This is part two of my interview with Nichole Schmidt, the Mother of Gabby Petito.

Most of you remember the Gabby Petito story as it unfolded on national news across this country.

When the reports said this young woman, traveling in a van out west with her boyfriend, had not been heard from for days, I admit I thought he probably killed her. Unfortunately, my intuition was correct.

I wanted to speak with Gabby's parents right away, but guessed it would never happen. But now it did.

In two episodes, I speak with Gabby's mother, Nichole Schmidt, on the WHEN DATING HURTS podcast.

QUICK NOTES:

• You will hear us mention a documentary in our chat. It is the 2025 Gabby Petito documentary you can see on Netflix. It is worth your time.

• Also, Gabby's parents were divorced when she was very young, but they stayed in close touch in an amicable fashion. Gabby's mother and father married others, and all four parents are involved in the Gabby Petito Foundation.

The Gabby Petito Foundation is driving real change in the fight against domestic violence and missing persons. Inspired by Gabby's legacy, their mission is to take action on the front lines, partnering with organizations and equipping communities and first responders with the tools, training, and support they need to prevent and respond collectively to violence, and to protect those at risk.

Gabby Petito Foundation

Gabby's Blog

Get Involved with Gabby Petito Foundation

Thank you for listening and subscribing to the WHEN DATING HURTS Podcast.

Bill Mitchell

NOTE:

If you are a survivor and want to share your story of abuse on the WHEN DATING HURTS Podcast, please email me: ⁠⁠⁠⁠[email protected]⁠⁠⁠⁠

The ⁠⁠⁠⁠WHEN DATING HURTS book⁠⁠⁠⁠ (in paperback, eBook, and audiobook) can be found on Amazon.

HELPFUL RESOURCES:

• National Domestic Violence Hotline – ⁠⁠⁠⁠The Hotline.org ⁠⁠⁠⁠– Call 800-799-SAFE

• ⁠⁠⁠⁠LoveIsRespect⁠⁠⁠⁠ – Call 866-331-9474

• RAINN (Rape Abuse Incest National Network) – ⁠⁠⁠⁠RAINN.org⁠⁠⁠⁠ – Call 800-656-4673

• SUICIDE HELPLINE: Call 988

Thank you for listening to our WHEN DATING HURTS podcast,

Bill Mitchell

⁠⁠⁠⁠WhenDatingHurts.com⁠⁠⁠⁠

DISCLAIMER:

The WHEN DATING HURTS Podcast is providing this platform for information to be shared. We do not state with any certainty that anything is true or untrue. Understand that what you hear is the viewpoint of the people sharing. The information, opinions, and recommendations presented in this Podcast are for general information only. Any reliance on the information provided in this Podcast is done at your own risk. This Podcast should not be considered professional advice.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This is part one of our two-part interview with Nichole Schmidt , the Mother of Gabby Petito.

Most of you remember the Gabby Petito story as it unfolded on national news across this country.

When the reports said this young woman, traveling in a van out west with her boyfriend, had not been heard from for days, I admit I thought he probably killed her. Unfortunately, my intuition was correct.

I wanted to speak with Gabby's parents right away, but guessed it would never happen. But now it did.

In two episodes, I speak with Gabby's mother, Nichole Schmidt, on the WHEN DATING HURTS podcast.

QUICK NOTES:

• You will hear us mention a documentary in our chat. It is the 2025 Gabby Petito documentary you can see on Netflix. It is worth your time.

• Also, Gabby's parents were divorced when she was very young, but they stayed in close touch in an amicable fashion. Gabby's mother and father married others, and all four parents are involved in the Gabby Petito Foundation.

The Gabby Petito Foundation is driving real change in the fight against domestic violence and missing persons. Inspired by Gabby's legacy, their mission is to take action on the front lines, partnering with organizations and equipping communities and first responders with the tools, training, and support they need to prevent and respond collectively to violence, and to protect those at risk.

⁠Gabby Petito Foundation⁠

⁠Gabby's Blog⁠

⁠Get Involved with Gabby Petito Foundation⁠

Thank you for listening and subscribing to the WHEN DATING HURTS Podcast.

