Can more faith—not less—heal our public life?
For a century, scholars argued that shrinking religion's public role would make politics calmer and more rational. In the last few decades, American religious participation has fallen faster than at almost any point in the nation's history, but our politics has only grown more polarized. What happened?
In this episode, we sit down with Matthew Kaemingk and Shadi Hamid, an evangelical and a Muslim, friends and collaborators across deep difference, to discuss their new book, which makes the case for religion as a constructive force in democracy.
Find their book Can Religion Save Democracy? <a href='https://bakerpublishinggroup.com/products/9781587436895_can-religion-save-democracy'>here</a>.

Can more faith—not less—heal our public life? For a century, scholars argued that shrinking religion's public role would make politics calmer and more rational. In the last few decades, American religious participation has fallen faster than at almost any point in the nation's history, but our politics has only grown more polarized. What happened? In this episode, we sit down with Matthew Kaemingk and Shadi Hamid, an evangelical and a Muslim, friends and collaborators across deep difference, to discuss their new book, which makes the case for religion as a constructive force in democracy. Find their book Can Religion Save Democracy? here.

Can more faith—not less—heal our public life?
For a century, scholars argued that shrinking religion's public role would make politics calmer and more rational. In the last few decades, American religious participation has fallen faster than at almost any point in the nation's history, but our politics has only grown more polarized. What happened?
In this episode, we sit down with Matthew Kaemingk and Shadi Hamid, an evangelical and a Muslim, friends and collaborators across deep difference, to discuss their new book, which makes the case for religion as a constructive force in democracy.
Find their book Can Religion Save Democracy? <a href="https://bakerpublishinggroup.com/products/9781587436895_can-religion-save-democracy" rel="noopener noreferrer">here</a>.

Shadi Hamid and Matthew Kaemingk: Can Religion Save Democracy?

Journalist Jon Rauch’s smart new book from Yale University Press, Cross Purposes: Christianity’s Broken Bargain With Democracy, offers three provocative and insightful essays. Though an outsider to Christianity—as he tells his long-time friend Pete Wehner of the Trinity Forum, Jon is a “gay Jewish atheist born in 1960”—Jon’s new treatise follows a dozen books, and hundreds of articles, covering topics from free inquiry to gay marriage, political realism to happiness, and the constitution of knowledge to matters of American political economy. 
The book explores the history and implications of three modes of the Christian faith in America. The first Jon terms Thin Christianity, embodied by mainline Protestantism. The second is Sharp Christianity—really MAGA white evangelicalism, what Jon calls a “fear-based” church.
But the third chapter, Jon makes a case for Thick Christianity, exemplified by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints and other creative exilic religious minorities who have made peace with the fact of pluralism and the democratic opportunity of compromise and negotiation—the principles James Madison also affirmed. He calls this book a sort of atonement for his past arguments that American society, and its political system, would be better without the influence of religions convictions. What changed for Jon? Partly it was his realizing that religion is a load-bearing wall, in any democracy. But partly it was an emergent friendship with Pete Wehner and with other thinking believers who have enlarged Jon’s vision.
 
Guests
<a href='https://www.jonathanrauch.com/'>Jonathan Rauch</a>
<a href='https://x.com/peter_wehner?lang=en'>Peter Wehner</a>
 
Additional Resources
<a href='https://www.interfaithamerica.org/article/money-meaning/'>“Cross Purposes: Christianity's Broken Bargain with Democracy,</a>” by Jonathan Rauch
“<a href='https://www.jonathanrauch.com/jrauch_articles/apatheism_beyond_religion/'>Let It Be: Three Cheers for Apatheism</a>” by Jonathan Rauch
"<a href='https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2025/01/evangelicals-trump/681450/'>Evangelicals Made a Bad Trade</a>" by Peter Wehner

Journalist Jon Rauch’s smart new book from Yale University Press, Cross Purposes: Christianity’s Broken Bargain With Democracy, offers three provocative and insightful essays. Though an outsider to Christianity—as he tells his long-time friend Pete Wehner of the Trinity Forum, Jon is a “gay Jewish atheist born in 1960”—Jon’s new treatise follows a dozen books, and hundreds of articles, covering topics from free inquiry to gay marriage, political realism to happiness, and the constitution of knowledge to matters of American political economy. The book explores the history and implications of three modes of the Christian faith in America. The first Jon terms Thin Christianity, embodied by mainline Protestantism. The second is Sharp Christianity—really MAGA white evangelicalism, what Jon calls a “fear-based” church. But the third chapter, Jon makes a case for Thick Christianity, exemplified by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints and other creative exilic religious minorities who have made peace with the fact of pluralism and the democratic opportunity of compromise and negotiation—the principles James Madison also affirmed. He calls this book a sort of atonement for his past arguments that American society, and its political system, would be better without the influence of religions convictions. What changed for Jon? Partly it was his realizing that religion is a load-bearing wall, in any democracy. But partly it was an emergent friendship with Pete Wehner and with other thinking believers who have enlarged Jon’s vision. Guests Jonathan Rauch Peter Wehner Additional Resources “Cross Purposes: Christianity's Broken Bargain with Democracy,” by Jonathan Rauch “Let It Be: Three Cheers for Apatheism” by Jonathan Rauch "Evangelicals Made a Bad Trade" by Peter Wehner

