Encountering Silence

Richard Rohr talks with us in this episode about silence, spirituality, contemplation, action, and why discernment is essential for each of these areas of life.

One of the most popular and beloved of living authors writing about contemplation , Fr. Richard Rohr, OFM is the founder of the Center for Action and Contemplation in Albuquerque NM, and the dean of the online Living School. Through his popular books, audio recordings, conferences, and daily emails, this Franciscan priest has become a leading spokesperson for the recovery of contemplative spirituality in our time.

Kevin, Cassidy, and Carl skyping with Fr. Richard Rohr.

"I believe the primary orthopraxy — praxis — is silence. Primary: it precedes all other spiritual practices, all other spiritual disciplines. And of course we're first of all talking — and I know you know what I'm going to say — about  interior silence. And that takes a while to achieve, because most of us, our mind fills up as soon as we open our eyes in the morning, with ideas, projects, agendas, arguments... and they're all of a verbal character." — Fr. Richard Rohr, OFM

Rohr spoke with the Encountering Silence team from his hermitage in New Mexico, where he offered insight not only into his work as a writer and speaker, but also into the challenges we all face as we seek to integrate contemplation (including silence) into the demands of contemporary life. Indeed, as our conversation progressed it became clear that, as much as he values silence, Rohr felt strongly that silence should never be used as an escape from the demands of relationships, communities, or the struggle for justice — the "action" that must be partnered with "contemplation."

Rohr has a keen understanding that silence is not something that not all people have easy access to — so, therefore, silence is a justice issue. He also points out that silence is not the same thing as contemplation (neither, for that matter, is being an introvert!) and that perhaps the most valuable gift that silence can give us is an invitation to move beyond the dualistic nature of language into a space that is restful, open, and simple — a space where, in the title of one of his most popular books, "Everything Belongs."

"Silence is a way of knowing." — Kevin Johnson

Richard Rohr is a warm and generous person and our conversation was quite intimate. He told us a remarkable story about encountering two of the most renowned Catholics of the twentieth century shortly after graduating from high school (spoiler alert: one of them was Thomas Merton!), and reflects in a truly beautiful and vulnerable about how it feels to be a man at 75 (we recorded just a few days after his birthday) where he finds grace in "having no agenda."

"If people do get into contemplation or silence in the first half of life, it's almost always by some encounter with limits. Let me call it that instead of suffering, because we're so afraid of the word suffering. But without limits entering your life, you tend to define your religion in terms of spiritual ascending, rather than descending." — Fr. Richard Rohr, OFM

Among the topics we touch on in our wide-ranging conversation is the distinction between true and false silence — as well as true and false dimensions of activism — the importance of being in the "second half" of life for embracing the contemplative life, the recognition that contemplation can take different forms in different cultures, and the hope that Rohr finds working with younger adults in the context of his ministry.

Some of the resources and authors we mention in this episode:

Richard Rohr, Essential Teachings on Love

Thomas Merton, The Sign of Jonas

Mother Teresa, Come Be My Light

St. Francis of Assisi, In His Own Words: The Essential Writings

Kenneth Leech, Prayer and Prophecy

Richard Rohr talks with us about silence, spirituality, contemplation, action, and why discernment matters.

We love poetry — and we find that, of all literary forms, poetry seems to most quickly and assuredly bring the attentive reader to the threshold of silence.

"Poets all see silence as sacred ground," notes Kevin, "because it's from the silence the poems come." Together we muse on how poetry puts us in touch with our bodies, our intuition, and how the relationship between poetry and silence is, perhaps, just the same as the relationship between silence and sound that forms the foundation of music.

Much like musicians use notes, poets are the composers of words. They pay such attention to the space between. More then we do in typical writing, typical everyday language, they heed the mystery, they listen to the offbeat, and they use it. They know how to harness it, they know how to hold it open-handed... it's I would dare to say closer to silence then any other writing is. — Cassidy Hall

Because we are all "poetry geeks" pretty much just as much as we are "silence geeks," we joke that trying to create a podcast about poetry should take us 200 hours (or more). So this week's episode is just a check-in, a snapshot of where our journey with poetry has taken us at least for now.

From Mary Oliver's earthy reflection written in response to a cancer diagnosis, to Polish poet Wislawa Szymborska's playful consideration of how the experience of the mind or soul has an "embodied" or "natural" dimension, to the more ethereal or even transcendent perspective of Evelyn Underhill, the poems we consider in this episode dance between matter and spirit, between consciousness and mystery, between wonder and doubt and insight. And while none of these poems are specifically "about" silence, they all usher us into that place where word and silence kiss.

