Between the Briefs

Every single organization in the world needs a regulatory body that monitors compliance and ethics. Even cannabis companies. In this riveting episode of Between the Briefs by Steno, hosts Adrian Cea and Joe Stephens welcome Samantha Misch, Senior Paralegal at Green Thumb Industries, for an insightful discussion on navigating the evolving intersection of law and cannabis compliance.

What You’ll Learn:

• The unique skills it takes to make it as a paralegal in today’s tech-driven world 
  
  
• Why the role of a paralegal is crucial to the business of cannabis today 

• How to walk the line between traditional legal work and emerging technologies 

• How to approach and keep up with regulatory changes in the cannabis industry 
  
  
• The valuable strategies for career advancement in legal operations
  
  
• Using technology to drive your growth as a paralegal, regardless of where you are in your career 

• Why the human element is a non-negotiable for paralegals today 
  
  

Tune in to explore the fascinating intersection of law and the cannabis industry, and the equally fascinating role of paralegals in it all. 

Highlights:


00:00 Introduction to Between the Briefs 

00:44 From Night School to Senior Paralegal: Sam’s Career Journey

02:07 The Power of Transparency in Professional Growth

03:14 The Multifaceted Role of Modern Paralegals

05:39 Leading the Illinois Paralegal Association

07:30 Technology's Impact on the Paralegal Profession

08:45 Inside Green Thumb Industries: Cannabis Compliance

13:58 Day-to-Day Operations of a Legal Operations Paralegal

17:10 Essential Documentation Strategies for Success

19:01 Strategic Career Entry Points for New Paralegals

20:54 AI's Role in the Future of Paralegal Work

26:11 The State of Paralegal Associations Post-2020

29:20 Leadership Journey in Professional Organizations

32:59 Final Thoughts: Staying Ahead in Legal Tech


Quotes:

1. "I think it's important for paralegals to be able to know a little bit of everything. I don't think you need to be a master of all things, but you need to have familiarity with a broad range of topics to be successful."
   
   
2. "AI cannot replace a paralegal. It could definitely streamline some processes and maybe help with creating a more efficient workload, but it can't replace the person that has to pick up the phone and talk to a client."
   
   
3. "The paralegals are the backbone or the silent helper in the room, and oftentimes, I feel like they have more of the small detailed knowledge that maybe the attorneys don't get a chance to see."
   
   
4. "I always tell people that I wouldn't jump to just a paralegal role. There's so many other roles that you can have, like a legal assistant or even a legal secretary. It's a really good way to get your foot in the door, get the experience, and understand how processes work."

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In this episode of Between the Briefs, Adrian Cea and Joe Stephens talk with Evan Shenkman, Chief Knowledge and Innovation Officer at Fisher Phillips. Evan shares how disciplined knowledge management, clean data, and responsible AI are transforming legal operations, from enterprise search and expert-finding to the next frontier of “ambient AI” that anticipates lawyer needs in real time.

With a decade of experience as a practising labour and employment attorney, Evan Shenkman has become one of the leading voices in legal innovation. As Chief Knowledge & Innovation Officer at Fisher Phillips, he has built and scaled the firm’s knowledge management, data analytics, and AI infrastructure, most notably leading the first firm-wide deployment of Casetext’s CoCounsel, a GPT-4-powered legal assistant. Recognised as ILTA’s Innovative Leader of the Year and among the Lawdragon 100 AI & Legal Tech Advisors, Evan’s work has redefined how large law firms capture institutional knowledge, enhance efficiency, and deliver client value through responsible AI adoption.

Highlights:

[00:00] Intro

[00:53] Evan’s path from litigator to innovation leader

[06:44] What knowledge management really means in legal practice

[08:04] Collaborating with attorneys to prioritise firm knowledge

[10:03] Enterprise search & expert-finding at Fisher Phillips

[12:53] Why good time entries create better data and better experts

[14:27] Cleaning and connecting data across firm systems

[20:21] KM as the foundation for responsible AI

[22:34] How AI reshapes productivity and revenue

[26:54] Driving adoption through training and AI policy

[31:07] Developing, updating, and enforcing responsible AI use

[35:27] Balancing innovation speed with stability

[37:15] Evan’s hottest take: the rise of ambient and agentic AI


Quotes:

• “KM is the foundation, the AI and the innovation is the application of that, right? You can't do a fancy AI-powered chatbot unless it's trained on really good information under the hood.”
  
