlike any other really, there's just nothing like it. I've had people that have shared horrible times that they've gone through. Or, for example, there's one young woman that came on, and she was her dog was supposed to be trained to alert her. And sadly, it wasn't very well trained. So she had to give, give it some more training. And then they came to realize that the dog was not only alerting for her diabetes, but it also is alerting for another condition that she has. So I think if we just remember that, to listen to our dogs, and to appreciate them, and to see what they're trying to teach us like like you said before, Morgan was my teacher. Mazie was my teacher, and Flynn’s teaching me as well. And I'm just grateful for all the stories that people share because they just bring life and light and sometimes encouragement when people need it. Like if their dog wasn't behaving well. And I just hope that people will come and have a listen and enjoy. Like you said, it's a community we love our dogs and are crazy for our canines and and it just helps to kind of bring a little bit of light into those dark times that we have sometimes too.

I so agree with you. Well, Emily, where can everybody find out more information about you and your podcast? Dogs are the Best Friends and I know you've already started a YouTube channel as well.

Yeah, yeah, it's https://dogsarethebestfriends.com/ is the website and you can find me also on Instagram. @dogsarethebestfriendscom for the account for that, too. And then we are actually on Facebook, we have a small community on there as well just to share fun stories and funny memes and things like that. And also just encourage each other there too. And that Yeah, and then the YouTube I know it's so funny. I don't have enough going on. right but the the YouTube channel is just to share some fun stories about Fynn and I we are on a very interesting adventure. I found my birth parents just in the summer of 2019. And that was huge. That was life changing. So I will get to go see my you know, my birth family as I call them this summer, and I will share those journeys with people in the lessons and also the good and bad of like converting a cargo trailer. Because I've learned from that as well. And I'd love to have people join me on the journey. It'll make it more interesting. Right. So thank you so much for having me. Amazing.

We so appreciate all of your insight. And thank you to Flynn, Mazie and Morgan for doing their part and teaching you and therefore teaching us so safe journey. I can't wait to hear about your adventure. And thank you for being with us and being an amazing dog mom.

Thank you so much, Krista. You're the best. Truly, thank you so much.

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Hey Winston was that another tail wagging episode?

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Hi everyone, this is Krista with episode number 117. On the Wag Out Loud pawdcast. Have you checked out all of the amazing partner products that I highly recommend? These are products that I've tried with my dog Winston that are both safe and effective. Want to help your dog to thrive? Just go to wagoutloud.com and check out the Partner Products section, and I've negotiated discounts for most of them.

Did you know that there are more than 2500 different species of fleas that exist throughout the world? That's true, but only one is the most common among American dogs and cats. And it's called the cat flea. Fleas not only caused a sharp pain when they bite but their salivary glands give off a substance that's irritating as well.

Welcome to the Wag Out Loud pawdcast where we are obsessed with bringing you helpful tips on canine health care, nutrition and overall well being. If you'd like to support the show, check out the amazing online events, products and resources that I personally recommend on the Wag Out Loud website. I'm your host, Krista and I'm super excited to be bringing you yet another tail wagging episode.

Hello there dog lovers. I am so excited about today's episode, and the conversation with Angela Ardolino. And she's going to be talking about screw canine cancer and the conventional therapies that come with it.

Angela Ardolino is a holistic pet expert who has been caring for animals for over 20 years and operates a rescue farm, Fire Flake Farm, in Florida. She is also the owner of  Beautify the Beast,  a natural pet salon and shop, with two locations in Florida. After getting her certificate in Medical Cannabis Biology and Therapeutic use from the University of Vermont School of Medicine, she founded CBD Dog Health to provide high quality, all-natural medical cannabis products designed specifically for pets.

Angela, why don't you introduce yourself and your passion for natural dog health?

You bet I am a medical cannabis expert and I concentrate on animals and pets. And I became a cannabis expert when I myself was diagnosed with rheumatoid arthritis. I was prescribed a pharmaceutical drug that was linked to lymphoma which I was not interested in getting cancer. So I was a pretty natural lifestyle. So I went out and searched for something that would take care of my arthritic pain. And I found cannabis and I tried it. And not only did it relieve all my pain, but it helps my stress and anxiety. So I could not figure out why everybody didn't know about this. So I threw myself into the industry. I was chosen to be in the inaugural class at the University of Vermont School of Medicine for the study of medical cannabis as a therapeutic use in biology. So that's when I learned that animals have the same systems as we do. And dogs in particular are even more sensitive to cannabis medicine. So I knew that was my calling. And that was back in 2016. And back then, I couldn't find anything that was appropriate for pets to take. So I started partnering with some wonderful chemists and essential oil experts sites, I had a pretty good knowledge of essential oils, and came up with some formulations for what was ailing our pets the most. So that's where CBD Dog Health was born. And yeah, this is what I do now. I also have a rescue farm where I rescue mostly sick and geriatric dogs and farm animals and treat them all with natural diets and cannabis and mushrooms and all kinds of adaptogens with amazing success. So yeah, the cancer is is a big one, and I've treated cancer a couple times now of mcps, lymphoma, anything just about all of them and the only one that I hadn't come across yet was osteosarcoma, which is the scariest of them all and my Doberman was diagnosed a year ago with a tumor just popped up on her wrist on her left wrist. And I had a bad feeling that that's what it was. So we took her in to get her blood work and x rays and sure enough, it's osteosarcoma. And I have been treating it holistically and ever since and she's already beaten all kinds of records and I kind of went through what every pet parent goes through when you get that diagnosis and you jump on online and you type in you know, osteosarcoma and you look at what your choices are and then of course I went and joined every Facebook group out there and I kind of you know, feel like I need to to scream from the rafters this message because I see everyone going with the conventional method still. And my gut feeling was why are we doing that? When all the research shows that there are so many other things out there, and that going, the conventional method doesn't get you any more time and costs you a whole bunch of money.

You've lived it, Angela. And that's why I'm so excited that you're sharing this because from what I've read is that dogs are affected by more forms of cancer compared to any other companion animal. And according to the Veterinary Cancer Society, cancer is the leading cause of death in 47% of dogs, especially dogs over the age of 10.

I just interviewed Dr. Marlene Siegel, who has been in practice for over 40 years. And she said, she used to see one to four cases of cancer every couple months in her practice. And now she says, sees eight to 10 a day. And, you know, the reasons for this is because, you know, after World War II, we had over 85,000 new chemicals introduced into our world, into our food into our personal care products. This is what the FDA is supposed to be regulating and helping us, you know, keep these things out. Imagine what it is now. And then remember that the pet industry is largely completely unregulated, from the food from what gets put on them. So we have to be our pets advocate, we literally cannot buy anything off of a shelf without doing our research and homework because nothing can be trusted anymore. Like, we can't even you know, we find our favorite pet food which takes forever and then the company changes and everything changes. So it is a constant, you know, work and make sure that we're we're keeping our pets safe. And we have to remember they're, being bombarded from the pesticides on you know, our plants and lawns and the chemicals and our carpet cleaners and laundry detergents and the plugins, they can't even get fresh air. And then we're putting toxins on top of them with the flea and tick and the heartworm and it comes from everywhere. vaccinations! they get it from everywhere, so I am screaming from the rooftops because, you know, I started this journey because I lost my first dog at seven years old with no diagnosis. The autopsy said irritable bowel is the only thing that they could find. Well, I now know I over vaccinated her. I fed her kibble I put the flea and tick on it. Everything my conventional vet told me to do and I killed my dog. I don't do that anymore. I'm the opposite and have figured out how to treat everything naturally. So osteosarcoma is genetic. And she's got it and I immediately had to trust what I do know and I know that cannabis kills cancer and the best part and when I say cannabis for those who are listening or are unsure I'm talking about a hemp plant the marijuana plant are both under cannabis plant and I am using both of them to treat my dog both CBD which is you know prominently found in hemp and which is you know, high in CBD and then marijuana which is high in THC, both THC and CBD kill cancer. And both have already been proven to in animal studies. And I'm happy to share the link that shows where the studies are so that your listeners can read themselves. Yeah, I was taught this. I learned it and now I get to put it in practice. And the best part is that research is continuing to come out. Especially all over the world. Italy just had a recent research study come out on how CBD actually helps bones heal and regrow. So, you know, I'm piling on that CBD for her because it's going to help her heal her own. You know, disease.

Angela, for those that don't know what osteosarcoma is, I understand it to be very aggressive and it's a painful bone cancer. That affects 25% of large breed dogs. So can you walk us through Nina and how she got her when she got it her diagnosis and what you've done and how she's doing today?

You bet. Um, we noticed she was limping first and Nina is very high metabolism energy. She runs through the woods at 100 miles an hour and comes back with giant gashes and you don't even She's not even We used to think she had that disease where she didn't feel any pain. We’d be like, Oh my god, what have you done? So she started limping. And we were like, oh, what you're looking at anything and, and then literally, it felt like, out of nowhere, the bump just appeared on her on her wrist. And, and I've seen the bump before. So I was like, Oh, God, I think I know what that is. And then of course, we asked Dr. Zack about it. And he was like, put some salve on it, I don't know, let's see what happens. So I think we waited like two weeks. And then we went ahead and took her in to get the blood work and x rays done, and that's when she was diagnosed. So I immediately started doing all my research, but I knew that regardless, that I was going to use incorporate cannabis, diet, mushrooms, everything that I know that works, and help support the immune system, because we have this wonderful thing called the immune system, which will help fight off the cancer and get rid of these bad cancer cells. So I called up Billy Hoekman, who was with Answers about a ketogenic diet and came up with her diet and did my research on my mushrooms. So she eats a ketogenic diet which a ketogenic diet is basically we aren't giving the cancer anything to feed off of. So, you know, starches and carbohydrates and grains turn into sugar, which feed cancer, right, and we don't want to give them anything, we want to starve the cancer cells. And then on top of that, and everything we're feeding is to support her immune system and her good cells to fight off the cancer cells. And then, you know, both the compounds in THC, CBD, Turkey tail mushrooms, these, these things are called adaptogens. And when you put more than one adaptogen, together, they become very synergistic. So when you get like three or four adaptogens, like a mushroom and a frankincense and a cannabis, THC and CBD together, you really get something that is amazing for your body. And when you take it, it goes to where your body needs, it adapts to what your body needs, and they go and search out like cannabis literally, CBD turns your cells into natural killer cells that then sends them out into your body and finds, anything that's bad and kills it and does not hurt the good cells like chemotherapy does. So, when I'm researching this, and I'm comparing, you know, okay, if I do the which, I feel like most people do this route. And of course, I'm going by what I've read on, you know, the Facebook groups and the platforms where people are sharing information, they do the chemotherapy, they do the radiation, they do the amputation. So amputating the leg does not get rid of osteosarcoma, like if they've got it on the leg. It's not that easy. It’s not like cut the tumor off and the cancer’s gone. Most of the times the leg is amputated because of pain management, because the tumor’s painful, but a lot of dogs, some dogs that don't do well with amputation, and I really felt that Nina was one of those dogs. Nina also still like she runs without using her leg. But she still stands, balances, walks some times, and she's still using her leg. So it's not like she stopped using it. And, you know, it's too painful that she doesn't she's living her full life. But you know, these people are going through all of it. And they're still losing their dogs, two, fiur, six months. Once in a while will make it to a year. Sometimes I've seen young dogs who got amputated, you know, did an amputation and radiation who are still alive after two years, but that is very, very slim. And but most of the time they still lose their dog after two, four, six months. And it just didn't make any sense to me. Why would I put my senior dog through that? Through the surgery through the Recovery through the back and forth through the trauma of losing her leg, the chemotherapy, the sick, the getting her to eat… all of that. She’s my alphadog it just didn't make any sense to me. And I went with my gut and what I know, and you know, I know how cannabis works. I know how adaptogen works. I know how the immune system works, and I trusted that and we're at her year anniversary and she's still thriving and we have no no spread. Which is what osteosarcoma does is that it metastasizes and spreads. And you know, usually when it gets to the lungs, that's when you know it goes downhill fast. And we've had no issues at all. I haven't even had a scare the, the worst thing that happened is she knocked hit her hit her tumor on the coffee table, and I heard her wince, you know, in pain, which now I knew what noise she would make if she was in pain. But other than that, she runs around, she acts pretty normal. You know, she sleeps hard at night. I even you know, one of the side effects of THC is incontinence. They’ll pee in their sleep. So that was happening. But I also know that CBD dampens the effects of THC. So I gave her especially the side effects. I gave her now to give her the heal tincture at night with the THC. And she no longer pees in her sleep. So that's pretty cool. So I really have like no side effects at all, except sometimes in the morning she’s either a little drowsy still, or super, super hyped and excited. Really good.