Journalist Jon Rauch’s smart new book from Yale University Press, Cross Purposes: Christianity’s Broken Bargain With Democracy, offers three provocative and insightful essays. Though an outsider to Christianity—as he tells his long-time friend Pete Wehner of the Trinity Forum, Jon is a “gay Jewish atheist born in 1960”—Jon’s new treatise follows a dozen books, and hundreds of articles, covering topics from free inquiry to gay marriage, political realism to happiness, and the constitution of knowledge to matters of American political economy.&nbsp;
The book explores the history and implications of three modes of the Christian faith in America. The first Jon terms Thin Christianity, embodied by mainline Protestantism. The second is Sharp Christianity—really MAGA white evangelicalism, what Jon calls a “fear-based” church.
But the third chapter, Jon makes a case for Thick Christianity, exemplified by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints and other creative exilic religious minorities who have made peace with the fact of pluralism and the democratic opportunity of compromise and negotiation—the principles James Madison also affirmed. He calls this book a sort of atonement for his past arguments that American society, and its political system, would be better without the influence of religions convictions. What changed for Jon? Partly it was his realizing that religion is a load-bearing wall, in any democracy. But partly it was an emergent friendship with Pete Wehner and with other thinking believers who have enlarged Jon’s vision.
&nbsp;
Guests
<a href="https://www.jonathanrauch.com/" rel="noopener noreferrer">Jonathan Rauch</a>
<a href="https://x.com/peter_wehner?lang=en" rel="noopener noreferrer">Peter Wehner</a>
&nbsp;
Additional Resources
<a href="https://www.interfaithamerica.org/article/money-meaning/" rel="noopener noreferrer">“Cross Purposes: Christianity's Broken Bargain with Democracy,</a>” by Jonathan Rauch
“<a href="https://www.jonathanrauch.com/jrauch_articles/apatheism_beyond_religion/" rel="noopener noreferrer">Let It Be: Three Cheers for Apatheism</a>” by Jonathan Rauch
"<a href="https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2025/01/evangelicals-trump/681450/" rel="noopener noreferrer">Evangelicals Made a Bad Trade</a>" by Peter Wehner
&nbsp;
&nbsp;

Jon Rauch and Pete Wehner: Christianity and Democracy in America

Jon Haidt offers candid perspective on today's university campuses, contemporary journalism, public discourse, and his own journey—as well as ways to better equip iGen students in their pursuit of human flourishing.
Guests:
<a href='https://www.stern.nyu.edu/faculty/bio/jonathan-haidt'>Jonathan Haidt</a>
<a href='https://eppc.org/author/peter_wehner/'>Peter Wehner</a>
Links:
<a href='https://www.thersa.org/events/2018/11/why-a-21st-century-enlightenment-needs-walls'>Why a 21st Century Enlightenment Needs Walls</a>, Jonathan Haidt, RSA Replay
<a href='https://thewholestory.solutionsjournalism.org/complicating-the-narratives-b91ea06ddf63'>Complicating the Narratives</a>, by Amanda Ripley
<a href='https://www.ted.com/talks/jonathan_haidt_the_moral_roots_of_liberals_and_conservatives?language=en'>The moral roots of liberals and conservatives</a>, Jonathan Haidt, TED2008
<a href='https://www.ted.com/talks/jonathan_haidt_can_a_divided_america_heal'>Can a divided America heal?</a>, Jonathan Haidt and Chris Anderson, TED2016
<a href='https://letgrow.org/'>Let Grow</a>
<a href='https://heterodoxacademy.org/'>Heterodox Academy</a>

Jon Haidt offers candid perspective on today's university campuses, contemporary journalism, public discourse, and his own journey—as well as ways to better equip iGen students in their pursuit of human flourishing. Guests: Jonathan Haidt Peter Wehner Links: Why a 21st Century Enlightenment Needs Walls, Jonathan Haidt, RSA Replay Complicating the Narratives, by Amanda Ripley The moral roots of liberals and conservatives, Jonathan Haidt, TED2008 Can a divided America heal?, Jonathan Haidt and Chris Anderson, TED2016 Let Grow Heterodox Academy

