Canny Conversations Podcast by Safaraz Ali MBE

Veteran business journalist Jon Griffin joins Safaraz Ali for a journey down memory lane and a look to the future. Jon, who spent many years as Business Editor with the Birmingham Mail, reflects on changes that have seen the business landscape change almost beyond recognition.

Their conversation considers how Birmingham and the West Midlands has coped with the move away from heavy engineering to a more technological and service based economy.

Jon has covered many big business stories during a long career but when asked which was the biggest he has no doubt that it was the demise of Austin Rover that at one time employed 10,000 people in well paid jobs at the plant in Longbridge.

The site in south Birmingham has now been transformed into a retail park and housing development.

It is a story that has happened in many cases with well paid work replaced by largely poorly remunerated and insecure jobs.

With the exception of niche market car maker Morgan in Malvern, there are now no British owned car makers in the region. Jaguar Land Rover is a major employer but will they stay in the West Midlands?
Safaraz talks about the growth in financial services with some big financial institutions like HSBC and Morgan Stanley coming to Birmingham.

The two men consider if this is the way forward and whether manufacturing in and around Birmingham will become something people will only read about in history books?

But perhaps all is not gloom and doom and a new style high technology manufacturing will come to replace what has gone before, providing skilled work for people from the area.

Jon talks about his work now as a business journalist writing for a number of magazines and specialist publicatio

‘An analogue mind in a digital world’
Journalist Jon Griffin, who was for many years Business Editor on the Birmingham Mail, talks with Saf about how his profession has changed. At the end of his newspaper career Jon described himself as someone with ‘an analogue mind in a digital world.’

The conversation talks about the decline of print journalism and the expansion of online and digital.

Saf and Jon consider the growth of the ‘citizen journalist’ and to what extent that has left people without the professional journalism that holds the establishment to account.

Jon is a passionate believer that democracy needs high quality journalism and that without it we all suffer.

The two men talk about ‘fake news,’ the consequence of the growth of social media and platforms like Facebook and Twitter.

It is a world in which people can write as they like without any concern for accuracy or balance, in which issues like the laws of libel do not apply.

Jon describes this unregulated media environment as ‘the wild west.’ The two men consider how things can be made better and if in order to do this platforms need to be made responsible for content in the same way that a traditional newspaper editor is.

Safaraz admits that he is a regular user of social media and believes it has a role although there is a need to be careful what you believe and do not believe.

Jon looks back on his career with fondness. ‘It enabled me to meet people and go places that would otherwise have not been possible and no two days were the same.’

He describes himself as a ‘dinosaur’ and is sure young journalists today don’t have as much fun as he did as they chase ‘clicks’ whereas he tracked down big stories. 

At the time of the recording Anne-Marie Eden was chief executive of Solihull Moors as they pressed for promotion to the English Football League, the Holy grail of the game. In this conversation Saf and Anne-Marie consider the importance of engaging with the community and diversity.

At the time of the recording Anne-Marie Eden was chief executive of Solihull Moors as they pressed for promotion to the English Football League, the Holy grail of the game. In this conversation Saf and Anne-Marie consider the importance of engaging with the community and diversity.

Football has its roots in the community and this is where Anne-Marie Eden says Solihull Moors keeps its feet firmly planted.

Likewise, Saf’s businesses are part of the community with engagement a major commitment.

They begin a fascinating conversation defining what they mean by community and agree that it can be a multiplicity of things including gender, heritage, profession, sporting interests and much more.

Solihull Moors was born from the bringing together of two rival football teams, Solihull Borough and Moor Green. Anne-Marie talks about how bringing these two communities together, especially in a sport that can be so tribal, has been achieved. Imagine creating a community if merging Manchester United and Liverpool or Glasgow Rangers with Celtic.

Saf shares his experiences of helping to create unity from individuals and groups that may come from a different place and view of life.

Anne-Marie explains why Solihull Moors is about much more than just success on the field and how ‘community’ is at the heart of the club.

There is a discussion about the importance of diversity and how having people from different backgrounds can add to a business and a football club.

They talk about the dangers of stereotyping, such as assuming black people will be good at sport, as well as inclusivity and allowing people of all abilities to have a chance.

But how to bring about diversity? Saf and Anne-Marie talk about positive action and the role of targets and why they are different to quotas.

Inevitably, the conversation touches on the growth of women’s football.

Anne-Marie Eden is one of a small but growing band of female chief executives in football. She is CEO at Solihull Moors, who at the time of the recording were playing in the National League – one step below the English football league. They discuss the business of football and shares lessons from their professional experiences.

In this conversation Anne-Marie and Saf discuss the challenges of running businesses in a high profile environment.

They share thoughts about the importance of leadership and the challenges of managing people where, very often, there is no shortage of ego.

This leads to a conversation about building strong teams and how this is a balance in which the best individuals may not necessarily be the best for the team.

At the time that the recording was made the Solihull Moors were pressing for promotion from the National League into the English Football League. This is a big step and hugely exciting but Saf and Lynne share their thoughts about the challenges and opportunities of scaling up a business.