Bill Mitchell

NOTE:

If you are a survivor and want to share your story of abuse on the WHEN DATING HURTS Podcast, please email me: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠[email protected]⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

The ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠WHEN DATING HURTS book⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ (in paperback, eBook, and audiobook) can be found on Amazon.

HELPFUL RESOURCES:

• National Domestic Violence Hotline – ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠The Hotline.org ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠– Call 800-799-SAFE

• ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠LoveIsRespect⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ – Call 866-331-9474

• RAINN (Rape Abuse Incest National Network) – ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠RAINN.org⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ – Call 800-656-4673

• SUICIDE HELPLINE: Call 988

Thank you for listening to our WHEN DATING HURTS podcast,

Bill Mitchell

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠WhenDatingHurts.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

DISCLAIMER:

The WHEN DATING HURTS Podcast is providing this platform for information to be shared. We do not state with any certainty that anything is true or untrue. Understand that what you hear is the viewpoint of the people sharing. The information, opinions, and recommendations presented in this Podcast are for general information only. Any reliance on the information provided in this Podcast is done at your own risk. This Podcast should not be considered professional advice.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

We are bringing back one of our most educational episodes. It was recorded a few years back soon after we met Nurse Laura Clary at the Greater Baltimore Medical Center. Listen to Ms.Clary and see domestic violence from her point of view as a professional.

Few have as many credentials added to their names as this amazing woman. Allow me to introduce you to Laura Clary, BSN, RN, FNE-A/P, SANE-A.

Laura has been a registered nurse for 11 years. In 2010, she completed her Forensic Nursing training at Greater Baltimore Medical Center and joined the GBMC team as a Forensic Nurse Examiner. She has been the Clinical Program Manager of the GBMC SAFE (Sexual Assault Forensic Examination) & Domestic Violence Program since 2014.

Laura is certified to care for patients who have been victims of sexual assault, rape, child abuse/neglect, intimate partner violence, and human trafficking. Laura obtained her National professional certification as a Sexual Assault Nurse Examiner from the International Association of Forensic Nurses in 2013.

Laura is a Board of Nursing approved Forensic Nurse Examiner Instructor and an active member of the International Association of Forensic Nurses, as well as the Maryland Child Abuse Medical Providers (CHAMP), and is Chair of the Baltimore County Sexual Assault Response team.

In May of 2017, she was nationally recognized when she was awarded the title of “America’s Most Amazing Nurse” by Prevention Magazine and additionally awarded Baltimore County, Maryland’s Woman of the Year in 2018.

She sees the worst that can happen. That's when she brings her best.

Thank you for listening to our WHEN DATING HURTS podcast.

Bill Mitchell

⁠WhenDatingHurts.com⁠

NOTE:

If you are a survivor and want to share your story of abuse on the WHEN DATING HURTS Podcast, please email me: ⁠[email protected]⁠

The ⁠WHEN DATING HURTS book⁠ (in paperback, eBook, and audiobook) can be found on Amazon.

HELPFUL RESOURCES:

• National Domestic Violence Hotline – ⁠The Hotline.org ⁠– Call 800-799-SAFE

• ⁠LoveIsRespect⁠ – Call 866-331-9474

• RAINN (Rape Abuse Incest National Network) – ⁠RAINN.org⁠ – Call 800-656-4673

• SUICIDE HELPLINE: Call 988

DISCLAIMER:

The WHEN DATING HURTS Podcast is providing this platform for information to be shared. We do not state with any certainty that anything is true or untrue. Understand that what you hear is the viewpoint of the people sharing. The information, opinions, and recommendations presented in this Podcast are for general information only. Any reliance on the information provided in this Podcast is done at your own risk. This Podcast should not be considered professional advice.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In this episode, you will hear what the world says about WHEN DATING HURTS heading into 2026.

An open-ended search underscored what we have been trying to accomplish is being achieved. We could not be happier. You should listen.

We gathered a lot of information, then we used a computer-generated voice to read it back for us.

In 2026, we look forward to delivering more episodes with survivors describing how they regained their lives. It's our hope new survivor stories will give current victims the tools they need to regain their precious freedom. That is the core mission of WHEN DATING HURTS.