Jon Haidt offers candid perspective on today's university campuses, contemporary journalism, public discourse, and his own journey—as well as ways to better equip iGen students in their pursuit of human flourishing.
Guests:
<a href="https://www.stern.nyu.edu/faculty/bio/jonathan-haidt" rel="noopener noreferrer">Jonathan Haidt</a>
<a href="https://eppc.org/author/peter_wehner/" rel="noopener noreferrer">Peter Wehner</a>
Links:
<a href="https://www.thersa.org/events/2018/11/why-a-21st-century-enlightenment-needs-walls" rel="noopener noreferrer">Why a 21st Century Enlightenment Needs Walls</a>, Jonathan Haidt, RSA Replay
<a href="https://thewholestory.solutionsjournalism.org/complicating-the-narratives-b91ea06ddf63" rel="noopener noreferrer">Complicating the Narratives</a>, by Amanda Ripley
<a href="https://www.ted.com/talks/jonathan_haidt_the_moral_roots_of_liberals_and_conservatives?language=en" rel="noopener noreferrer">The moral roots of liberals and conservatives</a>, Jonathan Haidt, TED2008
<a href="https://www.ted.com/talks/jonathan_haidt_can_a_divided_america_heal" rel="noopener noreferrer">Can a divided America heal?</a>, Jonathan Haidt and Chris Anderson, TED2016
<a href="https://letgrow.org/" rel="noopener noreferrer">Let Grow</a>
<a href="https://heterodoxacademy.org/" rel="noopener noreferrer">Heterodox Academy</a>

Jonathan Haidt and Peter Wehner: The Righteous Mind

The Persistence of the Culture Wars, Russell Moore’s 2014 address at Faith Angle - <a href='https://faithangle.org/session/persistence-culture-wars/'>https://faithangle.org/session/persistence-culture-wars/</a> 
Stop the Tax on Houses of Worship, Wall Street Journal, 11/22/18 - <a href='https://www.wsj.com/articles/stop-the-tax-on-houses-of-worship-1542918092'>https://www.wsj.com/articles/stop-the-tax-on-houses-of-worship-1542918092</a> 
The Storm-Tossed Family, 2019 - <a href='https://www.amazon.com/Storm-Tossed-Family-Cross-Reshapes-Home/dp/1462794807'>https://www.amazon.com/Storm-Tossed-Family-Cross-Reshapes-Home/dp/1462794807</a> 
Signposts podcast, Russell Moore’s bi-weekly podcast about faith and culture - <a href='https://www.russellmoore.com/category/podcast/'>https://www.russellmoore.com/category/podcast/</a> 
Christine Emba, Columnist, The Washington Post - <a href='https://www.washingtonpost.com/people/christine-emba/?utm_term=.16f9da7373da'>https://www.washingtonpost.com/people/christine-emba/?utm_term=.16f9da7373da</a>

The Persistence of the Culture Wars, Russell Moore’s 2014 address at Faith Angle - https://faithangle.org/session/persistence-culture-wars/ Stop the Tax on Houses of Worship, Wall Street Journal, 11/22/18 - https://www.wsj.com/articles/stop-the-tax-on-houses-of-worship-1542918092 The Storm-Tossed Family, 2019 - https://www.amazon.com/Storm-Tossed-Family-Cross-Reshapes-Home/dp/1462794807 Signposts podcast, Russell Moore’s bi-weekly podcast about faith and culture - https://www.russellmoore.com/category/podcast/ Christine Emba, Columnist, The Washington Post - https://www.washingtonpost.com/people/christine-emba/?utm_term=.16f9da7373da

The Persistence of the Culture Wars, Russell Moore’s 2014 address at Faith Angle - <a href="https://faithangle.org/session/persistence-culture-wars/" rel="noopener noreferrer">https://faithangle.org/session/persistence-culture-wars/</a> 
Stop the Tax on Houses of Worship, Wall Street Journal, 11/22/18 - <a href="https://www.wsj.com/articles/stop-the-tax-on-houses-of-worship-1542918092" rel="noopener noreferrer">https://www.wsj.com/articles/stop-the-tax-on-houses-of-worship-1542918092</a> 
The Storm-Tossed Family, 2019 - <a href="https://www.amazon.com/Storm-Tossed-Family-Cross-Reshapes-Home/dp/1462794807" rel="noopener noreferrer">https://www.amazon.com/Storm-Tossed-Family-Cross-Reshapes-Home/dp/1462794807</a> 
Signposts podcast, Russell Moore’s bi-weekly podcast about faith and culture - <a href="https://www.russellmoore.com/category/podcast/" rel="noopener noreferrer">https://www.russellmoore.com/category/podcast/</a> 
Christine Emba, Columnist, The Washington Post - <a href="https://www.washingtonpost.com/people/christine-emba/?utm_term=.16f9da7373da" rel="noopener noreferrer">https://www.washingtonpost.com/people/christine-emba/?utm_term=.16f9da7373da</a>

Russell Moore and Christine Emba: Evangelicals in Contemporary America

In this episode, we sit down with AEI president Arthur Brooks and NPR's Tom Gjelten to explore increasing loneliness and disenchantment with American politics, the power of storytelling, and new ways to engage distinct audiences in pursuit of the common good.
 
