Why Will No One Date These Guys?

Lauren comes back after nearly a year hiatus to discuss the best relationship and dating questions from r/AITA and r/AITAH. Unlike the mishmosh questions from prior episodes, this episode is all wedding-themed because she and Joel are planning a wedding and dreading what horrors await them as they approach their big day.  Come listen to us discuss how to deal with parents asking for a wedding invite for their relationship "third," how to respond when someone attempts to propose in the middle of the wedding dances,  and whether or not to invite your "kissing cousins" to your wedding. Come for the drama, stay for some wedding planning advice.

If you want to support Desert Paws you can find their website here,

This month we made a donation to a trans rights org supporting trans individuals fleeing states where their existence is being outlawed. There are a lot of groups doing good work like this: take a look at your community. 
 

Support the show

Joel and Naomi get together, in the same room even, to discuss weird stuff surrounding porn. This ranges from the rise of social media accounts where couples shame each other for porn use to the rise in "porn addiction" discussions to the weird subcultures of the NoFap movement. We also get into the crazy privacy and ethical implications of monitoring accused people's browsing history, how your car knows when you're having sex in it, and the rise of legislation that has effectively forced pornography websites out of entire US states. 

The clip at the end is from Paul Thomas Anderson's magnum opus Magnolia and stars the eponymous Julianne Moore. (Joel thinks Magnolia is PTA's magnum opus but that could just be because he isn't smart enough to digest the advanced cinematography and writing of PTA's later work. It's certainly better than Punch-Drunk Love. But then again, any movie where Adam Sandler gets to show off his acting chops can't be too bad.  Everyone loved Uncut Gems, after all. But then again, Magnolia had one of Tom Cruise's greatest roles as a loveable pickup artist scumbag. I dunno. This is all kind of stream of conciousness. It's 1AM and writing episode descriptions is hard. I'm just going to wrap it up now).

This month we made a donation to a trans rights org supporting trans individuals fleeing states where their existence is being outlawed. There are a lot of groups doing good work like this: take a look at your community. 

Support the show

It was a long haul through the wilderness and we lost a lot of our party but we're finally through and nearing the promised land. We finished Chapter 6, finally, and can now enjoy the cool breeze of fresh chapters in weeks to come rather than remaining in the fetid stagnant air.

We finally wrap up chapter 6 by discussing that despite his assertions ADHD is a real thing,  that mandated gender balances on corporate boards is not the end of the world, that women-only scholarships are something private entities should be allowed to offer and if he wants to even the playing field he'd be better off supporting free college, why custody cases and family courts are not unfairly biased against men, and why media and advertising really don't give women a free pass. We then summarize the 6 or so hours we've spent on this single chapter and talk a little about why unironically liking The Wolf of Wall Street's characters/message may be a red flag. 

The clip used is from the Mitchell and Webb look tv series, 

This month we made a donation to a trans rights org supporting trans individuals fleeing states where their existence is being outlawed. There are a lot of groups doing good work like this: take a look at your community. 
 

Support the show

"Well, all I hear is, "Patience"
All I have are missed bank payments
I can't keep my head above the nonsense
This ain't gonna make me famous
But I can't eat off this paycheck
My dreams are quick-dryin' cement
Slippin' through the tips of my fingers
Fill my pockets
Cannonball into the black when I hear you say

[Chorus]
"It won't be this bleak forever" (Yeah right)
"It won't be this bleak forever" (And I hope you're right)
"It won't be this bleak forever" (Have you seen me lately?)
"It won't be this bleak forever" (Yeah right)

Spanish Love Songs -Self-Destruction as a Sensible Life Choice. (Deep DTG lore - friend of the show Rj makes an appearance in this music video). For more media about people feeling like they're wasting their life by doing things they enjoy, check out the last 10 episodes of this multi-past book series!

