This episode is a must-listen for anyone who's ever felt like legal talk is impossible to understand (👋 Sara included!). We're joined by Elie Mystal, brilliant legal mind, powerful truth-teller, and New York Times bestselling author of Allow Me to Retort: A Black Guy's Guide to the Constitution, to break down the complex world of American law and what Democrats are doing all wrong (and can do better) in a way that's sharp, accessible, and even funny.

💥 He's back with a bold new book: Bad Law: Ten Popular Laws That Are Ruining America. If you're fired up about the state of our country, about policy that is working frighteningly as intended, or simply want to understand how certain laws are quietly shaping (and harming) everyday life, this conversation is for you.

What to listen for:

• The least-legal legal chat we've ever had, including loads of straight-talking humor that makes the truth go down a little easier – on how SCOTUS operates and how we can change it, on the laws we might easily repeal to make tremendous change in our country, and more

• Why we might be seeing more whitewashing of history, and the truth that we are back to us all needing to educate our own children on this country's true history.

• That what we are (or aren't) doing now is exactly what we would have been doing during any great catastrophe in history

• Practical ideas for how YOU can help dismantle harmful laws and make a difference in our country's trajectory.

This episode is perfect for fans of legal analysis without the jargon, book lovers, including our former Dear White Women book club, and anyone looking to better understand (and change) our current system.

🎧 Press play, and get ready to rethink what you thought you knew about the law.

About our guest:

Elie Mystal is the Justice Correspondent for The Nation, where he writes about politics and social and racial justice. Elie's first book, Allow Me To Retort – A Black Guy's Guide to the Constitution, was on the NYT's bestsellers list in April 2022. His second book, Bad Law: Ten Popular Laws That Are Ruining America, was released in March 2025. Mystal was the executive editor of Above the Law, a website with approximately 2 million unique visitors that focuses on law, courts, and justice. He's known for writing about the law and politics, breaking down Supreme Court decisions, and up-to-the-minute coverage of Supreme Court confirmation battles.

Off the page, Mystal is a legal contributor to the More Perfect podcast, a Radiolab spinoff, on WNYC. He's appeared regularly on MSNBC since 2018, appearing on All In With Chris Hayes, The Beat With Ari Melber, A.M. Joy with Joy Reid, and Up with David Gura. On the Radio, Mystal has been a frequent guest on the Brian Lehrer Show, the Dean Obedallah Show, and Signal Boost with Zerlina Maxwell. He's also appeared on The Mike Huckabee Show, the Megyn Kelly Show, Red Eye with Greg Gutfeld, and done various appearances on CNBC and Fox Business about legal industry news.

Mystal received his undergraduate degree in Government from Harvard University, his J.D. from Harvard Law School, and worked as an associate at Debevoise and Plimpton from 2003-2005.