Ian Anderson is nothing short of a legend. As the visionary flutist, frontman behind the famed English band, Jethro Tull, Anderson has been making groundbreaking music for six full decades. Jethro Tull first emerged on to the UK pop scene in the mid-to-late 1960s as part of the enormous wave of bands seeking to find fame in the wake of the massive success of the Beatles and the Stones. Throughout a winding, explorative career, Jethro Tull has amassed one of the most unique and varied catalogs in the annals of rock history.

Growing up in Scotland and Northern England in the years immediately following World War Two, Anderson’s childhood was littered with the after effects of the world’s deadliest ever conflict. As a youngster, Anderson soaked up the cultural impact of the war through comics and cartoons. Later, in his teenage years, he would come to learn about the horrific treatment of minorities in America through the records he would soak up that came into his port city from across the pond.

Energized by a young, vibrant Elvis Presley, Anderson dove headlong into the world of music.At first, he used the blues as a way to understand the possibilities of music, and then was gobsmacked by a pair of seminal psych records from the summer of 1967.

In that same summer of 1967, Jethro Tull were part of a seminal moment in English music history. Along with The Pink Floyd, Tyrannosaurus Rex, and Roy Harper, Jethro Tull would play the very first iteration of the Hyde Park Summer Concert Series in London. This famed concert series has been home to some of the most legendary acts in rock history, and Jethro Tull was there to Christen the event on its opening night.

Ian Anderson describes his life in music as a sort of expeditionary force that is at sea on a perilous, artistic voyage. There is something almost perfect about the nautical analogy of deep exploration through the wilds of a writer’s own imagination and talents. To paraphrase our recent guest Josh Ritter, each record is like a postcard back home from that exploration. Anderson, for his part, has been sailing these creative seas for some sixty years now and shows no signs of slowing down.

Here is a riveting, and relatively short conversation with a man that can only be described as a true legend.

Cheers,

Matty C

Josh Ritter describes making a record as a sonic postcard home from the world of living as an artist. As a performer and singer/songwriter, Ritter has seen a great swath of the world has to offer, and he has lived a life outside the normal confines of modern life. Living as an artist forces one to live a life of openness, and vulnerability. A songwriter’s job is to broadcast myriad often, subtle observations on the human condition that are able to make the listener feel that they have been seen, heard, and understood. It is within the connections that Josh Ritter mines for gold.

In Ritter’s mind, a finished album is the tangible result of one portion of the never-ending journey for an artist. A set of songs is a snapshot into the mind of the artist at the moment the record was made, but it’s also a direct response and representation to the world that is going on around us.

When an artist releases a record, it no longer belongs to just the people that made it. It becomes a living, breathing organism when strangers interact with it and are moved by it in some way. The listener is allowed, and even encouraged to insert his or her own perspectives and experiences into the song or the record, to make the finished work that much greater.

Ritter describes songwriting as a sort of hallway in which he installs a variety of doors and a little bit of architectural framework around the hallway, allowing listeners to pass through the doors and connect with Josh and his songs even for just a few minutes at a time in that imaginary space.

During this riveting discussion, Josh shares his perspectives on songwriting, sharing art, and why we should all be knocking on the door of joy every day of our lives. Over the course of a career that has stretched on for the last 25 years, Ritter has beautifully woven together words and music to create a catalog of songs focused on the beauty of human connection.

We also hit upon the great Roger Miller, the empathetic bravery of artists that is so often overlooked, my theory on why artists are like Jack Nicholson’s character in A Few Good Men, and so much more.

Let’s get into it.

Cheers,

Matty C

As a youngster in Little Rock, Arkansas, Ben Nichols wasn’t really sure what to do with himself. His brother Jeff had begun acting in the local children’s theatre at the age of ten, and by high school seemed destined for a life in and around the movies. With an innate curiosity and an eye for literature, Ben considered an English degree after high school, but he failed to find his calling in the prickly tedium of dissecting fiction. He turned instead to the world of reality, obtaining a history degree from a small college in his home state.

Throughout his academic exploits, Ben worked at the craft of writing songs. He’d first been moved to start a band in high school, inspired by local kids who put on makeshift shows at the riverside pavilion in Little Rock. Ben loved playing in bands, but he found his true calling in the dirty work of songwriting. He became obsessive about each word, each punctuation mark, and every minute detail.

By his early 20s, Ben had formed Lucero, and began touring with the band almost constantly. During their more than 25 year run, Lucero have played stages around the world, and amassed a vast, and varied catalog of music that is centered around the songs of Ben Nichols. Lucero’s tunes are often, in the words of Nichols, “about whiskey and heartbreak”, but they are also steeped in personal experience, and even family history.