Bill Mitchell

NOTE:

If you are a survivor and want to share your story of abuse on the WHEN DATING HURTS Podcast, please email me: ⁠⁠[email protected]⁠⁠

The ⁠⁠WHEN DATING HURTS book⁠⁠ (in paperback, eBook, and audiobook) can be found on Amazon.

HELPFUL RESOURCES:

• National Domestic Violence Hotline – ⁠⁠The Hotline.org ⁠⁠– Call 800-799-SAFE

• ⁠⁠LoveIsRespect⁠⁠ – Call 866-331-9474

• RAINN (Rape Abuse Incest National Network) – ⁠⁠RAINN.org⁠⁠ – Call 800-656-4673

• SUICIDE HELPLINE: Call 988

Thank you for listening to our WHEN DATING HURTS podcast,

Bill Mitchell

⁠⁠WhenDatingHurts.com⁠⁠

DISCLAIMER:

The WHEN DATING HURTS Podcast is providing this platform for information to be shared. We do not state with any certainty that anything is true or untrue. Understand that what you hear is the viewpoint of the people sharing. The information, opinions, and recommendations presented in this Podcast are for general information only. Any reliance on the information provided in this Podcast is done at your own risk. This Podcast should not be considered professional advice.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Has it ended? Not yet. Not in the mind of Marcus.

We are re-releasing this episode because it is so strong showing the warning signs we mention so often on WHEN DATING HURTS.

Jill began dating Marcus when she was 16. He was a few years older but seemed to be everything she wanted. Unfortunately, he brought plenty of trouble with him.

Listen to Jill, who lives in Canada, as she takes us through falling in love with a guy who used all the classic tactics seen in unhealthy relationships. No matter what she faced with him, she continued to think he was "the one", and she stayed with him nine long years. 

You will witness how hard it is to break off a relationship even when it holds few upsides. See how getting out rests on the ability of the abused person to find all of the strength needed to get out and stay out.

Jill does not hold back in her description of balancing her troublesome love life and a home life with difficult parents. She had nowhere to turn. 

You might share this episode with teens who need to hear it. Let Jill educate those you care about and worry about. Her story will stay with them and you. Here is someone who lived what she talks about.

Thank you for listening to our WHEN DATING HURTS podcast,

Bill Mitchell

⁠WhenDatingHurts.com⁠

NOTE:

If you are a survivor and want to share your story of abuse on the WHEN DATING HURTS Podcast, please email me: ⁠[email protected]⁠

The ⁠WHEN DATING HURTS book⁠ (in paperback, eBook, and audiobook) can be found on Amazon.

HELPFUL RESOURCES:

• National Domestic Violence Hotline – ⁠The Hotline.org ⁠– Call 800-799-SAFE

• ⁠LoveIsRespect⁠ – Call 866-331-9474

• RAINN (Rape Abuse Incest National Network) – ⁠RAINN.org⁠ – Call 800-656-4673

• SUICIDE HELPLINE: Call 988

DISCLAIMER:

The WHEN DATING HURTS Podcast is providing this platform for information to be shared. We do not state with any certainty that anything is true or untrue. Understand that what you hear is the viewpoint of the people sharing. The information, opinions, and recommendations presented in this Podcast are for general information only. Any reliance on the information provided in this Podcast is done at your own risk. This Podcast should not be considered professional advice.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On our "End of 2025" episode, it's just me answering your questions. I hope this is the kind of information you would like to hear.

The questions are ones I hear most often from listeners.

I hope you have a healthy and happy holiday season. This time of year is stressful for a lot of us–especially when we have lost loved ones.

I try my best to focus on what is here now. I appreciate this podcast is popular, because it is a useful place where I can help people all around the world.

Thank you for listening to our WHEN DATING HURTS podcast.

Bill Mitchell

⁠⁠WhenDatingHurts.com⁠⁠

NOTE:

If you are a survivor and want to share your story of abuse on the WHEN DATING HURTS Podcast, please email me: ⁠⁠[email protected]⁠⁠

The ⁠⁠WHEN DATING HURTS book⁠⁠ (in paperback, eBook, and audiobook) can be found on Amazon.