  
• “The innovation portion, which is just trying to have our attorneys do better stuff, different stuff, be more efficient, do things in a better, smarter, faster way going forward, figuring out what's around the corner, all of that works so much better with a foundation of good KM. And there so many people that say, hey, I would love to now create a chat out of all my firm's information. Great, where is your firm's information? Is it all up to date? Is it all accurate? Or is it all just in a big mush of some stuff is out of date, some stuff is accurate, some stuff is good, some stuff is not… If you're trying to point AI or gen AI at that, it'll do a horrible job.”
  
  
• “Ambient AI right now that's able to say, know what Evan probably needs because I just heard Adrian say something, Evan needs to know this and here it is Evan, right? … that makes me smarter in real time, right? And I didn't need to prompt, I didn't need to ask, I didn't need to go into a tool… And when you add agentic flows into this, where it can actually make judgment calls… I think is the next big thing.”
  
  
• “This is the most exhilarating and exhausting time to be in legal innovation…everything is moving so quickly.”

Between The Briefs is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so

In the rapidly evolving legal landscape, a firm’s attention to legal marketing vs. the lack of it could be the difference between its success and its failure. On the latest episode of Between the Briefs, host Adrian Cea sits down with Michael Mellor, Founder of 742 Advisors, and a legal marketing expert to talk about transforming law firm marketing and business development strategies for small and mid-sized firms. 
What You’ll Learn:

• How to differentiate your legal practice in an oversaturated market through a unique selling proposition
• Why traditional law firm marketing approaches are becoming obsolete in today's digital-first buyer journey
• How to leverage AI and technology for efficient client relationship management without overwhelming attorneys
• Why firm-wide accountability and leadership buy-in are crucial for successful marketing initiatives
• The critical balance between maintaining legal expertise and developing business acumen in modern law practice
• Why data-driven decision making is essential for convincing attorneys to adopt new marketing approaches

Tune in for insights on implementing effective marketing systems and changing traditional mindsets about legal business development.
Highlights:

00:00 Introduction01:34 From Finance to Law: A Strategic Communications Journey07:08 Walking Into a Room of Millionaires and Telling Them They're Wrong15:30 The Ikigai Framework: Finding Your Firm's True Identity21:13 The "Best Litigator in New York" Myth27:34 The Ferrari in First Gear: Why Expensive Tech Fails37:30 The Art of Disqualifying Clients42:25 Michael's Hot Take: Know Where the Puck's Going or You're Going Down45:19 Next Episode Preview
Quotes:

1. "I don't think that any consultant is coming up with anything extraordinarily innovative - it's really about how do you implement it in my firm. I think that's really what separates good consultants from great consultants because you can look at something from 10,000 feet away and say, well, this is easy."

2. "You can't be a generalist. You can't know everything, you can't wait for your phone to ring, you can't be the best litigator in New York. You gotta put together a plan, you gotta focus on things, you've gotta shut out the noise, and you gotta be consistent."

3."I talk to litigators, and I say, what do you wanna be? I wanna be the best litigator in New York - I say, okay, that's built on zero proof. You are having difficulty differentiating yourself on this floor of litigators, and there's six law firms in my elevator bank, so we've already got 400 litigators."

4."Leadership is so mission critical in leading by example and not the old school of “do as I say, not as I do.” If you're not inputting your stuff, if you're not sending us your closed matters, if you're not doing this stuff and you're yelling at everyone else too, that word gets out. You just watch it crumble."Between The Briefs is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so

Employment law is evolving rapidly with technology, but are attorneys and employers keeping up? In this episode of Between the Briefs, hosts Adrian Cea and Joe Stephens sit down with Michael Sigall, an associate at Seyfarth Shaw LLP, to explore the evolving landscape of employment law and workplace litigation. Michael shares invaluable insights on proactive legal strategies for employers, the impact of remote work on workplace disputes, and how AI is transforming legal practice. From documenting workplace interactions to navigating complex class action suits, this episode offers practical guidance for legal professionals and business owners alike. 
Tune in to discover why proper employment documentation matters, how to effectively handle depositions in the digital age, and what the future holds for employment law in an AI-driven world.Between The Briefs is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so