Saf talks about his involvement with football as one of the leadership team in a ‘grass roots’ academy that gets young people into the game.

Anne-Marie explains how she got involved in football through her work with a sponsor of ‘the Moors’ and talks about her previous work in recruitment and how this helps in her current role.

She admits that she was not a ‘fan’ of Solihull Moors before getting the job but Anne-Marie and Saf agree that this may not always be important as a ‘fan’ might be too likely to make decisions driven by emotion rather than business.

They talk about how bringing people into a business from a different sector can help bring a broader perspective and stop a tendency to do things in a certain way because they have always been done that way.

Vince Essex, who has more than 25 years’ experience of aviation, has his feet firmly on the ground when he joins Safaraz for a conversation about the past present and future of flying. They consider how the sector is recovering after having been one of the most badly hit by the Covid-19 pandemic.

Connectivity is hugely important for economic prosperity and business.

Safaraz is joined by Vince Essex, who has more than 25 years’ experience in the aviation sector, to talk about this and how the world of flying has changed.

Both agree that air travel has a big part to play in economic prosperity although Safaraz says that most of his flying is for leisure rather than business.

Vince and Safaraz consider the challenge for Birmingham that sits mid-way between London and Manchester and struggles to attract the passenger numbers that its facilities and excellent transport links deserve.

They also talk about working in aviation and the many and varied opportunities, with Safaraz providing thoughts about how apprenticeships can put people on the runway to a career in the sector.

Vince talks about some of the major changes and shares his thoughts on why very large aircraft like the Airbus A380 are having to give way to smaller and more energy efficient airplanes.

With the environment and climate change so high on the global agenda, Vince and Safaraz discuss how aviation can and is responding to the need to be cleaner.

As someone who flies infrequently Saf says that he only takes to the skies when a reasonable alternative is not available so does not feel guilt.

Vince says that aviation is doing what it can to be less polluting but accepts that there can be no quick fix and it will take time for step changes to engine technology to come about.

They also discuss how changing habits as a result of the Covid-19 pandemic will affect aviation and agree that the jury remains out on if the use of zoom and other similar platforms will reduce the demand for business travel.

But they agree that face-to-face is always going to be a big part of doing business.

Is resilience an essential prerequisite for anyone looking to go into business? This is the basis of the conversation between Safaraz and his guest, aviation professional Vince Essex. They talk about the many challenges that they have faced and how they have come through.

The importance of resilience and being able to cope with adversity is at the heart of a conversation that is in places highly emotional and thought provoking.

Vince talks openly about the challenges that he has faced in an sector that has always been highly volatile. He tells Saf about how his business fell off a cliff with the arrival of the Covid-19 pandemic that led to widespread lay-offs in the aviation and travel sectors.

Safaraz shares some of his story about adversity in business and both men talk about the loneliness that can come with being an entrepreneur and how they cope with those dark moments, in the early hours of the morning, when they can wake wracked with worry.

The message that comes over is that the thing that drives them through the dark times is a passion for what they do and an optimistic outlook.

Almost inevitably the conversation deals with the impact of the Covid-19 pandemic and the adequacy or otherwise of the Government support measures.

Vince tells his own story of the collapse of air travel that for him was compounded by the need to shield because he is a kidney transplant recipient. At one stage early in the pandemic he felt forced to come out of isolation for a meeting despite being highly vulnerable and having a young family.

Safaraz, unlike Vince, had a significant career in the corporate world before striking out on his own. He talks about what brought him to that decision and how it has worked out.

Both admit to the attraction of a secure job with decent pay, holiday and sick pay and a good pension at the end of it. But they come to the conclusion that for all its problems being entrepreneurs has brought them a ‘freedom’ and feeling of achievement that they do not think more ‘conventional employment’ would have provided.

Safaraz Ali, an employer with hundreds of staff is joined by journalist and trade unionist Tony Adams. They consider how the balance of power in the workplace has changed. Time was when unions with large numbers of members held huge power and in the minds of many too much. But now the pendulum has swung the other way with many people living with insecure jobs on short term and in some cases zero hours contracts with trade unions a shadow of what they were. Saf and Tony consider the modern landscape and what has gone before.

If some were to be believed there are no longer workers and bosses as everyone is now a colleague. The days when the bosses often occupied a different floor with their private offices, Personal Assistants or Secretaries and took lunch in their own dining room are the stuff of history. At one time it seemed that aspects of Government were determined over beer and sandwiches between Ministers and Trade Union leaders. Not so anymore.

But have things really changed that much and behind the veneer of the ‘democratised’ workplace? Saf and Tony wonder if ‘us and them’ is in a different way as real as it always has been but with the balance of power now firmly with the bosses. The power of trade unions has been hugely diminished and in so many places secure and well-paid jobs have been replaced by insecurity with large numbers of people living day-to-day on short term or even zero hours contracts.

For some the new world is welcome and provides for greater flexibility but this is not the case for others who look back with envy at their parents and grandparents who may well have had a job for life, something that has almost entirely disappeared from the world of work.

Safaraz Ali is joined by journalist and broadcaster Tony Adams to discuss the power of the spoken word and in particular the power of radio. Saf talks about his eclectic tastes in radio and his enthusiasm for grass roots community stations. They talk about how radio has changed and what the future looks like. A topic they touch upon is the huge amount of choice now available to listeners but debate if this is at the expense of quality.

Broadcaster and journalist Tony Adams joins Saf to talk about the spoken word and in particular radio. 

They consider how the radio landscape has changed over a lifetime. People who do not consider themselves to be very old will remember a time when listening to the ‘wireless’ involved a choice between the BBC Light Programme (now Radio 2), the Third Programme (Now Radio 3) and the Home Service (Radio 4) or the Pirate stations. Perhaps the golden age for radio were the war years before the arrival of television for the masses. TV had started in a small way before World War Two but really took off in the 1950s.

The extension of programming started with the introduction of BBC Local Radio stations and has grown ‘like topsy’ in the subsequent decades.

They share their own relationship with radio and Saf reveals the eclectic mix of programmes that he has listened to over the years. He enthuses about the power and value of local community radio and how it engages with the people it serves in a way that is not possible for national stations.

They have plenty to say about the huge choice now available to radio listeners and the benefits of the platform highlighting its intimacy and accessibility. But they also debate if this is at the cost of quality and how radio needs to make sure that it does not, especially at local level, allow itself to be a platform for ‘a regular few’ promoting their own agenda and the importance of making listeners appreciate the difference between news and opinion.

Radio stations are regulated, and this is discussed along with the question as to if more needs to be done. This includes the important question of editorial independence and the need to ensure advertisers do not impair editorial integrity.

There is no shortage of business start-ups. But many unfortunately fail. Ninder Johal and Safaraz Ali have both successfully run and grown businesses. They talk about why many do not get beyond the nursery slopes and what qualities are needed to scale up. They discuss the support that is available and the role of consultants, advisers and non-executive directors in successfully moving to the next level.

Ninder Johal started his business career in music, he is founder of the Signature awards that celebrates the best in business in the English West Midlands and is publisher of the Business Influencer magazine. He has been a colleague and friend of Safaraz Ali for many years and joins Saf to talk about a significant barrier for many businesses.

There are many start-ups, but a large proportion will fail and a lot struggle to grow to the next level. It is something of which Saf and Ninder have experience.

Both believe that a crucial first step is to know why a business wants to grow and to recognise that it is not for everyone. If a small business is going well, delivering the lifestyle the owner wants and makes them happy then there is nothing to say that they have to grow.

Saf believes that understanding strengths and weaknesses and having processes in place are essential for growth. He says that scaling a business is often less exciting than founding one. For Ninder, understanding numbers is vital as is ‘sticking with plan A before moving on to plans B, C and D.’ He also believes that a business owner looking to grow also should understand the difference between what advisers, consultants and non-executive directors offer.

An unavoidable part of growing is letting go and giving more control to others. Ninder and Saf acknowledge that this can be a very emotionally difficult thing to do. However, it is essential and Ninder stresses the emotional aspect with the story of the football club that will not appoint supporters to senior roles because of the importance of decision-making being driven by rational thinking not emotion.

The podcasts provides a guide to deciding if to go for growth and then how to go about it.

Ninder Johal, who joins Saf as his guest talks about the business landscape in the English Midlands. Both men have an Asian heritage, but they share their passion for Birmingham and the surrounding area that is now home. They address some telling questions such as whether Birmingham is the UK’s second city by name only and what can be done to raise its profile across the globe. They discuss the journey from a past based on heavy engineering to the present and look to the future

Safaraz Ali is joined by a long-time colleague and friend Ninder Johal as they discuss the state of business in the English Midlands, the place that they both call home.

Ninder began his business career in the music industry. He is now an adviser, non-executive director, founder of the Signature awards that celebrate the best in business, as well as publisher of the Business Influencer magazine.

Safaraz has described Ninder as a guru and mentor. They share their experiences of a life in business and how the place where they live had to change and reinvent itself, moving from heavy engineering based upon automotive to high technology and services. The discussion includes an analysis of where things have been done well and less well.

Saf and Ninder discuss concerns about why they believe the education system is letting young people and businesses down. They agree that making sure there is a supply of talent is crucial and Saf shares his passion for apprenticeships and the role that earning as you learn has to play in ensuring a world class workforce.

The two men discuss global Britain and its place in the world. Ninder believes that it is many years before we can know if Brexit has been good or not.

Both men come from an Asian heritage, but they share a passion and love of the place that they call home. Saf and Ninder believe that Birmingham is a great city with much to offer the world and have no truck with the suggestion that it is the UK’s second city in name only.

They foresee a bright future providing that there is a continual willingness to learn and adapt, a refusal to sit back on laurels and the processes to make sure a talented and skilled workforce is available.