HELPFUL RESOURCES:

• National Domestic Violence Hotline – ⁠⁠The Hotline.org ⁠⁠– Call 800-799-SAFE

• ⁠⁠LoveIsRespect⁠⁠ – Call 866-331-9474

• RAINN (Rape Abuse Incest National Network) – ⁠⁠RAINN.org⁠⁠ – Call 800-656-4673

• SUICIDE HELPLINE: Call 988

DISCLAIMER:

The WHEN DATING HURTS Podcast is providing this platform for information to be shared. We do not state with any certainty that anything is true or untrue. Understand that what you hear is the viewpoint of the people sharing. The information, opinions, and recommendations presented in this Podcast are for general information only. Any reliance on the information provided in this Podcast is done at your own risk. This Podcast should not be considered professional advice.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

We are excited to have Anna Astwood return. Anna's first visit was in early 2025.

Anna is a survivor of teen dating violence that occurred about 25 years ago. She has lived with this trauma every day since then. As a survivor of both sexual assault and teen dating violence from the ages of 12 to 18 years old, she knows the pain and the guilt of what relationship violence brings. She knows healing can take place.

In this episode, Anna will tell us what she is doing now–which includes finishing her book which will be published in 2026. She also speaks about healthy relationships in elementary school classes.

We have to say how proud we are of Anna. She has taken her pain and used it as motivation.

Here are links to Anna's lifesaving work:

The "Love Doesn't Hurt" Mission Statement: ⁠Love Doesn’t Hurt ⁠is a nonprofit dedicated to ending teenage dating violence and supporting those affected through education, empowerment and community support. 

Here you can ⁠find the Trauma Journal Anna created.⁠

⁠You can contact Anna Astwood at this link. ⁠

Or email Anna: [email protected].

Thank you for listening to WHEN DATING HURTS.

Bill Mitchell

NOTE:

If you are a survivor and want to share your story of abuse on the WHEN DATING HURTS Podcast, please email me: ⁠[email protected]⁠

The ⁠WHEN DATING HURTS book⁠ (in paperback, eBook, and audiobook) can be found on Amazon.

HELPFUL RESOURCES:

• National Domestic Violence Hotline – ⁠The Hotline.org ⁠– Call 800-799-SAFE

• ⁠LoveIsRespect⁠ – Call 866-331-9474

• RAINN (Rape Abuse Incest National Network) – ⁠RAINN.org⁠ – Call 800-656-4673

• SUICIDE HELPLINE: Call 988

Thank you for listening to our WHEN DATING HURTS podcast,

Bill Mitchell

⁠WhenDatingHurts.com⁠

DISCLAIMER:

The WHEN DATING HURTS Podcast is providing this platform for information to be shared. We do not state with any certainty that anything is true or untrue. Understand that what you hear is the viewpoint of the people sharing. The information, opinions, and recommendations presented in this Podcast are for general information only. Any reliance on the information provided in this Podcast is done at your own risk. This Podcast should not be considered professional advice.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This is a very short episode. I explain why I am removing three episodes that ran recently. There were with Michael Clark and his wife, Lynn Clark.

When I ran these interviews, it was with the best intentions and expectations. It is clear I was incorrect in what our listeners would accept.

My loyalty and respect has to be with my listeners – first and foremost. Many are survivors and some are working their way out of abusive relationships. For that reason, I needed to remove those episodes.

Please listen to my explanation.

And thank you for listening to the WHEN DATING HURTS podcast.

Bill Mitchell

⁠⁠⁠WhenDatingHurts.com⁠⁠⁠

NOTE:

If you are a survivor and want to share your story of abuse on the WHEN DATING HURTS Podcast, please email me: ⁠⁠⁠[email protected]⁠⁠⁠

The ⁠⁠⁠WHEN DATING HURTS book⁠⁠⁠ (in paperback, eBook, and audiobook) can be found on Amazon.

HELPFUL RESOURCES:

• National Domestic Violence Hotline – ⁠⁠⁠The Hotline.org ⁠⁠⁠– Call 800-799-SAFE

• ⁠⁠⁠LoveIsRespect⁠⁠⁠ – Call 866-331-9474

• RAINN (Rape Abuse Incest National Network) – ⁠⁠⁠RAINN.org⁠⁠⁠ – Call 800-656-4673

• SUICIDE HELPLINE: Call 988

DISCLAIMER:

The WHEN DATING HURTS Podcast is providing this platform for information to be shared. We do not state with any certainty that anything is true or untrue. Understand that what you hear is the viewpoint of the people sharing. The information, opinions, and recommendations presented in this Podcast are for general information only. Any reliance on the information provided in this Podcast is done at your own risk. This Podcast should not be considered professional advice.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

"Sara" is a domestic violence survivor. She is also my cousin.

