Beyond the Pale

Paul Ellis has impacted and inspired tens of thousands across the world with the message of God's unconditional love for them through his award winning books as well as his Escape to Reality blog. On today's episode Paul shares with Steve & Tammy the journey he has walked and the insights into God and Life he has learned along the way.

Get ready to go Beyond the Pale with Paul Ellis!

Show Notes:

4:50- (Intro) Walking across Europe & Tammy’s new dogs

8:17- Paul’s early life

12:50- Paul’s story arriving in Hong Kong

15:44- From university professor to pastor

19:47- Introduced to Grace

28:54- Why Christians mix Jesus & The Law

40:11- Escape to Reality

47:00- Why some Christians struggle with a God without conditions

Tre Cates shares how he initially became involved with, and then went on to be the Chief Operations officer for, the Savory Institute; a group that is literally saving the planet! Tre then explains how the holistic management and regenerative practices he has seen implemented through the Savory Institute has helped him understand how those same practices could be applied in business and work environments around the globe.

Get ready to go Beyond the Pale with Tre Cates!

Show Index:

2:10 (into) Tammy talks about a new love of philosophy and asking questions

12:50- How Tre got involved with the Savory Institute and and what they do there

30:36- How a system seeking short term benefits have brought long term consequences

39:22- How a "regenerative" system needs to replace an "industrial" system

51:19- Unleashing the full potential of people

Steve sits down with Tre Cates to talk about the journey he has been on for the last twenty years. Tre has gone from being church planter to a successful entrepreneur of a tech company, and ultimately to becoming Chief Operating officer for the Savory Institute, which, if you are NOT one of the over 4 million people who have watched Allan Savory’s 2013 TED Talk, the Savory Institute is an organisation, that is saving the planet….literally!

Tre has traveled to 6 continents and worked in 35 different countries for the Savory Institute consulting with organisations and government officials on applying regenerative holistic practices to land management that is making Earth that had been reduced to desert- green and arable again.

Tre sat down with me to share the journey of how he got to where he is now, as well as how the regenerative applications and practices they are learning to apply to the Earth can be applied to churches, businesses, governments and humanity as a whole….pretty much wherever 2 or more are gathered….well, you get the point Get ready to go Beyond the Pale with Tre Cates.

Show Notes:
2:40 (Intro) Tammy shares about how the family used Steve’s trip away to sneak two new puppies into the house

18:56: Tre shares his passion of seeing people’s lives transformed into who they were created to be

20:33: Tre questions “the system” from early on

27:50: Why church models are not sustainable

29:26: Embracing a decentralised “non-event” based community

42:42: Tre shares how his journey led him to ask “What was I put here for and how can I fulfill that purpose”

46:19 “Beautiful examples of creation in it’s complexity”

48:52: “We can have community, we can have real impact, we can serve people and you don’t need an organisation to do that”

Steve & Tammy continue their talk with Brian Zahnd as they unpack his new book "Sinners in the Hands of a Loving God." Brian shares with us pilgrims why Jesus’ sacrifice on the cross was NOT a payment to God and how thinking it is has been skewing Christians view of the Father for years.

From there we move to chatting about hell and while Jesus did speak a fair bit about hell, Brian suggests what he was referring to was not an after life torture chamber but rather the consequences (aka, the hell) we unleash on ourselves and the world around us when we fail to walk in the Way of Love Christ came to demonstrate

We wrap our time with Brian as he shares a bit on what the Book of Revelation is really trying to tell us…and it wasn’t what we were told in church growing up

Get ready to go beyond the pale with Brian Zahnd

Show Index
2:10 (Intro) Tammy shares how fear had crept into her faith

16:50 What if Jesus spoke to the U.S. Congress?

24:16 Was Jesus’ death a payment to God for our sins?

29:44 What is Hell?

31:50 “If you can’t preach the gospel without mentioning heaven or hell, you can’t preach the gospel”

41:36 What the Book of Revelation is trying to tell us

Brian Zahnd returns to Beyond the Pale to discuss his new book "Sinners in the Hands of a Loving God". As one of the leading voices in the church today Brian takes aim at Christian's endorsement of fear, violence, and nationalism reminding us that our God looks like Jesus and ONLY Jesus. Get ready to go Beyond the Pale with Brian Zahnd.