Our Culture of Contempt, Arthur Brooks, New York Times, 3/1/19 - <a href='https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/02/opinion/sunday/political-polarization.html'>https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/02/opinion/sunday/political-polarization.html</a> 
Love Your Enemies, 3/12/19 - <a href='https://www.amazon.com/Love-Your-Enemies-America-Contempt/dp/1982608803'>https://www.amazon.com/Love-Your-Enemies-America-Contempt/dp/1982608803</a> 
Why Was the Dalai Lama Hanging Out at the Right-Wing American Enterprise Institute?, Vanity Fair, 2/26/14 - <a href='https://www.vanityfair.com/culture/2014/02/dalai-lama-american-enterprise-institute'>https://www.vanityfair.com/culture/2014/02/dalai-lama-american-enterprise-institute</a> 
Be Open-Handed Toward Your Brothers, Commentary, 2/1/14 - <a href='https://www.commentarymagazine.com/articles/be-open-handed-toward-your-brothers-1/'>https://www.commentarymagazine.com/articles/be-open-handed-toward-your-brothers-1/</a> 
Tom Gjelten, National Religion and Belief Correspondent, NPR - <a href='https://www.npr.org/people/2100536/tom-gjelten'>https://www.npr.org/people/2100536/tom-gjelten</a>

In this episode, we sit down with AEI president Arthur Brooks and NPR's Tom Gjelten to explore increasing loneliness and disenchantment with American politics, the power of storytelling, and new ways to engage distinct audiences in pursuit of the common good. Our Culture of Contempt, Arthur Brooks, New York Times, 3/1/19 - https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/02/opinion/sunday/political-polarization.html Love Your Enemies, 3/12/19 - https://www.amazon.com/Love-Your-Enemies-America-Contempt/dp/1982608803 Why Was the Dalai Lama Hanging Out at the Right-Wing American Enterprise Institute?, Vanity Fair, 2/26/14 - https://www.vanityfair.com/culture/2014/02/dalai-lama-american-enterprise-institute Be Open-Handed Toward Your Brothers, Commentary, 2/1/14 - https://www.commentarymagazine.com/articles/be-open-handed-toward-your-brothers-1/ Tom Gjelten, National Religion and Belief Correspondent, NPR - https://www.npr.org/people/2100536/tom-gjelten

In this episode, we sit down with AEI president Arthur Brooks and NPR's Tom Gjelten to explore increasing loneliness and disenchantment with American politics, the power of storytelling, and new ways to engage distinct audiences in pursuit of the common good.
&nbsp;
Our Culture of Contempt, Arthur Brooks, New York Times, 3/1/19 - <a href="https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/02/opinion/sunday/political-polarization.html" rel="noopener noreferrer">https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/02/opinion/sunday/political-polarization.html</a> 
Love Your Enemies, 3/12/19 - <a href="https://www.amazon.com/Love-Your-Enemies-America-Contempt/dp/1982608803" rel="noopener noreferrer">https://www.amazon.com/Love-Your-Enemies-America-Contempt/dp/1982608803</a> 
Why Was the Dalai Lama Hanging Out at the Right-Wing American Enterprise Institute?, Vanity Fair, 2/26/14 - <a href="https://www.vanityfair.com/culture/2014/02/dalai-lama-american-enterprise-institute" rel="noopener noreferrer">https://www.vanityfair.com/culture/2014/02/dalai-lama-american-enterprise-institute</a> 
Be Open-Handed Toward Your Brothers, Commentary, 2/1/14 - <a href="https://www.commentarymagazine.com/articles/be-open-handed-toward-your-brothers-1/" rel="noopener noreferrer">https://www.commentarymagazine.com/articles/be-open-handed-toward-your-brothers-1/</a> 
Tom Gjelten, National Religion and Belief Correspondent, NPR - <a href="https://www.npr.org/people/2100536/tom-gjelten" rel="noopener noreferrer">https://www.npr.org/people/2100536/tom-gjelten</a>

Arthur Brooks and Tom Gjelten: Transcending Contempt

Faith Angle is a podcast about the dynamic, enduring impact of religion in American life—even when we don't think it's in the room.

Faith Angle is a podcast about the dynamic, enduring impact of religion in American life—even when we don't think it's in the room.

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Faith Angle brings together top scholars and leading journalists for smart conversations around some of the most profound questions in the public square. Rather than a current-events debrief, our goal is a substantive conversation one notch beneath the surface, drawing out how religious convictions manifest themselves in American culture and public life.

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