Ben and I spend much of the early portion of our interview talking about the terrific Lucero tune, ‘The War’ which tells the story of a young man’s experience in World War Two. The song is littered with many of the real life experiences that Ben’s own grandfather endured from D-Day through to the end of the War. While the tune is filled with personal touches and moments of history, it is also deeply resonant with themes of sacrifice, faith, and fear.

At the relatively late age of 42, Ben became a father. We discuss how that massive life change has affected his songwriting, his touring, and his outlook on life. Ben also shares the ways that the economic landscape has changed significantly for Lucero since the pandemic fell upon us. Costs have risen, ticket sales have shrunk, and Ben isn’t sure what this all means for the band he has fronted for almost thirty years.

Ben will also be out on a solo tour in the western part of the US starting on Nov. 5 with a fiddle player and pedal steel player in support of his recent solo album, In The Heart Of The Mountain. It was terrific to catch up with one of my favorite songwriters right before we both hit the road at opposite ends of the country.

Let’s get into it.

Cheers,

Matty C

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Be sure to catch me on the road during most of November with my dear friend, Jeffery Gower. You can find a full list of dates and even get the chance to have us play a concert at your place at https://www.phonophorerecords.com/sheddiointhesouth

The What Am I Making podcast is hosted, written, and produced by me, Matty C. 

Our theme music was written and recorded by David J. Baldwin

You can subscribe to our show wherever you get your podcasts. Please be sure to like, rate and review the show if you enjoy it. 

Our work is solely sponsored by listeners and readers like you. Please lend your support today with a paid subscription at whatamimaking.substack.com/. Now is a crucial time for new paid subscribers. Please step up and support the show. 

You can email the show anytime at [email protected]. You can also leave us a voicemail with your questions or concerns at speakpipe.com/whatamimaking

In 2017, music writer John McKie sat down to pen an in-depth piece focused on the greatness of Prince’s 1987 album, Sign O’ The Times. McKie describes the finished essay as an honorable failure. It was good enough for the moment, but he was left cold by the uncharted territory not covered in the piece. John longed to trace the path of Prince from his beginnings as an artist through his impressive catalog to excavate how an artist like Prince could conceive of an album like Sign O’ The Times.

In March of 2020, John lost his Dad, and within a matter of days, he found the world shuttered in the wake of the Coronavirus pandemic. With time on his hands and the influence of his Dad’s death, John set to work researching Prince’s history. He interviewed dozens of people involved in one way or another with Prince’s work and life. Through this vast research, McKie began to form a picture of a supremely talented individual fueled by self-doubt, and a profound desire to prove his own worth.

John shares the story of Prince’s legendary gigs at the famed Ritz in Los Angeles, which were attended by some of the biggest stars of the era. These mythic shows helped Prince to land a pair of opening slots for the Rolling Stones at the massive LA Coliseum. Unfortunately, the Stones’ audience were none too kind to the young, black, funk performer from the Upper Midwest. McKie explains how this traumatic experience might have been the fuel that powered an artistic explosion that would play out over the next seven years of Prince’s career.

During our chat, John and I look at Prince’s maniacal artistic pace, and the pressure that he put upon the musicians and crew-people that worked for him. We explore the artistic and financial motivations behind Prince’s switch from his own name to a logo; another move that may have been influenced by The Rolling Stones.

This is a fascinating conversation about a man who is one of the few musicians that could accurately be described as a truly visionary artist. During our chat John manages to humanize Prince, and allows us to see some of the humanity behind the myth. You’re sure to find something to love within this discussion even if you’re a Prince agnostic.

Cheers,

Matty C

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Thanks so much to John for joining me. You can find his new book, Prince: A Sign Of The Times at UKbookshop.org or wherever you get your books.

Be sure to catch me on the road during most of November with my dear friend, Jeffery Gower. You can find a full list of dates and even get the chance to have us play a concert at your place at https://www.phonophorerecords.com/sheddiointhesouth

The What Am I Making podcast is hosted, written, and produced by me, Matty C. 

Our theme music was written and recorded by David J. Baldwin

You can subscribe to our show wherever you get your podcasts. Please be sure to like, rate and review the show if you enjoy it. 

Our work is solely sponsored by listeners and readers like you. Please lend your support today with a paid subscription at whatamimaking.substack.com/. Now is a crucial time for new paid subscribers. Please step up and support the show. 