Sara appeared to be in a perfect marriage. A nice home and three healthy boys. But her ex-husband eventually devolved into a serial abuser. She did all she could to coerce him into getting help, but nothing seemed to work. When living with this man became dangerous, she needed to break free. 

Listen to a narrative of patience and courage. Sara took years before she could tell her story. We applaud her for sharing it with us on the WHEN DATING HURTS podcast. 

Thank you for listening to our WHEN DATING HURTS podcast,

Bill Mitchell

⁠WhenDatingHurts.com⁠

NOTE:

If you are a survivor and want to share your story of abuse on the WHEN DATING HURTS Podcast, please email me: ⁠⁠⁠⁠[email protected]⁠⁠⁠⁠

The ⁠⁠⁠⁠WHEN DATING HURTS book⁠⁠⁠⁠ (in paperback, eBook, and audiobook) can be found on Amazon.

HELPFUL RESOURCES:

• National Domestic Violence Hotline – ⁠⁠⁠⁠The Hotline.org ⁠⁠⁠⁠– Call 800-799-SAFE

• ⁠⁠VictimsVoice⁠⁠ – Everything they do empowers people to have happier, healthier lives beyond all forms of abuse.

• ⁠⁠⁠⁠LoveIsRespect⁠⁠⁠⁠ – Call 866-331-9474

• RAINN (Rape Abuse Incest National Network) – ⁠⁠⁠⁠RAINN.org⁠⁠⁠⁠ – Call 800-656-4673

• SUICIDE HELPLINE: Call 988

DISCLAIMER:

The WHEN DATING HURTS Podcast is providing this platform for information to be shared.

We do not state with any certainty that anything is true or untrue. Understand that what you hear is the viewpoint of the people sharing. The information, opinions, and recommendations presented in this Podcast are for general information only. Any reliance on the information provided in this Podcast is done at your own risk. This Podcast should not be considered professional advice.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This story comes with trigger warning about domestic violence with an emphasis on physical violence.

This is a return interview with Stephanie. We are so happy to have her back with us after several years.

For Stephanie, from the moment she was adopted, there were scant times life showed her an easy path. And yet, she has continually remained ultra-positive.

It is clear the one person Stephanie believed in most was herself. Listening to her story, your heart will go out to her years before she ever met up with Michael. It's a good thing, because he brought pure hell into her life over three years. 

Working together with law enforcement, she was able to turn the tables on this man who became such a despicable person and her serial abuser.

It is exciting to have Stephanie's update. Her life is nothing like it was years ago. Now, she is happy and thriving with her husband, Neil.

You can listen to Stephanie's previous episodes: Look for episode numbers 42, 43, and 44 on the WHEN DATING HURTS podcast.

Bill Mitchell

NOTE:

If you are a survivor and want to share your story of abuse on the WHEN DATING HURTS Podcast, please email me: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠[email protected]⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

The ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠WHEN DATING HURTS book⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ (in paperback, eBook, and audiobook) can be found on Amazon.

HELPFUL RESOURCES:

• National Domestic Violence Hotline – ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠The Hotline.org ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠– Call 800-799-SAFE

• ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠LoveIsRespect⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ – Call 866-331-9474

• RAINN (Rape Abuse Incest National Network) – ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠RAINN.org⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ – Call 800-656-4673

• SUICIDE HELPLINE: Call 988

Thank you for listening to our WHEN DATING HURTS podcast,

Bill Mitchell

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠WhenDatingHurts.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

DISCLAIMER:

The WHEN DATING HURTS Podcast is providing this platform for information to be shared. We do not state with any certainty that anything is true or untrue. Understand that what you hear is the viewpoint of the people sharing. The information, opinions, and recommendations presented in this Podcast are for general information only. Any reliance on the information provided in this Podcast is done at your own risk. This Podcast should not be considered professional advice.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices