Crazy Together

Marcus and Esme made a mistake. In the span of three weeks they put out two episodes about the evils of dehumanization (and the cruelty that comes along with it), and one episode in which they unironically called Epstein and all of his buddies “monsters.” You might be surprised to learn that this glaring inconsistency went unnoticed by the couple until earlier this week. 

So, Marcus and Esme clarify their stance on dehumanization (spoiler alert: they’re against it) and explain how their emotional reaction to the news sparked some cognitive dissonance. They also explain that their impulse to dehumanize was rooted in their desire for justice, and their concerns that these men might not get the justice they deserve . . . unless we all do our part to hold them accountable.

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In honor of Black History Month, Marcus and Esme have two fascinating stories to share about people who helped reshape history. 

Esme kicks things off with the story of Mamie Phipps Clark and Kenneth Clark, two black psychologists whose famous “doll tests” revealed how segregation shaped the self‑perception of Black children; and later provided the scientific rationale that helped the Supreme Court conclude separate educational facilities are inherently unequal in Brown vs. the Board of Education.

Marcus then tells the tale of Screamin’ Jay Hawkins, the eccentric, dramatic, and brilliant rock and blues singer who inspired the likes of Alice Cooper, Marilyn Manson, Rob Zombie, and Tom Waits (to name a few). Hawkins' outlandish songwriting and stagecraft were so convincing that audiences and critics alike mistook performance for pathology and labeled him a “mad genius.” Was he actually neurodivergent, or was he simply not granted the same grace his predecessors received for “creative mythmaking?”

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Epstein was a monster; there’s no doubt about that. But he wasn’t alone. 

It’s important to note that no one has been charged with any crimes yet (and with the current administration in place, it might be a while), so it’s still difficult to separate actual evidence of guilt from noise. Nevertheless, the contents of the most recent release(s) of Epstein files paint a picture of a wealthy and interconnected network of monsters who either engaged in horrific crimes or simply turned a blind eye to the crimes being committed. 

In this episode, Marcus and Esme call back to a previous episode (#52. The Unwritten Rules of the Elites) in an attempt to explain how a network like this forms, and why it is that seemingly no one in that network ever spoke out or attempted to put a stop to it. The short answer: when you prioritize your agenda above your ethics, morals, or even your sense of purpose, you might just find yourself in the company of monsters.

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In this week’s Hyperfocus Bonus, Marcus leads the listeners on a journey that is equal parts aquatic and an algorithmic, as he describes how he went from watching placidly peaceful underwater footage from scuba divers, to quick-cut video mash-ups of weekend sea captains submerging their expensive party boats before they can even get out on the open water. 

Esme counters with her own hyperfocus detour into the world of mobile strategy games, guild drama, and the existential dread of realizing you’ve accidentally joined a community that expects things from you.

Marcus and Esme close by highlighting the story of Seamus Culleton, an Irish immigrant who has been held in ICE detention for five months. If you are moved by Seamus’s story (link in the show notes), Marcus and Esme encourage you to call your members of congress and senators and request that they support efforts to free ALL non-violent detainees in ICE facilities.

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Midnight—Declan DP [Audio Library Release] Music provided by Audio Library Plus Watch:    • Midnight — Declan DP | Free Backgroun...   Free Download / Stream: https://alplus.io/midnight-declan-dp

In this follow‑up to last week’s episode on cruelty and dehumanization, Marcus and Esme try to figure out what happens after people buy into systems built on division, fear, and the promise of in‑group protection. Spoiler alert: those systems almost always turn on the very people who empower them.

Drawing on historical examples from American slavery, the Confederacy, and Nazi Germany, the episode traces a pattern that repeats across eras and continents: political movements that rely on dehumanization don’t just brutalize their targets, they usually harm their own supporters. Or as Esme puts it, “when you vote for cruelty, don’t be too surprised when they turn that cruelty on you.”

Marcus and Esme also lay out a multi-tier strategy for fighting back against dehumanization that relies on collective action, humanizing victims, and pointing out the motivations of the powerful people who seek to divide us. 

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In this week’s Hyperfocus Bonus, Marcus and Esme celebrate the life and work of the late, great Catherine O’Hara. 

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In this episode, Marcus and Esme try to answer the question, “how is it that people are capable of being so cruel to one another?” Drawing on philosopher David Livingstone Smith’s groundbreaking work, they explore how political leaders, military institutions, and propagandists have learned to tap into some of our most primal instincts to overcome our sense of compassion and empathy through the process of dehumanization. Smith shows that dehumanization isn’t just an insult or a slur; it’s a psychological and political technology people and governments use to amass power through the fear of existential threats posed by the least likely sort of villain there is: our neighbors and community members. 

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In this week’s Hyperfocus Bonus, Esme shares an observation from a recent classroom experience and links it to memories from her past. Marcus, sadly, jumps to offering solutions where none were requested. For his part, Marcus explains how an offhand reference in last week’s Hyperfocus Bonus has lingered in his mind and taken on a life of its own. Will he be able to set these thoughts aside, or will he follow them all the way to Broadway? 

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In this episode, Marcus and Esme explore the concept(?), practice(?), theory(?) of mindfulness. What is it? Why can it be a helpful tool for regulating heightened nervous systems? They discuss its roots as part of the Noble Eightfold Path in the Buddhist religion, how it became popular in Western culture, and then dive into what might be considered the darker side of “Mindfulness”—the co-opted capitalist version that uses it as a lever (velvet cudgel?) to persuade employees into ignoring organizational red flags and inequities, grooming for compliance and productivity. Marcus then has Esme read a “mindfulness meditation” he’s written from the perspective of corporate culture (if they were actually transparent in their goals). It’s a ride! Come join us, on Crazy Together!

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In this week’s Hyperfocus Bonus, Marcus and Esme celebrate the dawn of a new era where Irish actors get to use their own accents in sci-fi/fantasy movies and tv shows. Also, Esme shares an update about her own adventures in the real world.

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