You can email the show anytime at [email protected]. You can also leave us a voicemail with your questions or concerns at speakpipe.com/whatamimaking

If you have paid much attention to the worlds of indie rock, freak folk, and independent film in the last four decades, it’s likely that you have encountered some of the work of singer, songwriter, and actor Will Oldham. Oldham was born into a Louisville, KY family that was home to a robust record collection, and a deep regard for art and music.

As a teenager, Oldham began acting in the Lousiville theater scene and quickly landed a role as a feisty young preacher in the John Sayles film, Matewan. The experience helped him to understand the ingredients for healthy artistic collaboration. The experience also set the bar pretty high in Oldham’s mind as to what could be achieved when a group of artists and craftspeople all pull in unison in one artistic direction.

By the time he had finished high school, his parents had gifted him a guitar and he’d begun to learn to play familiar songs and quickly began writing his own. With his brothers, he formed a nascent band they dubbed Palace Flophouse. Will, and his brothers with varying degrees of input would make records under a variety of monikers like Palace Music, Palace Bros., or even simply Palace throughout much of the 1990s.

By the late 90’s, Oldham had settled upon the moniker of Bonnie ‘Prince’ Billy, releasing a string of critically acclaimed records that featured songs that were eventually covered by a series of massive artists including Johnny Cash, who recorded a version of the Bonnie ‘Prince’ Billy tune, ‘I See A Darkness’.

In addition to an extensive catalog of releases centered around his own songs, Oldham is a supreme interpreter of other songwriters as well. He’s made a series of recordings that feature terrific cover versions, including a pair of records done in tribute to the Everly Brothers and Merle Haggard respectively.

Bonnie ‘Prince’ Billy continues to record and tour with regularity. As Will and I discussed in our chat, he had just been booking hotel rooms for a show in Indiana the afternoon that we sat down together. And while he has learned to truly harness the joy of live performance, something that came to him later in his career, Will has grave concerns about the state of the music business, and the way fans are currently investing in and engaging with the music they enjoy.

This is a roving and riveting discussion with a truly visionary, and one of a kind artist. Will shares how human relationships have always been at the core of his work, and talks about the ways that he and his band use as much local crew as possible at their tour stops to connect with local music communities in a more foundational way. We explore the artistic endeavor of being an audience member, and we take a look at how letting your guard down leads to the most magical moments of all.

Cheers,

Matty C

Emily White describes herself as a Music Technologist. Fresh out of college and in the early years of the rise of digital streaming, Emily landed a job at Billboard magazine where she saw first hand the ways that these new technologies were quickly and drastically changing the music industry. She describes her time at Billboard as something like getting a degree in the music business.

During her Billboard stint, Emily became ever more deeply fascinated by the ways that technology changes the ways that we interact with and relate to music. Even in those nascent years of digital streaming, Emily could see that the world was changing its relationship to music in seismic ways.

Fascinated by the user experience, the potential of digital streaming and the art of product development, Emily then went to work at Spotify as a founding member of the team that would go on to create the Spotify For Artists app, a resource for musicians to better harness the power of digital streaming for the benefit of their career. Emily uses her extensive experience at Spotify to offer a fascinating perspective on the biggest player in the digital streaming space. We discuss the challenges for artists in a world where music has become ubiquitous and extremely affordable.

Emily does her very best to explain the complicated math behind the royalties being paid out to artists via streaming. It is a byzantine system that is based on play counts, streaming shares, user account details, and other nebulous and often confusing factors. Emily points out that it’s almost impossible to know a definitive per song streaming rate from any of the digital service providers, and she reckons there is probably not much difference between what one provider is paying over another.

As Emily points out, Spotify is a really good product for the end user. It works with any smart phone, requires no storage or downloads, and provides the overwhelming majority of recorded music on the go for just a few bucks a month. For all of the complications that streaming is causing within the musical ecosystem, it’s going to take more than goodwill and a morally upright message for musicians to begin to get paid appropriately for their recorded work.

This is another strand in the story of art versus economics. Consumers right now are winning, while artists lose out on proper compensation. As artists have struggled to make ends meet with those diminishing streaming royalties, we have seen a significant bump in the cost of concert tickets, which leads to Emily and I discussing the recent comments by Michael Rapino, the CEO of LiveNation, wherein he claimed that concert tickets were too reasonably priced compared to other live events like sports and theater. It is just another sign that the corporate jackals circling the music industry have zero interest in art and are instead laser focused on the cash grab.