Silence is embodied, and yet silence is paradoxically also immaterial... To encounter silence implies materiality. — Carl McColman

Some of the poets, authors and resources mentioned in this episode:

Mary Oliver, Devotions

Thomas Merton, Collected Poems

Irene Zimmerman, Incarnation

Mary Oliver, Thirst

Mary Oliver, Blue Horses

John Keats, Complete Poems

Wisława Szymborska, Map: Collected and Last Poems

Karl Rahner, Foundations of Christian Faith

Thomas Aquinas, Selected Writings

Evelyn Underhill, Immanence

Albert Einstein, Ideas and Opinions

Maggie Ross, The Fire of Your Life

Patrick Shen (dir.), In Pursuit of Silence

Jan Richardson, Circle of Grace

John O'Donohue, To Bless the Space Between Us

Willis Barnstone, tr., The Poems of Jesus Christ

Bonnie Thurston, Practicing Silence

May Sarton, Halfway to Silence

May Sarton, The Silence Now

Jane Hirshfield, Nine Gates

Edna St. Vincent Millay, Collected Poems

Rumi, The Essential Rumi

Silence isn't a fleeing from the world, it's a fleeing to the world. It's actually getting out of your ideas about the world, and actually showing up and being present in the world. — Kevin Johnson

Episode 18: Silence and Poetry

Hosted by: Carl McColman

With: Cassidy Hall, Kevin Johnson

Date Recorded: April 10, 2018

We love poetry — since poetry seems to quickly bring the attentive reader to the threshold of silence.

This week we have our first "return" guest, as Patrick Shen joins us again to discuss the new book he co-wrote and co-edited with Cassidy Hall, Notes on Silence. Describing the book as an "entry point" into silence, Patrick and Cassidy share with Kevin and Carl how the book functions as a companion to their documentary film In Pursuit of Silence — and how it is simply a work of art in its own right.

Silence is always over-stated — and under-said. — Cassidy Hall

 

 

Notes on Silence features a selection of essays by both authors exploring silence, and their relationship to silence, from a variety of angles. The book also includes transcripts of interviews from a variety of persons who are featured in the film: theologians, psychologists, artists, educators, and others who have many interesting things to say about silence and the noise in our contemporary habitat. Since only a portion of each interview could be included in the film, these transcripts provide a wealth of information for anyone who wants to go deeper in his or her pursuit of silence.

A monk from New Mellerey Abbey, Father Alberic, said to me, 'Silence is a place of infinite possibility.' Silence is also a place of infinite language, because there is no proper language — there is no official way to box it in." — Cassidy Hall

Notes on Silence also contains a generous selection of beautiful (and deeply contemplative photos) taken by both Cassidy and Patrick. As each of them shares thoughts on one of their favorite photos in the book, they give insight into how image as well as words can testify to the beauty of silence, and of our capacity for wonder at, and in, silence.

Alas, we cannot know for certain, the cosmos demands that we surrender to its majesty, and we must take our seat at the feet of doubt. — Patrick Shen

Some of the resources and authors mentioned in this episode:

Cassidy Hall and Patrick Shen, Notes on Silence

Patrick Shen (director), In Pursuit of Silence

Jonatha Brooks, 10¢ Wings (includes the song "Landmine," quoted in this episode)

Richard Rohr, Essential Teachings on Love

The Desert Fathers and Mothers, Early Christian Wisdom Sayings

Laurie Anderson, Big Science (includes the song "From the Air," quoted in this episode)

Absolute silence would be a state of lifelessness. Our relationship with silence is always filtered through sound in some way, shape or form. — Carl McColman

Episode 17: Notes on Silence

Hosted by: Kevin Johnson

With: Cassidy Hall, Carl McColman

Guest: Patrick Shen

Date Recorded: March 29, 2018

Patrick Shen joins us again to discuss "Notes on Silence" which he co-wrote and co-edited with Cassidy Hall.

What role does silence play in mysticism?

That’s the question that launches our conversation this week. Episode 16 is inspired by the recent release of The Little Book of Christian Mysticism, by Carl McColman. But rather than just focus on the new book, we decided to broaden the conversation in this week’s episode to a more general reflection on how silence and mysticism belong together — and influence each other.

We launch our conversation by looking at the problems connected with merely trying to define the word “mysticism” (and related terms  like “experience” and “spirituality”). From there we explore the connection between mysticism, mystery and silence.

“The Christian of the future will be a mystic — which is to say, a Christian who’s comfortable with silence, who’s comfortable with mystery, who’s comfortable with paradox and ambiguity, but who moves into all of that for the sake of love: the love of the Divine, and the love of one another.” — Carl McColman

Our conversation considers how mysticism is misunderstood by both the academic world the world of “pop” spirituality, how mysticism can make a difference even in the context of the institutional crisis in the church today, and how mysticism can be meaningful to the ordinary person today — leading to the radical (but ancient and orthodox) teaching of deification or divinization — what Saint Peter called being “partakers of the Divine nature.”

In our conversation, we explore who are some of Carl’s favorite mystics, how the women mystics of the Middle Ages need to be acknowledged as courageous heroines of the faith, and which mystics ought to be declared doctors of the church.