Show Index
2:06 (Intro) Steve & Tammy discuss the effect “fear” theology has had on their faith

14:48 Brian shares an update from their Camino pilgrimage in Spain a year out

28:54 How the Jesus Movement generation became the political “Christian Right”

34:00 Brian shares how he “woke up” into a new understanding in Christ

39:20 How the “fear” theology of Jack Chick cartoon tracts still impact the evangelical church today

41:45 When Christians see Jesus not as a teacher but simply a cog in God’s atonement process

We continue our discussion with Rebekah Pine and hear more of her journey as a young Christian living in Egypt and Jordan. Now a wife and mother of three young children Rebekah goes on to explain how her work in the Middle-East isn't over as she returns to Jordan to work with refugees fleeing the Syrian civil war.

Show Index:

1:57 (Intro) Steve & Tammy discuss “The Shack”

13:19 Rebekah shares what it was like being a Christian with a Muslim roommate

26:24 Life as a Syrian refugee in Jordan today

39:57 Having the support of family and church to return to Jordan

43:42 Rebekah shares some last thoughts and hope for the refugee situation in the middle-east

Rebekah Pine shares her journey of being a student of Middle East studies living in Egypt and Jordan and how years later, now a wife and mother of three children, feels a draw by God to return to Jordan to help alleviate the suffering of refugees fleeing from the Syrian civil war. Along the way Rebekah shares how her own faith was enriched and deepened as she navigated a Muslim world.

Show Notes:

2:30- (Intro) Steve & Tammy muse about Shakespeare

17:19- Rebekah shares how she first got interested in the Middle East

22:57- Moving to Egypt

26:10- Encountering the Muslim faith for the first time

42:10 - Having a humility in our understanding of God

43:14- Dialogue with Muslim friends

47:24- Rebekah shares anecdotes of being a female Hong Kong Chinese in the Middle East

50:52- Moving to Jordan

Part two of our talk with journalist and science writer Nury Vittachi continues to explore the tension between faith and science. Along the way Nury shares about the power of forgiveness as well as some of the positive attributes faith in general, and Christianity specifically, bring to the world around us. 
Show Notes:

1:33 (Intro) Steve and Tammy discuss cynicism towards Christianity and their own struggles at times with it

10:39 Nury shares how his interest in science first began

13:00 Creating a space beyond “Atheist vs. Theist”

27:58 Why young people are leaving church

35:39 Christianity and why its what's on the inside that counts

Journalist, author, and science writer Nury Vittachi joins Steve & Tammy to discuss the faith / science divide and shares with them how he navigates between those two worlds. Along the way Nury shares some childhood memories with famed author Arthur C. Clarke, whether the universe is indeed "conscience", and explains how the building blocks for reality is made up of ideas.

Join us as we travel Beyond the Pale with Nury Vittachi!

Show Notes:

1:54- Intro Steve and Tammy discuss a Facebook post on “worship”

16:38- Nury shares his background

19:50- “Materialist” vs. Quantum Physics

23:28- Can science be “mystical”?

34:40- Asimov, Sagan, and religion

37:01- Nury shares personal stories with Arthur C. Clarke

47:42- The moment God did “something”

This week we continue our talk with long time youth pastor Rich Kifer. Rich shares some of the wisdom he has learned, sometimes the hard way, as his spiritual journey has taken a number of twists and turns through the years. Along the way we discuss some of the litmus tests Christians tend to judge orthodox purity, the state of Christian and faith based movies, as well as advice Rich has for young people who feel they have a “call to ministry”

Get ready to go Beyond the Pale with Rich Kifer
Show Notes:

1:31 Intro- Steve & Tammy discuss Chinese Sichuan food and American politics

19:58- Discussing “Christian Movies”

29:36- Rethinking “salvation”

33:41- Turning “Good News” into “Terrible News”

40:51- Why do we “obey” Christ?

1:03:54- Advice for young people going into ministry