In her work as a music and technology writer, Emily has recently been focused on the resurgence of college radio. Emily has watched as student engagement has soared at stations across the country, with some seeing their participation rate doubling within the last few years. Students across the country are using these stations as third spaces on campus, creating community and connection as well as playing music and doing local reporting. In many ways, it is also a generational refutation from a growing number of students that have grown disaffected by the temporal nature of the digital world in which they have been raised.

This is a captivating conversation with a brilliant writer and thinker who has seen how the digital sausage is made. Come join me and Emily White as we dive into the world of technology, music, and art vs. economics. Let’s get into it.

Cheers,Matty C

Matt Kadane and his brother Bubba knew they were destined to make music together by the time they had reached Middle School. Growing up in the small city of Wichita Falls, Texas, the brothers were raised in a musical family. Their grandmother was a terrific ragtime piano player. Their father was obsessed with jazz, pop, and the burgeoning outlaw country movement emanating from Austin, Texas. Music was a constant in their home, and as soon as they were old enough, the boys began music lessons.

Eventually, the brothers would go on to form the great indie outfit Bedhead in the late 1980s. The band was slow, laconic, deliberate, and minimal. It was the perfect antidote to grunge, when that movement stormed the musical gates in 1991. Undaunted by the new sounds of that era, Bedhead doubled down on their commitment to slower songs and stripped back arrangements.

During our discussion, Matt shares the story of building Bedhead from a band of brotherly love into a fully functional four piece that would garner critical acclaim, and allow the band to tour the world extensively. We talk about the ephemeral nature of shows that happened in an era before smart phones and social media. Those were nights that existed in a moment, and then were gone forever, making them seem all the more sacred.

Bedhead were unfortunately lumped into a 1990s subgenre dubbed “slowcore” that also featured bands like Codeine and Low. Matt and I talk about the reductive nature of lazily lumping subcultures together based on nothing more than the most obvious parts of the music. That train of thought then leads us to a fulsome discussion of why we remember what we remember from a given era, often leading to just one or two artists from a movement being canonized, while the rest of the movement just fades away in time.

We learn the lessons behind the ending of Bedhead as Matt began to pursue a Ph.D and a career in academia. Still, the songs kept calling, and Matt and Bubba soon mounted a new band they dubbed, The New Year. That outfit featured a new rhythm section, but carried on many of the same auditory hallmarks of Bedhead.

Eventually, Matt secured his doctorate and began a teaching career as a history professor, leaving music on the backburner. Still, even when talking with Matt Kadane, Ph.D today, you can still feel the fires of indie rock burning bright within him.

Come join me and Matt Kadane for a great chat about brotherly love, slowing things down, and a whole bunch more.

Cheers,

Matty C

Our work is solely sponsored by listeners and readers like you. Please lend your support today with a paid subscription at whatamimaking.substack.com/. Now is a crucial time for new paid subscribers. Please step up and support the show.

Please consider a contribution to our crowdfunding campaign for the live record with me and The Wild Honey Collective.

You can email the show anytime at [email protected]. You can also leave us a voicemail with your questions or concerns at speakpipe.com/whatamimaking

In 2016, Sarah Kendzior’s family began a series of vacations across the American continent. Sarah, her husband, and their two children embarked on a series of lengthy road trips over several years in an attempt to fully experience the beauty of America; its landscapes, and its people. Kendzior hoped that she could show her children the most beautiful and bizarre places that this nation has to offer before America is irrevocably changed by this current wave of fascism and oligarchy.

This year, Kendzior published, The Last Great American Road Trip, a memoir of these family journeys and her family’s exploration of America. While these were joyous family vacations they were often tinged with darkness and a sense of the terror yet to come. In the book Kendzior “contemplates a love for country in a broken heartland”.

During our discussion, Sarah and I dive into our fragile relationship with the beautiful place we call home. Sarah shares the feeling that she had when she discovered the American west with its open skies, snowy peaks, and craggy deserts. Upon discovering that I am a Michigander, Sarah espouses her affection for the Pictured Rocks lakeshore, and we ponder whether a National Park along the Lake Michigan lakeshore would have a net positive impact on the region.

Sarah and I work to dispel the myth of the “Two Americas” idea, by sharing our own experiences of crisscrossing the country and interacting with folks who hold myriad viewpoints and beliefs, all while being mostly decent people. We talk about the cultural heft of the American south and the ridiculous notion of “letting the south go”. We also remember the heady days when oligarchs at least built libraries and opera houses instead of rockets.