“Experience is the beginning of mysticism... People will say ‘I am drawn to mysticism because I want an experiential faith.’ I think that’s great! But let that be your starting point, and not your ending point. If the experience of God is the beginning of mysticism, then God’s encounter with you is the end of mysticism.” — Carl McColman

Some of the resources and authors mentioned in this episode:

Carl McColman, The Little Book of Christian Mysticism

Maggie Ross, Writing the Icon of the Heart

Pseudo-Dionysius, The Divine Names and the Mystical Theology

Carl McColman, The Big Book of Christian Mysticism

Carl McColman, Befriending Silence

Carl McColman, Answering the Contemplative Call

Jacques Derrida, A Derrida Reader

John of the Cross, Collected Works

Meister Eckhart, Selected Writings

Anonymous, The Cloud of Unknowing

Don Cupitt, Mysticism After Modernity

Karl Rahner, Concern for the Church

Evagrius Ponticus, The Praktikos & Chapters on Prayer

Julian of Norwich, The Showings of Julian of Norwich

Thérèse of Lisieux, The Story of a Soul 

Mother Teresa, Come Be My Light

Teresa of Ávila, The Book of My Life

C. S. Lewis, The Four Loves

Thomas Merton, Dialogues with Silence

Thomas Keating, Open Mind, Open Heart: The Contemplative Dimension of the Gospel

Evelyn Underhill, Practical Mysticism

Caryll Houselander, Essential Writings

John Climacus, The Ladder of Divine Ascent

Pierre Teilhard de Chardin, The Divine Milieu

Dorothee Soelle, The Silent Cry: Mysticism and Resistance

Bernard of Clairvaux, Selected Works

George Maloney, Inward Stillness

Douglas Steere, ed., Quaker Spirituality

Augustine, The Confessions of Saint Augustine

The Catechism of the Catholic Church

Hildegard of Bingen, Selected Writings

Marguerite Porete, A Mirror of Simple Souls

Hadewijch, The Complete Works

Catherine of Siena, The Dialogue

Catherine of Genoa, Purgation and Purgatory; The Spiritual Dialogue

Exploring the role that silence plays in mysticism, in the light of Carl's book "The Little Book of Christian Mysticism."

Meet Brother Elias Marechal — Trappist monk, author, contemplative, storyteller, and a man of deep, resplendent silence.

Silence is always there — from the time we're born it's there, because it's in the image of God. — Br. Elias Marechal, OCSO

This episode — a conversation with Brother Elias — is our second Encountering Silence "Field Recording" in which one member of our team (in this case, Carl McColman) records a face-to-face interview with a person whose life is deeply engaged with silence.

Brother Elias is a monk of the Monastery of the Holy Spirit in Conyers, Georgia, at the edge of the Atlanta suburbs. Born in New Orleans, he is a lifelong spiritual seeker, who after a profound encounter with Divine Mystery while a freshman at Notre Dame, has devoted his life to meditation and to a spiritual practice both deeply rooted in Christian mysticism and yet profoundly embracing the wisdom of all the world's contemplative paths.

He is the author of two books: Dancing Madly Backwards: A Journey Into God (Crossroad Publishing, 1982) and Tears of an Innocent God: Conversations on Silence, Kindness and Prayer (Paulist Press, 2015). Of the latter book, Thomas Keating says it is "valuable and full of wisdom drawn from the author's remarkable experience of East and West." And Cynthia Bourgeault notes, "If you've never experienced authentic Trappist sapiential writing before, you're in for a treat!"

Carl McColman has known Brother Elias since 2005, so their conversation carries the warm feel of two old friends. They sat down together at the Monastery guesthouse in November of 2017 to have a wide-ranging conversation about silence, writing, and prayer.

The image of God contains all of God's qualities and characteristics. The first one is silence. Second, kindness; the third, compassion; then listening with deep respect even to someone with an opposite view, and so forth. And the whole idea is that you're in this land of unlikeness and then you wake up in some way to the image of God. And you begin this journey, led by the Spirit, through the land of likeness in which, as you go along, all the various characteristics of God begin to unfold... in a simple, easy, and effortless way. — Br. Elias Marechal, OCSO

In the podcast Br. Elias discusses his first encounter with infused contemplation — at the grotto of Notre Dame University, when he was a freshman — and later discovering the complementary practice of acquired contemplation. He also reflects on a near death experience he experienced as a child, about his lifelong quest for purity of heart, on his experience of twenty-five years as a Trappist monk, how silence is an essential element in restoring the image and likeness of God within us, and much more.

He speaks about his early experience learning meditation and how the practice of meditation fostered his own relationship with silence — and how the Holy Spirit carries us through the unfolding of the image and likeness of God within us. He shares  his understanding of the role that breath plays in prayer — particularly the Jesus Prayer — which allows us to let go "into the abyss of the kindness and compassion of God."

There is silence in heaven, because to communicate with one another, one "transfers" thoughts to another, and the other transfers thoughts to you — and this includes God. It's very very interesting. So silence is all-pervading in the heavenly kingdom. — Br. Elias Marechal, OCSO

Some of the resources and authors mentioned in this episode:

Elias Marechal, Tears of an Innocent God

Isaac of Stella, Sermons on the Christian Year

Eckhart Tolle, Stillness Speaks

Meister Eckhart, Selected Writings

Desert Mothers and Fathers, Early Christian Wisdom Sayings

Martin Laird, Into the Silent Land

Meet Brother Elias Marechal — Trappist monk, contemplative, and the author of "Tears of an Innocent God."