Whether it be because of their unique shape, comical walking or extreme ecology, there can be no denying that penguins are incredibly popular and charismatic animals. But what actually makes a penguin a penguin and how are they different from other birds? Have penguins always been, well, 'penguiny'?

Joining us for this interview are Simone Giovanardi and Daniel Thomas who have just described a new species of giant penguin from New Zealand. Together, we explore penguin evolution and how their new species Kairuku waewaeroa fits into this story.