I extol the virtues of the $75 annual national park pass that I made the most of last year, while Sarah and I worry deeply about the future of the National Park system in the hands of the Trump administration. There is extensive talk of the verdant subcultures that populate every region of our enormous country. We discuss being in God’s train set at Glacier, feeling ourselves gasp at the Grand Canyon, and learning how to tell the truth about America, warts and all.

Come travel the country, and maybe find the real America with me and Sarah Kendzior.

Cheers,

Matty C

This week, we are turning the tables at the WAIM podcast as I cede the captain’s chair to become the guest on my own show. My longtime friends and frequent collaborators, Barry and Abigail Hummel of the great Pops on Hops podcast will be de facto hosts this week as they quiz me and my bandmate/dear friend Jeffery Gower about the classic Stick Arounds album Ways To Hang On, about our upcoming tour to the South later this Fall.

For those not familiar, Pops on Hops is a father/daughter podcast that centers around music and beer. The hosts, Barry and Abigail Hummel share an album and a selection of beers in each episode to bridge musical generations and expand their collective palettes. In addition to being big music fans and hosts of a great podcast, the Hummels have long been big fans and supporters of my creative work. In 2023 and 2024, I made treks south to Gainesville, where Abigail lives, to play at gigs generously arranged by the Hummels.

This November, Barry and Abigail are having me back down for another visit, this time with my bandmate and dear friend, Jeffery Gower along for the ride. To help get the word out about the tour and to give us an excuse to share a beer together via Zoom, Jeff and I convened in the Sheddio and spent a wonderful couple of hours with the Hummels.

During the discussion, we sample a trio of craft beers and cider from the Sunshine state, including breweries located in the cities we’ll be playing on the tour. Barry and Abigail also put the 2018 Stick Arounds album, Ways To Hang On under the Pops On Hops microscope. They each share their three favorite songs from the record, and invite me and Jeff to open up about where the songs came from, what they mean, and how they came to form our best recorded work as a band.

Come and learn a bit more about a Stick Arounds classic, a few new alcoholic offerings, and a whole load of musical love.

Cheers,

Matty C

Thanks so much to Barry and Abigail for captaining this week’s episode. Thanks also to my dear friend and bandmate Jeffery Gower for joining us as well.

You can learn more about Pops on Hops at https://popsonhopspod.com/ and be sure to go to https://www.phonophorerecords.com/sheddiointhesouth to learn all of the details about my upcoming tour with Jeff to Florida and back.

The What Am I Making podcast is hosted, written, and produced by me, Matty C. 

Our theme music was written and recorded by David J. Baldwin

You can subscribe to our show wherever you get your podcasts. Please be sure to like, rate and review the show if you enjoy it. 

Our work is solely sponsored by listeners and readers like you. Please lend your support today with a paid subscription at whatamimaking.substack.com/. Now is a crucial time for new paid subscribers. Please step up and support the show. 

Please consider a contribution to our crowdfunding campaign for the live record with me and The Wild Honey Collective. Link in the show notes. 

You can email the show anytime at [email protected]. You can also leave us a voicemail with your questions or concerns at speakpipe.com/whatamimaking

Terra Lopez has been making music and touring for the last fifteen years. She began her career as a founding member of the duo Sister Crayon which later adopted the moniker, Rituals of Mine. Over her career, which included a stop at a major record label, Terra has built an impressive loyal following. Until the Covid outbreak that audience was a viable outlet for her to earn a nice profit regularly touring the country with a small band and crew.

In 2023, when Lopez toured with the same structure she had been using for more than a decade, she ended up losing money on the entire endeavor. It was yet another sign of the changing landscape for independent artists.

Terra brings all of this experience and more to her day job at Backline, a non profit that connects music industry professionals and their families with mental health and wellness resources. Working with more than 1,500 mental health professionals, Backline has already helped more than 77,000 music industry professionals gain access to crucial mental health services, all for free..

During our chat, Terra and I cover the host of unique mental health needs of the music community; from the financial stress of a creative lifestyle to the unrelenting workload required to simply stay relevant and financially stable in a world dominated by social media content. We talk intensely about how all art is political, despite its subject matter. We also discuss the separated lives of touring musicians, and the stop/start nature of the artist’s existence.

I get some amazing advice from Terra about how to handle toxic positivity and how to help manage my own trauma and grief, or at least my own perception of it. We chat about creating the spaces that you need to be your truest self, and Terra shares a poem that is the best antidote for imposter syndrome that I have ever heard.

This is a remarkable talk with a woman who is making great music and changing lives with her advocacy work. In essence Terra Lopez is doing double duty while she works to make the music industry a safer, kinder, and more equitable space for everyone.

Cheers,

Matty C

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