Well, Angela, I'm going to stop you there so we can take a quick sponsor break and we're going to come back and talk about the actual protocol that you are doing. So everybody's gonna learn a lot, so stay tuned.

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And we are back we are chatting with Angela Ardolino on Screw Canine Cancer! and the conventional therapies that come with it. Angela, you just told us an amazing story of Nina and her osteosarcoma and how you are beating the odds with her, you know what, what can be expected through conventional veterinary medicine, which you pointed out. And I have to agree it seems in humans and dogs, a lot of times with cancer patients that it's those invasive treatments of chemo and radiation that really end up killing us that we are actually destroying the organs.

And they don't die. Yeah, and they don't die of the cancer, they die of something else because their immune system has been destroyed. So they go oh my god, the chemotherapy killed the cancer. it did, but it also kills your good cells in your immune system, and you end up dying from something else. So it doesn't get logged is that cancer kills you. You died of COVID or you died of whatever it is that you couldn't fight off because chemotherapy has killed your immune system. And what's funny is that even if you're going to do chemotherapy, do cannabis with it because cannabis is going to support your immune system and you throughout you know the whole process. There's already you know, chemotherapy drugs that goes with chemotherapy that the pharmaceutical companies have already made with an isolate of THC.

Well this is really promising. I know the most common cancers in dogs you know we have mast cell tumors, melanoma, lymphoma, osteosarcoma that Nina is going through and are you saying that both THC and CBD can help with all of those different forms of cancer?

Yes, so remember that a full spectrum hemp extract, which is primarily CBD does have THC in it. That's why it's a full spectrum and has all the cannabinoids and terpenes in it that you need to fight cancer. The thing is, is that with so mast cell lymphoma, all the ones that you just named off, I've already gotten rid of with a full spectrum hemp extract and changing their diet, keeping toxins out of them. I mean, I have Daisy right now who's 16 years old, who, you know, we've got pictures of her mast cell tumor dying, and exploding and oozing and completely going away. So it’s out from her mass cell and she's still clear running around, you know, at 16 years old, enjoying her life. The thing with osteosarcoma was that it's the most aggressive and the most painful so that that scared me, but I knew that THC is your is the best painkiller that you could possibly do your natural painkiller. So I knew I had it. I just had to figure out how do I give it to her? When do I give it to her? How do I keep it in her system? And that's what I figured out. So how because THC is going to get your dog high, your dog is going to get drowsy. So, you know giving it to her only at night was important. So basically, if you want, I'll tell you what I did is my protocol. Well, my other favorite essential oil for its cancer killing properties is Frankincense. So I have a tincture that's called Ease. That was that I actually created for my Schnauzer when he started getting arthritis. And he was he was diagnosed with degenerative myelopathy which I don't even know if that's what that's a true diagnosis or what he doesn't suffer from what he's suffering from before. So what I did is on my horse tinctures, I took my dog tinctures and I made them a lot stronger. So Nina takes our horse, Ease tincture, which is a blend of Frankincense essential oil, 6000 milligrams of full spectrum hemp extract, which is very potent, and tumeric with MCT oil and hemp seed oil. So she gets that in the daytime, a full dose so that I can make sure she is not feeling any pain and she feels good, but she's not high or drowsy. She's still herself. And then at night, because I'm in the state of Florida I get it's called several things it could be called FICO, which stands for full extract cannabis oil, or can be called RSO, which stands for Rick Simpson oil. Rick Simpson was a California hemp farmer, cannabis farmer in California who got skin cancer from being out in the sun all the time, who literally crushed up the flower oil, rubbed it on his skin and cured himself of melanoma. So he is famous for this. So that's basically what she gets. And it's a really thick, sticky crude that you just squeeze out a tiny like a rice sized amount on your finger and rub it on her gums. And that does make her super high, but I give it to her at night. And I give it to her with our dog Heal oil, which is 42 milligrams of full spectrum hemp extract, to kind of dampen those side effects of her feeling super high, her peeing in her sleep, those types of things. And I give it to her every single night. And we also do a goat's milk or cow kefir for at night with a couple sardines so that she's not doing too much digestion at night. She is just working on healing herself. And the ketogenic diet we follow is she gets straight pork or turkey and the whole whole organs, bones, everything. And we add vegetables that have compounds that also have cancer fighting properties in it like broccoli and brussel sprouts and asparagus. She loves broccoli, so it's really easy to get her to eat. A lot of you know steamed broccoli, she loves it like it's you know like you're handing her a pork heart or something.

And then my other favorite cancer fighting adaptogen are mushrooms medicinal mushrooms. So she does mostly turkey tail since it has the most research and the most compounds and it also interacts with the endocannabinoid system which is what cannabis interacts with. So cannabis and mushrooms are very synergistic and are doing amazing things. So she gets turkey tail mushrooms every single day. Sometimes we add some Reishi in there, which is also really great for the immune system. Reishi is very bitter so I have to really sneak it in somehow I'll either bury it in the mix it in with the goat's milk or cow’s kefir to get her to not taste it. But that's essentially what I do we add some other things like phytoplankton, which is you know, filled with omega threes and sixes and fatty acids, same within NCT, hemp seed oil. And both of those are building blocks for creating her own Endocannabinoid. So we're supporting her from every possible way you possibly can along Same thing with the water she's drinking. You know that we have the essential minerals in it. And, you know, we'll add the silver hydrosol to it, which is also, you know, got cancer fighting compounds in it. So basically anything in nature that fights cancer, she's getting it.

No pain, no pain, no side effects? No, nothing. You know, wondering if she's feeling okay, no weird diarrhea attacks, I'm just thinking about all the things that I went through with Lucy with all the things that they were trying to make her feel better and and now I know, now I know better even knowing better, and being outfitted to go find that or an oncologist or whatever? is, you know, powerful, because then you can be like, yes, no, no, yes. I mean, even when I went to get her blood work, and x rays done, I had to say, you should have heard what they were saying to me. And I was like, I already have a vet. I'm just here getting x rays and blood work because he's in Miami. It's tough. But you have to remember, you know, we did a little tour with because we were working on a documentary and then COVID put it on hold. So we did a tour of California and the West basically where I interviewed Dr. Trina Hazzah who is the chief oncologist at the VCA in Los Angeles which is one of the biggest hospitals and the busiest and she turns to cannabis first when she gets a cancer patient because it is the strongest tool without hurting your immune system and out damaging no bad side effects the quality of life doesn't go away and nothing bad happens. So that's what she turns to first and she that's what she'll go for and use only if she can get it to you know completely save the animal. Which if you catch it in time you can.

And Angela should CBD be given internally and topically?

So yeah, I anything that has a tumor, I do both MCT tumor, I basically had was able to do experiments where I was like, Okay, let's see if we treat it with just the salve topically because dogs have three layers of skin and they have both CB one and CB two receptors in each layer. So putting a salve, a topical is really good for them for everything from a hotspot to a bug bite to an irritation to yeast, anything. It's also naturally antifungal, antibacterial, gets rid of pain, so it's one of the best things you can do for anything that's bothering your dog's skin. So putting just a topical on a tumor, especially that’s cancerous, will work ,it takes longer. If you can do a topical and do it internally, meaning you get a tincture and put it on to the gums. So that it gets right into the bloodstream. It half the time takes half the time to get rid of that tumor. So with Daisy's MCT. We did that. And I would say within 60 days, it was exploding dying. And it's been two it's two years later, I can't even tell that she had it. It was attached to her spine. Like you could not get underneath it. It was attached to her spine hard. And that thing. That's what's crazy that is that people are used to going and getting it cut off and you don't see it die. So we get people who call are like, I don't know, this thing looks terrible. It looks like it's getting worse. No, it's dying in front of your face and you've never experienced that you've never seen it. So people think it's painful but it's not they're not feeling it because they've got the CBD and you know they got the full spectrum hemp extract in them which is a natural painkiller. So it's messy and gross, but you're not putting your dog under for no reason to cut off something that's just gonna grow back because you're not taking care of it. CBD THC are killing it and making it go away and not come back. She does not have any tumors anymore. They're gone.

I am so excited about what you have found out and the studies that have been done and are happening right now. It's just so exciting. So Angela as we wrap up, we don't need to wait until our dogs have a cancer diagnosis. We should be giving a maintenance dose correct of CBD every day?

I feel that if you've got a large breed dog, there are so many of them that are getting some type of cancer and most of the time they're getting osteosarcoma. I think once your dog turns, you have it a large breed dog once it turns seven, you should start a full spectrum hemp extract, just keep inflammation down. That's another thing that Dr. Siegel said she said stop naming it and blame it. Stop naming all of these diseases when they're all based on inflammation, inflammation of something we've got to get rid of inflammation in our body. And if we can get rid of inflammation in our body, we can stop the disease from happening in the first place. And that's what a full spectrum hemp extract will do. If your dog is already a senior or already has some sort of disease or problem, a full spectrum hemp extract is absolutely going to help again because as we get older, degenerative diseases and the inflammation in our body, all of that is going to be supported by a full spectrum hemp extract. So I say every animal and every human being should be on a full spectrum hemp extract that is going to make you feel better. You're not going to have those aches and pains. It helps your stress and anxiety. Cannabis will save the world cannabis and mushrooms will save the world. Without making us go broke in the meantime.