We're nearing the end of chapter 6 and Aaron just starts getting super sloppy. In this part he argues that men should never get married due to most women thinking of marriage only as a status symbol like a handbag (?),  that one can prove all women are vapid and materialistic because of one scene in the 1999 movie American Beauty (which starred absolutely no weird sex-pervert actors and had absolutely no weird messages about contemporary masculinity), that one can prove women have no long-term interest in marriage by how they sometimes have less sex with their husbands after pregnancy (???), and that women are unfairly shown deference in all societies. Joel also did a journalism and found one of Aaron's blogs where he kind of gave away the end-goal of his belief system, denying non-tax-payers the right to vote or participate in democracy. Cool stuff. As usual, we debunk, but boy, our hearts are getting less and less into this as we continue. 

We're not linking to places you can buy this book. Go support your local library.

We are now recording through Riverside.fm and producing both video and transcripts of each episode. Find those on our Patreon. 

This month we made a donation to a trans rights org supporting trans individuals fleeing states where their existence is being outlawed. There are a lot of groups doing good work like this: take a look at your community. 
 

Support the show

It's been awhile since we did one of these. We either became less lazy or less vain.  Neither seems true, so maybe we just forgot this was a possible episode format? Doesn't matter.

In the almost 12 months since our last update the Guy siblings have really shaken things up. Naomi is living her best single girl life, Joel is happily engaged, and both siblings agree we need to rename the podcast to "Why Will No One Date Naomi Guy?" Or at least make it clear Joel's relationship is rock solid. Come for the drama, stay for our hot tips on proposals, therapy,  best guy friends, and horrible anecdotes about Naomi taking our other brother to a nude beach. It's not as bad as it sounds. (it may actually be worse).

We are now recording through Riverside.fm and producing both video and transcripts of each episode. Find those on our Patreon. This week there is more than 6 minutes of content in the video that was cut from our episode. Why was it cut? Probably for being too good. 

This month we made a donation to a trans rights org supporting trans individuals fleeing states where their existence is being outlawed. There are a lot of groups doing good work like this: take a look at your community. 

Support the show

All work and no play makes Joel a dull boy.  All work and no play makes Joel a dull boy.  All work and no play makes Joel a dull boy.  All work and no play makes Joel a dull boy.   All work and no play makes Joel a dull boy.  All work and no play makes Joel a dull boy.   All work and no play makes Joel a dull boy.  All work and no play makes Joel a dull boy.   All work and no play makes Joel a dull boy.  All work and no play makes Joel a dull boy. 
All work and no play makes Joel a dull boy.  All work and no play makes Joel a dull boy.   All work and no play makes Joel a dull boy.  All work and no play makes Joel a dull boy.   All work and no play makes Joel a dull boy.  All work and no play makes Joel a dull boy.   All work and no play makes Joel a dull boy.  All work and no play makes Joel a dull boy. 

This book is great. No notes. 

In part 4 of chapter 6 we discuss the four ways "women negotiate in bad faith." We dig into why Aaron isn't the best source of investment advice, why women are probably using dating apps in exactly the same ways at men (and not to toy with their emotions) why you should only really do things if you like them and not out of spite, and why if you're trying to get people to embrace reprehensible belief systems you have to ease them in by providing banal advice at first. We also discuss why the existence of Onlyfans does not spell the downfall of Western Civilization and Joel attempts to provide a slightly more positive philosophy to male readers of this text that doesn't embrace self-loathing as a lifestyle. 

We're not linking to places you can buy this book. Go support your local library.

This month we made a donation to a trans rights org supporting trans individuals fleeing states where their existence is being outlawed. There are a lot of groups doing good work like this: take a look at your community. 
 

Support the show

Were we bad in a past life? That's becoming an increasingly likely scenario as we continue to plod through this text, spending far too many of our precious waking hours engaging with this toxicity. We think there's some truth to the idea that you're an average of the 5 people you spend the most time with: probably not great that the words of Aaron Clarey/Myron Gaines are now on that list for Joel and Naomi. 