What does it take to be a rockstar modem trial lawyer in today’s day and age? A love for law, tech-forward curiosity and agile strategy - according to Joel M. Ferdinand, distinguished business trial lawyer and co-chairman at Pierson Ferdinand LLP. In this illuminating episode of Between the Briefs, hosts Adrian Cea and Joe Stephens sit down with Joel to explore the evolution of modern litigation practices. Joel shares invaluable insights on handling sophisticated business disputes, leveraging AI in legal practice, and building a revolutionary partner-only law firm model. 
Tune in to discover why the human element remains irreplaceable in litigation while learning how to effectively embrace technological advancement in today's legal landscape.
Between The Briefs is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so

So you’ve got the latest AI tools in your law firm’s arsenal. Now what? If you’re hoping AI reaches its potential without quality data, you’ve got another thing coming and Ashley Gibbs, Senior Director of Product Value, Engineers and Solution Sales Executives at Litera makes no bones about it on this episode of Between the Briefs. Tune in as she joins hosts Adrian Cea and Joe Stephens to explore the critical intersection of legal technology and data management. Tune in to discover how law firms of any size can leverage AI-powered solutions to streamline workflows, enhance data accessibility, and improve client service delivery. Through the course of this conversation, Ashley shares invaluable insights from her extensive experience in both law firm operations and legal tech implementation, offering practical strategies for overcoming adoption challenges and maximizing technology investments in the legal sector. 

AI can take you into the future only if it’s backed by great data. Listen in and get started! 

Between The Briefs is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so

There’s a new C-Suite executive running the law firm game. Law firm operations are evolving beyond traditional management, with COOs emerging as crucial leaders in driving profitability and innovation in the legal industry. And, we’re exploring this phenomenon in the latest episode of Between the Briefs by Steno. Join hosts Adrian Cea and Joe Stephens as they sit down with Amanda Koplos, COO at Shuffield, Lowman and Wilson, PA, for an illuminating discussion on law firm operations and innovation. Backed by two decades of experience, Amanda shares invaluable insights on the future of billable hours, AI integration, and why mid-sized firms need strong operational leadership to survive. 

This episode offers practical wisdom and unique insights on transforming law firms into profitable enterprises while maintaining quality client service.
Between The Briefs is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so

“There’s no stopping AI” - says Marla Crawford, General Counsel at Cimplifi in the latest episode of Between the Briefs by Steno. And like every good lawyer, she’s got the evidence to back up her statement. Drawing from her 35-year legal career spanning roles at Goldman Sachs and Jones Day, Marla shares invaluable insights on AI adoption in legal practice, the evolution of eDiscovery, and the future of legal operations. Tune in for practical wisdom on embracing AI while maintaining professional judgment, to understand why we're at a pivotal moment in legal technology and how professionals can successfully navigate this transformation.
This episode offers a thought-provoking perspective: the progress of AI and legal tech doesn’t mean the end of progress for lawyers and their practice. 

Between The Briefs is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so

What do the CIA and the legal tech revolution have in common? Katie DeBord. In the latest episode of Between the Briefs by Steno, Adrian Cea and Joe Stephens welcome former CIA analyst, and current Vice President at DISCO, Katie DeBord for a candid and critical conversation on the state of legal tech today and its future. Together, they explore the intersection of law, technology, and innovation as Katie shares invaluable insights on leveraging AI in litigation, the evolution of legal technology, and the future of law firm structures. Tune in for an honest discussion about overcoming technological hesitancy, implementing AI solutions in practice, and her bold take on the potential deregulation of law firm ownership in the US. 

Innovation is reshaping legal practice, and alongside, our approach to it. 

Between The Briefs is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so

While tech experts took their time to build world-class AI systems, what were lawyers doing? The accelerated excellence of legal technology has uncovered the lack of legal craft and skill and it’s time for a major rethink. In this episode of Between the Briefs by Steno, hosts Adrian Cea and Joe Stephens welcome JP Son, Chief Legal Officer at Verbit, to explore how AI is transforming legal services, the evolution of legal tech, and the challenges of balancing innovation with traditional legal practice. From revolutionizing legal transcription services to navigating complex IP challenges in the AI era, JP shares invaluable insights on how artificial intelligence is reshaping the legal profession. 

Tune in to discover why traditional legal training may need to evolve, how firms can embrace AI without stifling innovation, and what the future holds for legal professionals in an AI-driven world.

Between The Briefs is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so