And it's natural. It's holistic. Angela, you've got an amazing company CBD Dog Health and anybody that is interested in trying CBD for their dogs. This is pet specific, which is awesome. And you guys have tinctures you have salves, you have treats. So where can everyone find out more information about you and your amazing podcast, It's a Dog's Life and CBD Dog Health.

You bet. I'm at AngelaArdolino.com and if you type in the search bar Fuck Cancer, you'll find Nina's protocol listed for you and and CBD Dog Health has it on that one article that I just talked about Nina her protocol also have the links to all the research that I mentioned so that you can see for yourself how promising this is. And then CBDDogHealth.com is where you can find the dog tinctures, cat tinctures and the horse tincture if you are, you know either suffering yourself with arthritic pain or your dog is sick with cancer since something like osteosarcoma is so aggressive, I you really have to go at it with a really strong tincture. So when such strong I would go with the Horse Ease. so other people are mixing like the Heal and the dog East so that they can get the Frankincense in the in the cannabis together. But yeah, that's on CBDDogHealth.com. And my podcast is called It's a Dog's Life. And you can get it on just about any platform. And we talk about mostly natural remedies for pets. talk a lot about diet since it's so important and all the good stuff that's out there. That helps our pets heal naturally.

Well, we appreciate everything that you do. And for our listeners, Angela and the team at CBD Dog Health is offering an amazing chance for you to try their products. Go to CBDDogHealth.com. use the code WOL for Wag Out Loud, and you can receive 20% off all of these amazing products. So Angela, we are out of time. But I want to thank you for all that you're doing. I know I'm going to have you back because you're going to just find out more amazing information. And I can't wait for that.

Thank you so much for having me. I always love talking to you.

Wonderful. Thank you, Angela.

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Thanks for listening. You'll find some helpful links in the show notes. And if you enjoy the show, please be sure to follow and listen for free on your favorite podcast app. And please, please share your feedback. Visit https://www.wagoutloud.com/ for great product recommendations with discounts, amazing online events and fantastic resources. That's also where to visit our Bark About It page where you can suggest topics, guests or products. Be advised that this show offers health or nutritional information and is designed for educational purposes only. you're encouraged to do your own research and should not rely on this information as a substitute for nor does it replace professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. If you have any concerns or questions about your dog's health, you should always consult a veterinarian or a nutrition expert. Have a tail wagging day and we'll catch you next time.

Hey Winston, was that another tail wagging episode?

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Join Dr. Kimberley Khodakhah and I as we discuss The Scoop on Poop. We cover GI health, common diseases, prevention and supplements.bbSince we are always picking up after our pups, we therefore are always checking out our dog’s poop. And Poop is such a key indication of our dog’s health. Listen and learn! Your dog will thank you!

Wendie Patrick is here to do a quick dive into the ingredients found in many dog grooming products and why you should care. Some contain pesticides, suspected carcinogens, and irritants that can have negative health effects not just for the pup being groomed, but also the people who come into contact with the dog once he’s back in the home, snuggling with his family. Listen and Learn. Your dog will thank you.

Hi there this is Krista with episode number 114 On the wag out loud pawdcast, are you aware that Sundowners syndrome happens in our dogs too? Well, just like humans as our pups grow older, they experience various health issues including behavioral changes. sundowning in dogs is believed to be caused by age related issues such as the breakdown of the central nervous system, oxidative stress, and brain cell death. is your dog wandering, getting stuck, pacing or barking for no reason? More often in the evening or the nighttime? these could all signal sundowning in dogs.

Welcome to the wag out loud podcast where we are obsessed with bringing you helpful tips on canine health care, nutrition, and overall well being. If you'd like to support the show. Check out the amazing online events, products and resources that I personally recommend on the Wag Out Loud website. I'm your host, Krista and I'm super excited to be bringing you yet another tail wagging episode.

Hi there dog lovers, thank you so much for taking the time to listen in, and for your interest in your dog's health and wellness. Today, we are so honored to have Dr. Marty Greer with us. And she is going to chat about how has dog ownership changed in the era of COVID? And what can you do for your dog? Dr. Greer, thank you so much for spending time with us today. Why don't you introduce yourself and tell us why you wrote the book Your Pandemic Puppy?

Sure. So I've been blessed with a career that I love. I've spent 39, almost 40 years crawling around the exam room floor with puppies with clients with just like I have the best job in the world. All day, I get to work with clients, I get to help them with their pets, I get to help them with managing their breeding programs. I just feel really blessed to have had so much fun with a career where I really do get to play with puppies every day and all day. So the inspiration from the book was sort of a multitude of different things that all coalesce. one was COVID started. So I had some time out of my schedule that I wasn't going to be traveling I normally am traveling quite a bit in the spring and the fall, and doing presentations. But because of COVID we were grounded. So we were home. And I realized at that point, I had a little extra time on my hands. I love to write. So I thought well, I'll just rewrite my exam room material. So I'll just write like a 20 page handout and it'll be good and I'll just get everybody up to speed on what's new with vaccinations and heartworm and flea and ticks and spaying and neutering and all that. So that the material I have in my exam rooms is fresh, but at the same time, I had clients and other people in my ear talking about how many people were staying home and how they were all trying to acquire a new puppy or a new kitten. And the concerns that many people in the industry had about how that's going to look when people started to return to work and to school, leaving their dogs alone when they'd been used to a year or more 100% of our clients of their owners being home with their pets. So we were really concerned about that. And we wanted to keep dogs from entering back into rescue back into Humane Society, and keep those dogs in the loving homes that had decided that during COVID, it was an appropriate time to get a new dog.

Wow! thank you for doing that. Because yes, it is a thing. And I think all of us can agree that the past 14 months have been super challenging and downright difficult. But one of the positives and you mentioned it is that COVID puppies and rescues adoptions were up. I think it's 40% more than the year before. And with that, I think a lot of people have discovered that their dogs are even more amazing because they spent so much time with them, and have formed even stronger bonds. So what do you think we've learned about dogs as a part of the family unit during this crisis?

Well, I think people have come to appreciate their dogs, they've enjoyed being home with them, the dogs have enjoyed having people home. What we did think was pretty funny is at the beginning, we were seeing dogs for things that we normally wouldn't have seen them for, it would have been typically that someone would maybe call or just take care of something themselves, like, My dog is now having four stools a day. And we'd say well, how many times a day are you walking them.? But we used to walk them once. But now I walk them in the morning before I start homeschooling the kids, and then we walk them. And pretty soon you realize that the dog is getting four walks a day. And of course the dog is going to have more opportunities. And yes, they are getting more attention. And yes, they're getting more snacks. And yes, they're getting more food, but they're also getting more exercise and they're getting more attention. So people are picking up on things like that things like lumps and bumps, things like their breath doesn’t smell good things that ordinarily would have kind of gone by the wayside. I think cats are kind of looking forward to people going back to work. They're like, really, you've been home long enough. And I really need to catch up on some sleep episodes that I've been missing out on so yeah, exactly Could you go? But what we also noticed was that we were seeing people that had never had a puppy or a dog before as an adult. So a lot of people had put off dog ownership. They have kids that are you know, in grade school, high school, and their kids were saying, Yeah, but mom, you promised us a dog all the time, and there's not a better time. So we started to see clients that had dogs as children that had never been responsible for selecting, raising and socializing an adult dog or dog to adulthood as an adult person. So it changed the dynamics of pet ownership, we had a lot of people coming in that really didn't know how to manage these dogs. And the other concern was making sure that we were managing them so that they didn't develop a separation anxiety when people went back to work so that they would be able to be crate trained. So that when they started going back to the grocery store, or work or school or whatever they happened to need to do the dentist, whatever, that the dogs were able to self soothe, were able to manage themselves at home, whether they were crated or left loose in the house or left in some confined area, that the dogs understood how to behave. And they were just comfortable in that setting. Because with people home 24 hours a day, or at least one person home all that time, the dogs were being raised in an environment that wasn't sustainable.

That's absolutely right. And you alluded to it earlier, when you said we've been feeding more food and treats and I know that a lot of veterinarians are noticing increased rates of obesity and obesity was already an epidemic before COVID. And I think I read 30% of American dogs were overweight before the pandemic. So now with our quarantine 15 that I know a lot of us experienced. What do you say to people as far as how to check for the correct weight in their dogs? And what would what should we be doing to make sure that they're slim and trim?

Sure. So you should be really careful that they're not eating any excessive amounts of food that you're basically feeding the same caloric intake as you were before. So that might mean a little bit less dog food if you're a little heavy on the stacks. The snacks can consist very comfortably of fresh fruits and vegetables with the exception of grapes and raisins which of course we know are toxic and onions and potatoes and corn which are kind of either starchy or potentially toxic. So we want to avoid those. But if your kids or if yourself you're looking at a snack and you're having you know fruit or vegetable that's a great opportunity for your dog to have that with you. You can cut back a little bit on their dog food and have up to 10% of their food be some other kind of snack like fruits and vegetables. And then of course the exercise. So if this time of year you'd like to go out and spend more time outside and spend more time walking, that's a great opportunity for your dog to start going out and Be with you. Now that the weather is nice, and in most parts of the country, it's warm, but not too warm, and it's rainy, but not too rainy. And it's just a really great chance for us to be outside with our dogs and get them used to that extra amount of exercise that they might have missed out on during the colder weather.

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. Can you describe what it looks like for us to actually check our dog's weight, I know the rib test, how do you actually do that?

The rib test is a great one. And you you can do this really easily. Basically, what you want to do is take your own hand. And what you want to do is make a fist and feel the back of your hand, it's not your knuckles, but the back of your hand, you can feel those four bones. That's what your dog's rib cage should feel like. If it feels like the palm of your hand where it's in that little heel part of your hand where it's soft and squishy. That's a dog that's overweight, it feels like the back of your hand. That's where you can feel the ribs. That's ideal. But if it looks like you can see the same kind of protrusion as you would when you make a fist, and you look at your knuckles, that's too thin. So it's a really good tool for people to use, because it's something that they have right in front of them, they can feel it, they can see it, they can relate to it. So it's really handy. Now there are going to be differences from one breed to another. But unfortunately, even the most athletic dogs are frequently thought of as being too thin when they're at an ideal body weight because Americans have become accustomed to their dogs being a little on the soft and squishy side. So our dogs should be fit, they should be able to keep up with you on walks. and that type of thing runs of course, are a different story, you have to be really careful with running especially with really young puppies or exercising really young puppies too hard. But if your dog is fit, they should be able to keep up with you on walks. And in fact, you know, you walk probably too slowly for your dog to be really interested in a lot of the things that you're doing. Like when you're walking, the dog is trying to sniff over there and look over there and check this out. Check that out. So our pace can be a little bit boring. But don't keep your dog just right at your heel. right in that heeling position all the time that you're on a walk, the dog should have a chance to smell posts and check out the fire hydrants and sniff the neighbor's flowers and you know, kind of check things out so that they have some stimulation on the walk too. it's not just hardcore, put your nose down and March as fast as you can up and down the sidewalk. So the dog should have fun. And of course, if you have a place that's safe for the dog to go and be off leash, that's ideal. Not everybody's in that situation. And you have to be really careful with dog parks, some dog parks are safe. And some you have to be really aware of, especially if you have a young dog or a really small dog. Not every dog in the dog park is necessarily safe with your dogs. So just be really aware of that dog parks can be fun, but they aren't always completely safe. So be be thoughtful about it, you know, be smart about it. Just like go into the beach with broken glass, you've got to be really careful that it's always a safe place for you and your kids to be.