In part 3 of chapter 6 we discuss the unstated but explicitly eugenics-y arguments of valuing people by their productive capabilities, the fact that women do not uniformly vote as a block for welfare policies,  why fiscal incidence is a bad way to track both people's contributions to society and the government's provision of social services. and the fact that women did not immediately start voting for welfare policies as soon as they could vote.  We also dig into two unconvincing studies and a definitely not racist website Aaron cites but refuses to engage with. 

 We're not linking to places you can buy this book. Go support your local library.

This month we made a donation to a trans rights org supporting trans individuals fleeing states where their existence is being outlawed. There are a lot of groups doing good work like this: take a look at your community. 
 

Support the show

Naomj and Joel come together one final time to record a episode in the house Naomi's been living in for the last 2+ years. We bid farewell to it's loud echoey surfaces and do a little prayer that her future apartment will have much better acoustics. No promises. 

This week we're talking about all the weird changes in dating and marriage culture that have occurred  since the beginning of the year, ranging from advances in AI to new novel dating apps to Peter Thiel's investments in reproductive health apps to giant drops in the marriage rate to the more common use of astrology in wedding planning. Oh, and Joel sings some Frank Sinatra. Fun stuff. 

This month we made a donation to a trans rights org supporting trans individuals fleeing states where their existence is being outlawed. There are a lot of groups doing good work like this: take a look at your community. 

Support the show

Plato said something about a person's legacy being either their children or their accomplishments. We don't want kids so unfortunately this might be the only mark of the Guy siblings that survives the ages. Totally worth it, not a doubt in our minds.

In part two of chapter 6 we continue to debunk the assertion that women are not pulling their weight in society through the arbitrary standards he's created to support his argument. We start by chatting a little bit about Myron bringing white nationalist and misogynist Nick Fuentes onto his podcast in early July then get into why using the gender breakdown of college majors is a horrible way to track the actual jobs people end up with,  why majoring in "useful" fields of study might not be the best way to make money or help society,  why both sexes are directed into different major paths even if they have identical interests, why the top-10 jobs for women are actually pretty important for society and there are serious barriers for women trying to get into the career paths he thinks are integral to human civilization,  and why using FMLA and vacation leave rates as a litmus test for women's interest in careers is one of the stupider things he's said.

Joel also noticed Aaron/Myron's weird obsession with the interests of business over those of workers and took some time to talk about the political aspects of the text. He compares it the 14 basic tenets of fascism through Umberto Eco's essay Ur-Faciscm and argues that though this is pretty sloppily written it serves as a great way to indoctrinate people (mostly men) into explicitly fascist thinking patterns. Cool stuff.

If you want to know more about the argumentation methods of the far right, check out Innuendo Studios' series on far right rhetoric, The Alt-Right Playbook. 

We're not linking to places you can buy this book. Go support your local library.

This month we made a donation to a trans rights org supporting trans individuals fleeing states where their existence is being outlawed. There are a lot of groups doing good work like this: take a look at your community. 

Support the show

Be honest, you were expecting us to give up on this at some point, right? Like, how long could the Guy siblings really drag out one book? Well, don't be so surprised: when we order custom artwork we mean business. 

It's part one of chapter six, a chapter that requires no prior context to jump in and "enjoy." In this one Aaron/Myron try to prove that women aren't upholding their part of the "New Contract" by showing that women don't do nearly as worthwhile as jobs as their male counterparts. There's a lot to cover, including analogies about historical events that are completely divorced from reality, the bold claim that men cannot live without sex, our takedown of both Aaron's relationship rules and the book the Laws of Power,  and the first part of a multi-pronged attack against the idea that men were solely responsible for the development and maintenance of society up until the modern era. Naomi also shares a recap for Caramel Pretzel Chocolate bites that is more interesting/important than anything we've discussed in the book so far.  Not a knock on Joel, it's just that good. 

We're not linking to places you can buy this book. Go support your local library.

This month we made a donation to a trans rights org supporting trans individuals fleeing states where their existence is being outlawed. There are a lot of groups doing good work like this: take a look at your community. 

Support the show