That's a great recommendation. I think we all know that our dogs take on our stress. And of course, we have been super stressed the last year. So I just wanted to ask you, are you seeing more dogs coming in with anxiety or health issues related to all of the unease that we've had within our own families?

You know, we've seen a little bit of it. But the other thing that we've seen is the some of the dogs that are coming through rescues have gotten off to a pretty rough start in life. And we are being more lenient with them. At this point, there are fewer people willing to euthanize for behavior than used to be. So we have to be really aware that some of our dogs are just high stress dogs that are going to need some kind of behavioral intervention. And I want people to feel really comfortable with the opportunity to use behaviorists and also the opportunity to use your vet for behavioral management drugs. And there's nothing wrong with admitting to your veterinarian or your behaviorist, that you're struggling with a behavioral issue, whether it's separation anxiety, or generalized anxiety, or whatever behavioral issue your dog might have. It might be thunderstorms, it might be some other kind of noise phobias. But a lot of dogs carry baggage with them. And we don't always know where they've come from, what their early life was, like, how they were socialized how they were raised, what their genetics are, because some of these dogs that are coming through rescues are randomly sourced and not purpose bred. So they tend to come with more baggage than some of our purpose bred dogs. Now that's a generalization and it certainly doesn't apply to every single dog but I do want people to be aware of this. And to not be embarrassed not to not be afraid to say I'm struggling with depression, anxiety. I'm struggling with noise anxiety. I need help with this. And don't be afraid to ask your veterinary professional for medications that are appropriate. It doesn't mean that you're weak doesn't mean your dog is weak. It just means that we have tools now that we didn't Always have, that we can use to make your dog's life much easier. So you know, the little Snoopy cartoon with pig pen with that little black cloud that, or Charlie Brown that kind of has that little black cloud that follows him around, take them with a little crowd of death, or dogs shouldn't go through life under this little black cloud, they should have a happy, wonderful life. And there are many veterinarians who are really skilled at this. There's actually an association of behavior of veterinarians, there are great behavioral training people, and there's so much happier, and there's so much easier to live with and you should enjoy living with your dog, it shouldn't be a struggle. And people really don't want to get rid of the dogs that they've brought into rescue. They really want help. So don't hesitate to ask and if your veterinarians not familiar with it, look online. Like I said, there's an American Association of veterinary behavior, veterinarians that you can look up, there are people in your area that you can very comfortably contact and get some help with and some of these are even able to do telemedicine consults, not all of them. But some are able to do telemedicine consults. And what's cool about that is through the wonders of cell phones, see your dog in its own environment, see how things are looking in their life and help you sometimes even with a long distance, recommendation for how you can do things to make your dog's life much more comfortable and much more enjoyable.

That's great advice. And I know that myself, I'm a believer in integrative approaches as are a lot of our listeners. So there are so many different treatments and modalities that we can look at to help our dogs with behavioral issues as well. And you mentioned telemedicine, so I want to go back. First of all, give a shout out to all the veterinarians and their teams for stepping up to care for our pets during the pandemic. Wow, you guys shifted I mean, I sat in the parking lot. You know, you guys had to come out, get my dog take him in. It was a whole different experience and telemedicine was available as an option. What do you think we're gonna see in the future? I know a lot of facilities practices are still doing the wait in the parking lot routine. Is that going to continue? Do you think we'll see more telemedicine calls?

Oh, I think there's definitely going to be an increase in telemedicine because there are absolutely things that we can do better through telemedicine that we can hands on in the exam room, like I said, seeing their behavior, witnessing certain types of things like seizures, it's so much easier to do through telemedicine than trying to capture an event when you can't replicate it in the exam room. So I definitely think telemedicine is here to stay. the states are struggling. Each state has got their own set of laws on how telemedicine works for veterinarians. And they're all struggling with how to make it work so that it's safe and that we have a valid veterinary client patient relationship and the veterinarian that you're seeing has the ability to make recommendations, medical and others for your pet. So I definitely think telemedicine is here to stay. There are many platforms that have been developed in the last few years making video conferencing with your veterinarian a real thing. Some of them are allowing the veterinarians to charge for their time, which is really appropriate. If you're spending 30 minutes with a veterinarian, they should be monetized they should be paid for their experience and their expertise. So I think it's a great thing. In our personal practice, we only let one person into the exam room at a time since the start of COVID. We did not ever shut down completely but many veterinary clinics have and certainly if you have a doctor or team members that are immunocompromised, that might have to stay in existence for a while. We know there are plenty of veterinarians and veterinary staff out there that might be on chemotherapy or have some other kind of treatment for cancer or something else. And obviously, they need to keep themselves and their staff safe so that they can continue to practice medicine. But in our practice, we've let one person come in at a time and the other thing that we've done in our practices. For the last seven years, we've been planning a drive thru veterinary Wellness Center. And we did complete the construction of that about two months ago. So we now have clients that can pull into our garage as a patented system so they can pull into the garage they can have their pet either in the back of their SUV or minivan on an exam table in the garage with them or in an exam room that's visible through the window. So we now have clients that can be a participant in their veterinary visit without having to do it electronically. Now, if you don't have that option, electronic still works great. Because yes, your dog can be in the exam room or your cat can be on the table and in the treatment area. And you can be communicating through the telemedicine platform, looking at how the veterinarian and their staff is managing your pet talking you through the history talking you through the physical exam findings, discussing treatment options. It's really pretty cool what we can do through some of these platforms, so that you can be a participant in their care and in fact when we have one client in the exam room then we'll often have the other clients, that the spouse may be sitting in the vehicle. And so we just conference them in through FaceTime or AirVed or whatever platform we want to use for telemedicine. And then that client can be a participant in that whole discussion and not have to have the spouse go home, and try to repeat everything that you can. Because it gets to be really difficult to, you know, they say, Well, what do they say about this? And you're like, Oh, I don't really remember or Yeah, they said this, but I, but you wanted to ask something else. And so it's, it's really great to be able to use some of the technology that currently exists. And we're going to see continuing to be developed for our clients for our communication tools, because they can just get better and better.

That is great. Good for you guys to think outside the box. I love it

It’s been a lot of fun.

Well, that's cool. I hope other practices do something similar, because it's nice to have options, for sure. Were most people understanding during all the new processes during the past year?

Most people have been really good about it, they understand the safety factor that we need to keep our staff safe. I mean, we're in a small exam room with somebody for 15 or 20 minutes. And, and their pet and you know, they have the entire family in there just really increases the density and the risk of developing any kind of infectious disease, not just COVID. But other things as well. I mean, most veterinarians have seen a healthier staff during this because we're not picking up the flu, and we're not picking up colds, we're you know, we're washing our hands, we're wearing gloves, doing things that we wouldn't have done before. So, in general, yes, clients have been really accepting of it, they understand they want to be safe. They, they want their pets to be safe, but they still want their pets to receive the care that they need. And like you said, there's an increase not only in pet ownership, but we've also seen an increase in the number of visits per pet. So it made making veterinary visits. To get into your vet is more difficult. Almost every veterinary clinic is overwhelmed by the number of appointments that we're trying to see. And if you're doing curbside service, it does take longer to do each appointment, because of the transition piece between appointments, we've had to disinfect rooms between clients, we've had to cut down on our density, there's just been a lot of things we've had to change. We've had a few clients that have been a little touchy, I think some of them are just in general kind of mad at the world. They're frustrated, they're tired of being home. Yeah. And sometimes we're the only social contact the clients had in a week, they don't go to the grocery store, they don't go to Walmart, they don't run errands. They're not going to PTA meetings, or soccer games or any, any after work activities. So sometimes we're their only social context for the week. And it makes it really hard for them. They're like so glad to see a person and have a face to face conversation. They're pretty excited. And then of course, there's the really emotional times where we would ordinarily just reach out and hug someone. And I know they've said this on the human side as well is when you're losing a pet when or when you're having something really fabulous happen. some really great news that your pet is healthy again, or that you've just had a litter of puppies or something really emotionally exciting. clients want that connection they want that hug I miss just shaking people's hands when I'm being introduced to them. It is just a really different experience, you lose a lot of facial expression behind a mask, you lose a lot of interaction through a video camera. So it has been more difficult to communicate. We've had more clients get kind of grouchy and kind of touchy about things. And so we all just have to take a deep breath and really be nice to one another and realize that everyone's under a lot of stress. Everyone's working really hard to make this system happen. And we're all trying really hard every veterinary clinic is just swamped, and they're trying really hard to get the care that everybody needs. But it's not always very practical to make sure that everybody gets the appointment when they need it. Most veterinary clinics are booking out several months from just routine care, because a year ago, we were not allowed to do any of the routine care. So things got pushed back. And now with an increase in pet ownership, our caseloads are much heavier. And our staff needs to get home and needs to decompress and needs to have their free time. And so it's been a real challenge to make everybody happy to keep the staff happy. And and to keep the clients satisfied with the kind of care that they're getting because it feels different.

Yes, well, a big virtual hug to all of the veterinary practices out there. You guys have been doing amazing jobs. I just want to thank you for that. And in closing, let's touch on separation anxiety because it's inevitable. With a lot of dogs that have been your shadow. And when you start to leave, What tips do you recommend for separation anxiety?

Well, I'm a big fan of using crates or some kind of a confined area when you're not going to be able to supervise the dog, especially young dogs. We see a lot of young dogs in particular, chew up things that aren't safe. We've seen toxicities. We saw a lot of marijuana toxicity at the very beginning of this Because people were their kids were coming home from college and not necessarily very tidy with how they were keeping their supplies. So we did see some interesting toxicities and some interesting foreign bodies, some, you know, just increasing numbers of dogs chewing up underwear and things because they were anxious because they were nervous because of changes in the household. So absolutely, the dog needs to be accustomed to being in a crate or some confined area that you can puppy proof and make it safe. So they don't chew through electric cords and into backpacks, and all the other things that can be unsafe. But they need to learn how to be alone in a crate how to be alone in the house so that they aren't distressed by that. So it's going to require practicing, create training and then practicing being gone. And initially, you want to be gone for very short periods of time, and the dog just has to become accustomed to that new routine. So you can put him in a crate or in a small room, just the first time or two just for literally a second or two. It takes a long time to build up to five minutes, it doesn't take as long to go from five minutes to an hour. But those first few minutes of the first few hours can be very challenging to get a dog accustomed to. I love the use of the kinds of metal muffin tins that we can buy at the store. They're great, you can put dog kibble mixed with yogurt in them or some put, just water in your dog kibble, you can mix all kinds of fun things with it, put it in the freezer, have it frozen and ready to go so that when you're getting ready to go to work in the morning, you take that out and instead of the dog gobbling down their food in the first 10 seconds that you put it down, you get ready for work or school, you latch the crate with the muffin tin. it needs to be a metal one that is silicone like because the silicone ones are too chewable, latch it with the crate door closed and the muffin tin inside. So your dog is now looking at the muffin tin and going, wait, my breakfast is in there. And I really wish you would hurry up and get going to work because I have a busy day ahead of me now. So you can do some really fun things to kind of shift your dog's mindset about instead of being put in a crate and being told, well, I'll be back in four hours. Good luck, right, you can now say, look, what I have for you. This is really great. I know you haven't had breakfast yet, you're going to love this. But it's going to take you two hours to eat your breakfast. And by the time they're done eating their breakfast, they're tired. So now they're going to take a little bit of a nap in the crate, it's good to have a neighbor come in or go to care.calm or some other service that you can hire somebody to come in the middle of the day, so that the dog get out to go potty and get some exercise, get some snacks, those kinds of things. So now as you're transitioning back to work, you're not just going to say, okay, Monday, we go back and you're going to be alone for 10 hours, I hope it goes well for you Bye. Because it's destined to fail, it's destined that your dog is going to be distressed, you're going to be worried about him. And even if you do something like put a video camera on him with furbo, or some other kind of video camera while you're at work, you're going to be worried about him and you're not going to be focusing on what you should be doing. So it's really important that we transition them that we teach them that they know that they can be alone that they know they can be safe and they know you're coming home. So that you put them back into a routine that they get used to a few minutes at a time and then a couple of hours. And so they they don't start to dread the fact that you're putting on your work shoes instead of your fun shoes, but that they know you're coming back, and then they're going to be safe, and they're going to be okay. And when you get home, you're going to do all kinds of fun things. But it does take a transition, you can't just walk out the door one day and say I'm sure you'll be fine, you were good when I was home with you, I'm sure you'll do fine without me. Because they may not we really have to be aware that dogs can be destructive, they can do dangerous things to themselves and your home. So there's nothing wrong with using a crate or an ex pen or some other way that you can confine the dog so that they're safe, and they're happy and they're content and you've given him stuff to do while you're gone. So stuffed stuffed toys, puzzles, muffin tins, all kinds of activities that are really safe for them. You need to think it through and and really plan ahead and know what your dog loves and what they're not allergic to and what they want to do and how they can spend their time so that they're happy and content in your absence.

I totally agree. And I'm a believer, don't get all excited when you leave. Or when you come back. It's just okay. Fido I'll see you later. And then when you're back, you're you know, you're not having them jump up on you and high pitched voice. It's just part of the normal everyday routine, just be calm. Yep. They will get really wound up if you let them.

Oh, absolutely. And they feed off of you. So right. And if you feel guilty about leaving them, they're going to know that they're not going to be happy. And they have to realize, you know what, if I'm going to buy your dog food and I pay your for your veterinary visits, I'm going to buy you the next new treat, I have to have a job, I have to have an income, you're going to have to stay here by yourself for a little while and you'll be fine. Sometimes they're better with another pet. Sometimes they're not you really have to assess each individual pet and what their needs and wants are and how well they get along. You don't want to leave two dogs alone together that you can't trust that they'll be safe together they might have some resource guarding that happens while you're gone. So be really careful with how you set up those, those environments so that your pet can be successful, they can be happy. You need a couple of months to transition your pet into this new lifestyle.

Yes, totally agree. Well, Dr. Greer, I could talk to you forever. But unfortunately, we're running out of time. So where can everybody find out more about you? And your book, Your Pandemic Puppy?

Well, it's available on Amazon. Your Pandemic Puppy on Amazon It's the only book called Your Pandemic Puppy there. My name is Marty Greer. I have my veterinary clinic website. And I also have the pandemic puppy website, you can find me on Facebook @YourPandemicPuppy you can find me at Revival Animal Health, you can find me at Veterinary Village. I'm happy to communicate with you if there's anything I can do for you. Please feel free and go out. Take a look at the book. If you know somebody that's getting a new puppy, get the book for them before because it'll help with pet selections. And give them a chance to read through it for people that are purchasing a dog as a purpose bred dog, get the book ahead of time, if you're getting a rescue dog, get the book ahead of time and be prepared with the supplies and the behavioral kinds of work that you need to do. It doesn't just go through behavior. It goes through all the medical care of spaying and neutering recommendations, which are different now than they were in past years. New vaccination protocols. It's all in there. It's very up to date. It was published in November. So it's a very up to date current book with all the new kind of information that the current contemporary pet owner, regardless of their age group should know about pet ownership.

Dr. Greer, we can't thank you enough, everybody. Check out Your Pandemic Puppy on Amazon. And thank you for being with us. Dr. Greer. This was just fantastic information. And let's set up our dogs for success.

Thanks for listening. You'll find some helpful links in the show notes and if you enjoy the show, please be sure to follow and listen for free on your favorite podcast app. And please, please share your feedback. Visit https://www.wagoutloud.com/ for great product recommendations with discounts, amazing online events and fantastic resources. That's also where to visit our bark about it page where you can suggest topics, guests or products. Be advised that this show offers health and nutritional information and is designed for educational purposes only. you're encouraged to do your own research and should not rely on this information as a substitute for nor does it replace professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. If you have any concerns or questions about your dog's health, you should always consult a veterinarian or a nutrition expert. Have a tail wagging day and we'll catch you next time. Hey Winston, was that another tail wagging episode?

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Hi, this is Krista with episode number 113. On the wag out loud podcast, here's a tip help to keep your dog hydrated by adding fresh veggies to their meals. Most dogs that eat kibble are in a chronic state of dehydration and that contributes to problems such as kidney disease, or the formation of bladder stones. Vegetables are an excellent source of water and veggies like cucumbers, lettuce, broccoli, and brussel sprouts are over 85% water. So raw, lightly steamed or even frozen veggies are great, but you'll need to crush or pulverize them in a juicer or a blender, or your dog won't be able to digest them.

Welcome all dog lovers to another informative episode of The wag out loud podcast. And joining me today is Jeff Allen. Jeff Allen is the cofounder of Monkey’s House a Dog Hospice & Sanctuary and a bestselling author of Where Dogs Go To Live!: Inspiring Stories of Hospice Dogs Living in the Moment. And he is going to share with us about where hospice dogs go to live. Jeff, we so appreciate you being with us today and can't wait to learn more about you. Can you introduce yourself and tell us about your love of dogs?

Sure, Krista. And first thank you for having me on. It's an honor to be on Wag Out Loud. Thank you. So my wife and I in 2015 started Monkey's House. It's a dog hospice and sanctuary. We've rescued over 120 dogs that were going to be destroyed in shelters that come to our little farm here in New Jersey. And they live a great final chapter of their lives. We feed more holistic food depending on the health conditions. They live in a home environment. So yes, we have 20 to 25 dogs at any time living with us throughout the house. And it's just a great place. We have volunteers that come over to help out.

Wow! Well, Jeff, what do you consider to be a hospice dog?

So generally our dogs that we that we rescue have multiple medical, so they're medically diagnosed terminal. They could have cancer, major heart issues, liver, kidney, most of them also have either they're blind or they're deaf. So we have or both, we have quite a few things. But my wife, she was a nurse for many, many years. Now she's retired and she's just doing this. So she really does have that background and she's learned so much about dogs that really helps out. And, and I just do a lot of other things for the organization.

Wow, this sounds like a major undertaking. So why don't we go back? How was your dog Monkey the inspiration of Monkeys House?

That's a great question. So when we we were fostering dogs at the time. And we got Monkey from this local rescue shelter, said Hey, would you take little dog has major heart conditions, again because they knew my wife could handle the major medical issues. So we said yeah, will take monkey and my wife said that Monkey needs To get some very inexpensive heart meds, we've seen this before in dogs, she went to the shelter that shelter vet said, just take take him home. Monkey’s only gonna be around for like about a month or so. And that wasn't good enough for us. So we adopted Monkey took him to our own vet, he saw a cardiologist got on the meds he needed, which were like the $4 meds from Walmart, very inexpensive. And he lived 17 vibrant months with us. And that just kind of kicked it off, we realized there was there's very little resources for the terminally ill dogs in shelters. So we've started Monkey’s House.

That's fantastic. And what is your philosophy when it comes to dogs with a terminal illness? I know when we talked before, you had some different ideas about care, and you even have the beach and Santa, can you tell us more about all that?

Sure. And that's kind of our saying, right? Where dogs go to live? I you know, so look, these dogs, we get them as healthy as possible. We're not saying we're curing them from their terminal diagnosis. What we're saying is, we get them as healthy as they can be. So they can enjoy those final moments. And those final final moments could be simple things like going outside and having the sun and the wind blow in their face. Or it could be the more exciting things. We have a senior dog bus, it used to be a senior citizen bus. They all pile in with our volunteers meet us at the Jersey Shore. We'll go to see Santa. And they all go the ones who can't walk. We have strollers, we have little wagons, the blind ones, they love the different smells. So it's really it says something for even for us, right as humans. It's like, Look, you have to live every day till the end. So that's what we will do with these dogs. And they do they love life.

Lucky dogs, for sure. And how many dogs do you typically care for at one time? Did you say

at one time we were at almost 30 at one time, which was a lot for us. We generally about 25. But we have been down to about 20 during the pandemic because we also social distance. A lot of the volunteers weren't coming over. And they're just starting, you know, a lot of us got vaccinated. So we're just starting to come back on. So we're getting back up there. We I think we have 22 right now.

Okay. My main question is how on earth do you care for each dog's medical needs? When it comes to food and medications and supplements and anything else that they need to treat their illness? I would imagine that it's a 24/7 routine over there.

It certainly is. Well, first, I have to have this big do a big shout out to all of our, our supporters, right, we're a donation based organization, a 501 3c. So we do get a lot of donations that come in that help support the financial end of it because it is very expensive for anybody having dogs it will be very expensive for medical surgery or issues. Then each dog is looked at when they first come, we actually take them to the vet, Michelle figures out a diet for them because depending on what their medical condition is, if they have cancer or if they have some type of liver or kidney issues, then they are put on different dietary supplements along with the the base food could be different as well. Some dogs get a chicken, turkey, beef, even pork or or so on. And we feed more raw if we can or gently cooked food. So it's all home cooked, no bag food. And we found that that food therapy is really makes a big difference. We still use the traditional medicine as well. I mean if they if they need to get meds, they get their meds. But we do find that on being on healthy food reduces that at times.

Okay, that's great. So you've mentioned that you have volunteers, obviously that help you with all of this. How do these terminally ill dogs find you?

They all the all the shelters around here now? know of us. So when they have a dog that has a major medical issue that needs to be…a lot of them have to be euthanized, sadly, that they will get in touch with us. And if we have room for them, then we would gladly bring them in to Monkey’s House. First. They first they actually go to a quarantine foster for a couple of weeks. Because we don't want to potentially bring anything in from the shelter like kennel cough. So they're isolated for two to three weeks. And then they make their way to Monkey's House. And then they get they get all the love they can imagine… our aunts and uncles. Here's a good name for our Aunts and Uncles. I mean, our volunteers are called aunts and uncles. Because we want them to really be part of the family and they really fall in love with these dogs.

That is amazing. And Where exactly are you in New Jersey?

We're in Burlington County which is the Southern part of New Jersey.

Okay. And that's why you're close to the shore. That's fantastic. Yeah. Well, Jeff, you and Michelle are doing such great, great work, so that these dogs can actually live out their final days and pure happiness. And I want to talk to you about the emotional strain on you guys. So knowing that these dogs won't be with you for a long time, how do you deal emotionally with all the attachment? And then the inevitable loss? You're constantly dealing with anticipatory grief, aren't you?

We are. And, look, it's no different than, than anybody who has a dog, and that dog becomes sick, and you're taking care of it, and then it passes. It's heartbreaking. And honestly, every one breaks our hearts. And Michelle said one day, when they don't break our hearts anymore, that's when we'll stop. Because they deserve all of our love, and affection. You know, it's, it's tough, it is tough. But you know, we have 20 some, so we have to keep going. And you have to keep moving on. We're very sad. And we're sad for a long time. With 20 some dogs, you would think that we don't miss one dog. We miss them tremendously. there's a there's a big hole in the family for quite a while, I guess is no different than then someone who has one or two dogs to be honest with you.

And can you set the scene? What What does Monkey's House look like on a typical day?

I don't know there's any typical day here. So yeah, we, you know, I wake up, usually I'm up first, and I'll start getting some of the dogs out back in our big fenced in backyard. So they go out back and, and do their business or, and then I have to wake some of them up and carry them out. Because they can't they're not very mobile. And then we actually will get ready to start feeding and feeding takes about an hour and a half. Again, like I said, because it's all special meals. It's something that some of its pre cooked. But you still have to prepare 20 some meals. With the meds get the dogs we do have crates for a lot of the dogs for when we feed just so they're not getting into someone else's food with their medicine. So they are most of them are all separated. Once the feeding is done, then it's walking time. So they go out for walks. The ones that need a strollers and even we have a couple that are in their own little carts because their back end doesn't work. Put them in there, take them out. And sometimes you can't you're taking out five or six at a time on walks up and down the driveway. A few of the other dogs that can go further might go around the back field are, you know we have old country roads, there's not much traffic, you can go down the road, you know, then lunch, it's really funny around this time at lunchtime, it's very quiet, all the dogs are kind of resting. And then it starts back up again around four o'clock they get excited for dinner. And it's the same process again. And then on certain days of the week, like Wednesdays are the days that my wife takes all the dogs to the vet the pet bt some of them get physical therapy, the underwater treadmill, laser therapy. So usually she has about 15 dogs in our van that goes to the vet’s on Wednesdays. And then sometimes on the weekend weekend, we'll try to do a trip out to the state forest, we live close to the Pine Barrens or if it's a special occasion, we we hit the beach.

Well, this is a labor of love, for sure. And Jeff, you are an expert and caring for dogs with terminal illness. So let's chat about your thoughts about how we can care for a terminally ill dog here at home. What recommendations do you have?

I think the biggest recommendation with will say, first have a great relationship with your vet, we joke and say if you're not that you're going to especially during COVID, you're not going to hug your vet. But if you don't feel like hugging your vet, you might want to find another vet, you want to find the best vet that's going to listen to to your needs and your dog's needs. Like I said, we do traditional and non traditional. So our vet’s a little mix of the both. If you have a traditional vet that you want to look at some non traditional approaches, see if your vet’s interested in that. A lot of vets will be if they're not, you know, maybe you need to find somebody else to to work with. But that's not said you have to have a great relationship with your vet. Because if your dog does become have issues and you need to get like say fluids for your dog, you can do fluids at home. The vet can teach you how to do that. I do it all the time. I don't have a medical background. So you could do something like that at home. We call that sofa medicine. Chapter, a chapter in the book I wrote it talks about all those things that you can do at home that you know, in the comfort of your home, because your dog might be get anxious when you go to the vet. So if it’s done on your couch is going to be more relaxing to them and more relaxing to you. It's just have that relationship with your vet, and learn to educate yourself. So educate yourself as much as you can about the about the condition of your dog, I think that's going to put your mind at ease.

Absolutely. And I think what you guys are doing that is so amazing, as you're helping these dogs, you focus on the moment, that you're not looking into the future. And you are actually giving them precious time and memories, and living in the here and now, which I think is fantastic. And I would think a lot of people that have a dog with an illness, they're already thinking about when the dog is gonna pass and they're not living in the moment, like you guys are. I want to say kudos to you for doing that. Because a lot of us would just be in grief already before the dog is even passed. Do you want to speak to that?

Yeah, Krista, that the dogs feel that energy too. We have a big saying here that we try to keep everything positive, as much as we can, you know, the dogs that we take in, most of them have had a horrible life prior to us. But we don't think of that, you know, when they get here, we think of that point and forward. So everything is happy times, even when, you know, it's funny, we have a large Facebook following, and sometimes we’ll say, Oh, this dog came in and they'll see pictures of it and is really abused. And people, you'll get some people that are like, oh, well it’s in the best place it can be now, you know, going forward. Other people say that, but they also say, you know, bad karma for the previous owners. And we're like, no, don't even bring that up. Because we don't want to think of negative things. It's all positive. And like you were saying, it's all positive things. Even if your dog does have a terminal diagnosis. What can you do positive? Can you take them to a walk on the beach? No, if they can't walk, then can you put them in a stroller and take them somewhere? You know, it's just like you said it took little moments that they're going to enjoy. And when they enjoy, you're going to enjoy it.

Yeah, I agree. And we have to, you know, a lot of us are control freaks. And we have to accept the fact that we cannot control our dog's illness. So to your point, live in the here and now and make their final days as wonderful as possible and that would help you as well. And while we're on the topic of you know, the caretaking role, it has to be emotionally and physically exhausting for us taking care of our dog and seeing them in their final stages. So Wouldn't you say that it's so important for us to take time out for ourselves so that we can better in taking care of them?

Absolutely. I think we do need to do that. And again, like I said, if you could do that along with your dog, it's what, how better is that? Right? If you could spend some time, just even just sitting outside with them, doing whatever. And like I said, If as long as you know as much as you can about them, and the illness that they have with the condition that they have. Because that's going to put your mind at ease too. Because if you know what the stages are of that illness, then when things happen, you're going to understand it more so then then just be nervous and really upset about it. It's going to be upsetting, but at least you're going to know that knowledge is power in taking care of your dogs.

And you mentioned that you have a very strong Facebook following. You don't have to go through this alone, right? There has to be so many support groups out there of others going through the same thing.

Absolutely. You know, when we started Monkey's House in 2015, we didn't even think about what our Facebook group would be like we we just said, Oh, you know, we got we have to start one because we need to get followers and hope to support these dogs right financially and emotionally. But we didn't realize that we now have 70,000 followers on Facebook, around the world. And yeah, and it has it has been so yeah, not only do they fall in love with our dogs, it's amazing how they fall in love with dogs from they've never seen and one passes, we'll get you know, 10,000 comments and not just rip but like comments that they've been following this dog. But what is amazing is that when someone else's dog passes, like they’ll, you can tell that maybe they don't have the support at home so much. But on the Facebook group, they'll say something about it, and then all the other people chime in and give them support. So it really is a big support network in a way and we didn't we didn't realize that was what Monkey’s House was going to become, you know, the Facebook page and everything. So it's quite amazing. And also was one of the things that brings joy to my wife and I the most is when someone comments and says, you know, by following you guys, I took a chance. And I adopted a senior dog with medical issues because I realized I can do it. Or they'll say, I didn't put my dog down when I thought other people told me because I was listening to you. And I had so much, so much more wonderful time with them. Yes, there were tough times too. But, and that's those are the most rewarding things for us, is to not just the dogs that we have here. But we're helping people with their dogs as well.

I just got goosebumps, that is amazing. You're touching so many lives. So all of your hard work, it has to just feel so rewarding when when you hear confirmation like that.

It really is. because like you said, it is hard, it gets tough at times, sometimes, you know, sometimes, you know, we get down, I get down. And then when I start reading comments, or reading things like that, it really brings me back up and says you know what, I am doing the right thing. You know, we are doing a good thing for these dogs. So keep chugging along.

Well, Jeff, you briefly mentioned about the book, and the book is where dogs go to live inspiring stories of hospice dogs living in the moment. How did that book come to be?

You know, we we post every night on Facebook. And you know, if I did I do my wife, my wife probably does more than I do. My wife is more educational. I'm kind of more fun, you know, but people really enjoy it. And I started enjoying writing. So a couple of years ago, before I I put the book out, which was the end of last summer, I started writing about different dogs stories. And I just thought that they they deserve to have their stories told, I kept writing about the stories more and more. And within a couple of years, I basically had a book. So I, I put it out and it's got really, I got a five star rating on Amazon, I'm kind of surprised. 250 reviews, it's done very well. And it really does highlight all the stories of all the stories of dogs we have here. Not all the dogs we've like I said we had 120 that's about 37 stories in the book. And also, there's a little bit education in there talks about how Monkeys House how we care for the dogs, medically and in food therapy, and different things like that. And I talked about sofa medicine. So it tells you how you can take care of your dogs. If these fluids are inflamed and things like that. But it's it's very, I didn't want it to be sad. And I wanted to show people that. You know, these hospice dogs, a lot of people don't want to talk about hospice, right? It's a word that no one wants to talk about. But these dogs live life that's really why we titled it, where dogs go to LIVE. It's been a great experience I got this is my first book I've written I've actually I'm starting the second one. Now it's going to be out. It's a coffee table book actually of pictures of dogs and some some funny and inspirational quotes.

Oh, that's fantastic. Well, this book not only has amazing reviews, but the endorsements that you have from top people in the industry. I mean, that is impressive. When Dr. Karen Becker or Dr. Judy Morgan or Rodney Habib, we all know those names, and they give high accolades to this book. So it must be very heartwarming as well as informative.

Yes. I'm very thankful for all the people who did endorse, I said, I guess you're right, we got a lot of terrific endorsements for the book. And you know, to be honest, they just, they know what we do here. They know that the care we give these dogs, and they love what we do and and they read the book and they love the book too. So that was that was a plus double plus they get they love us and then they liked the book.

that's great. And are there other facilities like yours around the country?

Sadly, there's very few like ours, Krista, who's the you know, there's senior sanctuaries and a lot of senior sanctuaries have some hospice dogs. But, you know, a lot of shelters will have volunteers that might take their hospice dog home and they'll say, you know, take Fido home, just keep them comfortable in a bed and feed them and, and just let them rest until he passes. He does not and there's nothing wrong with that because I understand it. But that's not our philosophy. You know, our philosophy is we bring them to Monkeys House. We get them as healthy as they can be. For those final moments, and not just to lay in a bed, but to go to the Jersey Shore to take walks at the park, even if it's in a stroller, right, so they get the smells, they can they can get the sight.s So we, Michelle once said, you know, one of her quotes was just because you’re dying doesn't mean you can't live. And that's how we feel about these dogs. We want them to live.

And they have each other, which is fantastic as well.

Oh, it's amazing to see, you know, 98% of our dogs are senior dogs too. And they come in here by themselves. Next thing you know, they have a buddy or two or three they're laying with, like a dog pile of a dog pile together. So it's really cute.

That's fantastic. Well, Jeff, as we are wrapping up, I mean, my heart is so full right now. What would you like to leave us with?

I guess I'd like to say that, you know, senior dogs, and especially these senior dogs with medical issues, they still have a lot of love to give, and a lot of love to receive. So don't write them off so fast. Enjoy your time with them. Especially if you have a dog that's getting older and, and has some medical issues. enjoy time with them. Like I. said, get as much information you can on the illness that they have. Have a vet that really respects your opinions and that you respect and love. And just enjoy that final time with your dogs.

And it's perfect advice. Jeff, where can everyone find out more information about you? Monkeys House and your amazing book where dogs go to live?

So Where Dogs go to live is in any bookstore has it. Amazon is a big place people buy it or Barnes and Noble online those type of stores. So they can go to where dogs go to live out on Amazon. And then our Monkeys House is monkeyshouse.org. That's our website. And from our website, you can obviously see a lot of the dogs. If you're interested in you know, donate or follow us on Facebook has a link to Facebook. And so please come check out Monkey’s House, check out the book Where Dogs Go To Live!. FB: @monkeyshouse.org IG: @monkeyshouse_doghospice

And Krista I greatly appreciate for you having me on to talk about the dogs that we love so much.

We appreciate everything that you and Michelle and all of your volunteers, aka the aunts and uncles are doing for these dogs. And hopefully we gave everybody some inspiration today that if you have an aging dog with an illness, that there's so much you can do for them in their final days. So Jeff, thank you so much for being with us.

Thank you.

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Hello there! This is Krista with Episode #112 on the Wag Out Loud Pawdcast.

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Do you realize that a big part of protecting your dog from heartworm is protecting his immune system? That’s right! When you think of your dog’s immune system, you probably think about it warding off disease. But it also protects his body from parasites, like heartworms. A strong immune system is the difference between a few heartworms and an abundance of heartworms that would affect your dog’s health. Just another reason we need to improve our dogs’ gut health!

Hi there Dog lovers!  Thanks for tuning in to another amazing episode of the Wag Out Loud pawdcast.  Back for a 2nd time, Joel Baardseth is here to share some great information.  If you didn’t catch his earlier episode about Rawsome News for Leaky Gut, have a listen!  Joel has been in the pet industry for twenty years and each year he learns more about the Power of Food to help our four-legged kids live their best lives. He is the Sales Operations Manager for an excellent raw food company, Steve's Real Food. He teaches retail staff and the public how to use food to help with common dog and cat ailments.

Joel, thanks so much for being on again.

Thank you so much for inviting me back.

This is always fun chatting with you, we get to geek out and this time on air and people can learn from everything that you have to share with us.

Oh, we'll take nerd to the next level. All right, let's do it.

Well, Joel, you are going to chat with us about the wolf on your sofa. What does that mean?

Well, I like to use a relationship of dogs to wolves as a starting point, whenever I do presentations, I think it's important just to kind of realize that regardless of what leash colors and pink bows we put on our Chihuahuas that really, we did bring a wolf into our home. And it helps for the sole purpose of nutrition, and how to make them thrive. And I personally enjoy researching wolves. I also have a big affection for like wild cats, you know, jaguars, things like that. And something I've always loved as a kid is just kind of like and then these sort of be able to bring it into my my work world has been awesome. But the starting point of all this is that, you know, most people don't realize that wolves and dogs are, you know, they're 99.8%, the same DNA. And that point 2%, that's not identical. That's the difference in what we see. That's the difference between a chihuahua and a wolf and a mastiff is that point two. On the inside, they're all the same. So when wolves are studied, and if they were to open them up and look at the inside to learn, and you have an identical sized dog, right next to them, you wouldn't see a difference. And that's kind of awesome, right there. And in addition to that, they have the same scientific classification, and Canis lupus familiaris. You know, they're, they're the same, we know that they're the same for this reason, Wolves and dogs can mate in even produce offspring. That's how we know they're the same species. A horse and a donkey mate, they get a mule, but the mule is sterile. So the donkey and the horse are two different species. We want to have this because it helps us teach the wolves kind of we don't know exactly why. But they started to be domesticated maybe 15,000 years ago, you know, all this is going to be rough estimates. They've done DNA tracing, to get it that far. And there’s competing theories on why wolves came into our, into our world, if people did it, or if wolves, self domesticated, that's a theory that's out there too. But really why it's important is that's a long time, that they are eating what we'll call their ancestral natural diet. So both dogs and wolves are what's called opportunistic hunters. So in the wild, wolves and dogs, wild dogs, they have to form packs to survive, because they're not that good at what they do. meaning they're not that good at hunting on their own. They need that team to be able to do that. And that is a business relationship and the business is survival. Sometimes they get fresh prey, most of the time they're actually either scavenging or they actually graze. So they have a digestive enzyme You and I have it's called amylase, that allows them to metabolize like plant material. So in the wild wolves aren't just getting meat, and they're not only a carnivore, they actually have omnivore tendencies. They'll eat wild flowers. They will eat overripe berries, they love them in the fall and particularly berries that you and I wouldn't pick because they're too mushy, are loaded with lycopene, that is an antioxidant directly related to heart health. Now whether or not wolves know that they are absolutely drawn to them. So they do eat a lot of things because and they develop a wide variety of a diet. And it all stems from they're just not that great at hunting. Cats by comparison are true carnivores. They are flat out awesome at hunting, so they didn't have to develop…They don't have amylase in their saliva. They can't really metabolize plant material. Dogs can, wolves can, they need to in order to survive, so they can handle this wide varied diet. But they lean toward carnivores, they might have omnivore tendencies. But they absolutely perform best with a closer to a carnivore diet with maybe 15 to 20% plant material. That's really when they're at their best that we have found. So I have something really cool. Do you ever get to Minnesota?

I've never been there.

Well, okay, so I have these two lists to dos when you come. You probably don't want to come to this time of year, we're gonna have negative two degrees on Saturday as the high. so about an hour north of Minneapolis is this really cool place. It's called the Wildlife Science Center. And Peggy Callahan has been running it for 35 years. So this is a shout out to her too. And all the awesome work that she does, but on Saturdays, it's open to the public. And it's not a zoo, it is a sanctuary. She has about 110 wolves. So these wolves have come there for various reasons. Maybe mom got hit by a car. And you know, the young would die if they weren't brought somewhere. Or she had a pack of wolves that the alpha female actually taught the pack to hunt sled dogs. And so they're either getting killed or they had to be removed. So she brought them in. And so she's this wealth of information. And like, you know, Peggy, I need some cool stuff when I when I do these interviews, and I do you know, my webinars. And she told me she said that when she took it over 35 years ago, this sanctuary. The government was running it and they did a pretty good job, but they were limited budget. So they actually use kibble is what they fed the wolves, and I go all right. And she said so the first switch she made, and it turns out, it's the only dietary change she made was she worked out a deal with a DNR. In, you know, 100 square miles around the sanctuary, she gets all the roadkill deer. So her wolves’ primary diet, is road kill deer. And then she'll throw in wild flowers and you know, berries, just other things supplementally they're here and there that they would eat the wild. But they went fed kibble to that the life expectancy when they from all the records when fed kibble was 14 to 16 years, they now live 18 to 20. They have zero joint zero dental issues. And they average 130 pounds now, they actually averaged about 115 to 120. So they've gained muscle mass all by going from cooked food to uncooked food. So it helps us know what we can then apply to our four legged kids, to our dogs by using wolves and that knowledge. So wolves in the wild, they don't smell. They don't shed all over the place. They don't leave piles of poop that last three weeks. You know, all of those things are things we created that we think are normal, because of kibble, because of cooked food because of processed food. And it was created for the same reason, fast food and minute Rice was created for us convenience, it's meant we live fast lives. And we brought our dogs into that world too. And if we slow down a little bit, and take a look at this. And now we can get some knowledge from wolves and help guide us to keep our four legged kids a long, long time.

That all makes complete sense. Well, Joel, I've heard that scientists have found a genetic difference between dogs and wolves. And I think you alluded to it earlier that dogs appear to have a greater ability to digest starches, and that the wolf genome has two copies of the alpha amylase 2B, which helps to process starches. And dogs have somewhere between four and 30 copies of this gene. So some people might say when it comes to diet that treating dogs like wolves doesn't make nutritional or biological sense. What do you have to say to that?

I say that there are definite differences. If you look at just the fact that nature's survival of the fittest, and we try to keep the dog we bring the dog into the home that matches our personality that we connect with. And we don't know breeding history and all these things that can change kind of their immune and all of that. So sometimes, you know comparing them you know, you take Peggy's wolves 18 to 20 years, no joint issues average of 30 pounds. Well, we would love our large breed dogs to read like that going on to an uncooked raw diet isn't going to do that. But the trick is the raw diets that are the best, in my opinion, have about 20% plant material. And then you have the option to give treats and things like that. Remember, we're just going at that base diet, there is a fine line, you can amylase in your saliva. But that doesn't mean they can only eat they, they can have all the plant and all the starch that they that they want, there is a cap. So think of them as omnivore tendencies with kind of like a carnivore base. Peggy's wolves are based with roadkill deer, and then she gives these other things around it. Our dogs, even if that were true, that's still not enough to compensate for the level of starch and plant material that are in common kibbles out there, right. So we do want more protein from meat, we do want a higher meat content and keep that plant material at about 20%. And the results are awesome. I mean, that's, that's really what we look at is the results, how quickly, skin, eyes, teeth start to clean up, long life, muscle mass, these are all things that the raw feeders see over and over and over again. And so, you know, kind of the proof is in the pudding also. And so eliminating that, that high starch, I don't think starch should be factored in with what amylase can do. starch is bad for us. starch is bad for everything, you know, especially the processed starches. If we talk about fruits and vegetables, that's a little different. There are people that feed raw that give a lot of fruits and vegetables that they add to the raw and their dogs do great. But they're not adding high processed starch. They're not giving a pile of pizza crust or breads, like, that's where we gotta kind of draw the line. But whole living foods is a great way to roll. But there's so much this is what I love though is that Think about it. Like when Steve’s came out, there was no raw commercially prepared at the time. And then, you know, we got into grain free kibbles. Now we have, you know, specific quinoa in kibbles. And now we're talking about amylase, we couldn't have that conversation in the 80s or 90s, it would have gone over everybody's head. So for me personally, everything that you just said is more things for me to dig into more things for Steve's Real Food to consider, talk through, get the right testing and the right, you know, labs involved. And you know, the right animal scientists that we that we kind of talk through and have consult, because we want to get better. And I don't think any raw food on the market is perfect. I think we're all trying to get better every year and every year. And that really should be our goal. And so this is all new knowledge. You know, if you look at the you know how many years we've started studying this, if you're talking about 10s of years, that new, that new stuff. So we do have a long ways to go. But I love the starting point of carnivore with omnivore tendencies. I think that is a great way to kind of look at it, we're going to do a base diet, high meat, and then we can supplement with Whole Foods, fruits, vegetables, things like that. If you do that, we already know we're getting good results. Perfection is hard to hit though. So we'll keep trying on that.

I find it so funny that a lot of the dog food brands out there have pictures of wolves on their bags of kibble. And I just don't think wolves would prefer to eat kibble out of a bag versus going after prey. Just saying…

Exactly. Now, although there is this other side, to your little example there. if you had a plate of fresh carrots and broccoli and then there was a bag of chips next to you know, so that you might prefer something but the body might not. It is fascinating to watch. You know the change and the amount of changes I've seen, you know, when I first started feeding raw 20 years ago, I should say the month before I started feeding raw. I told my boss at the time, you know he he owned a distributor and I was one of the sales guys. And he brought me to the back of his warehouse and his name is Kirk Dietz and I'll make sure he listens too by the way. This was my shout out for him for bringing me into the pet industry. He walked me back to the back of his warehouse and he had this chest freezer that you might have in your garage. And he opened the door he goes Joel check it out. Raw Dog Food. And it's the best way to feed and he got all excited to tell me all of this and I shut the door and I said, I'm not gonna sell that hippie food. I don't know what that is because I was picturing leftover human food hitting the floor at the processing plant and swept into a bag. It just, it was. So out of my norm. I grew up, you see stacks of kibble in a store, and that's what you feed a dog. You know, I didn't know. So we've all had to kind of learn. And I look at as walking up through a staircase, if somebody is not comfortable yet, feeding all raw, there is enough health benefits out there that have been proven, feed, some, use it as treats, then. have their treats, be this uncooked, food that's very natural, that's fine. I'm on board with that. And if you start seeing good results, just see what happens if you add a little more. So I don't get down on anybody who is either anti raw, or because I was that person, I had to go up the staircase before I was comfortable. And I think it's totally okay, as long as they at least are open minded to listen, and just bank the information as we learn and can present it better.

That's great advice. And when I think of wolves in the wild, I mean, they must have so many different protein sources. You know, deer and moose and boar and rabbits and you know, beaver fish, what have you. So if our if we look at the way that we feed our dogs, maybe the same exact protein source day in day out, I would have to think that our dogs if given a choice, and I think when they have more protein choices, that means they have the different amino acid profiles, which has to be more nutritious. So do you recommend that we do rotate our proteins?

Constantly rotating for a couple of reasons. Number one, we would not want to eat the exact same thing day after day after day, it would get boring. So that's more on the emotional side of it. The other side of it is think 30 day health, not one day health. And I think people will do a lot better is there is there's nutrition in venison, and you can't get in chicken and vice versa. Rotate like crazy. Let's cover the gamut. Add in some goat milk too. give bones give freeze dried turkey necks then back away from those and add more of a higher protein source. It does prevent true food allergies. Now there's conditions out there that mimic food allergies, they give some of the symptoms but a true food allergy. If you have a dog that's susceptible to a true food allergy, repetition of the same thing over and over and over again, could ignite that. by rotating you can prevent that from ever happening. And so I love rotational diets, because wolves in the wild are used to this high variety. I can't use this example, if we if you and I ate the exact same thing. Let's say we had a baked potato every meal every day, you know for two years. And then your’e like, Joel I’m in town and there’s this new seafood buffet. And we went there, we could really upset our stomach. But if we ate a lot of different ethnic foods and a lot of variety, you can do a change and feel nothing. Our wolves and our dogs are the same way. So if you have a dog that has digestive upset rotate like crazy, and they welcome that it gives them a better healthier gut, work in canned food work in some good treats, stuff the Kongs with i like i like taking frozen. And I like taking cat food, canned cat food, it tends to be a higher meat content, a lot of times I put it in Kongs and I freeze it. And that's what I like to give. It's fun, it's different. It's unique. It's a different texture. It's all in the treat world though, you know a base diet is a complete raw diet. And then I have fun outside of that. And I like doing that. It makes life more interesting for the dog. The way I feed is if I change, flavors, formulas, or form every once in awhile I work in some freeze dried just for fun. I have special jobs that my Doberman has to do for each different food. And that's how I let her know what's coming. So when I make a food switch, she has a specific command, and then I switch and then she knows something different is coming her way.

That's a great idea.

Well, food is the biggest, single biggest We are the number one resource for our dogs. And you combine it with their second biggest resource which is food and that's their most personal interaction with you. And that's the best time you're going to have to feed them anyways. We're busy people . Make that interaction count. It's kind of the way I look at it. And it just gives you this awesome opportunity. I'll take freeze dried, you know, we got snow all over here right now. And I'll go to the tennis courts by my house, shut the gates, and just throw, freeze dried raw in the snow, and then Bimi has to find it. It's fun, it's entertaining. You know, it keeps them. But variety does that variety allows you to do those things. And then she can have something special and new and unique. That wasn't on the menu before. Once you establish variety, they can handle a lot of change. And it makes it a lot more fun. For both you in the dog.

Great, great advice. Well, as we're coming to a close, Joel, I was gonna ask you, I've read that wolves can eat seven pounds of food in a day. But they might not eat again for several days. So that brings me to the question of should we fast our dogs and give their digestive system a break?

There's one of those debates that can go either way. I do not fast my dog? Because I think about it as is that really by design? Or is that prey and food availability? And so that's one of the things I asked Peggy too and she's like, she doesn't fast her wolves. You know, she's like, that's kind of a availability thing. And I just lean toward her because her wolves, you know, average 130 pounds in captivity or 18 to 20 years. I like that. I want to follow that. And I can go either way. I've seen people get awesome results. When they fast once in a while. I just look at it as I lean more toward what if the prey was available? And would they be eating it. And that kind of comes down to wolves and dogs are opportunistic hunters, they don't know when their next food is coming. So they eat it all that's in front of them not knowing if it's gonna come? When would they be like if it was readily available. And I tend to lean towards that personally, I have no objections to people who do fast their dog once in a while, just be very careful with it. Because I've heard that they've gotten great results too. So I think this is one of those. We're still learning things, which makes it exciting. Because next year, we might do a podcast with the answer. Who knows? But right now we're still learning. Yeah.

So Joel, why don't you talk briefly about Steve's because I am a huge fan, what goes into the formulation of your food and what sets you guys apart?

We're an 80/20. Raw meaning 80% meat, meat by food definition is muscle meats, organ meats, and ground bone. And then the other 20 is going to be fruits, vegetables, you know, any kind of power foods in there that we add. And then we add goat milk to our entire line, if there was a separator amongst the raw brands that commercially prepared raw foods, and just so you know, I don't believe that there is a best brand, I believe that Steve's is the best food for me, because I love our commitment to the environment. I love that we're education first, that matches my lifestyle and the way I want to be. So there are other great brands too. And we all have small differences. We're all taking that same core knowledge. And then we kind of put our extended research on top, our extended research is, we add goat milk to the entire line, because we believe so strongly in gut health and goat milk is naturally loaded with probiotics. So there's a high level of goat milk in there to get a good healthy gut for our dogs. And so that is a, that's a big differentiator for us, that we get really good results on. I think we do a good job of being very transparent with our sources. So you know, competitors don't call up our sources and, and negotiate for them. But we're very transparent. I've visited some of the farms, I've been to the goat farm. And it was awesome. And the goats they're not only, you know, taken very good care of they retire on site. So this whole past year, that's their retirement, and looking at how much fun they were having. I want my retirement to look like theirs, right? They are well, cared for, they are happy and loving it. And that matters to me. You know that? That doesn't matter to everybody. You know, they're looking at their dog, and that's what matters to them. Well, I kind of I'm just a big picture thinker. And so, you know, we're part of a green initiative to you know, we're trying to get biodegradable bags, we're trying to do things that help beyond just feeding the dogs well. And so those are things that are unique to us. That's for you know, that's what makes it the best brand for me. And it's not always the best for others, but it absolutely is. The best for me. And on top of that, it just flat out performs. Yeah. And I think that's, that's the big one, right there is performance. You know, we've been around since 1998, with a lot of healthy dogs to show for it, like lots of awesome stories, healing stories. And, you know, that's kind of what we go by, is, wow, we just keep getting validated for this excellence. And that's what drives us.

That's so cool. Well, and it's so easy to feed as well. And if anybody listening is interested in trying Steve's Real Food, they are in most dog boutiques. So ask your local retailer, or if you would like it delivered right to your front door, we are offering a discount, so you just have to go to RawPetFood.com. Use the code WOL10. And get 10% off of your order. And I have a feeling that your dog will be very thankful that you do that. Joel, where can everyone find out more information about you and Steve's Real Food?

StevesRealFood.com, absolutely. Visit our website. There's some great knowledge in there. There's blogs, there's all kinds of extended information. There are studies that have been done. My email is [email protected] And I do not mind people emailing me saying I've got this German Shepherd with this. any guidance you can give me and I'll do my best to take that first step and and to help out. My favorite part of my world is the teaching portion. You know that that's what I love to do, and taking care of as many four legged kids as I can. So well, I should say, dogs and cats. I can't help you with a hedgehog or an eguana, although I think they're cool. I can't really help you with those.

Okay, just dogs and cats then.

Yep.

All right Joel, thank you so much for sharing with us today. Appreciate it.

OFFER: You too can try Steve’s Real Food by going to RawPetFood.com and Use code WOL10 to get 10% off of your order!

Joel, where can everyone find out more information about you and Steve’s Real Food?

Stevesrealfood.com

[email protected]

Social Media: FB & IG @StevesRealFood

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